308 réponses à ce sujet

[nhsk]

IsaacShep wrote...

Do you know the difference between bisexual and gay?

Yes... Or would you care to explain it to me so you are completely sure I know?

I don't see what that has to do with anything I said about conscious choice...?

[jshadow]

element eater wrote...

jshadow wrote...
have same sex romances if you want, just not with characters that are cannonicly the way they are, I don't want to repeat Anders mess up from DA2

but tali never makes any comment on her sexuality so were is it cannon that she couldnt be bi she is pretty flirty with fem shep.

Doesnt realy make sense shed like humans at all so i dont realy see what the big deal is wether or not she likes human females or human men. 

I'm pretty sure BatmanPWNS said that Tali has never shown any sign of liking FemShep in ME2, only MaleShep differently.

[jlb524]

...but it's totally fine for NPCs to ignore Shepard's morality or how he/she treated them in the past or to ignore species barriers when going for romance.

JUST DONT TURN THEM GAYZ ZOMG

[Kachie]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Oh boy, I hope not. I think not everyone should be bi/******, some should be but ,at the same time, some should be straight.

Plus Tali has never shown any sign of liking FemShep in ME2 but with MaleShep she reacts differently.

Actually, with my FemShep, Tali had made a small pass, with the whole romantic stuff they talked about at one point. Like Tali said something to the sort of (and I can't find a video clip on youtube to prove this sorry..) of if she were to ever link her enviro suite with anyone it would be Shepard. And then she goes back on it, embarrassing herself, and Fem!Shep still makes a pass like, "Are you blushing?" and flusters Tali more.

So despite people's dislike of more bi characters, even after the first two games they were not available, Tali could still quite possibly have a thing for Fem!Shep but Bioware was too afraid to open up the romance option, considering how Fox News hated on them for their sex scenes on TV calling it sexist and basically porn.

[Khayness]

This is why I love this forum.

People don't mind the lack of inventory customization, in-depth skilltrees/item stats and branching storyline as long as they can motorboat some lovely funbags with a female PC.

Thank God the forum community is a small part of the Mass Effect one and there are more people over there who doesn't care about this eroge **** for the yaoi/yuri fans.

[Ryzaki]

Khayness wrote...

This is why I love this forum.

People don't mind the lack of inventory customization, in-depth skilltrees/item stats and branching storyline as long as they can motorboat some lovely funbags with a female PC.

Thank God the forum community is a small part of the Mass Effect one and there are more people over there who doesn't care about this eroge **** for the yaoi/yuri fans.

 

Did you bother even reading up on ME3 or do you just want attention? 

[shepskisaac]

nhsk wrote...
Yes... Or would you care to explain it to me so you are completely sure I know?

I don't see what that has to do with anything I said about conscious choice...?

You don't get it at all lol. Tali is established to like opposite gender. That much we know. If she was 'turned gay', it would mean her attraction to opposite gender would've been contradicted, overwritten and retconned with an exclusive attraction to the same gender. Only this way there would be any implication being gay is a 'choice' as she was turned from straight/bi into gay = exclusively attracted to females. However, she was not at any point established to dislike the same gender. Lack of option to pursue a romance is not an evidence of her attractions (and if you think it is, then she shouldn't be possible to romance by Shep of EITHER gender since there wasn't an option to romance her in ME1). If Tali is available for s/s romance in ME3 (means she's bisexual means bisexual people like BOTH men and women), it does not contradict anything established previously and there's no change in her sexual orientation because you can't change something that wasn't established in the first place. Had she declared her dislike of the same-gender, then there would be a change. Since she didn't say anything about it, it's a blank slate and she could've been bisexual all along. That's just how it is. Personal assumptions about a character's sexuality are not part of canon or facts. Some assumed Tali was asexual in ME1, it didn't matter. It was just an interpretation.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 09 juillet 2011 - 06:35 .

[Ryzaki]

I assumed Tali was only attracted to Quarians.

I was wrong *shrugs* it happens.

[KainrycKarr]

nhsk wrote...

Faust1979 wrote...

It's stupid to make everyone bi i hope they don't go that route

Problem is that if they don't, somebody will whine about it; so they cave in and make everyone bi. Essentially telling everyone that the religions are right, that being gay or bi is a choice. Thus nullifying every equal right and acceptance norms, homosexual and bisexual movement groups have fought for the last 20-30 years.

See some irony here?

But then again, ME is already clad in creationist theories so why not...

What?

