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[Seboist]

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Cerberus appears to have done one good deed, or at least signed the checks, and suddenly all their past and current atrocities don't matter?



NO.

But I think you just like taking the Renegade/Badassssss stance in any discussion. It's like you go out of your way to find opportunities to show how ruthless you are. Have fun with that.

When it comes getting allies against machines that have been exterminating people for at least 37 million years, yeah past atrocities don't matter.

My Colonist/Ruthless Shepard would ally with Batarian slavers against them without second thought.

Yeah yeah yeah, it would probably be his FIRST thought. He could have a phalanx of Alliance Marines at his beck and call, but he'd rather hire scum and villainy. Really, this whole bad boy mystique is a mystery to me. It just smacks of douchebaggery to me.

Sad to see you'd endanger countless lives just to satisfy your own ego.

[Seboist]

jreezy wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

They did do those two things. Calling them good people is a bit of a stretch though.

They also saved the Citadel from a Batarian bioweapons attack.

[Siansonea]

Zjarcal wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

Snip the "they're good people" part of that post and it's hardly a dumb post at all.

Actually, Cerberus didn't do those things though, did they? Shepard did, and Shepard (sometimes) disavows Cerberus. So if we're giving Cerberus the credit for these acts, then we're basically admitting that Shepard is working FOR Cerberus. (For those who try to push the "for/with" meaningless distinction). In any case, we still don't know what Cerberus' goals are, everything the Illusive Man and Miranda have told Shepard could be complete BS.

And anyway, it's the "good people" idiocy that I was mainly calling attention to. Seriously, how does anyone say that with a straight face?

[Seboist]

jreezy wrote...

Seboist wrote...

jreezy wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

They did do those two things. Calling them good people is a bit of a stretch though.

They also saved the Citadel from a Batarian bioweapons attack.

Wasn't Jacob with the Alliance when that happened? If so then Cerberus can't take all the credit for that.

Yep, and they were evaluating him for recruitment while providing support.

[Seboist]

Siansonea II wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

Snip the "they're good people" part of that post and it's hardly a dumb post at all.

Actually, Cerberus didn't do those things though, did they? Shepard did, and Shepard (sometimes) disavows Cerberus. So if we're giving Cerberus the credit for these acts, then we're basically admitting that Shepard is working FOR Cerberus. (For those who try to push the "for/with" meaningless distinction). In any case, we still don't know what Cerberus' goals are, everything the Illusive Man and Miranda have told Shepard could be complete BS.

And anyway, it's the "good people" idiocy that I was mainly calling attention to. Seriously, how does anyone say that with a straight face?

Because it's true.

[Siansonea]

Seboist wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Cerberus appears to have done one good deed, or at least signed the checks, and suddenly all their past and current atrocities don't matter?



NO.

But I think you just like taking the Renegade/Badassssss stance in any discussion. It's like you go out of your way to find opportunities to show how ruthless you are. Have fun with that.

When it comes getting allies against machines that have been exterminating people for at least 37 million years, yeah past atrocities don't matter.

My Colonist/Ruthless Shepard would ally with Batarian slavers against them without second thought.

Yeah yeah yeah, it would probably be his FIRST thought. He could have a phalanx of Alliance Marines at his beck and call, but he'd rather hire scum and villainy. Really, this whole bad boy mystique is a mystery to me. It just smacks of douchebaggery to me.

Sad to see you'd endanger countless lives just to satisfy your own ego.

That's an erroneous conclusion, based on a flawed premise, based on an over-adherence to the emotional allure of negativity. I've said on a number of occasions that I recognize the necessity of working with Cerberus. I just think Shepard should have maybe made a few phone calls before signing on the dotted line. Cerberus would be Plan F for me, not Plan A. But some people just like to get their hands dirty and gleefully embrace any moustache-twirling villain they run across. I think that's a sign of immaturity.

[Siansonea]

Seboist wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

Snip the "they're good people" part of that post and it's hardly a dumb post at all.

