1476 réponses à ce sujet

[AVPen]

rapscallioness wrote...

The main thing is, imo, that the VS doesn't believe Shep was dead...and brought back. Understandable. The VS glazes right over that whole I was dead and brought back part, and goes right to Cerberus.

Kaidan: "Why didn't you try to contact me?! Why didn't you let me know you were alive?!"

Shepard: "Hey, not my choice! I spent the last two years nearly dead and in some kind of coma while Cerberus rebuilt me against my will and...."

Kaidan: "Wait........ you're with Cerberus now?!?!" 

Garrus: *facepalms, "Aw crap, this meeting is gonna suck."

Modifié par AVPen, 31 juillet 2011 - 02:50 .

[AVPen]

Made Nightwing wrote...

whywhywhywhy wrote...

Made Nightwing wrote...
Ah yes, "Speculation", the theory that we can assume what happened/would have happened from a limited amount of evidence. We have dismissed that claim

  What's speculated ?  If Shepard doesn't complete the actions in ME2 what happens ?  Thank you.

Just saying that Shep's badass enough to succeed. Without Cerberus backing him up, he could get more support from the Council and Alliance. Possibly. Like I said, speculation.

More support than "jacksh*t nothing"?
So, what, that would be "nada" or "bubkus"? 

[whywhywhywhy]

rapscallioness wrote...

Well, obviously we didn't get alot options because that's the way it was made.

But..in pretend world....if it was reversed and it was the VS I saw w/ Cerberus, etc. I'd have a whole lot of questions. It would have been a long conversation.

The main thing is, imo, that the VS doesn't believe Shep was dead...and brought back. Understandable. The VS glazes right over that whole I was dead and brought back part, and goes right to Cerberus.

But in thinking of the questions I would ask if it were reversed...honestly, I don't know what else Shep could say.

In the first mtg. the whole "It's been too long" bit. Yeah it's cringe worthy, but think about it. Shepard knows it's been 2 years. Heck, the VS coulda moved on; gotten married, maybe even have a kid. I don't see Shepard just breaking out cooing all over the VS like they just saw each other a couple of days ago. There's a very good chance it might not have been welcomed. Awkward.

My Shep told the VS that she was not working for Cerberus. Trying to stop the Collectors, but that doesn't mean I answer to them. And in return the VS went on abt how Cerberus was manipulating Shep w/ the threat of the Reapers...yada, yada. How do you argue w/ something like that? "No, I'm not being manipulated."

And even if the VS actually entertained the idea that maybe, just maybe Shep was telling the truth, and really was brought back from the dead, what kinda answers could Shep give?
VS: "Well, how did they get your body?
Shep: "I dunno."
VS: "How did they bring you back to life?"
Shep: "I dunno."

It was already established that Shep was there fighting off yet another seemingly mythical group that was abducting colonists. VS thinks Cerberus is behind it, and yet there's Shep trying to stop it.

My Shep also said, "You know me. You know I wouldn't do this unless it was for a good reason."
VS..."I don't know who either of us is anymore." Okay. Well, hell. "You've betrayed..." What? No..Oh, God.

Shep has no answers. Shep was dead and woke up in a Cerberus station. The how and why's, who knows. Is Cerberus behind the attacks? I don't think so, but who knows w/ these guys. Are the Reapers Really involved? Maybe? (at that point we didn't really know) But the Collector's definitely were...and Shep is there trying to stop them. Other than that Shep has no answers to give the VS. And no other way to help these colonists.

The Alliance already turned its back. The Council was tepid at best. Of course, we have TIM to thank for that. He put enuf info out that ppl already had their minds made up. That closed the doors for Shep, which is exactly what TIM wanted. It was like a hostage situation. TIM was holding the colonists hostage. Work with him, or you know they'll all die to the Collectors if you wait around for the Alliance to decide if they believe you.

At no point, however, did my Shep forget who she was working with. At no point did she ever trust Cerberus. Understandably, nobody believes Shep was brought back from the dead. Although, it's the truth, but where does that leave Shep? And how does Shepard explain stuff that even Shepard doesn't understand?

@bolded part, they discover the husks and that provides the link to the reapers.  So he did know. That further proves your point, great post btw.

