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[JFarr74]

RedCaesar97 wrote...

JFarr74 wrote...

Would you guys rather have the Inferno Grenade or the Flashbang Grenade? Which is more useful?

Flashbang Grenade is better than Inferno Grenade. Inferno Grenade is just too difficult to use and its usefulness is questionable.


Unlike Kasumi's and Zaeed's versions of these grenades (which are instant-cast and instant-hit), Shepard throws the grenades in an arc, and if they hit a wall they will bounce before exploding. It will take some practice before you can begin to throw them effectively.

As mcsupersport points out, Flashbang Grenade should stun enemies, knock husks off their feet which kills them, and at higher levels overheats weapons in an area effect.

The radius of Flashbang is uniform: any enemies within that radius will be hit by Flashbang Grenade. The radius of Inferno Grenade, is not uniform. Inferno Grenade explodes in fragments (4 or 5 fragments at rank 4). This means that Inferno Grenade will explode, but enemies with the explosion radius may not actually get hit by any fragments. This can result in a wasted 6-second cooldown.

Inferno Grenade does inflict 2x damage against armor, but that only becomes useful against lightly-armored enemies such as Vorcha or mechs. I'll have to test it again, but the armor damage bonus does not seem to always work like it should. I tried Heavy Inferno Grenade on Mordin's loyalty mission with a mid-level soldier, and occasionally it did not strip a Vorcha's armor completely off. Likewise, I tried it against some Loki mechs on Samara's recruitment mission and it did not strip their armor off either. And since mechs and Vorcha are very lightly-armored, you are better off shooting the armor off than burning it with Inferno Grenade. 

In my opinion, if you want to spend points on just combat or ammo powers, put all of your points in your native abilities, including one point in Concussive Shot, even if you never use it. For non-combat powers, one point in Neural Shock, Slam, or Stasis should be fine. If you are going to invest points in Flashbang Grenade, I recommend putting 10 points into it and evolving it to Improved Flashbang Grenade for the extra duration. The extra damage from Frag Grenade (the other evolution of Flashbang Grenade) is not worth it.

If I did upgrade Flashbang Grenade, which power should I evolve it to?

[mcsupersport]

JFarr74 wrote...

RedCaesar97 wrote...

JFarr74 wrote...

Would you guys rather have the Inferno Grenade or the Flashbang Grenade? Which is more useful?

Flashbang Grenade is better than Inferno Grenade. Inferno Grenade is just too difficult to use and its usefulness is questionable.


Unlike Kasumi's and Zaeed's versions of these grenades (which are instant-cast and instant-hit), Shepard throws the grenades in an arc, and if they hit a wall they will bounce before exploding. It will take some practice before you can begin to throw them effectively.

As mcsupersport points out, Flashbang Grenade should stun enemies, knock husks off their feet which kills them, and at higher levels overheats weapons in an area effect.

The radius of Flashbang is uniform: any enemies within that radius will be hit by Flashbang Grenade. The radius of Inferno Grenade, is not uniform. Inferno Grenade explodes in fragments (4 or 5 fragments at rank 4). This means that Inferno Grenade will explode, but enemies with the explosion radius may not actually get hit by any fragments. This can result in a wasted 6-second cooldown.

Inferno Grenade does inflict 2x damage against armor, but that only becomes useful against lightly-armored enemies such as Vorcha or mechs. I'll have to test it again, but the armor damage bonus does not seem to always work like it should. I tried Heavy Inferno Grenade on Mordin's loyalty mission with a mid-level soldier, and occasionally it did not strip a Vorcha's armor completely off. Likewise, I tried it against some Loki mechs on Samara's recruitment mission and it did not strip their armor off either. And since mechs and Vorcha are very lightly-armored, you are better off shooting the armor off than burning it with Inferno Grenade. 

In my opinion, if you want to spend points on just combat or ammo powers, put all of your points in your native abilities, including one point in Concussive Shot, even if you never use it. For non-combat powers, one point in Neural Shock, Slam, or Stasis should be fine. If you are going to invest points in Flashbang Grenade, I recommend putting 10 points into it and evolving it to Improved Flashbang Grenade for the extra duration. The extra damage from Frag Grenade (the other evolution of Flashbang Grenade) is not worth it.

If I did upgrade Flashbang Grenade, which power should I evolve it to?

I know it was a wall of text, but come on man........

[skuko]

because of RP and Lore reasons, i didn't want to get any tech or biotic powers for my soldier. question is, which ammo power is better? tungsten or warp? can someone point me to an ammo analysis article or something? thanks

[Praetor Knight]

skuko wrote...

because of RP and Lore reasons, i didn't want to get any tech or biotic powers for my soldier. question is, which ammo power is better? tungsten or warp? can someone point me to an ammo analysis article or something? thanks

This is how I rank ammo powers:
1. Inferno
2. Squad Cryo
3. Squad Disruptor
4. Tungsten & Heavy WarpSo for a soldier I'd recommend a one point power like Neural Shock instead of Tungsten or Warp ammo.

The Soldier's bread and butter is swapping between weapons for the job at hand, and spamming AR for offense and defense.

Edit: And extra damage is negligible when I've seen calculations, with the most important aspect being the crowd control the ammo powers provide.

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 12 juillet 2011 - 07:23 .

