84 réponses à ce sujet

[mumatil]

Ace of Dawn wrote...

I liked Carth, in fact more so than I did Ashley. He was very down to earth, and I respected him for that. And that's the brilliance about the characters, you will like or hate them not for lack of any sort of depth, but for the opposite. I'm not a huge Ashley fan because I don't really like her personality. And that's why it's nice, you react to the characters like in real life, so you act like you normally would.

Mhmm. Agreed, I don't care for Thane and Kasumi.

Then again I never liked how they are just card board cut out ideas of assasins and thieves.

I especially hate Kasumi.  Just that "no biggi I stole this invaluable statue from the human race for my own gain because I stole it on a dare."  ****.

Modifié par mumatil, 04 juillet 2011 - 11:47 .

[Maria Caliban]

xnoxiousx wrote...

Is Kaidan actually a deep character?

No. But it's not like the ME characters are especially deep.

[Merlin 47]

I found him to be about as deep as a piece of cardboard. But again, that's just me; Wrex, Ash, Liara, Tali and Garrus I found to be more interesting.

[goofyomnivore]

Playing a male Shepard he seems sorta distanced. I liked him and RP him as my Shepard's best buddy, you know being the only two human biotics serving on the Normandy. I imagined they developed a good friendship, before Eden Prime, Saren, etc.

However the game really doesn't present him as much of a "bro" like they do Garrus and Wrex. It seems more like a "co-worker/ you're my boss" relationship. I know it is Kaidan's character to be professional, and that is an appeal to some, but I kind of wish he would relax/ease up a bit more for male Shepard.

[shepskisaac]

Estelindis wrote...

I believe it was a biotic kick - but yes, very badass (albeit uncontrolled, which I think is why the story still haunts Kaidan to some degree years later, even when he's got most of his issues squared away).

Actually, his 'calm' nature is a result of the BAaT incident IMO and that he never really get this issue squared away as he would like to think he did. He tries to hold his emotions inside scared of his own past, what he did when emotions won over him. The BAaT incident made him restrain himself even more than he most likely ever would due to any good upbringing or stuff like that. Horizon is a good reflection of his more impulsive side crawling out. He loses control and snaps when he cares for someone deeply (Shep in this case).

Modifié par IsaacShep, 05 juillet 2011 - 02:00 .

[HTTP 404]

we need to go deeper!

[DaringMoosejaw]

He's deep.

In the ground!

Actually, vaporized. So. Not really.

[Estelindis]

IsaacShep wrote...

Actually, his 'calm' nature is a result of the BAaT incident IMO and that he never really get this issue squared away as he would like to think he did. He tries to hold his emotions inside scared of his own past, what he did when emotions won over him. The BAaT incident made him restrain himself even more than he most likely ever would due to any good upbringing or stuff like that. Horizon is a good reflection of his more impulsive side crawling out. He loses control and snaps when he cares for someone deeply (Shep in this case).

Precisely, Isaac - that's my point. What Kaidan was capable of (namely, killing a man when he'd only really meant to stop him per se) when he lost control continues to haunt him, making him perhaps over-cautious at the time the game is set (though he is otherwise a-okay).  We see elements of his fierceness emerge when it comes to people he cares for (such as Shepard and Ashley), but not to the point where he seems to be in danger of killing someone he doesn't mean to kill.  I really like the part of his conversation tree where Shepard points out that Rahna's horror at what he did and her consequent rejection of him marked Kaidan.  Kaidan ruefully acknowledges the point as a direct hit to his blind spot, but it's not like Shepard fixes him - it's just a shrewd observation that Kaidan adds to his own mental tally.

Modifié par Estelindis, 05 juillet 2011 - 02:08 .

[GodWood]

[shepskisaac]

Estelindis wrote...
Precisely, Isaac - that's my point. What Kaidan was capable of (namely, killing a man when he'd only really meant to stop him per se) when he lost control continues to haunt him, making him perhaps over-cautious at the time the game is set (though he is otherwise a-okay).  We see elements of his fierceness emerge when it comes to people he cares for (such as Shepard and Ashley), but not to the point where he seems to be in danger of killing someone he doesn't mean to kill.  I really like the part of his conversation tree where Shepard points out that Rahna's horror at what he did and her consequent rejection of him marked Kaidan.  Kaidan ruefully acknowledges the point as a direct hit to his blind spot, but it's not like Shepard fixes him - it's just a shrewd observation that Kaidan adds to his own mental tally.

