We all know that she has been part of Cerberus for a long time. Cerberus has done many bad things. But you can't hold every Cerberus Agent guilty for what other cells do. Some cells are undoubtedly good and some cells are definitely bad. My question is this. Has Miranda been part of the bad cells in her long history with Cerberus and would she do things like Kidnap children and experiment on them like other cells?
Question about Miranda?
Débuté par
KamikazeShepard
, juil. 07 2011 12:23
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#2
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 12:27
MisterJB
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We don't know much about Miranda's past with Cerberus. However, she expresses dissaproval at what happened in Pragia; calling it a mistake;, was horrified when she saw the conditions the children lived in and didn't want to continue experimenting on Rachni when she realized their sentiency.
So, the answer is no. Miranda is similar to Mordin in this aspect.
Also, you should pose this question in the Miranda fan thread, you'll get more elaborated answers.
http://social.biowar...5/index/7625709
So, the answer is no. Miranda is similar to Mordin in this aspect.
Also, you should pose this question in the Miranda fan thread, you'll get more elaborated answers.
http://social.biowar...5/index/7625709
Modifié par MisterJB, 07 juillet 2011 - 12:28 .
#3
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 12:30
Lil focker
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she is the romance starter for anyone that never played mass effect 1
#4
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 12:32
ashlover mark 2
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i dont think that she would have a problem with it if SHE and TIM thought it was nesscary.she didnt seem to have a problem with cerberus killing qaurians and trying to blow up a qaurian ship (which had kids on it) even though those ppl had done nothing to cerberus or humanity.
#5
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 12:51
MisterJB
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Define necessary. I don't see how recapturing Gillian is more necessary than what the scientists were doing on Pragia but Miranda is still against it.
The Rachni are not human and using them as Shock troops could save many human lifes but Miranda is against experimenting on them.
Keeping the Collector base could be crucial to stop the Reaper invasion but Miranda is against it.
No one but the Quarians have any idea how life in the Flotilla is and, since Miranda was not part of the group that attacked them and Cerberus works on a need to know basis, it's entirely possible that The Illusive Man tried to cover up the fact that Cerberus attempted to blow a ship full of civilians. Also, please notice that Praza makes no mention of civilians when he accuses Cerberus.
Also, those quarians were keeping one of Cerberus' most important assets. That would justify an attack.
The Rachni are not human and using them as Shock troops could save many human lifes but Miranda is against experimenting on them.
Keeping the Collector base could be crucial to stop the Reaper invasion but Miranda is against it.
No one but the Quarians have any idea how life in the Flotilla is and, since Miranda was not part of the group that attacked them and Cerberus works on a need to know basis, it's entirely possible that The Illusive Man tried to cover up the fact that Cerberus attempted to blow a ship full of civilians. Also, please notice that Praza makes no mention of civilians when he accuses Cerberus.
Also, those quarians were keeping one of Cerberus' most important assets. That would justify an attack.
Modifié par MisterJB, 07 juillet 2011 - 01:26 .
#6
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 12:59
fenix8081
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Well, she did already kind of kidnapped her sister. Granted there was decent reasoning behind it, but that's always been a bit suspect. We never really get to know how bad her dad was. Sounds like a rich parent who pushes there kid too hard to succeed in areas they failed, which you can find in any competitive youth sport. Emotionally scarring, yes. Reason enough to steal your sister away, I'm not so sure.
Although, earlier I was arguing for Morinth being on the same level of moral ambiguity as Samara, so my moral compass may have odd fluctuations as well on parent issues.
Although, earlier I was arguing for Morinth being on the same level of moral ambiguity as Samara, so my moral compass may have odd fluctuations as well on parent issues.
#7
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 01:27
KamikazeShepard
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MisterJB wrote...
Define necessary. I don't see how recapturing Gillian is more necessary than what the scientists were doing on Pragia but Miranda is still against it.
The Rachni are not human and using them as Shock troops could save many human lifes but Miranda is against experimenting on them.
Keeping the Collector base could be crucial to stop the Reaper invasion but Miranda is against it.
No one but the Quarians have any idea how life in the Flotilla is and, since Miranda was not part of the group that attacked them and Cerberus works on a need to know basis, it's entirely possible that The Illusive Man tried to cover up the fact that Cerberus attempted to blow a ship full of civilians. Also, please notice that Praza makes no mention of civilians when he accuses Cerberus.
Also, those quarians were keeping one of Cerberus' most important assets.
Wait how do you know she is against experimenting on Rachni?
