75 réponses à ce sujet

[Weltea]

I actually had a Shepard leave Ash he was romancing behind with the specific reasoning that if he saved her he would never be sure of he sacrified Kaidan just because of his feelings for her or if it was really the better choice...
(but guilt often is a motivation for my Sheps,like when Kirrahe(sp?) talks about what is essentially made out to be a suicide mission,quite a lot of my Sheps end up saving who ever they send with him because otherwise it would feel like sending that person to their death twice -and also that person hangs with salarian STG,meaning you get to save more lives...)

as for the night before Illos; I think guilt is just not foremost in their minds right now and they're to worried/focused on what might happen on Illos (+ I got the impression the Renegade Shep doesn't really do guilt anyway)
both Ash and Kaidan clearly feel guilty if you saved them whether romanced or not but with so much happening they probably don't have time to dwell on it forever and both have probably seen a lot of friends die,constantly asking "why did I survive" would make them crazy...

[l DryIce l]

 So, the reason you left Ashley behind...was because you were romancing her? 

[Mykel54]

My shepard put Ashley under her command for selfish reasons (romance) but it was an good military decision as Kaidan had worked with aliens before. But when the bomb was about to go off, my shepard was not selfish, he chose the bomb because it was the logical choice for the mission success. It just happened that Kaidan was in the wrong place. You could say that my shepard was selfish in that he prefered to have her love interest under his watch and not sent her on a risky assignment.

[ashlover mark 2]

Eddo36 wrote...

Sshodan wrote...

No, no guilt - I did not know that one of them will not survive when I made the digestion (I had no info in Mass Effect 1 before playing it), so I based my decisions on logic, that I still abide by even when not romancing VS.
I always sand Kaiden with the bomb because he is a tech specialist, and Ash with the salarians since they may use a good soldier in armor in a firefight.
And I always go after the bomb because the mission depends on it going off, if the site is compromised the mission will fail, so it is purely logic to me. No guilt.

And what about those Ash lovers? Has their love for Ash clouded their judgement that their Shep saves her instead of making this logical decision?

not my logic,the bomb gose off no matter who you pick so thats not really an issue and you save the STG team no matter what as long as you do the side mission (you have to disrupt the geth),to me in my perspective playing Mass effect 1 given equal armor and weapons regardless of speacial abilitys the squadmates all have about the same usefulness in combat gameplay. in the end it came down to who i liked more.....i liked kaidan alot,but i loved ash....so i picked her and i dont regret it....i do feel sorry for kaidan and maybe some guilt from time to time but ash is indeed worth it to me.

Modifié par ashlover mark 2, 13 juillet 2011 - 08:45 .

[Eddo36]

Well, you as the player knows the bomb will go off no matter what by your second playthrough. But your Shepard doesn't know the future for certain.

[ashlover mark 2]

i knew the bomb was going to go off for certain in my very first playthrough.

[Sshodan]

@ ashlover mark 2
Well if it was my Shep settled with the bomb I can think of half a dozen ways to get right of it. Starting form disarming it - anything that can be armed can be disarmed, I don't trust salarinas with their makeshift bomb that much, and ending with catapulting the damn thing in to orbit without disarming it. I may be paranoid, but I never live things that truly matter to the chance.
I ma have a renegade mindset but mission goes before any rescue operations to me.

[ashlover mark 2]

Sshodan wrote...

@ ashlover mark 2
Well if it was my Shep settled with the bomb I can think of half a dozen ways to get right of it. Starting form disarming it - anything that can be armed can be disarmed, I don't trust salarinas with their makeshift bomb that much, and ending with catapulting the damn thing in to orbit without disarming it. I may be paranoid, but I never live things that truly matter to the chance.
I ma have a renegade mindset but mission goes before any rescue operations to me.

there isnt anything wrong with the way you played. just a diffrence in perspective.i perrsonaly dont get to deep in "Role playing" as some players do.

like for example some players use squadmates in a strategic way and use who they think will be best for the mission and more useful; and play accordingly....where as i just pick who i feel like haveing and blow through whoever gets in my way as i dont have to much of a rpoblem with mass effects enemies.

