6970 réponses à ce sujet

[GodWood]

Xilizhra wrote...
Given the context? Yes.

Asking someone what's wrong?

How dare he!

[Xilizhra]

GodWood wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
Given the context? Yes.

Asking someone what's wrong?

How dare he!

Clearly you forgot about the earlier comment that made things wrong.

[GodWood]

Xilizhra wrote...
Clearly you forgot about the earlier comment that made things wrong.

Evidently.
What is this alleged comment?

[HiroVoid]

Xilizhra wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Seboist wrote...
Zaeed ends up being hired by Cerberus again and defends some Cerberus agent or whatever against Shepard. Naturally after Space Jesus Shepard defeats him in battle s/he's presented with the choice of guiding his soul onto the proper path(ala charm in his LM in ME2) or executing him.

Shepard's talkjutsu really ruins characters.
The way Bioware handles another 'villain' in ME3 is especially annoying. Just once I'd like a major antagonist to tell Shepard to get ****ed and spit in his face instead of saying "Oh how foolish was I to disagree with you" and then blowing their brains out.

This might be similar to what you were looking for probably, and I still think this was the most entertaining convo in ME2.

I believe that most of the people in this thread can rest assured that the option to be a complete and utter scumbag will remain open.

Meh.  Your perspective.  I just found it mocking and being rude right back to her after she was being rude to me in a humrous fashion.  I found it even funnier with Kasumi's post-comment of 'Oh please.  Humans have been solving your problems for years.'  I didn't choose the last bottom left option and chose to help them, but you can feel free to never do any wrong or be a symbol of character perfection.  The fact that I still choose to help them afterwards shows I wasn't just being some serious scumbag.

[Xilizhra]

The fact that I still choose to help them afterwards shows I wasn't just being some serious scumbag.

No, it shows you were being a dilettante scumbag. Such an improvement.

[GodWood]

I imagine your tune would be different if the roles were reversed.

[HiroVoid]

Xilizhra wrote...

The fact that I still choose to help them afterwards shows I wasn't just being some serious scumbag.

No, it shows you were being a dilettante scumbag. Such an improvement.

Your perspective.

[Xilizhra]

GodWood wrote...

I imagine your tune would be different if the roles were reversed.

I've seen little to indicate you have a decent imagination, but fine, carry on with that. I'll just be ensuring that such a situation will never arise in the first place.

[Xilizhra]

HiroVoid wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

The fact that I still choose to help them afterwards shows I wasn't just being some serious scumbag.

No, it shows you were being a dilettante scumbag. Such an improvement.

Your perspective.

As is everything everyone says ever. You may as well have said "the font is white."

[GodWood]

It's gray.

[BlueMagitek]

Now it's white. =D

[Labrev]

GodWood wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
I believe that most of the people in this thread can rest assured that the option to be a complete and utter scumbag will remain open.

Saying a smartarse remark to a racist, apologizing only to be both verbally (and physically) harrassed again then being the bigger man and walking away is being scumbag?

If you were the "bigger man," then why did you stoop down to her level in the first place?

[HiroVoid]

Xilizhra wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

The fact that I still choose to help them afterwards shows I wasn't just being some serious scumbag.

No, it shows you were being a dilettante scumbag. Such an improvement.

Your perspective.

As is everything everyone says ever. You may as well have said "the font is white."

So I suppose I should have responded with 'I understand you're having a hard time.  I will help you, so that you can get off like you want.'  I could have said that, but there comes a point when someone gets under your skin.  You did everything you could to destroy Sovereign.  You didn't mean for humanity to get top spot, but it happened.  Everywhere you go, you get hounded for being told that you killed the council even though you did what you thought was best to save the galaxy.  The Turian shopkeeper refers to you as human and absoulutely loathes you.  The new council won't even come to see you just because they think you only care about humanity.  You don't think after all this that it wouldn't make someone get the least bit annoyed or pissed off about being blamed for this when all you did was try to save everyone.  Now I come to this woman wanting to help her and she calls me human and being disrespectful toward me.  I don't have any problem humurously poking right back at her.  I'll still help her, but I don't have to be nice about it.  You can call me a scumbag, but I'm the scumbag that just helped those Asari out of their because of a crappy and unfair service no matter what the heck they thought of me.  I treat every member of my squad and people I meet with the decency and respect they deserve, and they usually respond in kind, but don't expect me to treat those that treat me with no decency or respect the type I would give to those people I treat equally.