[skuko]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

skuko wrote...

because of RP and Lore reasons, i didn't want to get any tech or biotic powers for my soldier. question is, which ammo power is better? tungsten or warp? can someone point me to an ammo analysis article or something? thanks

This is how I rank ammo powers:
1. Inferno
2. Squad Cryo
3. Squad Disruptor
4. Tungsten & Heavy WarpSo for a soldier I'd recommend a one point power like Neural Shock instead of Tungsten or Warp ammo.

The Soldier's bread and butter is swapping between weapons for the job at hand, and spamming AR for offense and defense.

Edit: And extra damage is negligible when I've seen calculations, with the most important aspect being the crowd control the ammo powers provide.

i took squad disruptor and squad incediary for crowd control. i'm using mattock + widow, so i'm looking to maximize damage per shot, with 60% dmg upgrade on ARs (i went paragon on zaeed) all the base mobs die in 3-4 shots from mattock, so that's good. so CC not being an issue, which ammo lends the best overall dmg per shot? (considering shields/barriers/armor/health) which ammo is the most universal one overall? 

[Praetor Knight]

skuko wrote...

i took squad disruptor and squad incediary for crowd control. i'm using mattock + widow, so i'm looking to maximize damage per shot, with 60% dmg upgrade on ARs (i went paragon on zaeed) all the base mobs die in 3-4 shots from mattock, so that's good. so CC not being an issue, which ammo lends the best overall dmg per shot? (considering shields/barriers/armor/health) which ammo is the most universal one overall?

Ammo powers base their bonus off of the weapon's base damage, before other bonuses are applied like the research upgrades.

Shredder has the highest at 80%, but only against health.
Tungsten has a 70%, but only against health and armor.
Inferno clocks in at 60% and again only against health and armor.
Disruptor's damage only applies to Shields and synthetics.
Heavy Warp has a 50% buff against barriers, health and armor
I consider Warp ammo a biotic power, if you want to RP that way, but it's nice against Collectors and Eclipse.



Edit: Ok, so far I've found this thread: Ammo Powers: the right tool for each enemy

And Bozorgmehr has this thread: The Power of the Adept, where the calculations for Warp ammo are in the first post.

Ok, found them here you go: +% Power Damage question | Power Damage's effect on Ammo Powers

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 12 juillet 2011 - 08:21 .

[mcsupersport]

Inferno ammo is better than any of the bonus ammo as a general rule for soldier.
1) Bonus damage is almost exactly the same as Tungsten, and hits the same except for synthetics which you have disruptor.
2) Inferno also gives the added fire dance cc effect.

At the end of the day a fully upgraded weapon will derive around 24% of it's damage against armor and health from the Tungsten(Heavy) AP ammo.

Warp ammo(heavy) will give you around 20% of the total damage against Barriers, armor and Health plus a nice boost against rag-dolled enemies.

Generally speaking Soldiers get the least from taking a bonus ammo because they already have things to cover damage, except for Barriers which makes Warp slightly better for them, but then again, things are already dying incredibly quick with the huge bonus Heightened gives.......

Flash bang works well, stasis(biotic i know), neural shock, slam, all are better. Take Flashbang and max your own powers.

[skuko]

thanks for the replies

[JFarr74]

mcsupersport wrote...

JFarr74 wrote...

RedCaesar97 wrote...

JFarr74 wrote...

Would you guys rather have the Inferno Grenade or the Flashbang Grenade? Which is more useful?

Flashbang Grenade is better than Inferno Grenade. Inferno Grenade is just too difficult to use and its usefulness is questionable.


Unlike Kasumi's and Zaeed's versions of these grenades (which are instant-cast and instant-hit), Shepard throws the grenades in an arc, and if they hit a wall they will bounce before exploding. It will take some practice before you can begin to throw them effectively.

As mcsupersport points out, Flashbang Grenade should stun enemies, knock husks off their feet which kills them, and at higher levels overheats weapons in an area effect.

The radius of Flashbang is uniform: any enemies within that radius will be hit by Flashbang Grenade. The radius of Inferno Grenade, is not uniform. Inferno Grenade explodes in fragments (4 or 5 fragments at rank 4). This means that Inferno Grenade will explode, but enemies with the explosion radius may not actually get hit by any fragments. This can result in a wasted 6-second cooldown.

Inferno Grenade does inflict 2x damage against armor, but that only becomes useful against lightly-armored enemies such as Vorcha or mechs. I'll have to test it again, but the armor damage bonus does not seem to always work like it should. I tried Heavy Inferno Grenade on Mordin's loyalty mission with a mid-level soldier, and occasionally it did not strip a Vorcha's armor completely off. Likewise, I tried it against some Loki mechs on Samara's recruitment mission and it did not strip their armor off either. And since mechs and Vorcha are very lightly-armored, you are better off shooting the armor off than burning it with Inferno Grenade. 

In my opinion, if you want to spend points on just combat or ammo powers, put all of your points in your native abilities, including one point in Concussive Shot, even if you never use it. For non-combat powers, one point in Neural Shock, Slam, or Stasis should be fine. If you are going to invest points in Flashbang Grenade, I recommend putting 10 points into it and evolving it to Improved Flashbang Grenade for the extra duration. The extra damage from Frag Grenade (the other evolution of Flashbang Grenade) is not worth it.

If I did upgrade Flashbang Grenade, which power should I evolve it to?

I know it was a wall of text, but come on man........

Yeah.....didn't see that....sorry.  Thanks man!