Actually, Cerberus didn't do those things though, did they? Shepard did, and Shepard (sometimes) disavows Cerberus. So if we're giving Cerberus the credit for these acts, then we're basically admitting that Shepard is working FOR Cerberus. (For those who try to push the "for/with" meaningless distinction). In any case, we still don't know what Cerberus' goals are, everything the Illusive Man and Miranda have told Shepard could be complete BS.

And anyway, it's the "good people" idiocy that I was mainly calling attention to. Seriously, how does anyone say that with a straight face?

Because it's true.

Yeah, I don't think the word "good" means what you think it means. They're pretty much evil, who have footed the bill so Shepard could accomplish what appears to be a good deed. Law of averages, I guess.

[Seboist]

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Cerberus appears to have done one good deed, or at least signed the checks, and suddenly all their past and current atrocities don't matter?



NO.

But I think you just like taking the Renegade/Badassssss stance in any discussion. It's like you go out of your way to find opportunities to show how ruthless you are. Have fun with that.

When it comes getting allies against machines that have been exterminating people for at least 37 million years, yeah past atrocities don't matter.

My Colonist/Ruthless Shepard would ally with Batarian slavers against them without second thought.

Yeah yeah yeah, it would probably be his FIRST thought. He could have a phalanx of Alliance Marines at his beck and call, but he'd rather hire scum and villainy. Really, this whole bad boy mystique is a mystery to me. It just smacks of douchebaggery to me.

Sad to see you'd endanger countless lives just to satisfy your own ego.

That's an erroneous conclusion, based on a flawed premise, based on an over-adherence to the emotional allure of negativity. I've said on a number of occasions that I recognize the necessity of working with Cerberus. I just think Shepard should have maybe made a few phone calls before signing on the dotted line. Cerberus would be Plan F for me, not Plan A. But some people just like to get their hands dirty and gleefully embrace any moustache-twirling villain they run across. I think that's a sign of immaturity.

It's a good thing that TIM (My Shepard's future husband) is anything but that,isn't it? He's been proven to be a selfless man willingly to risk his own life for the security of humanity. He's a great man.

[HogarthHughes 3]

Siansonea II wrote...

Well, all of this can be called atrocities. War crimes. Crimes against humanity. You're not going to make any of these actions more palatable by trying to lawyer away the "terrorism" label. Call it what you want, but it's all DESPICABLE. And so is anyone who thinks this sort of thing is okay.

Of course Cerberus is highly unethical, and their purpose attracts xenophobes like moths to a flame.  However slapping them with labels such as terrorist and **** which correlate with real world events and groups (in order to equate them) does not do Cerberus justice.

I'll use Project Overlord as an example.  Dr. Gavin Archer obviously cares about his brother (David).  Unless perhaps the picture, memory flashback sequences, and Simon Templemans voice acting all went way over my head, but I'm hoping that isn't the case.  Anyways despite this, Dr. Archer is willing to put David through (more or less) torture in order to further the Project.  This could mean that Dr. Archer is simply a monster through and through, but I don't think so.  I think that Dr. Archer is willing to put his brother through hell in a rushed attempt to save the Project (from being closed down by TIM due to lack of results) because he feels that Overlord is that important.  Not just to his career, but to humanity (& Cerberus) should war with the Geth erupt.  Project Overlord has the potential to save millions of lives, and Dr. Archer is willing to hurt those closest to him in order to make it happen.  Of course his rushed attempt to save the Project gets everyone else on-site killed, but even so.  From what I've seen Cerberus has plenty of people like Dr. Archer.  Not people who could really be considered "good guys" by any means, but they aren't quite villains either.  They are working for the greater good, and are willing to sacrifice to achieve it.  Although Cerberus certainly has people like Kai Leng too:  Vicious killers who are with Cerberus because they hate aliens, plain and simple (and Cerberus gives them an outlet for this).