Modifié par whywhywhywhy, 31 juillet 2011 - 03:15 .

[rapscallioness]

But as far as trying to restore the trust between Shepard and the VS, may be something simple during the trial scene.

Idk what role the VS is going to play in Shepard's trial, but I could see them having to testify in some way since they are eyewitnesses to both the Collectors and Shep being w/ Cerberus.

After the Alliance confiscates the Normandy, they could easily find that lil pic of the VS on Shep's desk. If they didn't know there was some kind of ...special relations between Shep and VS...they know now.

That would make them look askance at anything the VS would have to say abt. Shep. Perhaps, if VS testifies...in support of Shep....the "prosecution" brings up the special relations in order to discount the VS testimony.

The VS is peppered and pushed abt. the relationship until, yes, finally some kinda "Yes, I love/loved Shepard...I still do" statement comes out of their mouth. In front of everybody the VS stands by his love. There's the obligatory courtroom buzz, and my Shepard's heart melts a lil bit.

Quick and easy.

(shoot, but what if VS really thinks we're crazy as heck and/or murderous? Still believes we went awol to work for Cerberus? We're a traitor? What kind of evidence could come out to prove otherwise...and convince the VS?)

Edit: btw thanx @why:wizard:. It was like 2:00 in the morning when I wrote that. I had no idea if any of it made any sense..lol.

Modifié par rapscallioness, 31 juillet 2011 - 04:49 .

[MACharlie1]

I know it's unpopular but I really like the idea of the VS being a Reaper sleeper agent...

But only if there is an option to "turn them back". But even then...I'd still like the idea. It'd be a gutsy move on Bioware's part.

[Sepewrath]

Not really that's about as cliche as they can get. And if they were going to try and pull that, it would be a cop out to be able to "turn them back" either go full bore and make Shepard kill them or don't do it.

[Goneaviking]

laecraft wrote...

Concerning VS and the trial. VS is aboard the Normandy when the Reapers invade, and we know that the Reapers invade during the trial. It naturally follows that VS is not present during the trial.

Which is strange. What is VS during on board of the Normandy, when they should be testifying? I have no doubts that Shepard's association with Cerberus is going to be brought up during the trial, and VS will be asked to testify as the sole Alliance witness during the Collectors' attack.

Unless VS testified, then quickly exited the courtroom, ignoring the surprised looks of everyone present, and then quickly boarded the Normandy (the timing is odd, too - I doubt Shepard's trial is going to take that long, since it's the opening scene).

Then there is a question of what, exactly, is VS doing aboard the Normandy. It's a rather strange behavior for the independent person whose life is not a satellite to revolve around Shepard.

[snip]

Although it's conceivable that the justice system has been streamlined in a pretty spectactular way it's worth remembering that in today's world a homicide trial is rarely (ever?) concluded in one day (barring a guilty plea). A trial for killing hundreds of thousands of people? For the man who avenged Eden Prime and saved the Citadel?

It's unlikely that they'll be finished that in one day. People giving testimony like the VS, or forensic scientists, psychiatrists, terrorist experts, researchers in prothean technologies and so on aren't going to put their lives and careers on hold for months when they'll only need to take the stand once or twice. They also aren't going to be allowed to sit in on the trial given that what they see or hear could colour their future testimony.

If VS is on Normandy during the attack then they've probably either given evidence on an earlier date, or their presence hasn't been requested yet.

Anyway, that's how I see it.

[Iakus]

MACharlie1 wrote...

I know it's unpopular but I really like the idea of the VS being a Reaper sleeper agent...

But only if there is an option to "turn them back". But even then...I'd still like the idea. It'd be a gutsy move on Bioware's part.

Oh, please no!

ME 2 dragged the VS through the mud quite enough, thankyouverymuch.Having them working for the Reapers, even unwillingly, is just too much.  The VS gets enough hate as it is.

[Volus Warlord]

Hardcore rage bangin'.

Also, leave that "sleeper agent" nonsense in BSG where it belongs.

[Badpie]

iakus wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

I know it's unpopular but I really like the idea of the VS being a Reaper sleeper agent...