[Sshodan]

@ ashlover mark 2
Well I guess that works as long as you are having fun I'm usually the deeply role playing kind, and never can stop thinking about strategy, probably because I love RTS so much

[ashlover mark 2]

dont get me wrong i do play my shepard as if he were me and make choices accordingly.....but on virmire just wasnt going to leave ash to die.

liked kaidan but ash is my fave and im guessing this line of thinking is pretty much vice versa for those in both fanbases who feel similar.

[Goneaviking]

Eddo36 wrote...

Funkcase wrote...

They are soliders, you learn to adapt and move on. Shepard got over Jenkins very quickly too. Besides, they both volunteered, both of them were willing to give there life so the other might live.

Well you have to account for the fact that Jenkins wasn't a LI. Which is really the point of this topic.

The choice is whether to defend the bomb and make certain it detonates, or to save as many people (by which I mean Salarians) as possible. I generally go with saving the larger number of people possible, because it seems the more humane thing to do and because I trust my squad when they say they've rigged the bomb to blow no matter what.

Who my love interest is depends on the run through, and who I assign to which task depends on my curiousity about what would happend if...

My Shepherds always feel guilt over the death of their squad members, but know how to compartmentalize it. They'll be headcases come retirement, but for as long as they need to fight the Reapers they'll keep it bottled up and recognize that just because Kaidan/Ash are dead doesn't mean that the world has ended. After all, virtually all of the Shepherds have familiarity with death and suffering before the start of the game I'm assuming they've learned how to handle it and to keep on moving.

[Sshodan]

@ ashlover mark 2
And that's what I was saying - I would feel guilty for saving the LI in that situation, it would have never vent with my Sheps personality as I role play it. Neither it would sit well with my own.
I don't feel guilty because I was not saving anyone at the moment I made a decision - I had no idea that one of them would really die, so I went with my logic, romances did not factor in th the proceedings, so I have no reason to feel guilty.
But reading this tread and following my own logic I can see how saving Ash instead of Kiden may live some players with a bad aftertaste. It may even be designed that way - the story was written with maleShep in mind, so while living Ash alive is not by any means unjustifiable it may be little harder to do do without feeling uncomfortable, making the decision a little harder - just another dilemma for Shep. The writers do like to make the choices as doubtful as possible - like the ragnai queen one. Placing a biotic officer and a friend against a simple solder, but a woman Shep loves is right up the same alley.
But again that may be just my paranoia speaking

[Eddo36]

Goneaviking wrote...

Eddo36 wrote...

Funkcase wrote...

They are soliders, you learn to adapt and move on. Shepard got over Jenkins very quickly too. Besides, they both volunteered, both of them were willing to give there life so the other might live.

Well you have to account for the fact that Jenkins wasn't a LI. Which is really the point of this topic.

The choice is whether to defend the bomb and make certain it detonates, or to save as many people (by which I mean Salarians) as possible. I generally go with saving the larger number of people possible, because it seems the more humane thing to do and because I trust my squad when they say they've rigged the bomb to blow no matter what.

Who my love interest is depends on the run through, and who I assign to which task depends on my curiousity about what would happend if...

My Shepherds always feel guilt over the death of their squad members, but know how to compartmentalize it. They'll be headcases come retirement, but for as long as they need to fight the Reapers they'll keep it bottled up and recognize that just because Kaidan/Ash are dead doesn't mean that the world has ended. After all, virtually all of the Shepherds have familiarity with death and suffering before the start of the game I'm assuming they've learned how to handle it and to keep on moving.

Compartmentalizing it is one thing. Banging the person you saved instead right after the incident is kinda... wrong.

[jeweledleah]

Eddo36 wrote...

Compartmentalizing it is one thing. Banging the person you saved instead right after the incident is kinda... wrong.

its not RIGHT after - depending on when you do virmire mission, it could be weeks, or even months that pass between it and Ilos, and it doesn't need to be related.  if the relationship, if the feelings are worth it, you work through whatever issues you might have.  you don't just give up, becasue it might "look bad".

[sesheta255]

I feel no guilt at leaving Ash behind in every single playthrough. My first playthrough I really thought long and hard about who to save but in the end it came down to the fact (to me) that Kaidan was a bigger asset to the Alliance than Ash was. It seems logical to me that I make sure the bomb goes off without a hitch, and that Kaidan is at the bomb because Ash has no tech skills, so I go back to the bomb.

[ashlover mark 2]

jeweledleah wrote...

Eddo36 wrote...