#8
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 01:33
MisterJB
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Shepard: I saw your bases years ago. You were using rachni, Thorian creepers, even husks to make your own army!
Miranda: The husks were already dead, the Thorian creatures were mindless, and the rachni were abandoned once we understood their intelligence.
Miranda: The husks were already dead, the Thorian creatures were mindless, and the rachni were abandoned once we understood their intelligence.
#9
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 01:51
Eamon696
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Lol! Hey OP have you posted on GameFaqs recently? Is this in response to your argument in that Miranda thread?
#10
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 02:13
Labrev
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MisterJB wrote...
Shepard: I saw your bases years ago. You were using rachni, Thorian creepers, even husks to make your own army!
Miranda: The husks were already dead, the Thorian creatures were mindless, and the rachni were abandoned once we understood their intelligence.
Read: once we figured out that they are too smart to be made into submissive minions for our cause, we let them go.
Load of crap if they want to make it sound like they give two schits about the rachni.
#11
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 02:16
Golden Owl
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Hah Yes Reapers wrote...
MisterJB wrote...
Shepard: I saw your bases years ago. You were using rachni, Thorian creepers, even husks to make your own army!
Miranda: The husks were already dead, the Thorian creatures were mindless, and the rachni were abandoned once we understood their intelligence.
Read: once we figured out that they are too smart to be made into submissive minions for our cause, we let them go.
Load of crap if they want to make it sound like they give two schits about the rachni.
If Cerberus wants a husk and thorian creeper army, where do they get their resupplies of these things? I get the feeling they don't breed....
...Someone's gotta die to make a brand new husk or creeper...
Modifié par Golden Owl, 07 juillet 2011 - 02:17 .
#12
Posté 07 juillet 2011 - 02:43
dgcatanisiri
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Cerberus celled organization is designed specifically to restrict the flow of information. What information Miranda gets is filtered by TIM, no doubt - Miranda insists that the cells Shepard comes across were renegades, but EDI later tells Shepard that TIM keeps the number manageable to maintain control. If there are only about eight to twelve cells at a time, for the groups that Shepard encounters in the first game to all be renegade, it implies that TIM has no control over Cerberus, which all the other information we get openly contradicts.
And Miranda enjoys the occasional bout of self-delusion. "I'm never wrong," anyone? If she can justify something - the rachni, the creepers, the husks, the experiments, the deaths - she's going to until forced to admit the truth. I like to think that, even though you have to read between the lines for it, there is a subtext of Miranda becoming disillusioned with Cerberus' actions, even if she still agrees with its goals in the game. You can see it by bringing her to the Collector vessel and taking the renegade option when EDI reveals that it was a set up and her resigning on the base. I tend to think that this is what's going to lead in to her appearance in ME3.
And Miranda enjoys the occasional bout of self-delusion. "I'm never wrong," anyone? If she can justify something - the rachni, the creepers, the husks, the experiments, the deaths - she's going to until forced to admit the truth. I like to think that, even though you have to read between the lines for it, there is a subtext of Miranda becoming disillusioned with Cerberus' actions, even if she still agrees with its goals in the game. You can see it by bringing her to the Collector vessel and taking the renegade option when EDI reveals that it was a set up and her resigning on the base. I tend to think that this is what's going to lead in to her appearance in ME3.
#13
Posté 08 juillet 2011 - 02:53
Labrev
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My guess, as to how TIM runs most Cerberus cells, is probably something like this:
(Pragia/Teltin facility as an example)
--> TIM wants to create human superbiotic soldier, sets up a cell committed to achieving that goal.
--> TIM tells cell director, "get the results, keep me updated on your progress, I don't care what you do to achieve it just get the job done" and turns a mostly blind eye to the cell.
--> TIM will get impatient at a lack of progress and threaten to pull the plug if results aren't being had.
--> When cell implodes, project fails, and TIM has to learn the ugly truth about what happened at facility, he does a save-face by calling it a "rogue" cell.
The point of not being completely involved was so he could disavow any knowledge of illicit activity if it happens. Miranda will probably believe him, most others will call it BS. Of course, if the desired results were achieved, it wouldn't matter to him because "ultimately, the project was a success, that's all that matters."
(Pragia/Teltin facility as an example)
--> TIM wants to create human superbiotic soldier, sets up a cell committed to achieving that goal.
--> TIM tells cell director, "get the results, keep me updated on your progress, I don't care what you do to achieve it just get the job done" and turns a mostly blind eye to the cell.
