12 réponses à ce sujet

[jamesp81]

Why I am constantly getting my ass kicked?

It's pathetic, really.  I set up the tactics for my Wynn and Leliana to do ranged combat.  So, of course, they fight from melee range.  I have to manually retreat them to get them the hell out of sharp object distance.

I chose warrior as my class.  I was under the impression this class was intended to be a tank and able to withstand lots of punishment.  He might be slightly more believable as a tank if he wasn't eating health poultices like they were candy.

I did Broken Circle as the second major plotline quest, and there were battles in that damned tower I had to fight over ten times before I got lucky and won.  I'm also getting quite tired of being waylaid on the road by 300 wolves and getting overwhelmed by them.

So, clearly, I am somehow Doing It Wrong™.  Anyone have any ideas?  I've been reading through the strategy and tactics forum, but nothing in particular jumps out.

[ebevan91]

I'm doing it wrong too.

I'm only 5 hours into the game and some parts have been fairly hard for me.

[Deganis76]

Pause often, reasses the situation and make adjustments. I am a fairly experienced "pause and play" strategist. DA:O has some challenging encounters, but all in all it should not having you beating your head against a wall in frustration.

And regarding warriors=tanks...not always. Sword & Shield style, yeah, but Dual Weapon wielders and Two Handed fighters can get their behinds handed to them quickly if you are not careful...of course, they can also dole out a lot of punishment. And also, set your tactics so Wynne heals you & your allies if they dip below a certain health threshold (I like 50%). Wynne's Spirit Healer Specialty also has some really nice group heals that you can get as you level up.

[Merickson]

I'm just starting out the game in the dark forrest. Where do I find Wynne? Those 3 buffoons I have with me suck. They die like nothing. Also, In this game, are the players "really dead" when they die in battle or come back when your player leaves the scene? (Like in some Star wars games) Seems like the fighting is like Netherwinter more than Elder Scrolls. No control over the shield, huh?

[catofnine]

jamesp81 wrote...

It's pathetic, really.  I set up the tactics for my Wynn and Leliana to do ranged combat.  So, of course, they fight from melee range.  I have to manually retreat them to get them the hell out of sharp object distance.

I chose warrior as my class.  I was under the impression this class was intended to be a tank and able to withstand lots of punishment.  He might be slightly more believable as a tank if he wasn't eating health poultices like they were candy.

I did Broken Circle as the second major plotline quest, and there were battles in that damned tower I had to fight over ten times before I got lucky and won.  I'm also getting quite tired of being waylaid on the road by 300 wolves and getting overwhelmed by them.

re: Wynne and Leliana if they are set to the "ranged" ai behavior, they should plant and attack as soon as enemies get in their range.  I usually hit hold so they don't follow me all over and move my melee to meet enemy melee.   When contact happens, I take hold off so my melee guys can do what they do and ranged should not follow at this point.  To keep my ranged from attacking targets they have no business attacking i.e. stuff my tank or offtank doesn't have threat, I set up one of my sturdier nontanking characters to attack "enemy with lowest health" and direct all my ranged to "attack that character's target."  Focus fire will clear a crowded field pretty quickly.

re: your warrior and getting mauled by 300 wolves.  Are you running a sword and board warrior or a dps warrior?  If you're using SnB, keep in mind that spec does not come into its own until you max out the SnB defensive talents.  Usually max out the offensive SnB talents after the defensives ones, because I've always found the SnB tank a little too squishy for my tastes in the beginning.  I set my tank to activate shield wall when "surrounded by four+ enemies" or whatever high stamina cost defensive abilities you have when swarmed. 

Regardless of what kind of warrior you're running,  if you're getting rolled by everything and its mother you need to make better use of defensive buffs, cc and terrain.  Since you do have Wynne I'd suggest having one of the tactics set to "tank being attacked by melee--use glyph of warding" and set heals to fire on your tank at 50% health, rejuv at 90%.  She's also pretty awesome as crowd control when you stack glyph of repulsion+glyph of paralysis at a choke point (mind friendly fire, if you're playing on Nightmare.)  Using those glyphs separately are also pretty nice.  I like repulsion right at the tank's feet if I need to give my tank a little breathing room from a swarm and paralysis on an enemy caster that I intend to burn down.  Find ways to create chokepoints and control the amount of incoming damage your tank has to handle at any given time so that you're not getting rolled and your tank isn't chain potting potions like no tomorrow.

