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[Homebound]

BlueMagitek wrote...

Hellbound555 wrote...

@Blue
true but those organizations and government have something Cerberus does not have.

Regulations.

Since when has the Council had regulations?  They seem to determine things on a whim.  Where is the accountability, the checks and the balances?

And since when have they always followed regulations?  Don't forget that Hackett makes Shepard his personal asassin, potentially twice in a game, when he notes that such a thing is illegal under the Alliance.  And if the Alliance is sketching the law with one spectre, you can bet the other species are doing so as well.

True, but they are still accountable to the citadel races and their own people for what they do. There will always be that safeguard, despite all the crap they try to get away with.
Cerberus, not so much. They just dont care.

[GodWood]

Is this another one of those times were a poster condemns Cerberus then defends the council because they (lol) 'follow the rules' ?

[Homebound]

GodWood wrote...

Is this another one of those times were a poster condemns Cerberus then defends the council because they (lol) 'follow the rules' ?

no this is one of those times where a poster understands the parallels between cerberus and the council and tries to explain that the difference between them is that one of them has rules in the first place.

[Seboist]

GodWood wrote...

Is this another one of those times were a poster condemns Cerberus then defends the council because they (lol) 'follow the rules' ?

Yeah.

[GodWood]

I'm never quite sure what to think of such people..

On one hand they're naive, ignorant, fools who have absolutely no idea how the world actually works. But, on the other hand, they're useful tools that can be exploited by the more 'enlightened' among us.

Hmm.

[Ultai]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Hellbound555 wrote...

no this is one of those times where a poster understands the parallels between cerberus and the council and tries to explain that the difference between them is that one of them has rules in the first place.

The Council does not have any actual rules. They pretend to have rules, they put on a show about it, a facade. However they then turn around and enlist a group of individuals to break as many rules as they want as long as it benefits the Council.

They're hypocrites.

Was it a CDN article that had a story about how Spectres killed a bunch of people because they were talking bad about the Council or something to that effect?  I think it was something about bad economic numbers being associated with the Council somehow, and the Spectres shut them up.  It's been so long but I remember it vaguely.  Real stellar system of government that Council is.

[Seboist]

Ultai wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Hellbound555 wrote...

no this is one of those times where a poster understands the parallels between cerberus and the council and tries to explain that the difference between them is that one of them has rules in the first place.

The Council does not have any actual rules. They pretend to have rules, they put on a show about it, a facade. However they then turn around and enlist a group of individuals to break as many rules as they want as long as it benefits the Council.

They're hypocrites.

Was it a CDN article that had a story about how Spectres killed a bunch of people because they were talking bad about the Council or something to that effect?  I think it was something about bad economic numbers being associated with the Council somehow, and the Spectres shut them up.  It's been so long but I remember it vaguely.  Real stellar system of government that Council is.

Yeah and the Spectre involved was Tela Vasir.

[Seboist]

I wish there would have been a choice to capture Vasir and make her part of TIM's harem.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Ahh Tela Vasir, my second favorite mass effect villain!

But getting back to TIM. Does anyone got a good explaination for how Cerberus is able to attack and conquer Omega without any retaliation from the Council/Alliance (they must have some proxy soldiers they can use), or other Terminus states?

[Homebound]

like I mentioned, the Council isnt perfect either. But that can change. The council are politicians, and ultimately politicians are subject to the demands of the masses even if they change the rules to quiet the crowd.

Cerberus on the other hand isn't limited by that. It's their greatest strength and greatest weakness. If they do something wrong, theres no way to fix that exept by destroying them.

Modifié par Hellbound555, 19 février 2012 - 11:23 .

[John Renegade]

Hellbound555 wrote...

like I mentioned, the Council isnt perfect either. But that can change. The council are politicians, and ultimately politicians are subject to the demands of the masses even if they change the rules to quiet the crowd.

Cerberus on the other hand isn't limited by that. It's their greatest strength and greatest weakness. If they do something wrong, theres no way to fix that exept by destroying them.

So why didn't the masses change the way the Council works for the last few milennia? Do you expect that the masses will somehow suddenly get more intelligent, and if so, then what would be the catalyst?

[Dean_the_Young]

John Renegade wrote...

GodWood wrote...

You're like a young Saphra.

*not sure whether to take this as a compliment*

Don't. You have far greater patience and tact, which makes you a better speaker (or writer).

[Dean_the_Young]

Xilizhra wrote...

If you're not trolling, just... stop.

Well, he's not completely wrong. The general idea is there, even if some of the implementation is iffy.

Nah, not really.

[Dean_the_Young]

Ultai wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Hellbound555 wrote...

no this is one of those times where a poster understands the parallels between cerberus and the council and tries to explain that the difference between them is that one of them has rules in the first place.

The Council does not have any actual rules. They pretend to have rules, they put on a show about it, a facade. However they then turn around and enlist a group of individuals to break as many rules as they want as long as it benefits the Council.

They're hypocrites.

