1768 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

Saphra Deden wrote...
Legion makes no promises about peace. His geth are almost as hostile to organics are the Heretics are. 

Right. Real hostile towards organics. That's why while the heretics actually attack them while the geth send an agent to foster peace (Legion himself says they're open to peace as long as organics don't try to attack them and leave them alone.) and try to work together. Riiiight.  That's also why they didn't take the Reapers offer or chase after the remanants of the Quarians. Because they're hostile. 

And Legion *could* be lying but why bother? Humans had no idea how many geth their actually where. Humans and the like actually start thinking that they've wiped out almost all the geth (when in truth they're only driving the heretics into holes). The geth study organics true but organics study one another. It's curiosty about how another civilization reacts (and they do poke them for reactions. But that's not much different than someone putting two wild animals in apin to see how they interact). They could've stayed hidden, waited for organics to actualy be weak and then attack if they were actualy hostile. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 juillet 2011 - 08:00 .

[Fixers0]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Legion makes no promises about peace. His geth are almost as hostile to organics are the Heretics are.

Yeah, like in the same way your beloved Cerberus is hostile to the Alliance Navy.

[littlezack]

 
What he wasn't was an emissary. He is not here to make peace with organics. The "true" geth still shoot any organic who comes anywhere near them and have for centuries.

That might have something to do with their own creators trying to kill them just because they dared to express sentient thought. I don't think they hate organics so much as they're distrustful of them - with good reason. Most organic species treat them like malfunctiong equipment that needs to be repaired.

[Ryzaki]

Saphra Deden wrote...
Oh you freaking wish, kid. Legion was sent to make contact with Shepard. The motives behind that are vague at best.

What he wasn't was an emissary. He is not here to make peace with organics. The "true" geth still shoot any organic who comes anywhere near them and have for centuries.

In fact when the Heretics decided to leave and make war on organics the rest of the geth accepted their choice. They did not oppose it and did not undermine it or even warn the rest of the galaxy. They did nothing until the Heretics finally became a threat to them as well.

Legion and the rest of the geth are not our friends. They are temporary allies because we share common enemies. Nothing more.

 

 

You have no proof that's the true geth. You also don't have any proof if those organics were hostile or not before they were shot. (I don't have proof of the opposite. But I'm not claiming anything is fact).

And why would they? They don't owe anything to organics. Hell the only organics they personally know tried to exterminate them. You think organics actually do differently? Some people just don't care if it has nothing to do with them. Why fight your own kind for people you don't know? Legion only strikes against them once they become a threat to the geth. Which was sensible. The geth wanted to be left the hell alone. How likely would it have been that they would've taken the geth warnings and not just tried to kill the geth? The humans would've asked questions, wanted information probably would've assumed they were the same and tried to use them for weapons test. It makes sense they didn't say anything for their own self preservation. No different than the alliance going against Cerberus only when they start becoming a threat to them as well as others in the galaxy. 

And Cerberus is different?  Unlike Cerberus the geth are at least not liable to stab us in the back the second we let our guard down. They just want to be left alone. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 juillet 2011 - 08:05 .

[Nimrodell]

Actually, David's being put like that is the idea borrowed from Clockwork Orange:


If you've seen that Stanley Cubrick's movie, you'll know what's the reason for having his eyes opened like that the whole time.

[Praetor Knight]

Nimrodell wrote...

Actually, David's being put like that is the idea borrowed from Clockwork Orange:
*snip image*

If you've seen that Stanley Cubrick's movie, you'll know what's the reason for having his eyes opened like that the whole time.

But David has autism!

[Ryzaki]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Nimrodell wrote...

Actually, David's being put like that is the idea borrowed from Clockwork Orange:
*snip image*

If you've seen that Stanley Cubrick's movie, you'll know what's the reason for having his eyes opened like that the whole time.

But David has autism!

I've never seen Clockwork Orange.

So why are the guy's eyes open? 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 juillet 2011 - 08:16 .

[Praetor Knight]

Ryzaki wrote...

I've never seen Clockwork Orange.

So why is the guy's eyes open?

A wack behavioral modification treatment; and that dude was a killer.