I'm not saying that Cerberus should simply be given a free pass for their various atrocities because some of their scientists had good intentions, but they should not as a whole be painted with the same brush as people like Anders Behring Breivik (Norway shooter/bomber, kills 70+ innocent Norwegians because they're too soft on Muslims).

[ubermensch007]

iakus wrote...It shows that despite everything Shepard may have done in ME1, pro-Council, pro-Alliance, however many Cerberus bases you may have destroyed together, any acts you may have done, amount to nothing. The VS thinks you'd throw it all away in favor of Cerberus.  That your loyalties are so easilly swayed.

@iakus, It's like I said: The Virmire Survivor   --  "Forgot about Shep"

Modifié par ubermensch007, 17 août 2011 - 05:09 .

[1136342t54_]

I'll say a few things about the Cerberus argument.

Okay Cerberus is not a Terrorist group at all. Their purpose is not to use terror tactics to get what they want when they want. If that was truly the case they wouldn't have many members even Miranda would hate Cerberus. Although if they suddenly switched to terror tactics they could some serious damage that would be very noticeable by the Galactic community.

Now does that make them good people? No it doesn't actually far from it. Their motives aren't necessarily bad. They want humanity to be top dog which isn't wrong if you look at it from a human perspective. Basically you should want the best for your species. Now the way Cerberus goes about this isn't the best way exactly. They have assassinated a Pope so they can a pro human pope to support their ideals. They have assassinated SA parliament members so they can put one in office. Even Alliance Admirals who were actually starting to figure out things about Cerberus they've killed (Which they kind of had no choice). Cerberus wants the best for humanity but they want to be in control which is the main problem and they will do anything to do what they think must be done to defend humanity.

Now  Cerberus is not good not by a long shot but many of its members do actually want to help humanity and their methods aren't terrorism and they have supported good causes before. If I was going to put on trial many in Cerberus leadership I would likely put some up for treason and others more akin to Jacob and Miranda I would give them a chance to work for the Alliance. TIM would likely be put to death if I had the choice.

Modifié par 1136342t54 , 17 août 2011 - 06:00 .

[Siansonea]

@ Seboist: I'm just going to assume that you're being a provocateur at this point. You can't be serious. If on the off chance you ARE serious—seek help. You've got some seriously skewed ideas about what constitutes a great man. That is, unless you're just goofing on everyone for laughs, as I suspect.

[Siansonea]

1136342t54 wrote...

I'll say a few things about the Cerberus argument.

Okay Cerberus is not a Terrorist group at all. Their purpose is not to use terror tactics to get what they want when they want. If that was truly the case they wouldn't have many members even Miranda would hate Cerberus. Although if they suddenly switched to terror tactics they could some serious damage that would be very noticeable by the Galactic community.

Now does that make them good people? No it doesn't actually far from it. Their motives aren't necessarily bad. They want humanity to be top dog which isn't wrong if you look at it from a human perspective. Basically you should want the best for your species. Now the way Cerberus goes about this isn't the best way exactly. They have assassinated a Pope so they can a pro human pope to support their ideals. They have assassinated SA parliament members so they can put one in office. Even Alliance Admirals who were actually starting to figure out things about Cerberus they've killed (Which they kind of had no choice). Cerberus wants the best for humanity but they want to be in control which is the main problem and they will do anything to do what they think must be done to defend humanity.

Now  Cerberus is not good not by a long shot but many of its members do actually want to help humanity and their methods aren't terrorism and they have supported good causes before. If I was going to put on trial many in Cerberus leadership I would likely put some up for treason and others more akin to Jacob and Miranda I would give them a chance to work for the Alliance. TIM would likely be put to death if I had the choice.

I can't wait to put a bullet between TIM's eyes. That bastard needs to pay for what Cerberus has done in his name. For Admiral Kahoku, for Corporal Toombs, for Jack, for Gillian Grayson, for the Marines on Akuze and Edolus, for the rachni on Binthu and Nepheron, for the dead colonists from Horizon, for every innocent life that has been damaged or destroyed because of TIM's hubris and greed, he must pay. With his life.

