178 réponses à ce sujet

[Kilshrek]

erynnar wrote...

ROFL!!!  If only the voices had paid rent while they were whispering.

Holy! I'ma call my lawyer right now!

Think I could rope Bioware in on the case, after all it was their product which gave me such emotional distress and led me to cause self harm.

I kid. But the idea of the whispering voices paying rent.... if I got  ten dollars per voice, per day.....

[OmegaBlue0231]

Nope. I actually liked it more than origins, mostly because I never have to play that damned deeproads part again.

[IrishSpectre257]

I didn't have to. I was enjoying the game. I wasn't under the illusion that it was better than Origins, or even close to being as good, but I didn't regret my purchase.

[TEWR]

Yrkoon wrote...

Regarding the combat: I can easily see both sides of the argument, because it really is a mixed bag. But despite the "smoothness", "responsiveness", "speed", and all the other things people liked about DA2's combat, I still prefer Origins'.

Reasons: The tactical camera, the finishing moves (c'mon people, how can you NOT prefer the detailed, realistic decapitations and finishing moves of the first game?), and while it's not directly combat related, having a real choice on what you can wear and equip DOES translate to funner combat. I like my dual-wielding warriors. I like being able to switch weapons on the fly. I like the fact that my mage can swing swords, and pepper people from a distance with arrows from his bow. ALL of this is gone in DA2. And that makes a huge difference for me.

I've proposed a few times on the forums (and possibly this thread. I dunno) that Bioware should do class Specific Executions, all different.


Dual Wielding Rogue: Grabs the enemy and slits their throat
Archer: fires a critical hit at the foe's eye, which you can see protruding upon their death
S&S: Dismemberment of a limb or decapitation
Mage: Dependant on the element of the staff. Immolation, Electrocution, Freezing, Poison, Hades style soul steal. By Hades I mean GoW3's Hades.
2H: Stab the enemy in the stomach akin to what Sten could do.


As for armor, agreed. I've proposed that bioware create companion specific armor. It allows for us to still customize their look whilst still giving them a unique appearance. Hell they could even make their ultimate armor be the armor you'd see them wearing in the future. Like how Morrigan always wears her robes in Witch Hunt even if you gave her something else.

But.... mages should only use swords if they're an Arcane Warrior, which is an almost forgotten art known only by a few people, two of whom are dead.

[Yrkoon]

SSH83 wrote...

DA2 is a great game. I thoroughly enjoyed it and my only complaint was the unsatisfying ending. It's just too different from DA:O and thus the backlash.  If you give them the same thing, they demand innovation.  If you give them innovation, they demand the same old.  You just can't please some people.

Really?  The "innovations" argument again?

Contrary to the grotesquely over-perpetuated myth, most people embrace true innovation.  And most people love sinking their teeth into "new" things in a sequel.

But we didn't get that with DA2.   Instead,  We got cut corners.  We  got  the  "less-is-more" mentality of game development.  We got things that were stripped down from pillar to post.   We got streamlines and dumb-downs,  We got stuff  *removed* not innovated.  And while there was a small handful of things that were improved upon  (and even mentioned on this very thread), they are buried beneath the ocean  of everything else that wasn't "innovated"  at all.    THAT is the reason for the backlash  (and the dismal sales, btw)

As a  member of the "some people" crowd you're pretending to speak for, let me just say:  Yes, I  *CAN* be pleased.   Rather easily, in fact.  But its going to take a little more effort than what  Bioware recently slapped together and  deigned to call a sequel.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 08 juillet 2011 - 05:27 .

[erynnar]

Yrkoon wrote...

SSH83 wrote...

DA2 is a great game. I thoroughly enjoyed it and my only complaint was the unsatisfying ending. It's just too different from DA:O and thus the backlash.  If you give them the same thing, they demand innovation.  If you give them innovation, they demand the same old.  You just can't please some people.

Really?  The "innovations" argument again?

Contrary to the grotesquely over-perpetuated myth, most people embrace true innovation.  And most people love sinking their teeth into "new" things in a sequel.

But we didn't get that with DA2.   Instead,  We got cut corners.  We  got  the  "less-is-more" mentality of game development.  We got things that were stripped down from pillar to post.   We got streamlines and dumb-downs,  We got stuff  *removed* not innovated.  And while there was a small handful of things that were improved upon  (and even mentioned on this very thread), they are buried beneath the ocean  of everything else that wasn't "innovated"  at all.    THAT is the reason for the backlash  (and the dismal sales, btw)

As a  member of the "some people" crowd you're pretending to speak for, let me just say:  Yes, I  *CAN* be pleased.   Rather easily, in fact.  But Bioware failed to with their latest game.

This^ mostly. That "afraid of change" or "just not bright enough to catch the innovations" argument is now bordering on the ridiculous.