And it doesn't tell everyone that the religions are right. That's an incredibly stupid thing to say. All it means is that they are making a gameplay decision about fictional characters that they created, that they had previously said no to.

That's literally all it is. It's not like Kaidan or whoever is going to be like "hey i wasn't gay before, but i chose to be gay now!".

Do I agree with it? No, not at all, but let's not make retarded claims like that.

[KainrycKarr]

Ryzaki wrote...

Khayness wrote...

This is why I love this forum.

People don't mind the lack of inventory customization, in-depth skilltrees/item stats and branching storyline as long as they can motorboat some lovely funbags with a female PC.

Thank God the forum community is a small part of the Mass Effect one and there are more people over there who doesn't care about this eroge **** for the yaoi/yuri fans.

 

Did you bother even reading up on ME3 or do you just want attention? 

Of course he didn't, that would be sheer lunacy.

[Kachie]

IsaacShep wrote...

nhsk wrote...
Yes... Or would you care to explain it to me so you are completely sure I know?

I don't see what that has to do with anything I said about conscious choice...?

You don't get it at all lol. Tali is established to like opposite gender. That much we know. If she was 'turned gay', it would mean her attraction to opposite gender would've been contradicted, overwritten and retconned with an exclusive attraction to the same gender. Only this way there would be any implication being gay is a 'choice' as she was turned from straight/bi into gay = exclusively attracted to females. However, she was not at any point established to dislike the same gender. Lack of option to pursue a romance is not an evidence of her attractions (and if you think it is, then she shouldn't be possible to romance by Shep of EITHER gender since there wasn't an option to romance her in ME1). If Tali is available for s/s romance in ME3 (means she's bisexual means bisexual people like BOTH men and women), it does not contradict anything established previously and there's no change in her sexual orientation because you can't change something that wasn't established in the first place. Had she declared her dislike of the same-gender, then there would be a change. Since she didn't say anything about it, it's a blank slate and she could've been bisexual all along. That's just how it is. Personal assumptions about a character's sexuality are not part of canon or facts. Some assumed Tali was asexual in ME1, it didn't matter. It was just an interpretation.

Not only that but some people are in the closet and will try to play the part of a straight person. I wouldn't know how that would work in an alien culture, but I'd assume some cultures would be more open to it then lets say.. American culture. So it could be said that she was bisexual but afraid to act on her feelings for a female Shepard.

[Luigitornado]

I thought ME was about players playing the role of Shepard, not fanboys choosing the sexual orientation of other characters. Please no.

Modifié par Luigitornado, 09 juillet 2011 - 06:41 .

[arafinwe_ingalaure]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Oh boy, I hope not. I think not everyone should be bi/******, some should be but ,at the same time, some should be straight.

Plus Tali has never shown any sign of liking FemShep in ME2 but with MaleShep she reacts differently.

Wrong I think Tali showed many interest in FemShep in ME 2, and we all knew she was suppose to be BI because all the game guide said that Tali and Garrus where romanceable by anyone.  They just chicken out at last minute.

I want to romance Tali with FemShep in ME 3

[Luigitornado]

Kachie wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

nhsk wrote...
Yes... Or would you care to explain it to me so you are completely sure I know?

I don't see what that has to do with anything I said about conscious choice...?

You don't get it at all lol. Tali is established to like opposite gender. That much we know. If she was 'turned gay', it would mean her attraction to opposite gender would've been contradicted, overwritten and retconned with an exclusive attraction to the same gender. Only this way there would be any implication being gay is a 'choice' as she was turned from straight/bi into gay = exclusively attracted to females. However, she was not at any point established to dislike the same gender. Lack of option to pursue a romance is not an evidence of her attractions (and if you think it is, then she shouldn't be possible to romance by Shep of EITHER gender since there wasn't an option to romance her in ME1). If Tali is available for s/s romance in ME3 (means she's bisexual means bisexual people like BOTH men and women), it does not contradict anything established previously and there's no change in her sexual orientation because you can't change something that wasn't established in the first place. Had she declared her dislike of the same-gender, then there would be a change. Since she didn't say anything about it, it's a blank slate and she could've been bisexual all along. That's just how it is. Personal assumptions about a character's sexuality are not part of canon or facts. Some assumed Tali was asexual in ME1, it didn't matter. It was just an interpretation.