Was it a CDN article that had a story about how Spectres killed a bunch of people because they were talking bad about the Council or something to that effect?  I think it was something about bad economic numbers being associated with the Council somehow, and the Spectres shut them up.  It's been so long but I remember it vaguely.  Real stellar system of government that Council is.

That was Tela Vasir in a crack-down on TruthHax, a group which leaked unflattering economic figures that undermined the Council's claims.

[mummio2]

I haven't read the leaked script, can someone here who has tell me if me3 is going to be a sort of the coyote and the roadrunner line, with cerberus playing the part of the coyote for about 40-80 hours plotting very sophisticated schemes and incursions just to see them regularly ruined by shep and his/her paragon crew?

Modifié par mummio2, 19 février 2012 - 11:54 .

[BlueMagitek]

Hellbound555 wrote...

True, but they are still accountable to the citadel races and their own people for what they do. There will always be that safeguard, despite all the crap they try to get away with.
Cerberus, not so much. They just dont care.

Funny, because most of the time when the Council does something and the Citadel races don't like it, the Citadel races either put up with it or leave.  And the Council don't care at all.  They kicked out the Quarians, didn't even try to keep the Batarians around.

You're right, the Council just don't care~.

[Barquiel]

BlueMagitek wrote...

Hellbound555 wrote...

True, but they are still accountable to the citadel races and their own people for what they do. There will always be that safeguard, despite all the crap they try to get away with.
Cerberus, not so much. They just dont care.

Funny, because most of the time when the Council does something and the Citadel races don't like it, the Citadel races either put up with it or leave.  And the Council don't care at all.  They kicked out the Quarians, didn't even try to keep the Batarians around.

You're right, the Council just don't care~.

Don't you think that violating the laws/rules of an organization are valid grounds for expulsion from that organization?

Modifié par Barquiel, 19 février 2012 - 05:31 .

[BlueMagitek]

Barquiel wrote...

Don't you think that violating the laws/rules of an organization are valid grounds for expulsion from that organization?

Council: Don't make AI.
Quarians: 'k, we make VI.
Geth: We glitch in programming and have rudimentary AI now 
Quarians: OH ****! We shut you down.
Geth: lol no, enjoy ~1% of your population nubs
Quarians: Plz help
Council: LOL GTFO

Council: Hew-mans, u can colonize that traverse
Humans: 'kk
Batarians: But we are already doing that
Council: Trolololol
Batarians: Well we're leaving!
Council:  Don't let the door hit you on the way out~!

Yes, truly the Quarians and Batarians are deserving of their fates.

[John Renegade]

Barquiel wrote...

BlueMagitek wrote...

Hellbound555 wrote...

True, but they are still accountable to the citadel races and their own people for what they do. There will always be that safeguard, despite all the crap they try to get away with.
Cerberus, not so much. They just dont care.

Funny, because most of the time when the Council does something and the Citadel races don't like it, the Citadel races either put up with it or leave.  And the Council don't care at all.  They kicked out the Quarians, didn't even try to keep the Batarians around.

You're right, the Council just don't care~.

Don't you think that violating the laws/rules of an organization are valid grounds for expulsion from that organization?

Don't you think that settling a world outside of said organisation's territory by species not belonging to this organization shouldn't legally concern that organisation in any way?

Yet, it is apparent that this organisation can do whatever it wants whenever it wants and wherever it wants. (Yes, I'm talking about the quarian terminus almost-colony turned into an elcor colony by the order of the Council which 'persuaded' the quarians to let go of the world.)

Modifié par John Renegade, 19 février 2012 - 05:55 .

[Barquiel]

BlueMagitek wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Don't you think that violating the laws/rules of an organization are valid grounds for expulsion from that organization?

Council: Don't make AI.
Quarians: 'k, we make VI.
Geth: We glitch in programming and have rudimentary AI now 
Quarians: OH ****! We shut you down.
Geth: lol no, enjoy ~1% of your population nubs
Quarians: Plz help
Council: LOL GTFO

Council: Hew-mans, u can colonize that traverse
Humans: 'kk
Batarians: But we are already doing that
Council: Trolololol
Batarians: Well we're leaving!
Council:  Don't let the door hit you on the way out~!

Yes, truly the Quarians and Batarians are deserving of their fates.

The batarians considered the Skyllian Verge within their sphere of interest, they colonized nothing. And maybe the asari/salarians were not the biggest fans of the batarians because the hegemony attacked their colonies? Or do you suggest compulsory membership?

Yes, they should have helped the quarians to commit genocide (after the quarians struck the first blow and violated council laws). I am sure that nobody would blame the council in that case

[Barquiel]

John Renegade wrote...

Don't you think that settling a world outside of said organisation's territory by species not belonging to this organization shouldn't legally concern that organisation in any way?

Yet, it is apparent that this organisation can do whatever it wants whenever it wants and wherever it wants. (Yes, I'm talking about the quarian terminus almost-colony turned into an elcor colony by the order of the Council which 'persuaded' the quarians to let go of the world.)

Ekuna was council territory...and the quarians knew exactly that the system was in council space (or there would have been no reason to ask the council for permission)

The council simply didn't accept being presented with a fait accompli in this way.