Modifié par HiroVoid, 28 novembre 2011 - 04:05 .

[GodWood]

Hah Yes Reapers wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
I believe that most of the people in this thread can rest assured that the option to be a complete and utter scumbag will remain open.

Saying a smartarse remark to a racist, apologizing only to be both verbally (and physically) harrassed again then being the bigger man and walking away is being scumbag?

If you were the "bigger man," then why did you stoop down to her level in the first place?

I am not Shepard.

And he apologized.

[Xilizhra]

So I suppose I should have responded with 'I understand you're having a hard time. I will help you, so that you can get off like you want.'

Yes.

I could have said that, but there comes a point when someone gets under your skin.

If you allow it, yes.

Everywhere you go, you get hounded for being told that you killed the council even though you did what you thought was best to save the galaxy. The Turian shopkeeper refers to you as human and absoulutely loathes you.

Because you were wrong. You failed. Admit it.

The new council won't even come to see you just because they think you only care about humanity.

Rewarded as a regicide deserves.

You don't think after all this that it wouldn't make someone get the least bit annoyed or pissed off about being blamed for this when all you did was try to save everyone.

I'd be damned penitent after this. I can suck up my failure to achieve the best outcome at Aratoht without blaming others for being angry at me; you can do the same here.

You can call me a scumbag, but I'm the scumbag that just helped those Asari out of their because of a crappy and unfair service no matter what the heck they thought of me.

I admit that a dilettante scumbag is better than a full-time scumbag.

I treat every member of my squad and people I meet with the decency and respect they deserve, and they usually respond in kind, but don't expect me to treat those that treat me with no decency or respect the type I would give to those people I treat equally.

Don't worry. It's clear that asking such of you would not match your abilities.

[HiroVoid]

Xilizhra wrote...

If you allow it, yes.

Agreed.  I didn't say I was perfect.

Because you were wrong. You failed. Admit it.

I won't admit anything.  How am I supposed to know that not focusing on Sovereign wouldn't cause a reaper invasion?  The casualties would have gone to 10,000 to the entire galaxy.  I mourn the loss of the council and those people that died.  I wished it hadn't happened, but the cost of what could have happened had the reapers gotten loose was far too high.

Rewarded as a regicide deserves.

Those people can admit whatever they want.  I didn't choose to kill them because I thought they were a**holes or that they deserved it.  I made a choice to do what I thought would make sure that the galaxy would see tomorrow, and that the species 50,000 years from now wouldn't see their skies darkened.

Spoiler

I'd be damned penitent after this. I can suck up my failure to achieve the best outcome at Aratoht without blaming others for being angry at me; you can do the same here.

I understand people being pissed at me.  What I don't like is when I try to help someone, and they spew racist slurs at me.  They don't need to expect respect when they don't show me any.

Don't worry. It's clear that asking such of you would not match your abilities.

Good.  I only hope they can get on their ship and hopefully change their views of humans one day.  Now get back to your perfect universe where everyone except a government of slavers and a bunch of bad guys love your character.

I also like how you can take the 'moral high ground' when you call me a scumbag and insult me, yet me getting pissed off at a couple of Asari spewing slurs at me makes me a scumbag.

Modifié par HiroVoid, 28 novembre 2011 - 04:28 .

[Xilizhra]

Agreed. I didn't say I was perfect.

And why don't you say it? You admit it so easily? With so much riding on your success? The fate of the galaxy? You allow this?

I won't admit anything. How am I supposed to know that not focusing on Sovereign wouldn't cause a reaper invasion?

I did. You could have thought about it further, made the same connections I did. But you didn't, did you? Did you? No.