Not only that but some people are in the closet and will try to play the part of a straight person. I wouldn't know how that would work in an alien culture, but I'd assume some cultures would be more open to it then lets say.. American culture. So it could be said that she was bisexual but afraid to act on her feelings for a female Shepard.

blah blah blah

[jlb524]

Luigitornado wrote...

I thought ME was about players playing the role of Shepard, not fanboys choosing the sexual orientation of other characters. Please no.

They've already let them choose who's possibly interested in Shepard *coughs* Tali and Garrus *coughs*

[Kachie]

arafinwe_ingalaure wrote...

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Oh boy, I hope not. I think not everyone should be bi/******, some should be but ,at the same time, some should be straight.

Plus Tali has never shown any sign of liking FemShep in ME2 but with MaleShep she reacts differently.

Wrong I think Tali showed many interest in FemShep in ME 2, and we all knew she was suppose to be BI because all the game guide said that Tali and Garrus where romanceable by anyone.  They just chicken out at last minute.

I want to romance Tali with FemShep in ME 3

lol Tali would be my second choice for a romance option in the ME series (if it were available in ME2) but I've romanced Liara for so long I just like her better. But Tali is so cute and I wanna cuddle her too.. o_O I may have to create a seperate fem!Shep to romance her in ME3 just for kicks

[Blooddrunk1004]

Simple solution:
1. Don't turn any old charachters into bi, so fans can stop worrying.
2. Make only new charachters bi (not all, just 1 maybe)
3. We already have enough bi people in Mass Effect anyway (Liara, Samara, Kelly, Shiala) and i also heard Kaidan will probably be bi aswell.

Modifié par Blooddrunk1004, 09 juillet 2011 - 06:45 .

[Kachie]

[quote]

Not only that but some people are in the closet and will try to play the part of a straight person. I wouldn't know how that would work in an alien culture, but I'd assume some cultures would be more open to it then lets say.. American culture. So it could be said that she was bisexual but afraid to act on her feelings for a female Shepard.

[/quote]

blah blah blah



[/quote]

Nothing intellegent to say?

[shepskisaac]

Blooddrunk1004 wrote...

Simple solution:
1. Don't turn any old charachters into bi, so fans can stop worrying.

So, BW should just submit to illogical aruments?

Blooddrunk1004 wrote...
3. We already have enough bi people in Mass Effect anyway (Liara, Samara, Kelly, Shiala)

Oooohhhhh look, somehow all of them just happen to be females!

[Kachie]

IsaacShep wrote...

Blooddrunk1004 wrote...

Simple solution:
1. Don't turn any old charachters into bi, so fans can stop worrying.

So, BW should just submit to illogical aruments?

Blooddrunk1004 wrote...
3. We already have enough bi people in Mass Effect anyway (Liara, Samara, Kelly, Shiala)

Oooohhhhh look, somehow all of them just happen to be females!

Not to mention three of which are Asari and consider themselve mono-gendered so.. it counts yet it doesnt count for being bisexual... O_o Because all their race is are females, but they can reproduce with another female so it's still mono-gendered.

Besides, you can't romance Shiala or Samara in ME2

[nhsk]

IsaacShep wrote...

You don't get it at all lol. Tali is established to like opposite gender. That much we know. If she was 'turned gay', it would mean her attraction to opposite gender would've been contradicted, overwritten and retconned with an exclusive attraction to the same gender.

Only this way there would be any implication being gay is a 'choice' as she was turned from straight/bi into gay = exclusively attracted to females. However, she was not at any point established to dislike the same gender. Lack of option to pursue a romance is not an evidence of her attractions (and if you think it is, then she shouldn't be possible to romance by Shep of EITHER gender since there wasn't an option to romance her in ME1).

If Tali is available for s/s romance in ME3 (means she's bisexual means bisexual people like BOTH men and women), it does not contradict anything established previously and there's no change in her sexual orientation because you can't change something that wasn't established in the first place.

Had she declared her dislike of the same-gender, then there would be a change. Since she didn't say anything about it, it's a blank slate and she could've been bisexual all along. That's just how it is. Personal assumptions about a character's sexuality are not part of canon. Some assumed Tali was asexual in ME1, it didn't matter. It was just an interpretation.

More paragraphs please next time

And skip the explaining about what a bisexual vs. a gay is, I know if you didn't notice the irony. But I see your point about missing romance pursue attempts, I hadn't thought of that I must admit.

I just look into recent games, notably DA2 who turned a person clearly not attracted to men into a bisexual, namely Anders, and made everyone who was romancable bisexual. Which I personally still think is wrong (not bisexuality, but that everyone was).