Compartmentalizing it is one thing. Banging the person you saved instead right after the incident is kinda... wrong.

its not RIGHT after - depending on when you do virmire mission, it could be weeks, or even months that pass between it and Ilos, and it doesn't need to be related.  if the relationship, if the feelings are worth it, you work through whatever issues you might have.  you don't just give up, becasue it might "look bad".

^^ this/

[Eddo36]

sesheta255 wrote...

I feel no guilt at leaving Ash behind in every single playthrough. My first playthrough I really thought long and hard about who to save but in the end it came down to the fact (to me) that Kaidan was a bigger asset to the Alliance than Ash was. It seems logical to me that I make sure the bomb goes off without a hitch, and that Kaidan is at the bomb because Ash has no tech skills, so I go back to the bomb.

You weren't worried about the bomb taking out the whole Normandy with it?

[Eddo36]

jeweledleah wrote...

Eddo36 wrote...

Compartmentalizing it is one thing. Banging the person you saved instead right after the incident is kinda... wrong.

its not RIGHT after - depending on when you do virmire mission, it could be weeks, or even months that pass between it and Ilos, and it doesn't need to be related.  if the relationship, if the feelings are worth it, you work through whatever issues you might have.  you don't just give up, becasue it might "look bad".

The feelings in relationships are purely for selfish reasons, however. To satisfy yourself only, while you have people to save.

[l DryIce l]

Eddo36 wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

Eddo36 wrote...

Compartmentalizing it is one thing. Banging the person you saved instead right after the incident is kinda... wrong.

its not RIGHT after - depending on when you do virmire mission, it could be weeks, or even months that pass between it and Ilos, and it doesn't need to be related.  if the relationship, if the feelings are worth it, you work through whatever issues you might have.  you don't just give up, becasue it might "look bad".

The feelings in relationships are purely for selfish reasons, however. To satisfy yourself only, while you have people to save.

Why is that a bad thing? It's selfish. So what? All relationships are, aren't they?  It's not like Shepard said, "Alright, Joker, I know we could be going to Ilos now, but just go a bit slower. I've got something to do."

They were on their way to stop Saren when they had sex. They are literally saving the galaxy, putting their lives at risk. Give them a break. Let them be "selfish" for a couple hours, before they continue the deadly, horribly terrifying mission. 

[jeweledleah]

Eddo36 wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

Eddo36 wrote...

Compartmentalizing it is one thing. Banging the person you saved instead right after the incident is kinda... wrong.

its not RIGHT after - depending on when you do virmire mission, it could be weeks, or even months that pass between it and Ilos, and it doesn't need to be related.  if the relationship, if the feelings are worth it, you work through whatever issues you might have.  you don't just give up, becasue it might "look bad".

The feelings in relationships are purely for selfish reasons, however. To satisfy yourself only, while you have people to save.

loving another person is selfish?  /shrug.  I can live with that.  some times we have to make harsh choices.  and then we have to live with those choices.  sometimes those choices are biased.  other times your impartial choice also ends up being the choice you want to make and feeling relief at that can be selfish.  but that's life.  we are not automatons.  and holding on to the guilt for being human, allowing that guilt to kill something potentialy special?  that's just stupid.

[redbaron76]

Why would i feel guilt. I have arrived at my decision logicaly, since Ashley was my LI, I always sent her with the bomb. And since ashley was with the bomb it is very logical to go to the bomb site and make sure it goes off. Other wise the mission was snafu.

[Eddo36]

And why do you always send your LI with the bomb?

[The Real Bowser]

Eddo36 wrote...

This is different from my other topic in this forum in that I'm talking about VS in ME situation specifically. Since you picked to save your LI instead of another and get in that person's pants shortly after you doomed the other person. No remorse over that? I'm feeling it. Wonder if there are consequences for it in ME3, whether it be karma or somethin else.

Bioware said there would be concequences to being unfaithful to your ME LI during ME2.  I can't provide the link, but yes there will be.  Count on it.  Why wouldn't there be?

[Eddo36]

Not talking about being unfaithful, but about having VS as LI in first place.

[CyberDirectorFreedom]

I wouldn't feel guilty. You can't save everyone in a war. Do you feel guilty about all those random soldiers who were with them as they died. Didn't think so. Anyway, I always keep Ashley alive anyway, she's a better soldier. Don't care for her attitude, but she follows orders, as a good soldier should, and she's strong, good with all weapons.