But only if there is an option to "turn them back". But even then...I'd still like the idea. It'd be a gutsy move on Bioware's part.

Oh, please no!

ME 2 dragged the VS through the mud quite enough, thankyouverymuch.Having them working for the Reapers, even unwillingly, is just too much.  The VS gets enough hate as it is.

Word.

...that's really all I have right now.

Okay I think it's a mutual trust issue here.  Both Shepard and Ash/Kaidan have their reasons for being.... awkward... at the beginning of ME3.  Ash/Kaidan were too off the handle with their emotions and Shepard didn't really have a proper explanation because honestly I feel like s/he was still figuring it out for him/herself.

I really think it's a matter of:

"Sorry"
"Me too"
"So are we good?"
"Yeah.  We're good."


EDIT:  Bioware, I just wrote that scene for you.  You're welcome. 

Modifié par Badpie, 01 août 2011 - 05:03 .

[Dariustwinblade]

NO! You may like the VS enough to have them in your squad by some people loathe them. And would gladly take the chance of shoving them through the nearest Airlock.

I refuse to have the VS especially Ash in my team, I begged Anderson not to have her. What happened afteward? No amount of apology will make me trust them.

[Siansonea]

Dariustwinblade wrote...

NO! You may like the VS enough to have them in your squad by some people loathe them. And would gladly take the chance of shoving them through the nearest Airlock.

I refuse to have the VS especially Ash in my team, I begged Anderson not to have her. What happened afteward? No amount of apology will make me trust them.

So let me get this straight:

YOU go to work for a criminal organization. 

Ash says "You're working for a criminal organization?! Really?!"

And that earns Ashley the airlock? 

I can't decide if that's psychopathy or just immaturity, but both are very unappealing. <_<

[whywhywhywhy]

jreezy wrote...

whywhywhywhy wrote...

Made Nightwing wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Made Nightwing wrote...

whywhywhywhy wrote...

Made Nightwing wrote...
Ah yes, "Speculation", the theory that we can assume what happened/would have happened from a limited amount of evidence. We have dismissed that claim

  What's speculated ?  If Shepard doesn't complete the actions in ME2 what happens ?  Thank you.

Just saying that Shep's badass enough to succeed. Without Cerberus backing him up, he could get more support from the Council and Alliance. Possibly. Like I said, speculation.

The council that didn't dare risk war with the terminus systems? The alliance that had no idea about the seeker swarms? (which would've rendered any attempt at aid null?)

Could have heard about a brilliant salarian scientist working on Omega. Backed up by an Alliance frigate, and Operations Chief Williams detatched under his command, Shepard could have done everything the same way. Could. It's a possibility.

That's speculation.  See the difference

jreezy wrote...

I could've sworn that it was established
that Ashley was out of line on Horizon.

Your correct it has been.
Siansonea Shepard is just being stubborn.(She's a Shepard hater ) so we're being a bit silly now.

Where does her hate come from exactly? What has Shepard done to the VS that would warrant such hatred? She actually seems to hate Shepard more than the VS does and I find that more than a little strange.

I think it's from a IRL parellel of a popular guy who screwed her over and/or had lots of girls fawning over him.  Hits too close to home, so she sides with Ash the only female that has issue with our hero over the two games.

Modifié par whywhywhywhy, 01 août 2011 - 04:17 .

[Siansonea]

[quote]whywhywhywhy wrote...
[quote]jreezy wrote...


I could've sworn that it was established that Ashley was out of line on Horizon.[/quote]
Your correct it has been.
Siansonea Shepard is just being stubborn.(She's a Shepard hater ) so we're being a bit silly now.

[quote]Where does her hate come from exactly? What has Shepard done to the VS that would warrant such hatred? She actually seems to hate Shepard more than the VS does and I find that more than a little strange.


[/quote]


I think it's from a IRL parellel of a popular guy who screwed her over and/or had lots of girls fawning over him.  Hit's too close to home, so she sides with Ash the only female that has issue with our hero over the two games.
[/quote][/quote]


Hold the phone, kids. Hit the brakes, stop in the name of love, and check yourself before you wreck yourself. Are you really speculating on my motives for "hating" Shepard? Really? I hope none of you are psychology majors, because, well, FAIL.