He's a ticking bomb really. I don't even know if it ain't worse than Jack. She lashes out her emotions all the time which kinda keeps her craziness level at high, but stable level. Kaidan on the other hand could 'exceed' her in just one moment that would get him. Quite likely something like this will happen in ME3. He's able to keep himself stable most of the time, but when he forms a close bond with another person it may be dangerous. Maybe that's why he kinda appears socially shy and it doesn't seem he has a rich love life really (his comments how it's been a long time since he met a woman, how it were his friends that made him go out with some doctor from the citadel etc), maybe he reminds himself where deep relationships can lead. At the same time he wants acceptance (comment how he doesn't want Shep to think he's a whiner etc). Very interesting character.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 05 juillet 2011 - 02:18 .

[Siansonea]

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

He's deep.

In the ground!

Actually, vaporized. So. Not really.

How strikingly original.

You might want to peek at the previous pages in this thread.

[Estelindis]

IsaacShep wrote...

He's a ticking bomb really. I don't even know if it ain't worse than Jack. She lashes out her emotions all the time which kinda keeps her craziness level at high, but stable level. Kaidan on the other hand could 'exceed' her in just one moment that would get him. Quite likely something like this will happen in ME3.

My, I hadn't thought of this.  I had seen Kaidan as someone who tends to understate or underreact rather than the opposite if given a choice.  I saw it as a mature, largely comfortable reaction - just his way, his nature by now.  I didn't really think of how dangerous it might be if something really got under his skin and he tried to repress it in order to regain his valued calm, but the event leaves him so monumentally hurt and shaken that he can't handle it.    Mind you, he did deal with Ashley's death not too badly, but from the looks of things ME3 is going to have a lot of loss as a key part of the story.

Modifié par Estelindis, 05 juillet 2011 - 02:31 .

[Niddy']

His whining has created a very deep river of tears.

[Praetor Knight]

Kaidan is a fine character, he's likable enough. And darn that Virmire choice!

Captain Crash wrote...

Yep he tells you quite a deep backstory. I wasn't Kaidan's biggest fan, but after ME2 I realised how good he really is. You learn about his upbringing and his time as a biotic as well as several other personal feelings and experiences he shares

Then you have ME2 characters that are lacklustre in comparison. Like Jacob, any explanation into his biotic background? Nope, all the explanation we get is "I will hit 'em with the good stuff!". Thats one example of course.

Anyway I digress. My point being is that Kaidan is quite a deep character certainly! One the most Bioware have written in the series so far.

And sorry to go off track here, but this gave me an idea about why Jacob is the way he is in ME2.

That being a biotic set him apart from his dad and then other people in his life. So as a result Jacob has struggled opening up and getting close to others. It might help explain why he avoids saying much about himself and why his Romance scene has that priceless line. And I think he's fine as a character.

[eye basher]

kaidan is just the carth onasi of mass effect his just there to look good the same way that garrus is the anton rand of mass effect 2

[Siansonea]

In a perfect world, a character wouldn't be judged by the perception of other characters voiced by the same actor. We don't live in that world.

[Estelindis]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

And sorry to go off track here, but this gave me an idea about why Jacob is the way he is in ME2.

That being a biotic set him apart from his dad and then other people in his life. So as a result Jacob has struggled opening up and getting close to others. It might help explain why he avoids saying much about himself and why his Romance scene has that priceless line. And I think he's fine as a character.

Jacob himself seems to resist such easy pop-psychological analysis.  It can result in him dumping Shep, IIRC.  Kaidan, for his part, acknowleges that Shepard has a point but doesn't let it have a sweeping, life-rearranging effect (that we see).

[Praetor Knight]

Estelindis wrote...

Jacob himself seems to resist such easy pop-psychological analysis.  It can result in him dumping Shep, IIRC.  Kaidan, for his part, acknowleges that Shepard has a point but doesn't let it have a sweeping, life-rearranging effect (that we see).

I dunno, but I wouldn't consider myself a Dr. Phil type either. I haven't completed a femshep run to really know either way, anyway.

[Jonathan Shepard]

Kaidan's got a great backstory... unfortunately, his main issue is that his presence around Shepard and helping Shep stop the Reapers is unexplained. Wrex, Tali and Garrus signed on because Shep helped them out, Ashley lost her whole unit and wants payback, and Liara's mother is a huge plot-point to explain her presence. But Kaidan? He just happened to be another biotic soldier on board the Normandy. If he and Shepard had been established as good friends with some history, that would have made his loyalty to Shepard much more believe-able. Instead, he just kind of ended up as the fellow soldier who tags along.

