27 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryuu814]

and need some help XDD.
Yeah all the threads I seem to find don't really touch on what I really want in depth, only lightly. So I was wondering if people won't mind to help nudge me in the right direction.

to the stat build I'm going to try a 2:1 Ratio of Str and Con. Every or so levels I'll throw he points into Willpower to increase my stamina and burst damage during the fights.

Armour and weapons I'll figure out as I play.

Party is something I have no clue on what to do...
My warden is the wariror of the group but isn't the tank so survivability is a problem...
I need Morrigan and Wynne for damage and white mage respectively. But I heard it was psosibly to get Morrigan both sides of the mage tree but I'd like some confirmation on that if possible.
My final slot is possibly Zevran or Lelienna. I need a rouge for the disarms and what-not. Leaning more to Lelienna due to her archery...

Any help would be appriciated I haven't played Origins for ages so I'm a little rusty on the mechanics.
Note: I've completed all the previous DLC and plan on going through to Awakening, Golems, and Witch Hunt...I think you do them in that order anyway...Can't remember '

[Requiesta De Silencia]

Okay here are a few tips then :3

First off, 2h warriors are accepted Damage Dealers the only way to make them a reliable tank would be to pump just enough into str to get armor, and the rest into dex (for high defense combat). Coupled with some serious elemental resistances you should do fine.

Yes morrigan can go into the healing tree if you want. It's considered a bright idea to give every mage in your party the heal spell at the very least (even if they're not healing aligned, makes your survivability quite easier). Leliana is probably superior to Zevran near the middle to end game thanks to her archery (get her lethality and evasion asap) she is able to inflict quite a bit of damage from far outside combat range.

[Ryuu814]

That's good to know. Chances are I'll let Morrigan go a 'Red mage' (see final fantasy) approch with her magic and bring Alistar along for pure tanking ability.
I already knew I'd be a pure damage dealer with my sword of doom XD just some things I needed to double check and what-not before i lose another 40+ hours of my life XDD

[Requiesta De Silencia]

40+? I'm on 250 already (as testified by Steam) and I still can't stop

[Last Darkness]

Well I can say that the problem with Two-Hand style is always 100% the Players Fault.

Except for getting Cun up to 12 if you want Max coercion, every single point you gain should be exclusivly into Str.
(Keep in mind you get +4 to all Stats, +5 to Cun so you technicaly only need 11 Base cun to get the Max needed @16Cun.

Two-Hand more so then any other build is all about spamming your talents. You should NEVER be standing there auto-attacking.

Con is a dump stat, it only gives 5 Health per point. Practicaly useless unless you invest HEAVILY into it. Same thing with Willpower. Theres gear that gives Health and Stamina boosts.

Early on, dont lead with your Two-hander into a fight. Your not a tank and the enemies are likly to focus fire on you. Later on you gain alot of survivability once you get better armors. I always suggest having a tank early game, usualy Alistair or Sten and charging into fights with them then switching to your Warden.

Morrigan or Wynne can heal just fine, matter of fact you may see better results with Regeneration spells though. They get even better with this if you spec them as Spirit Healers.  Also FF Mage class system is a poor way to look at it since all mages in this game are Red mages since being a equivilent White or Black mage is inpractical and detrimental to your group. You have more then enough spell choice to be able to support and damage.

Rogues are not needed unless you really are a completionist who dosnt want to return later to pick doors/boxes for random loot.

As for Leilana/Zevran...dont make them Archers. Archery in the vanila game is terrible unless you go to extreme lengths and party builds to improve it (See my Sig link). Leilana and Zevran both do incredibly well as Bard/Assassin's using duel-wield daggers. Also you only need around 20 Str, and 30-32 Dex on them and all other points into Cunning for best results.

I would suggest running Warden, Alistair, Morrigan, Leiliana till you get more party options and better gear later in the game.