[DarkDragon777]

Siansonea II wrote...

1136342t54 wrote...

I'll say a few things about the Cerberus argument.

Okay Cerberus is not a Terrorist group at all. Their purpose is not to use terror tactics to get what they want when they want. If that was truly the case they wouldn't have many members even Miranda would hate Cerberus. Although if they suddenly switched to terror tactics they could some serious damage that would be very noticeable by the Galactic community.

Now does that make them good people? No it doesn't actually far from it. Their motives aren't necessarily bad. They want humanity to be top dog which isn't wrong if you look at it from a human perspective. Basically you should want the best for your species. Now the way Cerberus goes about this isn't the best way exactly. They have assassinated a Pope so they can a pro human pope to support their ideals. They have assassinated SA parliament members so they can put one in office. Even Alliance Admirals who were actually starting to figure out things about Cerberus they've killed (Which they kind of had no choice). Cerberus wants the best for humanity but they want to be in control which is the main problem and they will do anything to do what they think must be done to defend humanity.

Now  Cerberus is not good not by a long shot but many of its members do actually want to help humanity and their methods aren't terrorism and they have supported good causes before. If I was going to put on trial many in Cerberus leadership I would likely put some up for treason and others more akin to Jacob and Miranda I would give them a chance to work for the Alliance. TIM would likely be put to death if I had the choice.

I can't wait to put a bullet between TIM's eyes. That bastard needs to pay for what Cerberus has done in his name. For Admiral Kahoku, for Corporal Toombs, for Jack, for Gillian Grayson, for the Marines on Akuze and Edolus, for the rachni on Binthu and Nepheron, for the dead colonists from Horizon, for every innocent life that has been damaged or destroyed because of TIM's hubris and greed, he must pay. With his life.

Really now? You're not willing to sacrifice a few meaningless lives for a bigger cause? 

All of their actions will most likely prove to be valuable in the end.

You can't beat the Reapers without prior "preperations".

Modifié par DarkDragon777, 17 août 2011 - 09:53 .

[Made Nightwing]

@DarkDragon777. By what do we measure the meaning of a person's life? By their actions? By their potential?

Every man, woman and child in the universe has the right to live their life how they will. This is the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness that is set down in the US Constitution and is the example for all civilized countries in the world.

Admiral Kahoku was not a criminal. He was an honest man, who cared for his troops, and wanted to what was right. Cerberus killed him for this.

Corporal Toombs was an Alliance Marine, who swore himself to protect humanity, to give his life if need be. Instead, he was betrayed by the very humans he vowed to protect, and subjected to horrible torment that shattered his mind and body. Cerberus did this to him, for 'experimentation into Thresher Maw venom'.

Jack was a baby who had unusually high levels of biotic potential. Instead of studying her from afar, Cerberus chose to abduct her and experiment on her. What the **** did she do to deserve that? Just a kid who was deprived of her God given right to be free and sane. Cerberus tried doing the same thing to Gillian Grayson, only one of their members grew a damn conscience and fought back...and look what happened to him?

The Marines on Akuze and Edolus weren't afraid to give their lives for a cause, but they thought it would be the cause they chose for themselves, not to give human scientists some easy advancements in weaponry, or to cover up the crimes of those scientists.

The colonists on Horizon just wanted to live their lives. Sure, they might have been attacked anyway, but TIM ensured that they would be. The blood of everyone who died their is on his hands, there was a better way to lure the Collector's out.

No life is meaningless, we all have potential and value. At the end of the day, all Cerberus has done is gain a little technological advantage, at the cost of thousands of people dead or emotionally destroyed.

If Cerberus is willing to use worse methods than the Reapers in order to defeat them, then what is the point of winning?

[DarkDragon777]

Made Nightwing wrote...

@DarkDragon777. By what do we measure the meaning of a person's life? By their actions? By their potential?

Every man, woman and child in the universe has the right to live their life how they will. This is the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness that is set down in the US Constitution and is the example for all civilized countries in the world.