I still keep him alive in most playthroughs, but I'm thinking that maybe since he IS the only one without a plot-central reason for being there... -shrug- I like him as the "good friend" personally. Someone trustworthy and reliable and relatable, him being human and all.

[syllogi]

Jonathan Shepard wrote...

Kaidan's got a great backstory... unfortunately, his main issue is that his presence around Shepard and helping Shep stop the Reapers is unexplained. Wrex, Tali and Garrus signed on because Shep helped them out, Ashley lost her whole unit and wants payback, and Liara's mother is a huge plot-point to explain her presence. But Kaidan? He just happened to be another biotic soldier on board the Normandy. If he and Shepard had been established as good friends with some history, that would have made his loyalty to Shepard much more believe-able. Instead, he just kind of ended up as the fellow soldier who tags along.

I still keep him alive in most playthroughs, but I'm thinking that maybe since he IS the only one without a plot-central reason for being there... -shrug- I like him as the "good friend" personally. Someone trustworthy and reliable and relatable, him being human and all.

Kaidan was handpicked by Anderson, just like Shepard, Pressly, Joker, and the rest of the original crew were.  It would have been interesting to make his backstory somehow connected to the main plot, but why is it *needed*, especially if it strains believability to make everyone have a soap opera-esque connection to the main villain?

Any good soldier who wants to help people would have enough reason to want to take down Saren and the Reapers. 

[Shrayev]

Jonathan Shepard wrote...

Kaidan's got a great backstory... unfortunately, his main issue is that his presence around Shepard and helping Shep stop the Reapers is unexplained. Wrex, Tali and Garrus signed on because Shep helped them out, Ashley lost her whole unit and wants payback, and Liara's mother is a huge plot-point to explain her presence. But Kaidan? He just happened to be another biotic soldier on board the Normandy. If he and Shepard had been established as good friends with some history, that would have made his loyalty to Shepard much more believe-able. Instead, he just kind of ended up as the fellow soldier who tags along.

I still keep him alive in most playthroughs, but I'm thinking that maybe since he IS the only one without a plot-central reason for being there... -shrug- I like him as the "good friend" personally. Someone trustworthy and reliable and relatable, him being human and all.

Yeah exactly, I couldn't agree more. 

To be honest, I have a lot of respect for Kaidan. He's had a **** life so far: sent to BAAT (or whatever the Biotic training camp was) and pretty much brutalized as a child, implanted with damaging technology...essentially experimented on and turned into a weapon, against his will. Plenty of people who went through that reacted negatively-- we fight multiple Biotic terrorists in ME1 with legitimate gripes.

Kaidan didn't go that route. He elected to serve the Alliance and do what he felt was the right thing. The man has a really powerful moral compass, and to top it off, he recovered from his past rather than holding grudges and becoming a misanthrope. I think he deserves a lot of credit for that.

At the same time, it's clear that he still bears the scars of what happened to him. That's why I can't let him die on Virmire. Ashley's father surrendered to aliens and in so doing tarnished her family name. By sacrificing herself on Virmire, she redeems her family name to a significant degree: she saved many human lives by doing so.

If I let Kaidan die there, I'd feel like he was just being screwed over by the Alliance...again. He bored me on my first playthrough, but the more I think about it, the more I realize that he's my favorite character in the ME universe. A really selfless, optimistic individual-- just what humanity needs. He's like a Shepard that never went Cerberus.

[sbvera13]

Strephon Gentry wrote...

Kaidan is a very deep character. Actually, about 6 feet deep in all my play throughs...

Totally with you on that one.

Dunno what possessed the Devs to make a flat, bland character and then cast him with the same voice actor as a flat, bland character from another game.  I swear, the only difference between Kaidan and Carth Onasi is that at least this time around you can finally kill the bugger off.

Modifié par sbvera13, 05 juillet 2011 - 03:55 .

[Eshaye]

Warkupo wrote...

People don't like Kaiden for the same reason people don't like Jacob; Despite the trials they have gone through they are mostly perfectly normal people.

And normal is boring.

Kaidan is plagued by the fact that he is very much ABnormal, he tries very hard to stay in as much control as possible on the outside because he doesn't want anyone to view him as a monster. He is definitely not normal, you just have to talk to him. 

[shepskisaac]

Estelindis wrote...
 Mind you, he did deal with Ashley's death not too badly, but from the looks of things ME3 is going to have a lot of loss as a key part of the story.

He didn't have any romantic feelings for Ash though like he obviously has for Shep, whether romanced or not.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:37 .