[Ryzaki]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

I've never seen Clockwork Orange.

So why is the guy's eyes open?

A wack behavioral modification treatment; and that dude was a killer.

...I'm curious as to why David's behavior would've needed to be modified. They wanted to make him more robotic? How would they accomplish that? Especially with the autism. 

And it looks like if that was the intention that failed too. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 juillet 2011 - 08:17 .

[littlezack]

I got the impression that it was just to keep him from closing his eyes and shutting out all the data.

[Praetor Knight]

Ryzaki wrote...

...I'm curious as to why David's behavior would've needed to be modified. 

And it looks like if that was the intention that failed too.

Only one thing comes to mind, to enhance his capacity to focus on interpreting the Geth signals.

But that's a high price to pay if that's why he's like that.

[Ryzaki]

Praetor Shepard wrote...
Only one thing comes to mind, to enhance his capacity to focus on interpreting the Geth signals. 

But that's a high price to pay if that's why he's like that.

 

Ah. 

Really. I wonder if his brother had the decency to keep his eyes moist? 

littlezack wrote...

I got the impression that it was just to keep him from closing his eyes and shutting out all the data.

 


That might be the case. But why would shutting his eyes make the data go away? It's not like he was staring at it as it passed by on a screen (unless I missed something).  

[Someone With Mass]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Oh you freaking wish, kid. Legion was sent to make contact with Shepard. The motives behind that are vague at best.

What he wasn't was an emissary. He is not here to make peace with organics. The "true" geth still shoot any organic who comes anywhere near them and have for centuries.

In fact when the Heretics decided to leave and make war on organics the rest of the geth accepted their choice. They did not oppose it and did not undermine it or even warn the rest of the galaxy. They did nothing until the Heretics finally became a threat to them as well.

Legion and the rest of the geth are not our friends. They are temporary allies because we share common enemies. Nothing more.

Oh gee, I wonder if it has something to do with that Dyson sphere they're building, which they believe to be their sole purpose in life to complete and they don't want any organics to tamper with it, so they send a message out to the organics to just stay the hell away.

That doesn't mean they can't make peace if they're given the chance. Legion was made to look after Shepard. He also serves as a terminal to the geth. Shepard can use that to his advantage when needed.

[Kaiser Shepard]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Legion makes no promises about peace. His geth are almost as hostile to organics are the Heretics are.

Legion says nothing that could be verified through other sources, either. For all we know, 'his geth' are a lie and he is to 'his people' what the Architect was to the Darkspawn.

[Praetor Knight]

Ryzaki wrote...

Really. I wonder if his brother had the decency to keep his eyes moist?

I think they did since it seemed that his cheeks looked moist, but it had to be torturous if they kept his eyes open for the entire day, he probably couldn't sleep.

littlezack wrote...

I got the impression that it was just to keep him from closing his eyes and shutting out all the data.

 


That might be the case. But why would shutting his eyes make the data go away? It's not like he was staring at it as it passed by on a screen (unless I missed something).  

I think it either hurt to recieve the data or David couldn't stay focused long enough for what they wanted, so they were rushing their research with trying to maintain a seamless line of communication with the Geth.

At least most of the knuckleheads got what was coming to them. I really wanted to leave the good Doctor in that thing.

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 13 juillet 2011 - 08:35 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

ubermensch007 wrote...

With this, I think that BioWare is just deciding to do the opposite of what the default narrative was in Mass Effect 2.Which was "Renegade Decision"

Except that Mass Effect 2 was actually lighter on the Renegade Decision narrative than the Paragon one.  There's more content, cameos, and positive validation to your Paragon choices than any other.

It also even reaches back and skews the ending to Mass Effect 1 toward favoring the Paragon side.

If you're referring to Cerberus, both Shepards are forced to work with them and is not related to any choice presented in the game.  Renegade Shepard never applied to Cerberus or anything...

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 13 juillet 2011 - 09:17 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

I've been reading numerous arguements for why the favoritism of the Paragon choice has been done thusfar... but my point is still that they could've balanced out the choices and made them even to themselves... have some pluses as well as minuses instead of having a game where a real choice is not necessary when you want the most positive outcome.