Those people can admit whatever they want. I didn't choose to kill them because I thought they were a**holes or that they deserved it. I made a choice to do what I thought would make sure that the galaxy would see tomorrow, and that the species 50,000 years from now wouldn't see their skies darkened.

But you failed, and you refuse to admit it? And why's that? Because you "did the best you could?" Well, that's not your job; you're supposed to do the best thing possible! Your job isn't to be a fallible human; we have billions of them. You're a Spectre with unsurpassed access to a means to save not only the galaxy, but many, many specific people within it! You failed and you're telling me that it's no failure? That's why you're the scumbag! You threw away a chance to bring about the best possible outcome, which you could have discerned from the situation as it stands, and you see it as something you shouldn't be blamed for? That's the only reasonable reaction!

This is why you're Failures! Your job is to be perfect! And you muddle it with your human bull****! You dishonor the Alliance! You dishonor the galaxy! You dishonor yourselves! And most of all, you dishonor the human potential that you so claim to love by squandering it on your pitiful ****ing degeneracy!

[BlueMagitek]

Xilizhra's always been a tad crazy. Rambles on and on but can't answer a yes or no question.

I'm pretty sure the two Asari were Geth Infiltrators anyway, so they really shouldn't have been helped anyway.

[HiroVoid]

Xilizhra wrote...
And why don't you say it? You admit it so easily? With so much riding on your success? The fate of the galaxy? You allow this?

It's not my job to be nice to racists.

I did. You could have thought about it further, made the same connections I did. But you didn't, did you? Did you? No.

You didn't know anything.  You made assumptions.  You thought you knew what you were talking about.  They may have been right, but they were still nothing more than theories and assumptions.  You took even that 1% chance that could have led to galactic extinction.

But you failed, and you refuse to admit it? And why's that? Because you "did the best you could?" Well, that's not your job; you're supposed to do the best thing possible! Your job isn't to be a fallible human; we have billions of them. You're a Spectre with unsurpassed access to a means to save not only the galaxy, but many, many specific people within it! You failed and you're telling me that it's no failure? That's why you're the scumbag! You threw away a chance to bring about the best possible outcome, which you could have discerned from the situation as it stands, and you see it as something you shouldn't be blamed for? That's the only reasonable reaction!

This is why you're Failures! Your job is to be perfect! And you muddle it with your human bull****! You dishonor the Alliance! You dishonor the galaxy! You dishonor yourselves! And most of all, you dishonor the human potential that you so claim to love by squandering it on your pitiful ****ing degeneracy!

Nobody's perfect.  Everyone has their flaws no matter what they admit to.  I went through the end of ME1 knowing the galaxy could be extinguished.  Sovereign and the reapers were an unknown.  I could make assumptions.  I could make connections.  I could do all of that, but it's possible I could be proved wrong.  I took the path that I felt had the best chance to save not just the galaxy, but the galaxy in 50,000 years, and the one in 100,000 years.  The reapers aren't an entity that I'm going to take even that 1% chance they succeed if I can come up with a better one.  I'm going to take the path that either assures or increases my chances that they're wiped out, so that 50,000 years from now, people'll live in a universe that doesn't have to worry about making that sort of choice or risk.  You can rationalize your theories, and you may be right, but that doesn't change the fact that there was a 100% way of you knowing, and you took that 1% chance you could be wrong.  If everyone on the DA survived your playthrough, I'm glad for them.

[HiroVoid]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Wow, I had no idea people cared so much about how Shepard reacted to a couple of asari. I would think this was one of the most inconsequential and unimportant choices in the game, but I guess others apparently feel differently.

I think it's kinda gone past that matter, and what Xil thinks of my character, and now going more into the final choice in ME1.  Arguments can be funny that way.

[GodWood]

Xilizhra wrote...

Agreed. I didn't say I was perfect.

And why don't you say it? You admit it so easily? With so much riding on your success? The fate of the galaxy? You allow this?

I won't admit anything. How am I supposed to know that not focusing on Sovereign wouldn't cause a reaper invasion?

