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[Cobra5]

"If I have to Shepard, I'll use my rank and make it an order."

"You know, you remind me of a reporter I know..."

[Hallusinaatti]

Looks like nobody in BioWare has been in a RL military - even a private knows that you really need to work your way up to gain ranks.
Alenko is the worst example of a military officer I've ever seen.
To me it seems that ranks in Mass Effect go:

Private -> Lieutenant -> Sergeant -> Captain -> Commander -> Admiral

That's pretty much just giving fancy titles for people who play nice to get above in the system. The more skilled you are the lesser your rank is. The commander rank is odd, since half treat Shepard as superior and half treat as a mere private. In a RL military every god damn Alliance person would be nothing but saluting when Shepard enters the room. Also, apparently years of service with constant service but no promotions is a bit odd.

[wolf99000]

not knowing much about the military

the more interesting thing is the trail is how the trail effects the rank do you keep your rank while under arrest because you would be guarded by people who are lower ranks and you could just order them to open the cell

[Made Nightwing]

Hallusinaatti wrote...

Looks like nobody in BioWare has been in a RL military - even a private knows that you really need to work your way up to gain ranks.
Alenko is the worst example of a military officer I've ever seen.

Looks like you've never served either, or if you have, you have served with a bunch of cowboys who don't know **** about real combat leadership. Kaidan is possibly the best example I could use to show what a frontline officer should be. Calm. Collected. Emotionally mature and moved on from traumatic events in his past.

He also has integrity. To quote the inestimable Warrant Officer Clissold, as he addressed a group of wannabe Officer Candidatesin their first preparation session for the Officer Selection Board, "If you haven't got integrity, then no one is going to follow you into combat."

[naledgeborn]

Made Nightwing wrote...

Hallusinaatti wrote...

Looks like nobody in BioWare has been in a RL military - even a private knows that you really need to work your way up to gain ranks.
Alenko is the worst example of a military officer I've ever seen.

Looks like you've never served either, or if you have, you have served with a bunch of cowboys who don't know **** about real combat leadership. Kaidan is possibly the best example I could use to show what a frontline officer should be. Calm. Collected. Emotionally mature and moved on from traumatic events in his past.

He also has integrity. To quote the inestimable Warrant Officer Clissold, as he addressed a group of wannabe Officer Candidatesin their first preparation session for the Officer Selection Board, "If you haven't got integrity, then no one is going to follow you into combat."

And he's in the trenches with his men instead cowering like a **** sipping tea in some far off tent. NightWing has the right of it.

Also SAN has a simillar paygrade system to RL military. Enlisted < Non-comissioned Officers < Comissioned Officers. 

ENLISTED

• Serviceman 3rd class/Private 2nd class
• Serviceman 2nd class/Private 1st class
• Serviceman 1st class/Corporal

NCOs

• Service Chief
• Gunnery Chief
• Operations Chief

OFFICERS

• 2nd Lieutenant
• 1st Lieutenant
• Staff Lieutenant
• Lieutenant Commander
• Staff Commander
• Captain/Major
• Rear Admiral/General
• Admiral
• Fleet Admiral

And no you "don't really need to work to gain ranks". It goes by seniority and aptitude. An AB becomes a Sr Arm in 3 years. Pass the test and s/he's a Staff Sgt. Do your research before you open your mouth and sound like an idiot. 

[Valdrane78]

@naledgeborn
Except enlisted personel don't become officers outright, they have to go back to college. Enlisted become warrant officers if they so choose, but not commisioned officers. I take it all with a grain of salt, it is a game after all and direct reflection with real world variations rarely works.

P.S. the way people gain ranks in the Airforce is a joke, take a test and become a staff NCO. I am of the opinion that if half those people tried to gain rank in the Marine Corps, they wouldn't make is past E-4.

[InfoGuy101]

You know what we need for ME3 is a codex that explains ranks in the Alliance to sort this sort of thing out lol. 

Or just make Shepard a Captain when he get's his commisson back . 

Or be really creative and make Spectre status a rank within all military forces in Citadel space equal to Captain or General ect. That way at least everyone who's a Spectre (including the VS and hopefully Shepard) has the same rank and will follow the more senior soldier eg. Shepard. 

[naledgeborn]

Except enlisted personel don't become officers outright, they have to go back to college. Enlisted become warrant officers if they so choose, but not commisioned officers. I take it all with a grain of salt, it is a game after all and direct reflection with real world variations rarely works.

Well depends where you're making the jump from. If you're going from enlisted to commisioned then you have to go to college, or OTS, or both. If you're an NCO the process is easier and they encourage NCOs to get college level education in the inside anyway.