Here's how I see it. You kids saw the scene on Horizon play out, saw Ashley attack "you", got mad at Ashley, looked at each other and said "b¡tches be hasslin' me, man, amirite?" and "established" that "Ashley was out of line". Because all you can see is Shepard's point of view. Even though Ashley could have no knowledge of what's really been going on since Shepard woke up, and couldn't be expected to believe half of what Shepard says even if it's the truth as Shepard sees it, (resurrection? REALLY.) you expect Ashley to just jump on board the Shepard Derp Train™. You're so identified with the player character that any character who takes an accusatory tone with "you" will be harshly judged and tossed out the nearest airlock, because Heaven forbid they might actually have a point.


And furthermore, there is no "Siansonea Shepard". I do not invest my own personality into the player character. I play them as distinct individuals, which is why I have so many different types of Shepards, from complete Paragon goody-two-shoes to pure psychopath Renegades. It is not me that's up there on the screen, which is why I can look at Shepard from a reasonably objective point of view, and evaluate what the other characters say to Shepard without too much emotional investment getting in the way of logic. 


You all should try that sometime. Or switch majors. In any case, stop speculating about my psychological profile, because I can pretty much guarantee that you'll be off the mark. You simply don't have enough information. 

Modifié par Siansonea II, 01 août 2011 - 04:13 .

[whywhywhywhy]

Siansonea II wrote...
Hold the phone, kids. Hit the brakes, stop in the name of love, and check yourself before you wreck yourself. Are you really speculating on my motives for "hating" Shepard? Really? I hope none of you are psychology majors, because, well, FAIL.


Here's how I see it. You kids saw the scene on Horizon play out, saw Ashley attack "you", got mad at Ashley, looked at each other and said "b¡tches be hasslin' me, man, amirite?" and "established" that "Ashley was out of line". Because all you can see is Shepard's point of view. Even though Ashley could have no knowledge of what's really been going on since Shepard woke up, and couldn't be expected to believe half of what Shepard says even if it's the truth as Shepard sees it, (resurrection? REALLY.) you expect Ashley to just jump on board the Shepard Derp Train™. You're so identified with the player character that any character who takes an accusatory tone with "you" will be harshly judged and tossed out the nearest airlock, because Heaven forbid they might actually have a point.


And furthermore, there is no "Siansonea Shepard". I do not invest my own personality into the player character. I play them as distinct individuals, which is why I have so many different types of Shepards, from complete Paragon goody-two-shoes to pure psychopath Renegades. It is not me that's up there on the screen, which is why I can look at Shepard from a reasonably objective point of view, and evaluate what the other characters say to Shepard without too much emotional investment getting in the way of logic. 


You all should try that sometime. Or switch majors. In any case, stop speculating about my psychological profile, because I can pretty much guarantee that you'll be off the mark. You simply don't have enough information. 

I tried to read that but my eyes keep turning the words to blah blah blah, you might as well be talking about shoe shopping.

[Siansonea]

whywhywhywhy wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...
Hold the phone, kids. Hit the brakes, stop in the name of love, and check yourself before you wreck yourself. Are you really speculating on my motives for "hating" Shepard? Really? I hope none of you are psychology majors, because, well, FAIL.


Here's how I see it. You kids saw the scene on Horizon play out, saw Ashley attack "you", got mad at Ashley, looked at each other and said "b¡tches be hasslin' me, man, amirite?" and "established" that "Ashley was out of line". Because all you can see is Shepard's point of view. Even though Ashley could have no knowledge of what's really been going on since Shepard woke up, and couldn't be expected to believe half of what Shepard says even if it's the truth as Shepard sees it, (resurrection? REALLY.) you expect Ashley to just jump on board the Shepard Derp Train™. You're so identified with the player character that any character who takes an accusatory tone with "you" will be harshly judged and tossed out the nearest airlock, because Heaven forbid they might actually have a point.