[MJRick]

I thought it was alot better then origins.

[standardpack]

1: The f**king corporate scumbags didn't let the creators take long enough to make the game as epic as it could/should have been

2: Waves, changes to past companions, reused maps hindered my enjoyement while playing.

3: I just couldn't relate to Hawke as I did to the Warden as much as I should have.

I guess my peeves are all about preferences mostly. For Origins I can't remember how many times I replayed it, all the way through Awakenings and Witch Hunt. In DA 2 so far I have only finished one play through, I started a couple other games for different classes but I just can't get into it as much as I did to Origins. Though I did like the fact that you could change Hawke's face in the middle of the game... AFTER buying a dlc of course.

[Syonica]

Horrible game. This was the only time in my life I was inspired to actually create an account on the company forums corresponding to the game to express my sincere hatred and sheer angry of spending 60 bucks towards this game.

If I only I knew the entire game took place in a bland little city in the first place. Seems like it should be a 3rd parter developer title.

[PinkShoes]

I dont hate the game i really dont its a good soild game, its FINE. But Origins was such an amazing game that DA2 just falls short.

But yes i did try and convince myself it was a good game because DAO is my favouite damn game i love it so much. Sometimes playing DA2 isnt fun...its more like work.

[nicethugbert]

I told my self that in some respects better, some worse, some standard. The increased attack and response speed is really important to me. Without it, I'd consider the game worse than DAO as it would be just about the same in many other respects.

[StartOrange]

The game was not what I expected after playing DA:O.

That being said, I still thought it was a fantastic game and I enjoyed it from the start to the very end.

Sure, it was sad with so many re-used areas, but it had so many other strong points that it was easily overlooked in my case.

[Valus]

I did actually trick myself into thinking this was a decent game for about the first week after finishing it. I tried really hard to defend the original way the story was told and the narration. Fact was I didn't care for either. I can still say both are positive points of the game but totally eclipsed by all the rubbish one has to try and ignore in order to fully enjoy them. I was die-hard about the direction DA:O was taking RPGs that at first I wasn't able/unwilling to process that DA2 was a bad game. I also felt kind of bad since I personally got about 8 coworkers to go out and buy DA:O, they loved it, and now were probably playing/hating DA2 (they did and they did). Not saying it's terrible game although largely undeserving of any real praise. There is nothing good about the game, plenty of things that are ok, and a few things that are just terrible. Just saying it's a bad game and 2 steps back from the 1 step forward that DA:O took. Thankfully we have the Witcher franchise to fall back on.

[Steingrimur Steingrimsson]

Actually, I think it was pretty much the opposite. I had had this very, very, very bad feeling in my gut ever since I played the demo and it prevailed throughout the entire complete game, probably making me more skeptical than the game deserved. But one thing is for certain: the ending was complete and utter dung.

[Lord Gremlin]

Yes... My story is similar to OP. Bought Signature Edition.
But I've completed DA2 without switching to other games as I expected a very impressive ending and some major choice to make in the ending.
I was disappointed. As the time passes I can judge it more honestly. DA2 is somewhere between bad and mediocre. This is not the point however, the point is when compared to Origins it was just garbage.
And the most impressive thing is that Origins was so great, so awesome, that it literally took me MONTHS to finally admit DA2 was garbage.
Seriously, I kept praising and defending DA2 for some time after finishing it. I hated gameplay, ending, everything, but I loved Origins so much I kept defending sequel.

And BTW, thank you bduff4545. You actually made me think about it. Now I know why a lot of people said Bioware "betrayed" them... It was not about betraying aka making a different game. It was about selling a bad-mediocre game as a sequel to a masterpiece and profiting from it.

[Cutlasskiwi]

Nope, I like the game. A game that I'm still having fun with after several playthroughs I would be hard-pressed to call bad.

[Feraele]

Yrkoon wrote...

True story:  I not only  managed to convince myself it was a good game, but even after  being bored to tears with the recycled  maps and the endless waves, I managed to convince myself that  it was a deliberate part of the narrative.,.. that Varric was trying to Bore Cassanda to sleep so that he could escape and then the  *real* part of  Dragon age 2 would begin.   I half expected  Cassandra to  cut varric off, mid-sentence, and say something to the effect of:  "Bullsh*t, Dwarf, stop  repeating yourself already and tell me something NEW.

But when it didn't happen, I suddenly came to the realization that this  game was  NOT that good.  That it was something very VERY alien to Bioware: a bad, uninspired, uncreative, game.

Maybe that's why I can't even finish my first run through...my brain is refusing to accept it lol.

[jds1bio]

Yes, I told myself this.

[bduff4545]

go to my OP I edited it so it has a review now, the reviewer actually has most to all my viewpoints about the game.