Admiral Kahoku was not a criminal. He was an honest man, who cared for his troops, and wanted to what was right. Cerberus killed him for this.

Corporal Toombs was an Alliance Marine, who swore himself to protect humanity, to give his life if need be. Instead, he was betrayed by the very humans he vowed to protect, and subjected to horrible torment that shattered his mind and body. Cerberus did this to him, for 'experimentation into Thresher Maw venom'.

Jack was a baby who had unusually high levels of biotic potential. Instead of studying her from afar, Cerberus chose to abduct her and experiment on her. What the **** did she do to deserve that? Just a kid who was deprived of her God given right to be free and sane. Cerberus tried doing the same thing to Gillian Grayson, only one of their members grew a damn conscience and fought back...and look what happened to him?

The Marines on Akuze and Edolus weren't afraid to give their lives for a cause, but they thought it would be the cause they chose for themselves, not to give human scientists some easy advancements in weaponry, or to cover up the crimes of those scientists.

The colonists on Horizon just wanted to live their lives. Sure, they might have been attacked anyway, but TIM ensured that they would be. The blood of everyone who died their is on his hands, there was a better way to lure the Collector's out.

No life is meaningless, we all have potential and value. At the end of the day, all Cerberus has done is gain a little technological advantage, at the cost of thousands of people dead or emotionally destroyed.

If Cerberus is willing to use worse methods than the Reapers in order to defeat them, then what is the point of winning?

Sometimes you have to sacrifice things for the greater good. If you can't do so, you will pay with greater losses later. You have to look at the bigger picture here. Sometimes the potential of a situation or single being outweighs the potential of many. Don't let foolish liberties blind you.  With Jack,if those experiments didn't happen, Shepard could've lost a valuable ally.  Things can come back to help you in unexpected ways, even if they appear to be a failure. If you aren't willing to take risks, and sometimes actions viewed as cruel, you will never discover more.

Modifié par DarkDragon777, 17 août 2011 - 10:43 .

[Siansonea]

DarkDragon777 wrote...

*snip*

Really now? You're not willing to sacrifice a few meaningless lives for a bigger cause? 

All of their actions will most likely prove to be valuable in the end.

You can't beat the Reapers without prior "preperations".

Who gets to decide whose lives are "meaningless"? You? Pffft. Spoken like every war criminal who ever lived...

[LiquidLogic2020]

Oh don't care if they give me boxes of blow jobs and chocolates the VS has no part in my team after ME2.

[Siansonea]

Made Nightwing wrote...

@DarkDragon777. By what do we measure the meaning of a person's life? By their actions? By their potential?

Every man, woman and child in the universe has the right to live their life how they will. This is the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness that is set down in the US Constitution and is the example for all civilized countries in the world.

Admiral Kahoku was not a criminal. He was an honest man, who cared for his troops, and wanted to what was right. Cerberus killed him for this.

Corporal Toombs was an Alliance Marine, who swore himself to protect humanity, to give his life if need be. Instead, he was betrayed by the very humans he vowed to protect, and subjected to horrible torment that shattered his mind and body. Cerberus did this to him, for 'experimentation into Thresher Maw venom'.

Jack was a baby who had unusually high levels of biotic potential. Instead of studying her from afar, Cerberus chose to abduct her and experiment on her. What the **** did she do to deserve that? Just a kid who was deprived of her God given right to be free and sane. Cerberus tried doing the same thing to Gillian Grayson, only one of their members grew a damn conscience and fought back...and look what happened to him?

The Marines on Akuze and Edolus weren't afraid to give their lives for a cause, but they thought it would be the cause they chose for themselves, not to give human scientists some easy advancements in weaponry, or to cover up the crimes of those scientists.

The colonists on Horizon just wanted to live their lives. Sure, they might have been attacked anyway, but TIM ensured that they would be. The blood of everyone who died their is on his hands, there was a better way to lure the Collector's out.

