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By PaintFan08. Because god yes.
Modifié par Ashwraith, 21 octobre 2011 - 11:04 .
Brotherhood of Cerberus - The Illusive Man Discussion/Support Thread
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Lambda Faction
, juil. 09 2011 10:26
#2451
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 10:55
Ashwraith
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Crap, forgot about Anderson. Fixed.
EDIT: Top of the page, you say? :U
By PaintFan08. Because god yes.
EDIT: Top of the page, you say? :U
By PaintFan08. Because god yes.
Retour en haut
#2452
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 10:56
Ravensword
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Seboist wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Who the hell is Kai Leng? He must be from the books, right?
Yeah, Cerberus operative and former N7 marine that TIM got out of prison for killing a Krogan with a knife.
Oh. He killed a Krogan all by himself? What else is there to know about him?
#2453
Guest_cacharadon_*
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:00
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Saphra Deden wrote...
SandTrout wrote...
My memory is not quite good enough to quote the book off the top of my head, but part of TIM's internal monologue included the point that he recognized that he did not ask Kai Leng what had happened to Grayson until there was nothing that could be done anyways (they were already departing on the escape shuttle).
No, I don't recall that being the case. As soon as Kai Leng showed up he knew what had happened.
If someone could quote the book though, that'd be great.
In any case, the fact that he grabbed a gun and went after Grayson at all, rather than boarding an escape pod, proves my point. When Kai Leng showed up it was after TIM's two troopers had been killed. Would it be realistic to expect TIM and Kai Leng to fight through the entire station by themselves?
TIM might have his own doubts about his bravery while on the shuttle, but if he thought about it seriously he'd realize he already knew it was pointless once Kai Leng showed up.
A 'selfless hero' can retreat too, you know.
quoting from the book :
The Illusive Man almost replied, “You made the wrong choice.” Instead, he bit his tongue as herealized he could just as easily have asked Kai Leng the same question back on the station, while therewas still a chance to do something about it.The encounter with the turians had rattled him. He had thought he was going to die. Faced with aglimpse of his own mortality, he had decided not to ask Kai Leng about Grayson because he didn’t wantto know the answer.
I doubt retribution would ever be a good source to find redeeming qualities about TIMmy. Him being responsible for Grayson in the 1st place and all...
The evolution comic potrayed him in a much better light. He wasn't even xenophobic in it considering that it was set during FCW. Going so far as to help Saren prevent the reaperised Turians from breaking into Palaven (it was Eva who talked him out of it).
#2454
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:02
Dave of Canada
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Anderson is what Paragon Shepard aspires to be.
Kai Leng is what Renegade Shepard could've been.
Both very interesting characters.
Kai Leng is what Renegade Shepard could've been.
Both very interesting characters.
#2455
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:03
Aeowyn
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Ravensword wrote...
Seboist wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Who the hell is Kai Leng? He must be from the books, right?
Yeah, Cerberus operative and former N7 marine that TIM got out of prison for killing a Krogan with a knife.
Oh. He killed a Krogan all by himself? What else is there to know about him?
He can kill armoured and armed turians while dancing naked in the moonlight with a knife in his hand.
#2456
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:05
Sebby
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Aeowyn wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Seboist wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Who the hell is Kai Leng? He must be from the books, right?
Yeah, Cerberus operative and former N7 marine that TIM got out of prison for killing a Krogan with a knife.
Oh. He killed a Krogan all by himself? What else is there to know about him?
He can kill armoured and armed turians while dancing naked in the moonlight with a knife in his hand.
That's the kind of man Renegade femshep likes. <3
#2458
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:06
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I see. I take it that Kai Leng is a bastard, then. The kind of person you'd buy an expensive bullet to save for the coup de gras.
#2459
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:06
Ashwraith
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Aeowyn wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Seboist wrote...
Ravensword wrote...
Who the hell is Kai Leng? He must be from the books, right?
Yeah, Cerberus operative and former N7 marine that TIM got out of prison for killing a Krogan with a knife.
Oh. He killed a Krogan all by himself? What else is there to know about him?
