58 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr. Gogeta34]

The main thing there is that both Paragon and Renegade are supposed to be the "good guys"... just not both the "nice guys"

[Nightdragon8]

XDMMX wrote...

As a Renegade, I know that BioWare will cater to all the Paragons. Why you ask?

If they screw Paragons, Paragons will incessantly wine that the so called "Good Guys" didn't win.

If they screw Renegades, Renegades will probably just say, **** this, and move on.

So there gonna go with whatever causes less people to wine on there forums,

Although since Paragons are gonna probably wine about something anyways, they should just go for an awesome Renegade ending where humanity establishes dominance over the galaxy and forms the Terran Empire.

funny enough tho as of late its teh Renegades that have been whining the most....

[Dexi]

Depends... You can be paragon and do loads of stupid things, and can be renegade and do loads of stupid things...

People shouldn't renegade vs paragon so much because in the end it's a choice, nobody forces you to do so... I hear renegades complain about being punished... well, if you wanna go renegade it doesn't mean you have to do all that crap a 100% renegade does. I hear other people that paragons are taken for fools... again, their fault, you don't have to do the 100% paragon crap.
It's a matter of choice.
Many times in my paragon playthrough, of what I consider pure paragon, I chose renegade responses.
And that's how I consider the game should be played... not "i plei paragonz durr *point upper response* clickz space clickz space hurrrrr!!"

[Drone223]

I think all choices will benefit some how regardless of what they are but we will see the full benefits of those choices in ME 3 because as of ME 2 despte the reactions to some choices none of them have been actually any real effect

[Dexi]

I can't comprehend how some people want or expect that every choice will play out well...

People must understand that there are STUPID CHOICES. Both in real life and Mass Effect, both for paragon and for renegade.
You can't expect to do a stupid thing to work out well, that unless you're incredibly lucky... But an incredibly lucky Shepard to solve everyone's problems is just bad narrative.

[XDMMX]

Nightdragon8 wrote...

XDMMX wrote...

As a Renegade, I know that BioWare will cater to all the Paragons. Why you ask?

If they screw Paragons, Paragons will incessantly wine that the so called "Good Guys" didn't win.

If they screw Renegades, Renegades will probably just say, **** this, and move on.

So there gonna go with whatever causes less people to wine on there forums,

Although since Paragons are gonna probably wine about something anyways, they should just go for an awesome Renegade ending where humanity establishes dominance over the galaxy and forms the Terran Empire.

funny enough tho as of late its teh Renegades that have been whining the most....

Oh well I admit I was wrong.

But a true Renegade understands that just the act of being a Renegade is reward in itself. Who didn't love punching that reporter in the face, consequences be damned!

[TexasToast712]

 The smart people of course!  RENEGONS FTW!

[TexasToast712]

Whats the difference between Paragades and Renegons? I see Renegons as guys who are douches but do the right thing on big decisions.

Modifié par TexasToast712, 10 juillet 2011 - 09:34 .

[GodWood]

XDMMX wrote...
Oh well I admit I was wrong.
But a true Renegade understands that just the act of being a Renegade is reward in itself. Who didn't love punching that reporter in the face, consequences be damned!

A twoo renegade would've just used the renegade persuade option.

[GodWood]

TexasToast712 wrote...
Whats the difference between Paragades and Renegons? I see Renegons as guys who are douches but do the right thing on big decisions ala paragon route.

I thought it was

Paragades = Paragons with a short temper (use R interupts) but who still 'stick with their morals' with the big choices.
Renegons = Genuinely good guys who make the hard choices [major renegade choices] for the greater good (think Mordin)

I myself just prefer grouping paragades under the paragon banner and renegons under the renegade banner.

[BatmanPWNS]

I choose paragon because I usually would say what the paragon option has.

[TexasToast712]

GodWood wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...
Whats the difference between Paragades and Renegons? I see Renegons as guys who are douches but do the right thing on big decisions ala paragon route.

I thought it was

Paragades = Paragons with a short temper (use R interupts) but who still 'stick with their morals' with the big choices.
Renegons = Genuinely good guys who make the hard choices [major renegade choices] for the greater good (think Mordin)

I myself just prefer grouping paragades under the paragon banner and renegons under the renegade banner.

Hmmmm I lean more to the Paragade end of the spectrum then. I do all renegade interupts and pick mostly renegade dialogue but on the big decisions like Council, Rachni, Collector Base etc. I go Paragon. Iam a badass with a heart of gold?

[DalekBob]

You know, rather than simply punishing Paragons or Renegades it might be interesting if they have more ambiguous consequences that don't explicitly endorse one path or the other. The Rachni Queen might be a good example.

On the one hand I doubt she was telling Shepard bare faced fibs since she went out of her way to thank you on Ilium. But I don't think it'll be all sunshine and flowers since Sovereign alone was able to indoctrinate their whole species. It seems likely that they're more vulnerable to Reaper influence than other races. Perhaps it's a side effect of evolving to be receptive to the condemning of their queen, but in any case it spells trouble.

One way they could show this would be for the Reapers to target them for indoctrination, enslaving much of the brood and causing far higher casualties than there would have been if you killed the queen. However, other will escape the reapers and play a pivotal role in winning the final battle, leading a quicker victory, leaving it up to the player to decide if sparing her was worth the cost.