[Dariustwinblade]

Well duh! Nice gamers get nice things cause they put in moar effort

[Lumikki]

Saphra Deden wrote...

ubermensch wrote...

Shepard: Who gave you the right to "play God" ?

Dr.Archer: The people who were to afraid to make difficult decisions themselves.When they pray for a miracle.There -- really praying for men like me to make the tough choices.

Archer is right.

How you define difficult decissions?

Example Rachni Queen, which one is more difficult choise kill her or leave her alive?

Modifié par Lumikki, 13 juillet 2011 - 09:19 .

[Ryzaki]

Praetor Shepard wrote...
I think they did since it seemed that his cheeks looked moist, but it had to be torturous if they kept his eyes open for the entire day, he probably couldn't sleep.

 

Aye. That mixed with all those voices in his head...it's no wonder he cracked. 

I think it either hurt to recieve the data or David couldn't stay focused long enough for what they wanted, so they were rushing their research with trying to maintain a seamless line of communication with the Geth.

At least most of the knuckleheads got what was coming to them. I really wanted to leave the good Doctor in that thing.

Blargh. David was probably suffering from extreme overload with all those voices in his head. I mean...listening to 20 people talking at once can be annoying. 200? 300? More. Anyone would probably go insane from that. I wonder if he could make them shut up? Probably not. 

That would've been perfect. Just throw Archer in that and turn around and walk away and when he begs you to let him go Shep just goes "Quiet. Please make it stop." and close the door behind him. Archer'll probably die from dehydration in a few days anyway. (yes I'm vindictive. I don't deny it.) 

And then TIM has the nerve to say it sets them back in understanding the Geth. Hey moron we have a geth onboard. It's nice enough to speak our language too. How about you get off your ass come on the Normandy and ask Legion some questions? Or **** use those spycams of yours to observe his behavior or ask EDI who has several conversations with him? Nah that's doesn't have enough needless suffering involved. <_<

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 juillet 2011 - 09:19 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Dariustwinblade wrote...

Well duh! Nice gamers get nice things cause they put in moar effort

Nothing wrong with nice things... the issue is favoritism and the notion of a tough choice being severely deflated by it. 

Your rationale also alludes to a game where there are no hard choices or tough decisions to be made, just pick the "nice gamer/Paragon" option and things will turn out the best way that they possibly can.  Galaxy in danger?  Take time out to help that kitten... the threat will wait for you... no need to really think about it.  That type of game is counter to what Bioware claimed to be trying to do with the Mass Effect series.

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 13 juillet 2011 - 09:21 .

[Ryzaki]

 

Nothing wrong with nice things... the issue is favoritism and the notion of a tough choice being severely deflated by it.  

Your rationale also alludes to a game where there are no hard choices or tough decisions to be made, just pick the "nice gamer/Paragon" option and things will turn out the best way that they possibly can.  Galaxy in danger?  Take time out to help that kitten needlessly punch someone in the face... the threat will wait for you... no need to really think about it.  That type of game is counter to what Bioware claimed to be trying to do with the Mass Effect series.

Yeah...that's not a lone paragon thing. 

It's called Take Your Time. 

It's a common BW trope. 

And I love how every single paragon choice happens the best way ever even though only one paragon choice (the council) has actually given humanity a benefit. Everything else somehow is magically positive even if nothing's happened. I guess the consequence not happening immediately = postive now and someone saying they'll give you help later (you know...like Cerberus does)  = positive and nothing negative at all is possible. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 juillet 2011 - 09:25 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Ryzaki wrote...

Nothing wrong with nice things... the issue is favoritism and the notion of a tough choice being severely deflated by it.  

Your rationale also alludes to a game where there are no hard choices or tough decisions to be made, just pick the "nice gamer/Paragon" option and things will turn out the best way that they possibly can.  Galaxy in danger?  Take time out to help that kitten needlessly punch someone in the face... the threat will wait for you... no need to really think about it.  That type of game is counter to what Bioware claimed to be trying to do with the Mass Effect series.

Yeah...that's not a lone paragon thing. 

It's called Take Your Time. 

It's a common BW trope. 

lol it is when it comes to the major decisions.  The point still stands.