Valdrane78 wrote...

P.S. the way people gain ranks in the Airforce is a joke, take a test and become a staff NCO. I am of the opinion that if half those people tried to gain rank in the Marine Corps, they wouldn't make is past E-4.

True enough. Those exams however are harder than you think. "Work smarter, not harder" is how the saying goes.

Modifié par naledgeborn, 19 septembre 2011 - 02:00 .

[trying_touch]

the other characters already tell you what to do... your teamates: their individual support missions, cerberus: to do their dirty work for em, the council: to save the universe...

edit: anyway, they're both Spectres now, they don't outrank anyone, nor are outranked by anybody ...

Modifié par trying_touch, 19 septembre 2011 - 02:13 .

[nelly21]

Shep still outranks Kaiden in the only pecking order that matters: the bad ass club. Rest assured, Shep's position of Commander in Chief Badass is secured.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Spectre status takes priority. Shepard is a Spectre, unless you were stupid enough to tell which ever council to shove it. Kaiden does not out rank Shepard. Kaiden's rank is his last before becoming a Spectre. As to whom the crew takes orders from will be determined by one of two people: Anderson or Hackett, and you can bet your sweet behind it's going to be Shepard.

[azerSheppard]

naledgeborn wrote...

Except enlisted personel don't become officers outright, they have to go back to college. Enlisted become warrant officers if they so choose, but not commisioned officers. I take it all with a grain of salt, it is a game after all and direct reflection with real world variations rarely works.

Well depends where you're making the jump from. If you're going from enlisted to commisioned then you have to go to college, or OTS, or both. If you're an NCO the process is easier and they encourage NCOs to get college level education in the inside anyway.

Valdrane78 wrote...

P.S. the way people gain ranks in the Airforce is a joke, take a test and become a staff NCO. I am of the opinion that if half those people tried to gain rank in the Marine Corps, they wouldn't make is past E-4.

True enough. Those exams however are harder than you think. "Work smarter, not harder" is how the saying goes.

Same with CIA

[Valdrane78]

naledgeborn wrote...

Except enlisted personel don't become officers outright, they have to go back to college. Enlisted become warrant officers if they so choose, but not commisioned officers. I take it all with a grain of salt, it is a game after all and direct reflection with real world variations rarely works.

Well depends where you're making the jump from. If you're going from enlisted to commisioned then you have to go to college, or OTS, or both. If you're an NCO the process is easier and they encourage NCOs to get college level education in the inside anyway.

Valdrane78 wrote...

P.S. the way people gain ranks in the Airforce is a joke, take a test and become a staff NCO. I am of the opinion that if half those people tried to gain rank in the Marine Corps, they wouldn't make is past E-4.

True enough. Those exams however are harder than you think. "Work smarter, not harder" is how the saying goes.

I had a childhood friend who joined the Airforce (I had joined the Marine Corps at the same time) anyways, his B-Billet for a few years was to administer those tests and go over different candidates for SNCO's.  While on leave once I went to visit him and he let me take one of those tests for sh*** and giggles, I passed no problem.  Now that was over a decade ago,I do not know if the test has changed at all.

[ErichHartmann]

I walk the line from rank to rank,
And don't take sh** from any rank.

[Valdrane78]

lightsnow13 wrote...

 Does anyone know what they (Kaidan or Ash) were doing while shepard was "dead"

I'd like to know how they achieved that rank...they must have done something that caught the attention of the council.

Yeah, helping Shepard save the Citadel.

[N7 Elite]

Seeing as the rank bestowed to Kaidan, was posthumously given... It holds little importance. It's not like it matters if he did die in your playthrough.

What? Is his ghost going to order you around? Naw...

[Chuvvy]

Valdrane78 wrote...

lightsnow13 wrote...

 Does anyone know what they (Kaidan or Ash) were doing while shepard was "dead"

I'd like to know how they achieved that rank...they must have done something that caught the attention of the council.

Yeah, helping Shepard save the Citadel.

Nope, I liked Kaiden but he stayed on the Normandy

Sit on the Normandy
Get saved by Shepard
Get frozen
Get saved by Shepard
???
Become Spectre

It was a bold plan but it worked out for him

[Gh0st_00]

Meh. If Kaidan tries anything I'll just drop him off at Pinnacle Station and pay Ahern to turn the safeties off.

"What was that Kaidan? You wanted the Geth Colossus and Thresher Maw survival mission? Sure, why not?"

Modifié par Gh0st_00, 20 septembre 2011 - 02:28 .