He can kill armoured and armed turians while dancing naked in the moonlight with a knife in his hand.
He's the Most Interesting Cerberus Operative in the World.
Modifié par Ashwraith, 21 octobre 2011 - 11:07 .
#2460
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:11
Dave of Canada
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Ravensword wrote...
I see. I take it that Kai Leng is a bastard, then. The kind of person you'd buy an expensive bullet to save for the coup de gras.
*SPOILER*
Most people hate him for killing Aria's daughter.
#2461
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:12
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cacharadon wrote...
The Illusive Man almost replied, “You made the wrong choice.” Instead, he bit his tongue as herealized he could just as easily have asked Kai Leng the same question back on the station, while therewas still a chance to do something about it.The encounter with the turians had rattled him. He had thought he was going to die. Faced with aglimpse of his own mortality, he had decided not to ask Kai Leng about Grayson because he didn’t wantto know the answer.
I doubt retribution would ever be a good source to find redeeming qualities about TIMmy. Him being responsible for Grayson in the 1st place and all...
I think you are being way too harsh here. You make it sound as if he never marched off to battle. When faced with hope (when he thoughth he was about to die) he gave in to his weaker half. He's human after all.
#2463
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:16
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Ashwraith wrote...
Pssssst.
Drive-by TIMShep, ho~!
Is TIM an aspiring model? :happy:
#2464
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:17
Ravensword
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Ashwraith wrote...
Pssssst.
Drive-by TIMShep, ho~!
Look at this...
#2465
Guest_cacharadon_*
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:23
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Saphra Deden wrote...
cacharadon wrote...
The Illusive Man almost replied, “You made the wrong choice.” Instead, he bit his tongue as herealized he could just as easily have asked Kai Leng the same question back on the station, while therewas still a chance to do something about it.The encounter with the turians had rattled him. He had thought he was going to die. Faced with aglimpse of his own mortality, he had decided not to ask Kai Leng about Grayson because he didn’t wantto know the answer.
I doubt retribution would ever be a good source to find redeeming qualities about TIMmy. Him being responsible for Grayson in the 1st place and all...
I think you are being way too harsh here. You make it sound as if he never marched off to battle. When faced with hope (when he thoughth he was about to die) he gave in to his weaker half. He's human after all.
um I was quoting the book... so yea...
And let's not forget the reason why he was at that particular base in the 1st place, he wanted to see Grayson suffer, (i can quote the book again if you like).
Don't forget Grayson was one of his top operatives and someone who drank in every word that ever poured out of TIM's mouth.
He was a true believer and ultimately he was expendable.
The message im trying to get across in my incoherent stream of concience is that, by trying to save humanity he is destroying the very thing that defines humanity. Humanity is not defined as survival at all costs in my book. Actually I cant think of anyone so jaded outside of fiction.
I play a pragon shep, deal with it:innocent:
*Edit,
Eh, didn't mean for it to sound that offensive, I love TIM's character and his portrayal, just don't agree with his methods.
Modifié par cacharadon, 21 octobre 2011 - 11:26 .
#2466
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:25
Dave of Canada
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Grayson wasn't a "true believer", he betrayed Cerberus and was holding them hostage with intel. Rather than waste resources and simply eliminate Grayson, Grayson was dragged off and experimented upon. If not him, it would've been somebody else.
#2467
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:26
SandTrout
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Many thanks for the quote.cacharadon wrote...
quoting from the book :
The Illusive Man almost replied, “You made the wrong choice.” Instead, he bit his tongue as herealized he could just as easily have asked Kai Leng the same question back on the station, while therewas still a chance to do something about it.The encounter with the turians had rattled him. He had thought he was going to die. Faced with aglimpse of his own mortality, he had decided not to ask Kai Leng about Grayson because he didn’t wantto know the answer.
I doubt retribution would ever be a good source to find redeeming qualities about TIMmy. Him being responsible for Grayson in the 1st place and all...
The evolution comic potrayed him in a much better light. He wasn't even xenophobic in it considering that it was set during FCW. Going so far as to help Saren prevent the reaperised Turians from breaking into Palaven (it was Eva who talked him out of it).
