33 réponses à ce sujet

[Cypher0020]

I ususally get Alistair into the love part of the bar, and his side quest is coming up.....but do I have to harden Alistair before the Landsmeet in order for him to wed a HNF?

You have to have max persuade too right?

[Zjarcal]

No, he doesn't have to be hardened to marry you. If he's in love with you, you don't even need max persuade.

It's only with non-HNF that the hardening part actually matters, not for the marriage but to avoid being dumped.

[Cypher0020]

so bar needs to be just in the white then?

[Last Darkness]

Well if he Hardend it makes it ALOT easier to marry him. The difficulty check to pass that dialog choice is reduced by half.

Also you should NEVER let a Unhardend Alistair rule. Hes bad at it and results in bad ending epilogues.

But thats not much of issue, after all your forcing him to become King.

[Cypher0020]

hardened alistair doesn't mean 'evil' does it? I just felt like a total douche saying everyone was out for themselves....o.0

But if it cuts the persuasion check....tempting lol

[Monica21]

No, he's not evil or mean. The only effect it has is on what you can do at the Landsmeet and on how interested he is as a ruler if you make him king.

[Last Darkness]

Hardend Alistair becomes more like Duncan, or I should say a real Grey Warden.
He makes much better deicisions and is a much more capable person if you Harden him.

Dragonage is like this, many of the choices and events in game have the appearance of one way or another but have results that are unexpected. (Most of the choices that appear to be good for example are some of the worst possible ones to choose and have the biggets consequqnces)
Some people are unwilling to be that no-compromise **** who does what has to get done.

[Cypher0020]

Ah like the Orzzamar situation? While Beheln is seen as the "bad" choice, I think he's a far better ruler than Harrowmont....

[Wulfram]

Unhardened Alistair isn't a particularly bad ruler, just not a very committed one. He'll be popular but will leave much of the business of ruling in the hands of others - if you're going to be Queen and Chancellor then that probably means you, so that's OK in my books.

For the City Elves, Unhardened Alistair is much better than Anora.

[Last Darkness]

Wulfram wrote...

Unhardened Alistair isn't a particularly bad ruler, just not a very committed one. He'll be popular but will leave much of the business of ruling in the hands of others - if you're going to be Queen and Chancellor then that probably means you, so that's OK in my books.

For the City Elves, Unhardened Alistair is much better than Anora.

Anora was basicaly running the country with advice from her Father.

Alistair as King unhardend dosnt want the position and does everything he can to avoid it so you as the Warden have to FORCE him to do it for your own desires, Not his.
Also obviusly he becomes a puppet ruler controled by the other Banns and such.
Thanks Warden for making Alistiar everything he hated and never wanted.

So many people ignore Alistairs desires.

It does practicaly literaly say Eamon rules Ferelden if unhardend Alistair rules alone. 

[Jedimaster88]

Wulfram wrote...

Unhardened Alistair isn't a particularly bad ruler, just not a very committed one. He'll be popular but will leave much of the business of ruling in the hands of others - if you're going to be Queen and Chancellor then that probably means you, so that's OK in my books.

For the City Elves, Unhardened Alistair is much better than Anora.

What I have seen from the epilogue, hardened Alistair is also best thing for the city elves, whether he is married to anora or not. Anora ruling alone on the other hand is not an option for me. Hardened Alistair gives good reasons why Anora alone is not a good choise. Hardened Alistair is also more eager to become a king, so I dont have to feel guity about making him one.

Unhardened Alistair is not necessarily a bad ruler, well not that bad anyways, but I believe he will be like Cailan was, so there are risks for him to be a puppet. Hardened Alistair instead wants to run the show more actively and learns the necessary skills to rule the country. He does what he chooses and not what others decide for him, but he still doesnt let it corrupt him and he maintains his sense of justice, which is a good thing.

[Last Darkness]

Jedimaster88 wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Unhardened Alistair isn't a particularly bad ruler, just not a very committed one. He'll be popular but will leave much of the business of ruling in the hands of others - if you're going to be Queen and Chancellor then that probably means you, so that's OK in my books.

For the City Elves, Unhardened Alistair is much better than Anora.

What I have seen from the epilogue, hardened Alistair is also best thing for the city elves, whether he is married to anora or not. Anora ruling alone on the other hand is not an option for me. Hardened Alistair gives good reasons why Anora alone is not a good choise. Hardened Alistair is also more eager to become a king, so I dont have to feel guity about making him one.

Unhardened Alistair is not necessarily a bad ruler, well not that bad anyways, but I believe he will be like Cailan was, so there are risks for him to be a puppet. Hardened Alistair instead wants to run the show more actively and learns the necessary skills to rule the country. He does what he chooses and not what others decide for him, but he still doesnt let it corrupt him and he maintains his sense of justice, which is a good thing.

I favour Hardend Alistair married to Anora.

[Cypher0020]

That's what I did on my DC run...I found it the best of all the endings? I kept Loghain alive, did the DR, and I'd like to think Alistair and Anora loved each other.... or at least h'd treat her better than Cailan did

[Sir Edric]

Hmm Alistair and Anora love each other? I dunno. I have a hard time picturing that.