Hope this helps some. 

Modifié par catofnine, 05 juillet 2011 - 01:05 .

[Norolim]

I won't be able to help you with the pre-set tactics 'casue I don't use them. IMHO micromanaging your party is much more fun, than just watching the tactical system do it for you (if you manage to set it up correctly).

As far as classes are concerned, warrior does not equal tank. Choosing warrior class does not give you a tank straight away. You have to build him into one. To do that you have to develop attributes and abilities suitable for this type of a warrior. The most important attributes for a tank are Dexterity and Strength. He needs Strengh predominantly to be able to wear the best armor, so 42 is enough. You can also build up Constitution, as this affects your warrior's hit points (20 is enough from my experience). All other attribute points should go to Dexterity, as it has a direct effect on your Defence, and Defecnce is of course critical for a tank. Your main focus with the abilities should be defence again and all those that increase hostility of creatures towards the tank, e.g. Threaten or Taunt. Your tank should be using a one-heanded weapon and a shield and therefore you should invest in Shield Style abilities. Champion is the best specialisation for a tank.

You can also build a warrior into a damage dealer. Here Strength and Willpower are the most important attributes. If you want to learn more on possible character builds read THIS excellent faq.

I usually played a party consisting of a warrior damage dealer, warrior tank, rogue damage dealer and a ranged damage dealer mage or a support mage (you won't find this one in the faq; it's my personal build).

And once again I encourage you to try switching off tactics and doing it all yourself. It's much more fun and you have no one to blame but yourself, if your ranged characters attack from melee distance.

Modifié par Norolim, 05 juillet 2011 - 02:15 .

[jamesp81]

Norolim wrote...

I won't be able to help you with the pre-set tactics 'casue I don't use them. IMHO micromanaging your party is much more fun, than just watching the tactical system do it for you (if you manage to set it up correctly).

As far as classes are concerned, warrior does not equal tank. Choosing warrior class does not give you a tank straight away. You have to build him into one. To do that you have to develop attributes and abilities suitable for this type of a warrior. The most important attributes for a tank are Dexterity and Strength. He needs Strengh predominantly to be able to wear the best armor, so 42 is enough. You can also build up Constitution, as this affects your warrior's hit points (20 is enough from my experience). All other attribute points should go to Dexterity, as it has a direct effect on your Defence, and Defecnce is of course critical for a tank. Your main focus with the abilities should be defence again and all those that increase hostility of creatures towards the tank, e.g. Threaten or Taunt. Your tank should be using a one-heanded weapon and a shield and therefore you should invest in Shield Style abilities. Champion is the best specialisation for a tank.

You can also build a warrior into a damage dealer. Here Strength and Willpower are the most important attributes. If you want to learn more on possible character builds read THIS excellent faq.

I usually played a party consisting of a warrior damage dealer, warrior tank, rogue damage dealer and a ranged damage dealer mage or a support mage (you won't find this one in the faq; it's my personal build).

And once again I encourage you to try switching off tactics and doing it all yourself. It's much more fun and you have no one to blame but yourself, if your ranged characters attack from melee distance.

Good info, good FAQ.  Thanks.

[Arthur Cousland]

I like to have Wynne heal at 75%, regeneration at 90% and force field at 50%. I prefer to heal early and often, rather than wait until it's too late and you need to spam heals to get out of the red.

Who's the 4th member other than your warden, Wynne and Leliana? Alistair makes a great tank with his weapon+shield talents. For a durable tank build, I usually go 2 strength/1 dexterity at level up until they get to 38-42 strength to equip the best armor, and then go all dexterity for high defense. If your tank isn't taking much damage, or at least is hard to kill, then less healing needed.

Also, check the wiki link in my signature. It's full of helpful dragon age info.

[TBastian]

The first part of the game is always the hardest. Tactics has little to do with it, unless you're some sort of psychic/precog. If your tactics aren't good anyway, then that's just one other complication you'll need to deal with (and that won't even make it to the list of the game's top 10 worst early game complications.)
This is because NPC AI is not very bright regardless, so try to  keep things simple. Note that there's an option that allows you to set Leliana and Wynne to RANGED on top of the tactics page.
Skills/spells/attributes are what makes a character powerful in this game, and you don't start out with a lot. As you replay the game you'll become better at optimizing your starting stats.