#2468
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:27
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cacharadon wrote...
um I was quoting the book... so yea...
You quoted the book and then you offered your opinion on it. That's what I was responding to, idiot.
chacharadon wrote...
And let's not forget the reason why he was at that particular base in the 1st place, he wanted to see Grayson suffer, (i can quote the book again if you like).
Which... means what? Most people on this forum would do the same thing to watch the Illusive Man suffer or Udina or any other character they don't like.
Whatever Grayson may have once been at this point he was a traitor to Cerberus.
cacharadon wrote...
The message im trying to get across in my incohernt stream of concience is that, by trying to save humanity he is destroying the very thing that defines humanity.
...and now you've exposed yourself as an ignorant plebian.
#2469
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:28
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And you again demonstrate why most people have very little respect for you, Saphra.
#2470
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:32
Sebby
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Dave of Canada wrote...
Grayson wasn't a "true believer", he betrayed Cerberus and was holding them hostage with intel. Rather than waste resources and simply eliminate Grayson, Grayson was dragged off and experimented upon. If not him, it would've been somebody else.
He should be grateful his hide was used to further the cause instead of riddled with bullets.
#2471
Guest_cacharadon_*
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:34
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Dave of Canada wrote...
Grayson wasn't a "true believer", he betrayed Cerberus and was holding them hostage with intel. Rather than waste resources and simply eliminate Grayson, Grayson was dragged off and experimented upon. If not him, it would've been somebody else.
You need to read "Ascension". The only reason Grayson went along with the drug trials on his daughter was because his belief in TIM was absolute. He loved Gillian and yet he was the one ferrying the drugs to Jiro. Khalee points out that Jiro almost killed Gillian with his experiments and yet he still kept on working with TIM and lead the attack on the flotilla. It was much later that he betray cerberus by allowing Gillian to escape, and going on the run himself.
I don't see much point in whitewashing TIM, it's his conflicting nature that makes him such a fascinating character. 3 books, 2 games and 5 comics down and all we have is speculation on where his leanings lie.
*Edit, typo
Modifié par cacharadon, 21 octobre 2011 - 11:37 .
#2472
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:37
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cacharadon wrote...
You need to read "Ascension". The onl reason Grayson went along with te drug trials on his daughter was because his belief in TIM was absolute. He loved Gillian and yet he was the one ferrying the drugs to Jiro. Khalee points out that Jiro almost killed Gillian with his experiments and yet he still kept on working with TIM and lead the attack on the flotilla. It was much later that he betrays cerberus by allowing Gillian to escape and going on the run himself.
Which in the end means he wasn't a true believer. He decided to listen to his heart instead of his brain. It's tragic.
#2473
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:40
Kaiser Shepard
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They smell, he doesn't need any more of a reason than that.Ashwraith wrote...
And of course, I'd like to know why he hates aliens so damn much. INQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW, KAI LENG.
#2474
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:42
Sebby
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Kaiser Shepard wrote...
They smell, he doesn't need any more of a reason than that.Ashwraith wrote...
And of course, I'd like to know why he hates aliens so damn much. INQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW, KAI LENG.
Did he attend the Kaiser Shepard school of hate and bigotry?
#2475
Guest_cacharadon_*
Posté 21 octobre 2011 - 11:43
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god...Saphra Deden wrote...
cacharadon wrote...
You need to read "Ascension". The onl reason Grayson went along with te drug trials on his daughter was because his belief in TIM was absolute. He loved Gillian and yet he was the one ferrying the drugs to Jiro. Khalee points out that Jiro almost killed Gillian with his experiments and yet he still kept on working with TIM and lead the attack on the flotilla. It was much later that he betrays cerberus by allowing Gillian to escape and going on the run himself.
Which in the end means he wasn't a true believer. He decided to listen to his heart instead of his brain. It's tragic.
You do realise that your talking about a father and his only daughter right? (granted he's not the biological parent, but he loves her all the same). And you think that being the father he should have gone ahead with cerberus' drug trials? How can this constitute as listening to his brain?