And furthermore, there is no "Siansonea Shepard". I do not invest my own personality into the player character. I play them as distinct individuals, which is why I have so many different types of Shepards, from complete Paragon goody-two-shoes to pure psychopath Renegades. It is not me that's up there on the screen, which is why I can look at Shepard from a reasonably objective point of view, and evaluate what the other characters say to Shepard without too much emotional investment getting in the way of logic. 


You all should try that sometime. Or switch majors. In any case, stop speculating about my psychological profile, because I can pretty much guarantee that you'll be off the mark. You simply don't have enough information. 

I tried to read that but my eyes keep turning the words to blah blah blah, you might as well be talking about shoe shopping.

Gee, and usually you're so rational and objective.

That's sarcasm, by the way. 

[whywhywhywhy]

Siansonea II wrote...

whywhywhywhy wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...
Hold the phone, kids. Hit the brakes, stop in the name of love, and check yourself before you wreck yourself. Are you really speculating on my motives for "hating" Shepard? Really? I hope none of you are psychology majors, because, well, FAIL.


Here's how I see it. You kids saw the scene on Horizon play out, saw Ashley attack "you", got mad at Ashley, looked at each other and said "b¡tches be hasslin' me, man, amirite?" and "established" that "Ashley was out of line". Because all you can see is Shepard's point of view. Even though Ashley could have no knowledge of what's really been going on since Shepard woke up, and couldn't be expected to believe half of what Shepard says even if it's the truth as Shepard sees it, (resurrection? REALLY.) you expect Ashley to just jump on board the Shepard Derp Train™. You're so identified with the player character that any character who takes an accusatory tone with "you" will be harshly judged and tossed out the nearest airlock, because Heaven forbid they might actually have a point.


And furthermore, there is no "Siansonea Shepard". I do not invest my own personality into the player character. I play them as distinct individuals, which is why I have so many different types of Shepards, from complete Paragon goody-two-shoes to pure psychopath Renegades. It is not me that's up there on the screen, which is why I can look at Shepard from a reasonably objective point of view, and evaluate what the other characters say to Shepard without too much emotional investment getting in the way of logic. 


You all should try that sometime. Or switch majors. In any case, stop speculating about my psychological profile, because I can pretty much guarantee that you'll be off the mark. You simply don't have enough information. 

I tried to read that but my eyes keep turning the words to blah blah blah, you might as well be talking about shoe shopping.

Gee, and usually you're so rational and objective.

That's sarcasm, by the way. 

Just because it's stated sarcastically, doesn't make it any less true
Been under the weather the past few days I don't have the same energy. This is all off topic so if we want to fuss/fight at each other we should probably take it to pm.  ding ding ding  In this corner we have "Siansonea Shepard II"....

[whywhywhywhy]

laecraft wrote...

Concerning VS and the trial. VS is aboard the Normandy when the Reapers invade, and we know that the Reapers invade during the trial. It naturally follows that VS is not present during the trial.

Which is strange. What is VS during on board of the Normandy, when they should be testifying? I have no doubts that Shepard's association with Cerberus is going to be brought up during the trial, and VS will be asked to testify as the sole Alliance witness during the Collectors' attack.

Unless VS testified, then quickly exited the courtroom, ignoring the surprised looks of everyone present, and then quickly boarded the Normandy (the timing is odd, too - I doubt Shepard's trial is going to take that long, since it's the opening scene).

Then there is a question of what, exactly, is VS doing aboard the Normandy. It's a rather strange behavior for the independent person whose life is not a satellite to revolve around Shepard.

I am struck by the uncanny vision...

* * *

VS: *having just testified, calmly sits in their seat, waiting for the trial to be over*

(Suddenly, VS hears someone in their mind - a thousand of voices speak in union.)

Reapers: (GET OUT OF THIS PLANET NOW. THE TIME OF OUR ARRIVAL HAS COME. IF YOU STAY, YOU WILL BECOME A CASUALTY. WE STILL NEED YOU.)

VS: !

VS: (How much time do I have left? The trial will be over in a few minutes. If I leave now, it will be suspicious.)

Reapers: (THE TIME FOR HUMANITY IS OVER. WE ARE IN THE SYSTEM OF YOUR HOMEWORLD. WE ARE HERE.)

VS: Excuse me, I need to leave the courtroom. Open the doors.