[ladyvader]

XxDeonxX wrote...

So in ME2 we find out Kaidan was promoted to the rank of Staff-Commander while Shepard is out, in ME3 apparently Ashley Williams has reached the rank of 2nd lieutenant where she was promoted to operations chief while shepard was out, so risen 1 more rank between me2 and me3 so its quite possible Kaiden may even be being cosidered or already be a Major / Captain. So with Shepard rejoining the Systems Alliance in ME3 does that mean we have to start taking orders from Kaidan now since he is out commanding officer and outranks us? or is he going to calmly step aside and let shepard take the reins of command?

I personally dont like the idea of being given orders from kaidan.. lucky for me he didn't survive Virmire and by ME3 theres still 2 ranks between Shepard and Ashley Williams =P but for those who saved Kaidan on Virmire.. What will you do if Kaidan starts giving you commands  especially those that conflict with your Shepards views?

Kaidan got bumped two ranks.  Ash got bumped two ranks.

[Han Shot First]

Private -> Lieutenant -> Sergeant -> Captain -> Commander -> Admiral

Reverse Lieutenant & Sergeant.

A Lieutenant is a Commisioned Officer and is a higher rank than a Sergeant, which is a NCO. (Non-Commissioned Officer.) Non-Commissioned Officers are enlisted men.

Also while I don't recall the full Alliance rank structure, there appear to be a few ranks missing. The Alliance has Corporals (NCOs), Chiefs and Gunnery Chiefs (Staff NCOs), and Majors. (Officers)

There are also Servicemen which appear to be Alliance military personnel who are the equivalent of Privates, but serving as naval personnel, whereas the Privates are Marines. The only thing that gets a bit murky with the Serviceman rank is that the woman from Ashley's unit who was killed on Eden Prime and whose body was used for research by the Alliance, also holds the Serviceman rank. At first glance this would seem odd, since if she was a Marine she should have been a Private rather than a Serviceman. Either Bioware has trouble keeping track of the rank structure they created, or Alliance Marines are similar to the US Marines in that their medical personnel come from the Navy, in which case she would have been a medic.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 20 septembre 2011 - 05:03 .

[capn233]

naledgeborn posted Alliance ranks above.

This is not a major problem for many reasons. You are a Spectre. You are captain of the Normandy, even if you are a Lt Cmdr. And most importantly, Kaidan is probably dead.

What rank was Kaidan in ME? I know he was a "lieutenant" but which one? We know exactly what rank Ash was in ME due to dialogue, I thought Kaidan was always simply called "lieutenant?" Was he assumed to be a "staff lieutenant" simply because Ash was promoted 2 ranks, so he had to be as well? Did the developers state such?

[111987]

Technically, couldn't Ashley and Kaidan could both outrank Shepard in ME3? If they are Spectres, and Shepard didn't get his/her Spectre status reinstated.

[Heimdall]

Slidell505 wrote...

Valdrane78 wrote...

lightsnow13 wrote...

 Does anyone know what they (Kaidan or Ash) were doing while shepard was "dead"

I'd like to know how they achieved that rank...they must have done something that caught the attention of the council.

Yeah, helping Shepard save the Citadel.

Nope, I liked Kaiden but he stayed on the Normandy

Sit on the Normandy
Get saved by Shepard
Get frozen
Get saved by Shepard
???
Become Spectre

It was a bold plan but it worked out for him

  The game tends to assume that all companions where there for everything.

[Han Shot First]

This is not a major problem for many reasons. You are a Spectre. You are captain of the Normandy, even if you are a Lt Cmdr. And most importantly, Kaidan is probably dead.

A Spectre doesn't 'outrank' military personnel, because Spectres are completely outside a military chain of command. The Office of Special Tactics and Reconnaissance is a civilian intelligence agency. Shepard was able to command an Alliance military vessel in Mass Effect 1 because in addition to being a Spectre, he was a Lt. Commander in the Alliance military. If his path to being made a Spectre had been a civilian one he wouldn't have been in command of a military vessel, and if he needed one for missions he would just been a passenger much like Nihlus at the start of Mass Effect 1. As civilian government agents, Spectres don't command warships.

With that in mind Kaidan outranking Shepard is an issue if Shepard returns to ME3 as both a Spectre AND an Alliance military officer. If so Kaidan should be in command of the Normandy since the crew answers to the Alliance chain of command, not the Office of Special Tactics and Reconnaissance.

The only way around this is for Shepard to also be promoted to Staff Commander in ME3.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 20 septembre 2011 - 05:47 .