[Requiesta De Silencia]

I've never seemed to have a problem making Archers excellent. It's a fairly straightforward tactic: pump just enough str in to get light armor, get a moderate amount of cunning (about 30 or 40) and pump the rest into dexterity, grab evasion and all the archery talents, and grab a bow that has the Rapid Aim bonus.

After following this, I found out that my level 15 leliana archer was inflicting more damage than my mages against a high dragon.

[Last Darkness]

Requiesta De Silencia wrote...

I've never seemed to have a problem making Archers excellent. It's a fairly straightforward tactic: pump just enough str in to get light armor, get a moderate amount of cunning (about 30 or 40) and pump the rest into dexterity, grab evasion and all the archery talents, and grab a bow that has the Rapid Aim bonus.

After following this, I found out that my level 15 leliana archer was inflicting more damage than my mages against a high dragon.

I roll with some extreme character builds usualy.
If they are not hitting for at least 120+ damage per attack I consider them useless.
Also not a fan of Rogue Archers, their abilities dont match up well. Warrior Archers are superior. Rogues are much better backstabing for auto-hit and crit damage.


Archers in Origins, are rather sad unless measures are taken. See my Sig.

[Requiesta De Silencia]

Read that, and everything I could find on archery after I went through Origins/Awakening the first time through (with really sad archers). I'm a little less extreme than you, as long as they're hitting 60-70 damage but hitting fast and accurately I figure they're way more useful. That's why I dislike 2-H warriors (they hit really slowly and rarely...but heavily).

I will admit that I babysit my archer's tactics menu a lot more than other classes though. I update them constantly depending on where in the game I am...

[Last Darkness]

Requiesta De Silencia wrote...

Read that, and everything I could find on archery after I went through Origins/Awakening the first time through (with really sad archers). I'm a little less extreme than you, as long as they're hitting 60-70 damage but hitting fast and accurately I figure they're way more useful. That's why I dislike 2-H warriors (they hit really slowly and rarely...but heavily).

I will admit that I babysit my archer's tactics menu a lot more than other classes though. I update them constantly depending on where in the game I am...

Try the Spirit Warrior Archer in Awakning yet? Its....highly satisfying.
Especialy if you have a Archer Tank setup.

[Ryuu814]

*walks in*
whoa o.o did't expect this much info XD so uh thanks I guess Mr Darkness sir
I used to dislike 2 handed warriors myself. I tried it on a whim and something just seemed to click with me for some reason. And I prefer dealing damage rather than tanking XD so there we go.

So wait, the Archery bug is still present in the game then? I may need to grab Zevran ASAP then...he kinda works better as some of his stuff is already Dual Wield.

I used to roll in a typical FF party XDD mostly because I was a pure mage. I'll have to look into using Morrigan as both types of mage...Or Wynne...maybe I prefer her moslty because she's from the Chantry...*Shrugs* oh well.
Thanks for the advice, I'll keep what you said about my main in mind.

To be fair I'm keeping Alistar in my party 24/7 as he's my main tank.
And yes, I'm taking a rouge because I like opening stuff...sue me :3

[Last Darkness]

NP

Hope it helps.

[TBastian]

Archers in Origins are good for two things - sniping and disabling. Arrow of Slaying pre-combat allows you to regen most of your stamina by the time combat starts and gets rid of one nasty, and most ranged combat talents with disabling effects do not offer a physical resistance check.

Note that there is such a thing as diminishing returns when it comes to damage in Origins. Sure we could take a two-handed weapons user that does 100+ damage per hit instead of an archer, except our mage or Morrigan already kills most things in nightmare in a few seconds. At least the archer would be able to score a few shots on dying monsters, on top of her of Arrow of Slaying target. The two-handed weapons user would mostly just stare in awkward silence.

Modifié par TBastian, 12 juillet 2011 - 09:29 .

[Ryuu814]

TBastian wrote...

Archers in Origins are good for two things - sniping and disabling. Arrow of Slaying pre-combat allows you to regen most of your stamina by the time combat starts and gets rid of one nasty, and most ranged combat talents with disabling effects do not offer a physical resistance check.