(The judge falls silent in the middle of asking another question. Everyone turns his head to look at VS.)

Executor: *scandalized look* This is a closed processing. No one may leave the courtroom until the trial is over. If you need to use the bathroom, it's over there.

VS: I'm on an urgent mission. This is Citadel business.

Executor: If you would just wait for a few minutes? The trial will be over soon.

VS: This trial is a farce, and I will not take part in it any longer! I'm a Spectre - open the doors, now! Let me out. Let me out!

Shepard: *gives VS an odd look*

Executor: Very well. Let the Spectre out.

VS: *runs out of the courtroom*

Judge: The Spectre seems emotionally unbalanced. Are we sure that we can accept a testimony of such a person?

(Meanwhile, outside, VS is trying to find a ship to leave the Earth.)

VS: I just need a quick pick-up. Right now. Is it so much to ask for?

Alliance captain: We're under orders to stay on the orbit until the trial is over. Everyone is on edge - the Earth, the Council, the non-Council species. We're on high alert here. Just wait until the sentence is passed, and then we'll be coming to pick everyone up. What's the rush, anyway?

VS: This is Council business. I can't share the details. I need you to come and pick me up RIGHT NOW.

Alliance Captain: *tone becomes cold* Well, this is an Alliance ship, and I am a commanding officer. We're sorry to inform the Council that we're unable to comply right now. Your demands are unreasonable, and the Council's orders do not override the commands of our military.

VS: *interrupts the connection*

VS: Dammit! I need a ship without a captain. Where would I find such a thing?

VS: ...

VS: But of course.

VS: *click* Normandy? I'm coming on board. I need to safeguard the evidence.

The Normandy: Will be coming to pick you up in two minutes. Be aware that we're not allowed to leave the orbit until the direct orders of the admiral -

VS: (I cannot leave the orbit! What should I do?)

Reapers: (THE ASSAULT TROOPS WILL IGNORE YOUR VESSEL. LEAVE THE GROUND, AND YOUR CHANCES FOR SURVIVAL WILL IMPROVE. YOU WILL NOT PERISH IN THE CHAOS OF THE INVASION.)

VS: Of course, of course. I don't need to leave the orbit. Hurry up, now!

(a while later...)

VS: (This is just great, now. This ship has an AI, and it won't listen to me! We're coming back to the Earth to pick up Shepard. Now what am I supposed to do?)

Reapers: (THIS IS AN EXCELLENT OPPORTUNITY. YOU MUST BECOME SHEPARD'S MOST TRUSTED ADVISER. FOLLOWING YOUR COUNCIL, HE WILL LEAD THE GALAXY TO ITS DOOM.)

VS: (There is a little problem with that. I don't think that Shepard trusts me anymore.)

Reapers: (THEN YOU MUST RESTORE HIS TRUST. ONCE HE LETS YOU CLOSE ENOUGH, YOU WILL STAB HIM IN THE BACK.)

VS: (It would be very hard to do. Almost impossible. Why would anyone trust me after everything I've said and done?)

Reapers: (ORGANICS ARE FOOLISH. THEY BELIEVE WHAT THEY WANT TO BE TRUE. FEW WANT TO QUESTION THE MOTIVES OF AN ALLY. BE HIS FRIEND, AND HE WILL NEVER QUESTION YOU WHY. BE HIS LOVER, AND YOU WILL HAVE NEITHER TIME NOR DESIRE FOR VERBAL COMMUNICATIONS.)

VS / Ashley: (I'll do my best. I think I had high heels somewhere in my grenade pack. Maybe I can do something to my hair, as well. If I let it down like this...how do I look like?)

Reapers: (WE DON'T KNOW. ASK AN ORGANIC OF YOUR OWN SPECIES.)

VS: Maybe I could ask - oh, Shepard. Welcome back, captain.

As crazy as it sounds theirs a high probability of this being true.  When the collector ship lands Ash is frozen by the seeker drones after lilith took off running but was eventually frozen and captured.  Lilith is taken but Ashley the person who they allegedly came for the one frozen closer is overlooked ?  No good explanation was given to how she made her escape and freed herself from the seeker drone toxin.  We know their sting causes the stasis just because the ship left doesn't mean she should have been released from the effect.  If that's the case where were the rest of the colonists ?