I did. You could have thought about it further, made the same connections I did. But you didn't, did you? Did you? No.

Those people can admit whatever they want. I didn't choose to kill them because I thought they were a**holes or that they deserved it. I made a choice to do what I thought would make sure that the galaxy would see tomorrow, and that the species 50,000 years from now wouldn't see their skies darkened.

But you failed, and you refuse to admit it? And why's that? Because you "did the best you could?" Well, that's not your job; you're supposed to do the best thing possible! Your job isn't to be a fallible human; we have billions of them. You're a Spectre with unsurpassed access to a means to save not only the galaxy, but many, many specific people within it! You failed and you're telling me that it's no failure? That's why you're the scumbag! You threw away a chance to bring about the best possible outcome, which you could have discerned from the situation as it stands, and you see it as something you shouldn't be blamed for? That's the only reasonable reaction!

This is why you're Failures! Your job is to be perfect! And you muddle it with your human bull****! You dishonor the Alliance! You dishonor the galaxy! You dishonor yourselves! And most of all, you dishonor the human potential that you so claim to love by squandering it on your pitiful ****ing degeneracy!

That was very entertaining.

Bravo.

[DarkSeraphym]

Xilizhra wrote...

I did. You could have thought about it further, made the same connections I did. But you didn't, did you? Did you? No.

Aren't you patting yourself on the back a little too much for being successful in what was essentially a coin toss? It wasn't like we were bombarded with graphs of casualties, lists of available ships, and statistical figures to suggest our odds of success had we expended forces to save the Council. Without any of these things, I don't see how you could have been anymore informed about your odds than the rest of us. Instead, seems to me like you, along with rest of us who played ME, went with what we thought was best at that very moment. There is a phrase for that, it's called "winging it".

Let's be honest here Xilizhra, every single one of us "winged it" when it came to that decision.  We didn't have any of the data that would have allowed us to make an informed decision. We were told the Council was in immediate danger of being destroyed by Sovereign. One of our party members, or at least in my game anyway, vocalized his desire to convince Shepard to focus on Sovereign because we'd be giving up resources to protect political officials. You made the decision to protect the Council, despite what the game had suggested could happen as a consequence, and you got lucky that you ended up being able to protect the Council and save the galaxy all in one day. I made the decision to give up the only dreadnaught that was immediately available at the time and I also got lucky.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 28 novembre 2011 - 05:16 .

[Xilizhra]

You can rationalize your theories, and you may be right, but that doesn't change the fact that there was a 100% way of you knowing, and you took that 1% chance you could be wrong. If everyone on the DA survived your playthrough, I'm glad for them.

There was never a 100% way to know. Other risks could occur while leaving the geth fleet completely intact after destroying the only dreadnaught available. Your refusal to admit error remains disgusting.

[HiroVoid]

Xilizhra wrote...

You can rationalize your theories, and you may be right, but that doesn't change the fact that there was a 100% way of you knowing, and you took that 1% chance you could be wrong. If everyone on the DA survived your playthrough, I'm glad for them.

There was never a 100% way to know. Other risks could occur while leaving the geth fleet completely intact after destroying the only dreadnaught available. Your refusal to admit error remains disgusting.

The way the choice was presented at the time was that 'Focus on Sovereing' was the most efficient way to destroy Sovereign while you risked ships going after to save the Ascension.  Still, I'm fine with that justification if you want to use it for going after the Ascension.  You just simply didn't bring it up before and said I should have known the best outcome was to save the ascension since I should have known that Sovereign needed Saren to activate the relay to get the reapers there when one of the squadmates points out Sovereign opening up the relay could still be a worry.  You're also pointing out how I should have known the geth ships would have been a threat even though it wasn't put into the context of the situation.  Again, I'm fine with you personally using that defense though.  My defense is there was no way to know what was the best route.  I decided to go with the context of the scene that said that the most efficient way to deal with the situation was to focus on sovereign.  Heck, it even gave me 8 paragon points and 9 renegade points since it seemed to understand that context of the situation.