Note that there is such a thing as diminishing returns when it comes to damage in Origins. Sure we could take a two-handed weapons user that does 100+ damage per hit instead of an archer, except our mage or Morrigan already kills most things in nightmare in a few seconds. At least the archer would be able to score a few shots on dying monsters, on top of her of Arrow of Slaying target. The two-handed weapons user would mostly just stare in awkward silence.

Huh...I forgot about such talents...now that I think about it...ScatterShot has saved my ass more than once by stunning opponents...
I would play Nightmare, but for one to me there isn't much incentive due to the lack of an achivement XDD

[mosesofwar]

...One InstaDEATH button < an Arsenal. Hit one enemy minus a boss for a lot? Yeah, 2 Handers do that too, but they have multiple talents that do that, not just one. Scattershot is nice, but I'd rather use a Mage that Mass Paras; Sleep would be even better for a Horror or Waking Nightmare combo. If you're using Archers for CC, you misewell use a Mage. Other than Critical Shot, Archer abilities have pretty bad diminishing returns during mid to late levels (Until Awakening, Archers in Awakening are pretty sweet). Arrow of Slaying is like instaDEATH but, as with Final Blow, it deals a TON of damage, but unlike Final Blow it's Stamina cost isn't proportional to it's damage.

It's all up to play preference, but I'd rather take an Arsenal of basically 1 to 2 hit death blows, in comparison to auto-attacking and spamming Critical Shot or Scattershot. I can get more use out of my Rogue if their DWing and I get get more out of my Warrior doing Tanking/2Handing. To me, so much of the Archer tree is meh; if I was going to take anything from it, it would be a hybrid Archer/DW warrior.

Modifié par mosesofwar, 12 juillet 2011 - 12:13 .

[Last Darkness]

dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Arrow_of_Slaying
That 60 seconds downtime is a problem.

[TBastian]

Everyone has CC's, not just the archer or the mage. Point is, in some parties "arsenal" is already pretty much covered. This was why I made the comment on "Diminishing Returns" when it comes to dealing damage. And once we start talking about parties with two well-built nuker mages... Even a party which already has two two-handed weapons users might opt for having an archer instead of bringing along a third two-handed weapons user. I don't think there's anything in the game worth bringing three well-built two-handers to. Two well built two-handers is already enough for most encounters to end in seconds, as long as you have good mage to back them up.

Although I did end up bringing a two-handed weapons warrior for all my two-mage parties in Awakenings, this was because that two-handed Warrior was also in fact our tanker. Point is, you can get so ridiculously powerful in Awakenings that even a Mage can tank effectively, if need be.

Modifié par TBastian, 12 juillet 2011 - 11:37 .

[Requiesta De Silencia]

Last Darkness wrote...

dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Arrow_of_Slaying
That 60 seconds downtime is a problem.

I always order my archers to use Arrow of Slaying "only" on elites+ specifically because of that evil cooldown time :| no point wasting an arrow of slaying on something I could kill with a single spell or two seconds with momentum.

[Last Darkness]

Requiesta De Silencia wrote...

Last Darkness wrote...

dragonage.wikia.com/wiki/Arrow_of_Slaying
That 60 seconds downtime is a problem.

I always order my archers to use Arrow of Slaying "only" on elites+ specifically because of that evil cooldown time :| no point wasting an arrow of slaying on something I could kill with a single spell or two seconds with momentum.

Make sure you start the fight with it against a nasty target or mage as well

[Yrkoon]

  Ok, I'm going to attempt to give  some "helpful advice".   Just a note:  In the past, I've been accused of being a little too caustic and "combative"  when I do such a thing.    But  that's not my intent at all.   If it happens again,   Just ignore the tone. 
 

Ryuu814 wrote...
to the stat build I'm going to try a 2:1 Ratio of Str and Con.