But I see my fears apparently have been laid to rest as Casey H apparently said people wouldn't be retconned into liking their gender, I could have seen f.example Jack being turned bisexual from the DA2 treatment, which WOULD have been a major flaw. Now I have some faith that she won't, she stated she wasn't attracted to girls in ME2.

And my argument was not against Tali in particular, but the fear of the DA2 treatment in general.

I'm all for trying, but if everyone says "yes"... well... nerd rage from my part

[andy6915]

Wow, I had no idea I would come back to my topic and see it play out like this. I thought I would get a couple of "don't know"s and that's it. Huh. Anyway, I'm going to qoute 2 people that I agree with.

Kachie wrote...

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Oh boy, I hope not. I think not everyone should be bi/******, some should be but ,at the same time, some should be straight.

Plus Tali has never shown any sign of liking FemShep in ME2 but with MaleShep she reacts differently.

Actually, with my FemShep, Tali had made a small pass, with the whole romantic stuff they talked about at one point. Like Tali said something to the sort of (and I can't find a video clip on youtube to prove this sorry..) of if she were to ever link her enviro suite with anyone it would be Shepard. And then she goes back on it, embarrassing herself, and Fem!Shep still makes a pass like, "Are you blushing?" and flusters Tali more.

So despite people's dislike of more bi characters, even after the first two games they were not available, Tali could still quite possibly have a thing for Fem!Shep but Bioware was too afraid to open up the romance option, considering how Fox News hated on them for their sex scenes on TV calling it sexist and basically porn.

IsaacShep wrote...

nhsk wrote...
Yes... Or would you care to explain it to me so you are completely sure I know?

I don't see what that has to do with anything I said about conscious choice...?

You
don't get it at all lol. Tali is established to like opposite gender.
That much we know. If she was 'turned gay', it would mean her
attraction to opposite gender would've been contradicted, overwritten
and retconned with an exclusive attraction to the same gender.
Only this way there would be any implication being gay is a 'choice' as
she was turned from straight/bi into gay = exclusively attracted to
females. However, she was not at any point established to dislike the
same gender. Lack of option to pursue a romance is not an evidence of
her attractions (and if you think it is, then she shouldn't be possible
to romance by Shep of EITHER gender since there wasn't an option to
romance her in ME1). If Tali is available for s/s romance in ME3 (means
she's bisexual means bisexual people like BOTH men and women), it does
not contradict anything established previously and there's no change in
her sexual orientation because you can't change something that wasn't
established in the first place. Had she declared her dislike of the
same-gender, then there would be a change. Since she didn't say
anything about it, it's a blank slate and she could've been bisexual
all along. That's just how it is. Personal assumptions about a
character's sexuality are not part of canon or facts. Some assumed Tali
was asexual in ME1, it didn't matter. It was just an interpretation.

Both those posts are true. Tali has made some comments that could be considered flirty, and has acted embarrased after the fact, and you can make f-Shepard respond positively. Honestly, those comments make me think Tali has had a crush on f-Shepard just like she did m-Shepard, but is just less open and more tight lipped about it. She certainly acts like someone with a girl crush. I'll admit, Miranda or Jack (for example) would feel left field if they were bi next game, but Tali? Let's just say f-Shepard coming onto Tali would not get a negative reaction out of Tali of any sort, if you get my meaning.

[Wulfram]

Kachie wrote...

Actually, with my FemShep, Tali had made a small pass, with the whole romantic stuff they talked about at one point. Like Tali said something to the sort of (and I can't find a video clip on youtube to prove this sorry..) of if she were to ever link her enviro suite with anyone it would be Shepard. And then she goes back on it, embarrassing herself, and Fem!Shep still makes a pass like, "Are you blushing?" and flusters Tali more.

Relevant part starts at 2:35

It's fairly ambiguous, since linking suits is about trust and acceptance rather than necessarily sex or romance.

Modifié par Wulfram, 09 juillet 2011 - 06:55 .

[Ryzaki]

...How exactly was Anders "clearly" not attracted to men?

FYI that : I love you, but not in that way. Comment is for the Warden regardless of gender or race.
FYI2: Bisexual men are attracted to women too.
FYI3: Bisexual men are *not* attracted to all men they met.

[mya11]

Blaba blaba again a thread for this discussion pff

You can speculate for the romance but for this moment nobody know who romance !!

Wait and see on march 2012 please

Modifié par mya11, 09 juillet 2011 - 06:53 .