[Kaiser Shepard]

All these recent Paragon vs Renegade topics have been rather tame. It feels like it's time for someone to start another big Genophage discussion or maybe a Geth/life one.

[Lumikki]

I mean it's just character attitude choise, what does it matter?
You OP make it sound like right or wrong path?
It's about allowing players player different attitude characters and still WIN the war.
Doesn't really matter which one comes stronger, this is about shepards story.
They all can even come exactly same at the end.

Modifié par Lumikki, 10 juillet 2011 - 01:08 .

[Raiil]

GodWood wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...
Whats the difference between Paragades and Renegons? I see Renegons as guys who are douches but do the right thing on big decisions ala paragon route.

I thought it was

Paragades = Paragons with a short temper (use R interupts) but who still 'stick with their morals' with the big choices.
Renegons = Genuinely good guys who make the hard choices [major renegade choices] for the greater good (think Mordin)

I myself just prefer grouping paragades under the paragon banner and renegons under the renegade banner.

I always saw it as being within 25% of the other (so in my case, 60/40 renegade/paragon, making me a renegon, but for my sibling, who was about 55/45 paragon/renegade, making them a paragade).

I sort paragades and renegons under one banner, the 'context matters' one. 

[xentar]

Lumikki wrote...

I mean it's just character attitude choise, what does it matter?
You OP make it sound like right or wrong path?
It's about allowing players player different attitude characters and still WIN the war.
Doesn't really matter which one comes stronger, this is about shepards story.
They all can even come exactly same at the end.

As long as developers don't make one path explicitly superior to the other...

[Bad King]

Arppis wrote...

I find it kind of hilarious how renegade players are so upset that doing all those "one way" choices lead to oneway street. What you expect? Really? Paragons try to build better relations and work for option that more benficial for galactic community. It shouldn't come as surprise that you don't win any friends by punching and shooting everyone who gives even little room for you to do so.

Not really, there are plenty of silly paragon choices which end up screwing things up. Such as arresting Jax (the illegal weapons dealer) in ME1 and ruining Chellick's investigation, or attempting to arrest those exo-geni researchers experimenting on Thorian creepers and ending up murdering them all. Not exactly beneficial to the galactic community.

And many of the renegade options do win you allies- you can help increase Terra Firma's political standing or you can shoot Finch and gain the respect of the Turian guard.

[nhsk]

The "pure paragon based" protagonist in DA:O did some dumb mistakes that was revealed in the epilogue only, so I doubt ME will be any different, it just isn't as shown ingame as you would like.

Like it was rather innocent to let that dwarf girl study magic, but meh backfire.
Putting the noble king on the throne, backfire.
Siding with the templars just to be sure no demons was still lingering and even first enchanter agreed with was a good choice, yep backfire in another quest.
Rescuing that daughter? Yep you just barred yourself from getting the best damn bow in the game.
Not toughening up the goody two shoes templar? Yep you created a less than competent king when putting him on the throne.

I could probably find more examples, I just think that BW still has a few tricks up their sleeve to punish paragons in the long run.

Modifié par nhsk, 10 juillet 2011 - 02:39 .

[Bad King]

TexasToast712 wrote...

GodWood wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...
Whats the difference between Paragades and Renegons? I see Renegons as guys who are douches but do the right thing on big decisions ala paragon route.

I thought it was

Paragades = Paragons with a short temper (use R interupts) but who still 'stick with their morals' with the big choices.
Renegons = Genuinely good guys who make the hard choices [major renegade choices] for the greater good (think Mordin)

I myself just prefer grouping paragades under the paragon banner and renegons under the renegade banner.

Hmmmm I lean more to the Paragade end of the spectrum then. I do all renegade interupts and pick mostly renegade dialogue but on the big decisions like Council, Rachni, Collector Base etc. I go Paragon. Iam a badass with a heart of gold?

I'm probably renagon then. I always thought it was to do with your levels of paragon/renegade (so paragade = 60-75% paragon and 25%-40% renegade and Renagon = 25%-40% paragon and 60-75% renegade), but I prefer GodWood's interpretation.

Modifié par Bad King, 10 juillet 2011 - 02:45 .

[The Blue bird]

nhsk wrote...
Siding with the templars just to be sure no demons was still lingering and even first enchanter agreed with was a good choice, yep backfire in another quest.

I'm pretty sure annulling (read: killing/tranquilling) an entire Circle because there might be an issue would be classed as Renegade. I'd compare it to the Genophage issue.

[nhsk]

The Blue bird wrote...

nhsk wrote...
Siding with the templars just to be sure no demons was still lingering and even first enchanter agreed with was a good choice, yep backfire in another quest.

I'm pretty sure annulling (read: killing/tranquilling) an entire Circle because there might be an issue would be classed as Renegade. I'd compare it to the Genophage issue.

They weren't made tranquil or killed if you didn't use the amulet thingy, they were put into a quarantine to be observed.

Irving could die, but only if you didn't use the Litany.

So no, I could perfectly well argue that from a human noble PoV it wasn't at all evil with the views on magic in Thedas, it was just safe.

Modifié par nhsk, 10 juillet 2011 - 02:55 .

[littlezack]

 Am I the only one who thinks it's a little silly to only play the game as a Paragon or a Renegade and classify yourself as such? It just feels limiting, especially when there's a lot to see playing the game on both sides.