[Abispa]

To be honest, I enjoyed it and played more that I have DA:O and DA:A. Even though I believe that DA:O was a far better representation of "old-school" RPG than DA2 was a showcase for the "new" RPG. MOST of my play-throughs were fun despite some obvious stupid Templar moments, but...

While metagaming and making choices that I don't make with my "real" characters, I discovered a whole host for truly awful moments that would stretch credulity well past the breaking point.

For instance, I would NEVER have thought of trying to turn in Anders to Cullen in Act III, and when I found out I could... well... sort of. The stupidity of the scene that followed would make me want to give game no more than two stars on principle alone.

[oldmansavage]

Yrkoon wrote...

SkittlesKat96 wrote...


EDIT: I refuse to believe anyone who says the Witcher games are any better than Dragon Age II though (well actually The Witcher I and II are slightly better but I suppose it comes down to personal preference) The Witcher was just such a drag for me to play and I still haven't finished The Witcher II (but I am enjoying it and I did enjoy the Witcher just not as much as I did DA II)

 I hesitate to even compare the two games  (TW2 vs. DA2) because they're so deliberately different from one another.  But when someone forces me to stack them together and make a comparison,  then YES, I'd say  the Witcher 2  is heads and shoulders above DA2.  It just does so many things so much better:  story, atmosphere, style, pacing,  Even the sex scenes are more memorable.

DA2 wins points on the fact that it's more "classic"  (it's party based,  more classes, more spell choices, more combat talent choices, more interesting loot)  But  even THAT stuff isn't enough to  make things equal.  Not when it fails so horribly  in its  presentation, and game world choices, and story...   you know, the fundamental things that we RPG fans look for in an RPG.

Hahah I ;thought when she called bull**** on varric that was Bioware's way of poking fun at lame action games.  But then my heart sunk when i realized it was the actual gameplay.

[Rann]

I absolutely detested it on my first playthrough, which began right after I completed my third playthrough of DA:O and DA:A. I realized that some it that had to do with simple comparison to DA:O, which was (IMO) the new highwater mark for RPGs, particularly in combat, so I forced myself to reinstall it and play again. It was better, but still not fun.

With patch 1.03, and lacking any other game that I felt like playing, I decided to play DA2 one more time, and I think it's now at a point where, if I'd never heard about DA:O, I would have had a strong positive feel for the game. (I'd still grumble about reuse of maps and waves of enemies, but there was stuff to grumble about in DA:O too.) I'm pretty sure that it's not just familiarity causing this new, somewhat grudging acceptance; I played Leliana's Song for the first time, right before starting my third DA2 pass and I quite enjoyed it, so I can safely say that I can enjoy a patched DA2 even when following a DA:O-like playthrough (though DA:O still feels superior to me). I can't say the same for NWN2, for example -- despite my earlier love of that game, playing it after playing DA:O is simply impossible for me due to the combat system differences -- DA2 is closer to DA:O than NWN2 is.

[Iakus]

I thought it was "pretty good" Not great. Certainly not Origins great. But I'm not sorry I bought it. I just hope that in DA3, the player can have more of an impact on the story.

[MonkeyKaboom]

The biggest problem with DA2 is that it had to follow DA:O. The combat I liked much better. I wish they had kept the larger level of class customization, even though a lot of skills in DA:O were pretty useless, but it was the choice to be useless. That said, the team interaction was much improved. I just don't think DA is a good idea anymore. The whole concept of telling a story about the world of Thedas, its just a bad idea. Why? Because how do you top the story of the warden? The ME universe works because its a continuation of a grand story across the trilogy. DA is too disjointed. Its just too difficult to have a strong central plot for a game series such as this, when the plots have very little to do with each other. The best to pull it off so far, I feel, has been Bethesda. Elder Scrolls is essentially the same idea BW is trying to do with DA. Telling the story in a number of different lands. The difference though is for starters its sandbox game vs more linear game. And that further means that really, none of the ES games had a REALLY strong central plot. Yes there was one, but the games were really more about doing your own thing, guilds, etc. DA is trying to do that. But it went from a strong central story, to paperboy 2.0. Its like Saving Private Ryan is followed up by the chronicles of Gomer Pyle. Compared to the HoF, Hawke is just amateur. Honestly, Awakening would have been the better choice for a sequel. It had all the makings of a good story had they chosen to really flesh it out.

[Cutlasskiwi]

bduff4545 wrote...

This guy actually made me realize that I've been telling myself it was BETTER than Origins listen to this guuy's review I found today: 

Is that guy serious? When I saw the title "Angry Review" I started to wonder if it would be a serious review but I started to listen nonetheless. Then stopped when he started talking about the characters being emo, whiny, ****ty and from Final Fantasy. And the game being a sausage fest.

Sure he had some valid points and complaints before that but I just can't take it seriously.