--> TIM will get impatient at a lack of progress and threaten to pull the plug if results aren't being had.
--> When cell implodes, project fails, and TIM has to learn the ugly truth about what happened at facility, he does a save-face by calling it a "rogue" cell.
The point of not being completely involved was so he could disavow any knowledge of illicit activity if it happens. Miranda will probably believe him, most others will call it BS. Of course, if the desired results were achieved, it wouldn't matter to him because "ultimately, the project was a success, that's all that matters."
#14
Posté 08 juillet 2011 - 02:57
conrad winkles
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I don't think she would like it. But she does have a history of kidnapping, yet if you take her with you during jacks loyalty mission she does express how she isn't happy about what went on there. She would probably not like to do something like that but she might do it anyway just because she was following orders.
#15
Posté 08 juillet 2011 - 03:37
ReallyRue
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I'm not sure about her morality, but she did say if she had total control of the Lazarus project, she would have installed a control chip in Shepard. So I don't think grey acts of morality would be unlikely for her.
#16
Posté 08 juillet 2011 - 03:52
LuxDragon
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Most of the things we know about Cerberus is through their failed stuff that they can't contain.
Miranda has stated that she gets called in for the impossible and still succeeds (Which means it's stays secret). To that point, I don't know if we actually know what she's accomplished and what she's done to do it.
Miranda has stated that she gets called in for the impossible and still succeeds (Which means it's stays secret). To that point, I don't know if we actually know what she's accomplished and what she's done to do it.
#17
Posté 08 juillet 2011 - 08:33
knightnblu
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The one thing that seems to be forgotten on this thread is that Miranda is a pragmatist with situational ethics. One could say that she is against harming children in general, but if push comes to shove, I believe that she would do so in a heartbeat to get the job done. As for the husks being dead in her dialog with Shepard, sure the husks were already dead, but it was Cerberus that killed the colonists and stuck them on the Dragon's teeth to begin with. Technically correct, but intellectually dishonest.
I would be very surprised to learn that Miranda had never done anything similar to the Cerberus projects that Shepard had stopped. Jack even has a sense of this when she calls Miranda a Cerberus Cheerleader. It isn't for her looks that Jack makes this assessment, but her zeal for the group. This is why I believe that Miranda took part in atrocities for Cerberus. Perhaps she was even involved in the project on Akuze that nearly got Shepard killed in the sole survivor background. We may even find that one out if we ever run across Toombs again.
Miranda changes during her time with Shepard and I believe that it is the assault on the Collector base that finally forces Miranda to choose between what is right and what is good for Cerberus when Shepard blows the base and she stands with Shepard against TIM. When she tells Shepard that they had to destroy the base, I believe that she was trying to justify her actions to herself rather than seeking to reassure Shepard. So I also think that it would be fair to say that even Miranda was surprised by her actions.
Miranda is handicapped by her association with Cerberus since the age of 16. She has really never experienced life outside of Cerberus influence or that of her estranged father. Such a sheltered life has order and protections, but it is the chaos of life in which we are forged and grow strong. Working with Shepard, she begins to realize just how much she has missed and begins to wonder about the choices she has made in the past. I really expect this character to grow in ME3 as she begins to emerge from the shroud of Cerberus.
I would be very surprised to learn that Miranda had never done anything similar to the Cerberus projects that Shepard had stopped. Jack even has a sense of this when she calls Miranda a Cerberus Cheerleader. It isn't for her looks that Jack makes this assessment, but her zeal for the group. This is why I believe that Miranda took part in atrocities for Cerberus. Perhaps she was even involved in the project on Akuze that nearly got Shepard killed in the sole survivor background. We may even find that one out if we ever run across Toombs again.
Miranda changes during her time with Shepard and I believe that it is the assault on the Collector base that finally forces Miranda to choose between what is right and what is good for Cerberus when Shepard blows the base and she stands with Shepard against TIM. When she tells Shepard that they had to destroy the base, I believe that she was trying to justify her actions to herself rather than seeking to reassure Shepard. So I also think that it would be fair to say that even Miranda was surprised by her actions.
Miranda is handicapped by her association with Cerberus since the age of 16. She has really never experienced life outside of Cerberus influence or that of her estranged father. Such a sheltered life has order and protections, but it is the chaos of life in which we are forged and grow strong. Working with Shepard, she begins to realize just how much she has missed and begins to wonder about the choices she has made in the past. I really expect this character to grow in ME3 as she begins to emerge from the shroud of Cerberus.