No life is meaningless, we all have potential and value. At the end of the day, all Cerberus has done is gain a little technological advantage, at the cost of thousands of people dead or emotionally destroyed.

If Cerberus is willing to use worse methods than the Reapers in order to defeat them, then what is the point of winning?

And lets not forget all the other biotic potential kids who were sacrificed in the Subject Zero program, to test the safety of various scientific "techniques". That anyone thinks Cerberus' methods are a good idea just shows how inhumane some humans are. I suppose if someone you cared about was one of the "meaningless lives" sacrified in the name of the Illusive Man proving a hypothesis about some random thing or other, it would be a different story. But as long as it's somebody else, Go Cerberus. <_<

[Zjarcal]

Siansonea II wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

Snip the "they're good people" part of that post and it's hardly a dumb post at all.

Actually, Cerberus didn't do those things though, did they? Shepard did, and Shepard (sometimes) disavows Cerberus. So if we're giving Cerberus the credit for these acts, then we're basically admitting that Shepard is working FOR Cerberus. (For those who try to push the "for/with" meaningless distinction). In any case, we still don't know what Cerberus' goals are, everything the Illusive Man and Miranda have told Shepard could be complete BS.

And anyway, it's the "good people" idiocy that I was mainly calling attention to. Seriously, how does anyone say that with a straight face?

True, but it was Cerberus who provided all the facilities for Shepard to do it. Whatever their intentions or long term goals, they did contribute greatly to stopping that particular threat. Sure, you can still dislike them (and I am no fan of Cerberus for the record), but they still deserve plenty of credit for that.

And yes, I know the "good people" part was rather... naive?

[Siansonea]

DarkDragon777 wrote...

*snip*

Sometimes you have to sacrifice things for the greater good. If you can't do so, you will pay with greater losses later. You have to look at the bigger picture here. Sometimes the potential of a situation or single being outweighs the potential of many. Don't let foolish liberties blind you.  With Jack,if those experiments didn't happen, Shepard could've lost a valuable ally.  Things can come back to help you in unexpected ways, even if they appear to be a failure. If you aren't willing to take risks, and sometimes actions viewed as cruel, you will never discover more.

Sounds like "logic" that could be used to justify pretty much anything. I guess if you're not on the receiving end of such logic, it's not so bad, huh? Might makes right, and all that.

I really do wonder about the background of people who make statements like this. This sort of thing is the what skinheads and other supremacist groups would say. Of course, Cerberus is a supremacist organization, so I guess if you agree with their methods you're likely to be a supremacist yourself. Or maybe just somebody with an extreme lack of empathy. To a clinical degree.

[ADLegend21]

Oh dear lord.

The VS was right to be mad at Shepard

Shepard was right to feel hurt because theyw ere doing the right thing.

Both are right so no need to be mad, just kiss and make up.

[Siansonea]

Zjarcal wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Cerberus saved humanity from the Collectors and provided aid to the survivors of Horizon and the Hugo Gernsback. They're good people.

Whatever. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

Snip the "they're good people" part of that post and it's hardly a dumb post at all.

Actually, Cerberus didn't do those things though, did they? Shepard did, and Shepard (sometimes) disavows Cerberus. So if we're giving Cerberus the credit for these acts, then we're basically admitting that Shepard is working FOR Cerberus. (For those who try to push the "for/with" meaningless distinction). In any case, we still don't know what Cerberus' goals are, everything the Illusive Man and Miranda have told Shepard could be complete BS.

And anyway, it's the "good people" idiocy that I was mainly calling attention to. Seriously, how does anyone say that with a straight face?

True, but it was Cerberus who provided all the facilities for Shepard to do it. Whatever their intentions or long term goals, they did contribute greatly to stopping that particular threat. Sure, you can still dislike them (and I am no fan of Cerberus for the record), but they still deserve plenty of credit for that.

And yes, I know the "good people" part was rather... naive?

Okay, maybe I'll shoot TIM in the forehead instead of in the stomach. In acknowledgment of his "good deed for humanity".