75 réponses à ce sujet

[S.A.K]

Do you consider Geth as people or just machines? Legion is a he, they or a it? And can the geth be indoctrinated?

Also will quarians be able to acquir their home world from geth without war? Legion said that quarians didn't ruin their world in the morning war and that the geth aren't staying on the surface of the world. They are acting as "caretaker" of quarian home world. Legion and Tali work together along with shepard. So I think geth and quarians can coexist as long as they undestand each other.

Modifié par S.A.K, 06 juillet 2011 - 03:15 .

[DaveExclamationMarkYognaut]

People - they are AI, after all. I think it's heavily implied that indoctrination is what happened to the geth that you fight. Legion's a "they" - a set of geth programs operating out of a unique combat platform. The Geth are probably the coolest "alien" in the Mass Effect universe because they're actually, well, alien.

[Jonathan Shepard]

They're machine-people. The most alien of all the races (excluding Reapers) due to their fast-as-light communication and infancy as a society; despite being only 300 years old, they have an extremely interesting social structure and solid views on what they should collectively do as a race. Legion is /technically/ an "it," though I consider Legion a "he," the way EDI is a "she." It's based on the voice-tones more than anything else, really. And through the "rounding error" shown in Legion's loyalty mission as the explanation for heretic Geth, Geth seem to not be affected by Indoctrination at all; at least, not in the usual sense.

[AngelicMachinery]

Geth are a people, just as any other thinking being is a people. As for gender, I'm not entirely sure... is it every explicitly stated? Is a pronoun ever used... Does Legion identify with a particular gender over the other?

[Candidate 88766]

Legion is a person. A normal AI is a person, just without a body. A single Geth however is a bit more difficult to classify. Alone, a Geth is nothing more than a VI, a computer. When they group together though the become sentient and truly intelligent. So the Geth as a whole are people, whereas a single Geth is a machine.

[TexasToast712]

 Machines. No matter how you try to pretty it up they are still manufactured creations of wires and metal.

[Gavinthelocust]

TexasToast712 wrote...

 Machines. No matter how you try to pretty it up they are still manufactured creations of wires and metal.

You're a rudimentary creature of blood and flesh.

[naledgeborn]

It's confusing.

1 Geth = 1 VI. Which is what we have now more or less.
200 + Geth = 1 AI. Which we don't have yet but is a controversial topic in of itself.
1, 183 Geth = Legion. Which is hundreds of Geth isolated in a platform that show signs of developing individuality, personality, and understanding.

How I feel about it will largely depend on how Legion and the orthodox Geth evolve and develop in ME3. For now they are "its" getting ever closer to "they" status.

[AngelicMachinery]

Gavinthelocust wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

 Machines. No matter how you try to pretty it up they are still manufactured creations of wires and metal.

You're a rudimentary creature of blood and flesh.

I  Sovereign.

[naledgeborn]

TexasToast712 wrote...

 Machines. No matter how you try to pretty it up they are still manufactured creations of wires and metal.

Wrong. They're not "machines" governed by both hardware and software like organics and AI. Geth are only software. Codex is your friend.

[thatguy212]

I consider Geth people, and Legion is a they, but i usually just call him he because he has a male voice actor, and geth can't be indoctrinated in the same way a organic lifeform could

[Sticky Controller]

@TexasToast
The human body is known as a hive. We house thousands of organisms, even though they are what make us up. Do you consider yourself a person or just a home for other lower beings? An A.I learns and grows the more it continues to exist. People do the same thing. I agree with Gavinthelocust as well. Not trying to change your opinion at all, though. Some people see more similarities in such designs. Metal casing is like our flesh. Wires can be substituted for our arteries. Machines are just far more durable. Clones are manufactured, but are organic. (Talkin' about that sheep. Doubt we will make a human clone. Too many ethics involved) Just because you can make something doesn't mean it can't be something more than a creation. Hell, millions of people in this world have something man-made inside their body.

[S.A.K]

I guess geth can be interpreted as both it or they. If we take one geth which is only about intelligent as a dog, that might be considered an "it". But when they are networked in a hardware platform increasing the overall intelligence, then it can be called a they and can be considered as people. If they ever build that Dyson Spares they will become the most intelligent beings in the galaxy. This is why I find geth so facinating. I hope Geth and Quarians can live in peace after ME3!

[Big I]

The geth are people, but from what we've seen they seem to have more in common with a hive species like the rachni than with humans/asari/etc.

[Nashiktal]

They are its, but still people. Unless the Geth somehow get private bits that exchange DNA, they have no gender.