And yes, the encounter with the wolves is hellish for any low level party.

If you haven't discovered these already then these little tidbits should help:
1) Use your crowd-control (or "CC") skills. These can be anything from a skill that stuns, to the Sleep spell, to the warrior's Shield Bash.
A group that focuses on offense and killing monsters quickly can be more liberal with whether they should CC spam or not, otherwise you'll want to take lots of these and use them often.
2) Kite, when you can't tank things outright.
3) If you wanna play a good  tanker then know that your Defense stat is just as important as your Armor stat. Defense can prevent you from actually getting hit in the first place, and ideally you should have it at around 60 by Lothering and higher after.
4) Morrigan is actually a more effective support than Wynne at low levels, not to mention a more powerful nuker at higher levels. This is because Heal and Force Field are only 2 levels away, as far as Morrigan is concerned. Wynne shines at mid levels and killing casters with Mana Clash. You might wanna stick to Morrigan until such time that you can swap her for a Wynne with the Force Field spell.
5) Rogues may seem sucky at lower levels, but they start with the Poison-making skill. This allows them to throw flasks, which are essentially grenades. Flasks do about as much damage as a very high level mage spell - use these when you're hard pressed.
6) Give all warriors a single point in Poison-making. This also allows them to throw flasks.
7) If one of the treaty quests is giving you a hard time, leave and work on another. (Exceptions: Mage Circle Treaty and Earl Eamon's quest). All the starting areas of the other treaty quests have easier monsters and give lots of XP and good items.

Modifié par TBastian, 07 juillet 2011 - 04:09 .

[Requiesta De Silencia]

Perhaps it's your build that's the problem. Warriors aren't exactly the "best" tanks in the world...I could tank almost every boss in Awakening with a dual weapon rogue (with some elemental resistences of course).

There are two types of tanking: Take The Hit Tank or Dodge The Damage Tank (I made those names up on the spot )

A Warriors can be either of them. You can dual wield daggers going about 42 str (for medium armor) and the rest into dex, or you can go Shield pumping 26 into dex, about 50 into str (by the end of awakening) and the rest into Con. You should be able to survive a good deal of the first part of the game if you have at least 20 dex and 20 con. If you're aiming to be a tank I recommend going Champion as well (whether a dex or con tank), it gives you some Serious crowd control with War Cry.

Other then that, make sure that in your tactic's section you've assigned Wynne's and other mages/archers behaviors to be "ranged" (not sure if you already did that or if you just set up her tactics slots as ranged). Morrigan is your best support at the lowest levels of the game (just give her Heal at her first level up) though she's more "damage focused" later in the game.

And finally make sure you have a healthy set of Poultices and remember to follow the "take out the weakest first" lessons. Even if they have 1 hp left they're still attacking you, get rid of all the 1 hp targets first and leave the elites for last.

[jamesp81]

TBastian wrote...

The first part of the game is always the hardest. Tactics has little to do with it, unless you're some sort of psychic/precog. If your tactics aren't good anyway, then that's just one other complication you'll need to deal with (and that won't even make it to the list of the game's top 10 worst early game complications.)
This is because NPC AI is not very bright regardless, so try to  keep things simple. Note that there's an option that allows you to set Leliana and Wynne to RANGED on top of the tactics page.
Skills/spells/attributes are what makes a character powerful in this game, and you don't start out with a lot. As you replay the game you'll become better at optimizing your starting stats.

And yes, the encounter with the wolves is hellish for any low level party.