You'll do fine  with this plan,  But you'll be  severely underpowering  your character.  2-handers need Strengh.  They don't need anything else.  For every point you spend on a different stat, that's just less damage you'll be doing for every swing.  And with a 2:1 ratio  every level up, you'll basically being doing 33% less damage per swing by end-game.  Sound good to you?  Then by all means, ratio your warden.  But your fights will last longer.  Oh, and you'll be missing more often too.  Which particularly sucks when you're a 2-hander. 

Conclusion:     Pump strength... only. 

 Every or so levels I'll throw he points into Willpower to increase my stamina and burst damage during the fights.

 Lets think about this one for a second.  For every 1 point of will, you recieve a whopping +5 points of stamina.  So...  the question arises, how many points of willpower do you  think you're gonna need to spend attribute  points on?  4?  5?  7?     I only ask because one of the BEST 2-handed weapons in this game is Chasind Great Maul, which gives you +75 stamina  (that's the equivilant of 15 points of willpower, btw.  More than enough for your   "burst damage" needs)  There's also  a TON of  other gear that boosts willpower and stamina.  I seriously do not recommend you  also  tap into your  attribute pool to pump willpower even further.    Not when those points are there  to help you increase your damage output.

Conclusion: Pump Strength... only.

Armour and weapons I'll figure out as I play.

Ok, then we won't bother with advice on that  here.

Party is something I have no clue on what to do...
My warden is the wariror of the group but isn't the tank so survivability is a problem...

Not really.  You don't need a tank in DA:O,  Unless you're playing on Nightmare, and even then you  still don't need a tank, you just need high Armor ratings and high defense ratings which are easily had with any class.   Normal mode is even simpler, because the enemies aren't so relentless that  a few well placed crowd control tactics can't  take care of any issue.    If you build  and use your 2-hander correctly,  he'll draw all the aggro to himself and you'll have no problems  completely crushing all the mobs before they even realize that your mage and archer  are also  taking them out from the safety of...  over there  ----->.

But back to the party makeup...For me, when I'm playing a two-hander, I've never gone wrong with a basic party consisting of:

1) My warden  (2-handed warrior)
2) Morrigan  - offensive mage, nuker crowd control)
3) Wynne - healer,  buffer  (she can get haste early on.  Haste is your 2-hander's friend.) back-up crowd control
4) Lelianna -rogue.

But really, you shouldn't limit yourself.  One of the things that makes DA:O such an awesome game is that it doesn't restrict itself to the cliche party trope  made popular by games like WOW..  That is to say, You can be equally effective in combat if your party consists of 4 warriors. Or 4 rogues, or 4 mages.    or 2 rogues and 2 mages.   etc.  You can also be surprizingly effective with a Solo rogue, or a solo mage etc.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 15 juillet 2011 - 03:13 .

[Requiesta De Silencia]

Last Darkness wrote...

*snip*

Make sure you start the fight with it against a nasty target or mage as well

Oh I has something special for those mages >:3 with their tiny physical resistence levels

[Grey warden24]

probably already for a thread for this but what kinda armor should a 2 hander use and can i pick up a great sword early in the human noble story.

[Requiesta De Silencia]

Grey warden24 wrote...

probably already for a thread for this but what kinda armor should a 2 hander use and can i pick up a great sword early in the human noble story.

a two hander is centered mainly around damage, and so has incredibly high str. Massive armor would be best to give your 2H a bit more survivability, unless you're going for a Dex tank 2H or a Con Tank 2H in which case sticking with heavy or medium armor is fine.

[Grey warden24]

ok thanks for the reply and does it matter which story i start one in, just curious which one would be the most effective i just got the game last week and am having trouble making a character.

[mosesofwar]

If you have the Ultimate Edition, I'd recommend getting Cailan's armor, then moving on to the Warden Commander's Armor around level 14 - 16. After that, you'll be plugging and playing. I like having lower fatigue penalties, and both of these armor sets give bonuses to fatigue reduction and ability cost. as a 2H Warrior, you want to spamming your abilities; auto-attack isn't nearly effective as your massive 2H swipes :-). Also, pick up the Helm of Honnleath, it's the best helmet in Origins.

[Grey warden24]

ok thank you very much good sir.