If we call it a he, its due to our own social conventions.

[AngelicMachinery]

Nashiktal wrote...

They are its, but still people. Unless the Geth somehow get private bits that exchange DNA, they have no gender.

If we call it a he, its due to our own social conventions.

You're refering to sex, not gender.  While it is unlikely that geth would develope a gender identity I would not discount it entirely particularly if they being interacting with biological races more often.

[ISpeakTheTruth]

Geth are people. Very smart fast communicating people but people all the same.

[BatmanPWNS]

Machine because every time there killed no one really cares. Also if there was an option saying let [insert species] live or geth live. I would pick the other species unless it's the Husk or Reapers of course.

[AngelicMachinery]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Machine because every time there killed no one really cares. Also if there was an option saying let [insert species] live or geth live. I would pick the other species unless it's the Husk or Reapers of course.

Legion seems a bit upset whenthey're dying  on the suicide mission.  I think that matters more than what others think, don't you?

[ElectricZ]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Machine because every time there killed no one really cares. Also if there was an option saying let [insert species] live or geth live. I would pick the other species unless it's the Husk or Reapers of course.

Geth certainly don't understand death the way organics do -- except for Legion, they are in constant contact with their network, and if a runtime is destroyed, it can be replaced with a backup. They don't have enough experience with organics to have any empathy, or to recognize any kind of loss if one of us is killed.

I think Legion's experiences, once uploaded back to the collective, would change that. It certainly has feelings about Shepard (wearing the N7 armor) but lacks the ability to explain why. It also has spent a long time, according to the Shadow Broker file, interacting with organics over networks through games, during which time it:

got suspended repeatedly for cheating, which it successfully got overturned,
got suspended for taunting n00bz, for which it accepted punishment,
got an achievement for freeing slaves with no casualties,
bought, but did not play a game depicting the defense of Eden Prime from the heretic geth, thereby making a donation to the rebuilding of a human colony razed by his own kind,
and spent 75 hours playing (and failing miserably) an interactive inter-species relationship simulator.

So I think Legion, and possibly the geth as a whole, want to have peaceful coexistance with organics and are more than a collection of bits and bytes. What's more, of all the factions in the galaxy, they seem to be the only ones who really desire peace, their violent splinter group of heretics nonwithstanding. For my money, they're people, and worth saving in ME3.

Modifié par ElectricZ, 05 juillet 2011 - 09:07 .

[Spartanburger]

I consider them both Machines and People.

I know that they cannot be physically hurt, and due to their backup feature, cannot really die unless they are not networked.
I also know that they are sentient, and both capable of and have the right to make and follow their own decisions and goals.

[Han Shot First]

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Geth are a people, just as any other thinking being is a people. As for gender, I'm not entirely sure... is it every explicitly stated? Is a pronoun ever used... Does Legion identify with a particular gender over the other?

I think the Geth are essentially genderless. After all they don't reproduce sexually so terms like 'male' or 'female' don't really apply. If I were to talk about Legion however, I'd probably use 'he.' But only because his platform seems to have a male form and his voice sounds masculine. But is he actually male? No.

Likewise I would use 'she' when referring to EDI since she's got a feminine voice. But just as Legion isn't really male, EDI isn't really female either. She's an AI that is mimicing an organic female.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 05 juillet 2011 - 10:05 .

[The C Trayne]

geth are machines... they do not feel and only do what they are programmed to do or in the case of the geth well idk what they are doing honestly they are simply machines killing a bunch of stuff...

Legion is a cool geth and a they because he is multiple geth minds in one body

[ElectricZ]

Saphra Deden wrote...

They're not people, they're are just computer code. Well, "it" I should say. There really is no "they" it is just one huge network of geth programs that evolved beyond organic control as the result of an oversight in their design.

Geth are just faulty tools.

"Evolved" is an interesting choice of word...

Upon their creation, the geth were just simple tools, but they changed into something more. They/it are now a thinking, self-aware, possibly feeling entity.

We started out as strands of protein in a primordial sea of organic material. That was our humble beginning, our organic computer code. Maybe foolishly, we're tinkering with that code to engineer organisms that can create biofuel, clean up our messes, and cure disease. Someday we may create something that can think and reason, or even reproduce. At what point does it have rights, I can't tell you...

But if 300 years later it's still around, forming its own ideas about society, culture and struggling to find its place in the universe alongside the rest of us, I'd say we'd have to ask them to join the club. After all, we didn't start out any better.

It doesn't matter how the geth came to be, or why they were built. It's what they are now that matters.

*Now being 2185, of course.