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[ThatDancingTurian]

While I think it'd be nice to acknowledge that Garrus and Tali (and Joker and Chakwas) stuck by Shepard throughout all of the games, I'd hate for them to have a situation like Liara where some deep emotional connection is just assumed regardless of the player's choices or feelings on the matter.

Some people don't feel the same way about those characters and I can imagine how annoying it would be for their Shepard to start calling them best buds regardless of how they handled them. Just like how I had a hard time even getting through LotSB for all of the Paragon options and non-choice dialogues making Shepard and Liara out to be total BFFs. So much cringing.

Maybe if they could make it contingent on certain choices or make it an optional dialogue (and not the only choice per alignment, for people who play professional Paragons who are goody-goody but not overly chummy). In those cases I'd be all for it.

I can just see people resenting it if certain characters are propped up as especially devoted towards Shepard over their own personal choices.

Modifié par Aris Ravenstar, 10 juillet 2011 - 04:49 .

[The Twilight God]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

While I think it'd be nice to acknowledge that Garrus and Tali (and Joker and Chakwas) stuck by Shepard throughout all of the games, I'd hate for them to have a situation like Liara where some deep emotional connection is just assumed regardless of the player's choices or feelings on the matter.

That connection is assumed for all ME1 squadmates. You can treat Tali like complete **** and she will still love you. You can leave Garrus on the Citadel and he's still you're bro complete with conversation about how you prepared for Ilos. At least with Liara you mind melded and that process alone could make you closer to her. 

People like to think there is no canon in ME but there is. Liara IS you BFF (And if you didn't romance her you do have burried feelings for her rather you like it or not), Garrus IS your long time brofriend and Tali Is your #1 fan. Wrex and Shepard are two peas in a pod (Assuming he survived). All you can do is deal with it.

Don't fight it. It is inevitable. You are dust struggling against a cosmic wind.

I was going to play a the most bigoted Shepard I could, but realized it was pointless. If I leave Garrus on the Citadel he still apparently joined me regardless, Tali will still be my biggest fan if I accuse her of spying for the Flotilla and deny her the geth data and Liara will be my BFF/unspoken love even if I tell her I think asari "sex" is gross and tell her I don't trust her. Pointless to resist. Play accordingly. Granted, none of this bothers me because all my Shepards like all the people in ME, but I can see how this would be annoying to people who don't like certain characters and can't genuinely roleplay their Shepard the way they want.

[Han Shot First]

Creativechick113 wrote...

You guys are all going to hate me, but I think in a way the VS is pretty loyal too. Not necessarily to Shepard, but to their beliefs. They really stick by what they think is right, and to me, that means loyalty. But, it might just be me.

They are loyal to the Alliance first and foremost.

But that definitely isn't a character flaw. Is Shepard any different? Or did humanity regress back to the middle ages, where men-at-arms owed loyalty to liege lords rather than their nation?

[nhsk]

Han Shot First wrote...

They are loyal to the Alliance first and foremost.

But that definitely isn't a character flaw. Is Shepard any different? Or did humanity regress back to the middle ages, where men-at-arms owed loyalty to liege lords rather than their nation?

Judging by the amount of mercs in ME2 and cerberus crew in ME3 (i seriously doubt every last soldier in cerberus is indoctrinated..) I would say the latter.

[Patchwork]

[quote]laecraft wrote...

[quote]Creativechick113 wrote...


This is a grunt's way of thinking, not an officer's. This is provincialism, very narrow-minded mindset for someone as well informed as VS. I have to wonder why VS even went along with Shepard when he stole the Normandy in ME1. Didn't it make Shepard a traitor back then, too? Why didn't they stop him or leave his crew? Looks like their loyalty strengthened with time.
[/quote]

I don't know about Ash but romanced Kaidan has some dialogue before Illos regarding this. Basically if Shepard questions if she's doing the right thing by stealing the Normandy Kaidan replies he wouldn't be there if he didn't think FemShep is in the right.

I might be alone in this but imo loyalty shouldn't be measured by how blindly someone follows Shepard.

I know the old saying ' A good friend will bail you out of jail, but a true friend will be sitting beside you saying "that was fun!" But is being a loyal friend to Shepard really all about having no opinions or other ties which conflict with their loyalty to Shep?

[DonutsDealer]

For me the most loyal are Tali, Garrus and Liara.

Liara for saving your body from the collectors.

Garrus is Shep's bro but and he would go everywhere with him.

About Tali, I don't know why people say she forced you to lie because of her loyalty to the quarians. She made you lie because of her love to her father.

[Kreidian]

88mphSlayer wrote...

no love for Conrad Verner?

LOL, definately in the creepy loyal catagory.

[Kreidian]

JBONE27 wrote...

Kreidian wrote...

This is just a thought that I've wanted to share. I'm kinda surprised no one has really discussed this yet - or at least at my in ability to find such a thread; I fully admit I may utterly suck at the intarwebs this early in the morning.

So assuming they survive, the only two teammates that have been with shepard at every step of the way since the very begining, in every single game, will be Garrus and Tali. Now certainly fan favoritism has played a role in this, but I do think it's interesting that the two most loyal teammates, willing to work with Shepard even while she was working with Cerberus, were these two aliens. ( So alien infact that they even have a different base carbon pattern. )

At the very least it would be nice to see some serious acknowledgement of this in the game.

Granted, technically speaking they weren't there from the very begining, and certainly not at every step of the way, after all, you don't even meet them until well after Eden Prime. As far as the whole crew goes, that honor belongs to Joker and Dr. Chakwas. Even though they pretty much just stay on the ship the whole time there is no doubt they've been the most loyal out of all of Shepard's crew. Hell they jumped on board Shepard's crew in the second game before Shepard even knew she had a crew to work with. In fact out of everyone in the entire franchise, Joker has the unique quality of being the only person gaurenteed to live through all three games. Not even Shepard herself can really lay that claim.

Now that's something I'd really love to see mentioned in ME3.

That's not quite true.  There are actually 3 characters who are garenteed not to die in at least the first 2 games and are loyal to Shepard.  Joker, Anderson, and Liara... I could also count Hackett, but considering you didn't see his face until Arrival, I'm not sure I should count him.

Yes, but unlike the others, Joker is gaurenteed to remain alive despite being right there with you through all three games flying the Normandy right into the most dangerous places in the galaxy.

[JShepard1992]

I believe Garrus, Liara, Tali, Chakwas, and Joker are completely loyal to Shepard since they are his oldest friends

[GamerT123]

Although liara isn't my LI her loyalty is by far the most intense so much so that it transcends death. Willing to give Shepard's body to Cerberus at a chance of his revival, THAT'S LOYALTY UNMEASURABLE.
Garrus, Tali, Wrex are pretty much second to that
Garrus loyalty to shepard is like a mentor to best friend if it's male shepard that is. garrus is willing to go down hell and listen to shepard even listen to his opinion and trust shepard judgement more than his own which isn't good for self-esteem.
Wrex is loyal to shepard and consider shepard a friend and I'm sure that if Wrex wasn't leading the krogan
he would have helped shepard.

DonutsDealer wrote...

About Tali, I don't know why people say she forced you to lie because of her loyalty to the quarians. She made you lie because of her love to her father.

I agree with you here tali wanted shepard to lied out of love for her father and tali loyalty seems to be torn between her fellow quarian and shepard.

[darthnick427]

iOnlySignIn wrote...

darthnick427 wrote...

I think this is spot on except thane. I think he's a 7.5 or 8

I'll give his mind a 8.5 and his body a 5.5. Hence he gets a 7. :-)

hahaha fair enough