If you haven't discovered these already then these little tidbits should help:
1) Use your crowd-control (or "CC") skills. These can be anything from a skill that stuns, to the Sleep spell, to the warrior's Shield Bash.
A group that focuses on offense and killing monsters quickly can be more liberal with whether they should CC spam or not, otherwise you'll want to take lots of these and use them often.
2) Kite, when you can't tank things outright.
3) If you wanna play a good  tanker then know that your Defense stat is just as important as your Armor stat. Defense can prevent you from actually getting hit in the first place, and ideally you should have it at around 60 by Lothering and higher after.
4) Morrigan is actually a more effective support than Wynne at low levels, not to mention a more powerful nuker at higher levels. This is because Heal and Force Field are only 2 levels away, as far as Morrigan is concerned. Wynne shines at mid levels and killing casters with Mana Clash. You might wanna stick to Morrigan until such time that you can swap her for a Wynne with the Force Field spell.
5) Rogues may seem sucky at lower levels, but they start with the Poison-making skill. This allows them to throw flasks, which are essentially grenades. Flasks do about as much damage as a very high level mage spell - use these when you're hard pressed.
6) Give all warriors a single point in Poison-making. This also allows them to throw flasks.
7) If one of the treaty quests is giving you a hard time, leave and work on another. (Exceptions: Mage Circle Treaty and Earl Eamon's quest). All the starting areas of the other treaty quests have easier monsters and give lots of XP and good items.

I've got Alistair's defense rating sitting at 95 (to be fair, this includes Wynn's heroic defense buff, which I've got her set to use on him).  My two handed warrior's strength is at 43, 20 dex, 25 willpower.  I miss a lot.  I also use the stunning powers (critical strike and pommel strike) as often as I can, and I've got Alistair doing the same in his tactics menu (he's using shield pummel).  I also use two handed sweep for the multiple knockdown if I get surrounded.

One problem I may be having is with my party composition.  I usually take Alistair (tank), myself obviously (damage, 2 handed warrior), Wynn (healing and ranged damage), and Leliana (ranged and lockpicking).  I find that Leliana is just not very combat effective, but I feel compelled to keep her around to unlock containers.

Morrigan would be my preference from a pure combat stand point.  By the way, what are considered to be the "nuker" spells?  This is all I can think of to try, as this just is not working.

Modifié par jamesp81, 10 juillet 2011 - 01:44 .

[Fallstar]

Primary nuke is probably fireball, as it is instant cast, high damage and has a knockdown effect. It also has some dot. But I personally don't use Morrigan for that. If you're having trouble with the game, it may be due to your lack of cone of cold. That spell is absolutely broken, and can be acquired early on. Basically, it freezes anything in a cone area - even the final boss. I'd advise you to swap out Wynne for Morrigan, and get Morrigan as much +% cold dmg gear as possible. The Winter's Breath staff, ashen gloves and Robes of Posession are what you want to look out for. Then manually take control over her at the start of a fight, and freeze the toughest enemies.

[TBastian]

Try to get him to around 90 base defense. 95 defense is decent but Heroic Defense is a short term spell, relying on it for general fights is unhealthy. Heroic Defense is more of a spell you only cast when you need to step up your game (boss fights, etc).
Two-handers tend to miss a lot at low levels, this is natural until you stack enough strength points. Until then you could rely on abilities like Precise Striking. Once your strength reaches 60+ and you start equipping better gear you'll be shocked just how powerful your two-hander can be, especially if you have him flank so his attack/crit rate rises.

Leliana doesn't start out as a specialized character, so to make her as battle-worthy as you can you'll have to adjust her tactics regularly until you fully develop her fighting style (two-weapon or ranged). To help improve her lockpicking try raising your influence with her, so she gets a good boost to cunning. The best way to improve Leliana's early game is to do the first part of the Elven Treaty quest (the first two areas) so you can give her Dalish Leathers (good set, nice dex boost, really helps her early game), Leliana-specific gifts (there's an Andraste's Tear in the area) and items with +cunning. These items will maker her a decent warrior until you finish improving her lockpicking abilities. After that get Lethality (a must for Leliana). Note that Leliana also has poison-making, so whatever the case she's still valuable against bosses and difficult groups early game.

Nukes are spells which deal direct damage. Most of the game's powerful nukes are in the Primal Spells tree. There is actually no one good nuke, since to be a good nuker a mage must have lots of them. Otherwise, you're just a mage with a damaging spell.
If you're more interested in giving your support/disable mage offense options instead of actually making a nuker then the best spell to pick is indeed Cone of Cold. Cone of Cold freezes opponents, and a critical hit on a frozen opponent will shatter it (kill it in one hit). All normal mobs can be shattered, and Lieutenants have a good chance being shattered. Don't try this on bosses.

Modifié par TBastian, 10 juillet 2011 - 09:26 .