[Sshodan]

Me thinks when it comes to VS people tend to mix two things together that should not be mixed - trust and romance quite in that way:
1. Trust. Restoring trust with VS is easy - a logical explanation for their behavior and they assuring Shep that they solved the issues and are ready to follow him/her is enough. They had a reason to doubt Sheps identity (he could have been a Cerberus impersonator, a clone or hell knows what else), or saintly (control chip anyone?) if they found a way to verify Sheps identity and absence of any chips it should be enough. End of story. Trust is based on logic, and logic is easy.
2. Romance and maybe deep friendship. Romance and other emotional connections are about feelings, and thous as you may very well know, are not controlled by logic. And lets' face it - on Horizon VS hurt Sheps, and by extension players feelings, and that can't be just explained away. It does not matter why VS did it - hurt is hurt, it's presence is a fact and something the writers would have to find a way to heal, disregarding it would just make people hater VS more.
No amount of logic or explanation will persuade someone to stop being hurt, only sincere apologies, regret and deep care can bridge that kind of rift. So who should apologies and express that care? That's easy - VS is a computer generated image, they have no feelings, not really, the Player is a real living being, and as a consistence the one who can have their feathers ruffled which lives us with one simple conclusion - in order to stop the VS hate and bring the situation to a satisfying resolution for all players VS has to apologies and make it up to the player.
Deep down inside we are all children with out self centric views of the world, it's good if we can set them aside in real live and be mature adults, search for compromises and find middle ground, swallow our hurts and apologize even when we did nothing wrong. But computer games are not real live simulators or exercise in maturity, they appeal to our inner child much more than to logic and common sense, so they have to deal with the open, overemotional reactions, and give us an outlet for them.

[Siansonea]

@whywhywhywhywhywhywhy: Actually, it is on topic. We're discussing the VS, and Shepard's reactions to Horizon. You'll move Heaven and Earth to construct a scenario in which the VS is a completely irrational douchebag for not just cozying up to Shepard the instant they meet on Horizon. You think the VS should just "trust" Shepard, no matter what. Because Shepard did some awesome stuff two years ago.

You expect the VS to believe preposterous things, like Shepard saying he was in a coma for two years while Cerberus rebuilt him. Yes, it happened in the game, the player saw it. But the VS didn't, and it sounds like a load of hooey. Any reasonable, rational person would be skeptical about such a story.

And the whole idea of Shepard working with Cerberus should make a reasonable, rational person question the wisdom and motives of Shepard. And certainly anybody who gave their oath to the Alliance should not be sanguine about their former commanding officer ditching the Alliance to work with an avowed enemy of the Alliance. You can bash the Alliance until the cows come home, and you might bring up some good points, but it doesn't change the fact that the VS is an Alliance operative, and they are acting in accordance with their duty. Shepard was once with the Alliance, was once with the Council, but now Shepard is with Cerberus. Freakin' Cerberus. And everyone around here acts like that's perfectly okay, that it's no big deal. You people have a short memory.

Modifié par Siansonea II, 01 août 2011 - 04:58 .

[Seboist]

Kaidan is lucky my femshep wasn't able to romance Zaeed in ME2 or else he would have been dumped so fast his head would've spun. He better not screw things up in ME3 or else she'll wind up in bed with Kai Leng to spite him.

[AVPen]

Siansonea II wrote...

You can bash the Alliance until the cows come home, and you might bring up some good points, but it doesn't change the fact that the VS is an Alliance operative, and they are acting in accordance with their duty. Shepard was once with the Alliance, was once with the Council, but now Shepard is with Cerberus. Freakin' Cerberus. And everyone around here acts like that's perfectly okay, that it's no big deal. You people have a short memory.

You mean like how Ashley/Kaidan were performing their "duty to the Alliance" when they went along with Shepard and openly mutinied against the Alliance and Council after they locked the Normandy down and refused to allow Shepard to travel to Ilos to stop Saren and Soveriegn? 

Modifié par AVPen, 01 août 2011 - 05:27 .