It could be a "I respect you" kind of a relationship, but not a "love romance" one.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

In DA2 Alistair's rulership capabilities don't seem to matter. It's whether or not he married Queen Anora that makes a difference. If he rules by himself or married the Warden, there are rumours his bloodline was a lie used to depose Anora and consequently his/their reign is plagued with trouble (even if they are both considered heroes and popular for the most part).

His DA2 codex only (explicitly) says that Ferelden has prospered if he married Anora.

Alistair Codex entry DA2.

[Last Darkness]

Vrex_12 wrote...

Hmm Alistair and Anora love each other? I dunno. I have a hard time picturing that.

It could be a "I respect you" kind of a relationship, but not a "love romance" one.

I agree

It not like all Nobles and Royals marry outta love. Its to prevent Wars, or further power by gaining lands and such.

[Mike3207]

Does hardening Alastair have any effect on a Anora-Human Noble PC marriage? I was looking at the Dragon Age Wiki and it said Anora would marry the PC unless Alastair was hardened.

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

Mike, hardening Alistair has nothing to do with that. You just have to make sure that you talk to her about marrying each other before the Landsmeet, then either let Loghain live (and lose Alistair) or have Alistair kill Loghain instead of you. Anora won't marry a man who kills her father.  And then after Loghain is dealt with, you have to remind everyone that you and Anora are going to get married.

Modifié par Neverwinter_Knight77, 15 juillet 2011 - 11:27 .

[ejoslin]

If hardened Alistair kills Loghain, though, he automatically takes the throne. If Alistair is not hardened, he won't automatically take the throne. So in order for the PC to marry Anora, either you have to let Loghain live (either hardened or unhardened Alistair) or have unhardened Alistair kill Loghain.

As far as what it takes for Alistair to marry the human noble female warden? Not much.

If Alistair is in love, it's an autopass, hardened or not. This means his personal quest has to be done. If you have not done his personal quest, he is not in love.

Hardened Alistair: He will marry a warden no matter what his feelings towards her is -- this is completely dependent on the warden's persuade skill. He will marry even if he's at 100 hostile, though it is extremely difficult to have him be both hardened AND hostile as you have to be at least warm to do his personal quest. For any level not in love, he just needs 2 points in coercion. So yes, it is just as easy or difficult for Alistair to marry a warden he adores as one he hates.

Unhardened Alistair: He will not marry a warden who he hates -- you need to be at least -25 neutral (that's a minus sign there). It takes three points in coercion. Again, he will marry a warden he loves no matter what.

Even though I say points in coercion, I will point out that a high cunning will count towards coercion, so rogues may be able to have fewer points in coercion for this to get him to marry her.

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 juillet 2011 - 12:51 .

[LT123]

Don't you have to get up to 70+ to actually get the "I'm been thinking about what you said" conversation to actually harden him? So to marry a hostile Warden, you'd have to get his approval up to 70 and then back down into the negatives. Wow. Maybe with Feastday Gifts?

[PrinceLionheart]

Cypher0020 wrote...

hardened alistair doesn't mean 'evil' does it? I just felt like a total douche saying everyone was out for themselves....o.0

But if it cuts the persuasion check....tempting lol

Hardened Alistair just means he actually has a backdown, and won't let people walk all over him.

[ejoslin]

LT123 wrote...

Don't you have to get up to 70+ to actually get the "I'm been thinking about what you said" conversation to actually harden him? So to marry a hostile Warden, you'd have to get his approval up to 70 and then back down into the negatives. Wow. Maybe with Feastday Gifts?

No.  You only have to be warm, which is 26+, though you do have to have had a certain number of conversations with him as well.  However, for a female it's easy to do if you try.  You have to do his personal quest fairly early, though don't actually enter Redcliffe -- turn around before you speak to Tomas.  Do the follow up conversation. romance him, laugh at him when he gives you the rose which will take his approval down to zero, then kill Connor and be nasty about it.  There are other ways, of course, but this is the easiest way I think without using cheats.

Modifié par ejoslin, 16 juillet 2011 - 05:48 .

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

I wouldn't be able to harden him with my "nice guy" character. "Everyone looks out for themselves. You should learn that." just seems like a very cold and cynical thing to say.

However, to what ejoslin is saying, I was only able to get the conversation "I've been thinking about what you said" after I got him up to level 75 (friendly).

I have a question though, LT. Why on Earth would you purposely make Alistair hate you and then marry him?

[Monica21]

Neverwinter_Knight77 wrote...

I wouldn't be able to harden him with my "nice guy" character. "Everyone looks out for themselves. You should learn that." just seems like a very cold and cynical thing to say.

Eh, this is just poorly written dialogue in my opinion. It doesn't really mean anything except to harden him. It sounds cold but he doesn't take it as such. I think it's still fine to harden him with a "nice guy" character, especially depending on what you want to do with him. If you want him to be king, then you're definitely being nicer in the long run by hardening him.

I have a question though, LT. Why on Earth would you purposely make Alistair hate you and then marry him?

Power. Put him on the throne, unhardened. You then marry him and he becomes your puppet.

[PrinceLionheart]

Neverwinter_Knight77 wrote...

I have a question though, LT. Why on Earth would you purposely make Alistair hate you and then marry him?

I don't think that's possible. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you spare Loghain, your relationship with Alistair effectively ends. He either takes the throne and marries Anora (if you previously suggested this plan) or goes off into exile and become a drunkard.