27 réponses à ce sujet

[Rawr23]

Is there any way to stop Anders from destroying the Chantry and murdering Elthina?  Can you kill him/kick him from party before he does so?

I've played through DA:II twice, making different choices concerning Anders.  On my mage, I helped him do whatever he asked and distracted Elthina as he infiltrated the Chantry.

On my rogue, I refused to help him, voiced my support for the Templars, and still, he destroys the Chantry.

Can you stop him?

[DRTJR]

No he's a d*ck like that

[Rawr23]

Damn. Thanks anyway!

[Icy Magebane]

Sadly, a lot of this game is on rails... you can even report him directly to Cullen and although he says he'll "investigate," nothing comes of it. Think about that. You are the Champion of Kirkwall and you tell the Knight Captain about an apostate living in Darktown who has some kind of mysterious plan going on and he doesn't even try to arrest him? These are the same Templars who go out of their way to oppress every other mage in Kirkwall, and mentioning the specific location of an apostate doesn't yield any kind of result... bah...

This kind of crap is why I think we'd have been better off with a simple "save the world" story... there are just way too many facepalm moments where the game doesn't make any sense... I realize they wanted to tell a specific story so we don't have a lot of control, but something like this is illogical, given the Templars' zealous natures.

[Macropodmum]

What I found amusing was that in my last playthrough I romanced him and yet I didn't remember him bringing up anything about a revolution, yet this time around when I made it clear we were just friends he wants to tell me all about his revolution.

[Sinaxi]

QQ moar about no game choices.

Anders still sticks it to Elthina no matter what you do.

[Plaintiff]

No matter what you do, the Chantry will be reduced to a smoking crater. Which Anders and I then have sex in.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

You can tell him you won't help him rescue Karl in Act I and you'll find another way to enter the Deep Roads. He'll say he'll wait for you at the Chantry.

You can tell him to leave the party in Act 2 after 'Dissent'. He comes back.

You can report him to Cullen, or *bring* him to Cullen. He never gets arrested.

You can refuse to do 'Justice' in Act 3. He still manages to carry out his plan.

So yeah. You're pretty much stuck with him no matter what your choices until the Chantry blows.

[Torax]

It's funny to be honest. Only because I didn't really like how he was talking to the other companions in the first place. So once I noticed I couldn't prevent his actions? I just don't even really use him for anything but the deep roads to keep the siblings alive if I want them to be grey wardens. I don't even bother to upgrade any of his stuff or seek out his gifts. I just have trouble finding him appealing at all. Even in my first game play in DA 2, I thought he was possibly tolerable in Act 1 but once Act 2 hit? I just couldn't stand him. Eventually downloaded an addon so at least Merrill could be a healer...

[Rifneno]

It depresses me people actually give a rat's ass about Elthina. That **** should've been burned at the stake. I understand the sympathy for the actual innocents in the Chantry, but Elthina? All the atrocities that led to the situation blowing up (no pun intended) are her fault.

[GavrielKay]

Icy Magebane wrote...
This kind of crap is why I think we'd have been better off with a simple "save the world" story... there are just way too many facepalm moments where the game doesn't make any sense... I realize they wanted to tell a specific story so we don't have a lot of control, but something like this is illogical, given the Templars' zealous natures.

These moments are some of my biggest problems with the game.  It's a fantasy story, they completely control the world they've created.  A bit of self-consistency would be lovely.

[Icy Magebane]

GavrielKay wrote...

Icy Magebane wrote...
This kind of crap is why I think we'd have been better off with a simple "save the world" story... there are just way too many facepalm moments where the game doesn't make any sense... I realize they wanted to tell a specific story so we don't have a lot of control, but something like this is illogical, given the Templars' zealous natures.

These moments are some of my biggest problems with the game.  It's a fantasy story, they completely control the world they've created.  A bit of self-consistency would be lovely.

Thank you... seems like a few people missed the point... it's not about preventing the bombing, it's about the game being inconsistent to the point of unbelievable in many areas... Why would they even give us an option like talking to Cullen if the result was something as far-fetched as what we ended up with?  This is the issue, not whether or not the mages need to be oppressed... <_<

Modifié par Icy Magebane, 15 juillet 2011 - 06:12 .

[Huntress]

Rifneno wrote...

It depresses me people actually give a rat's ass about Elthina. That **** should've been burned at the stake. I understand the sympathy for the actual innocents in the Chantry, but Elthina? All the atrocities that led to the situation blowing up (no pun intended) are her fault.

Yes same here, if they just sit and think about it instead of pulling hot airs, they'll see that:
Neither the chantry, templars, and Lords gives a rat about innocent peoples.
Mages have innocents on their ranks, templars have innocents on their ranks, the chantry help murderers to find a new way in life while they call mages evil and cursed. Only mages can do wrong the "others" are poor things and should be feed and protected withing the Chantry walls. Way to.f.go!<_<

[Agamo45]

It's one of the thongs that makes the story horrible. The same damn thing happens no matter how you play Hawke.

[GavrielKay]

Icy Magebane wrote...

GavrielKay wrote...

Icy Magebane wrote...
This kind of crap is why I think we'd have been better off with a simple "save the world" story... there are just way too many facepalm moments where the game doesn't make any sense... I realize they wanted to tell a specific story so we don't have a lot of control, but something like this is illogical, given the Templars' zealous natures.

These moments are some of my biggest problems with the game.  It's a fantasy story, they completely control the world they've created.  A bit of self-consistency would be lovely.

Thank you... seems like a few people missed the point... it's not about preventing the bombing, it's about the game being inconsistent to the point of unbelievable in many areas... Why would they even give us an option like talking to Cullen if the result was something as far-fetched as what we ended up with?  This is the issue, not whether or not the mages need to be oppressed... <_<

Indeed.  I'm fine with not being able to prevent the bombing, although they could have handled Anders' asking for the help differently.  It is self-consistent in the story that Anders is determined enough to go it alone or find other help if Hawke refuses.  It is definitely not consistent with Cullen's character to sit on that knowledge and let it happen.

There really are too many places where immersion is broken in this game due to poor story telling. 

[Torax]

The worst of any of them is actually when despite refusing to escort ketojan? Varric will agree and then you're sitting in the room still and your quest log will still force you to escort him in the first place. Do not offer the player a decision only to slap them in the face by forcing them to do it anyway despite it. Granted there were things like that in many games. Just that one in DA2 was just worst and most obvious to me.

[Icy Magebane]

Torax wrote...

The worst of any of them is actually when despite refusing to escort ketojan? Varric will agree and then you're sitting in the room still and your quest log will still force you to escort him in the first place. Do not offer the player a decision only to slap them in the face by forcing them to do it anyway despite it. Granted there were things like that in many games. Just that one in DA2 was just worst and most obvious to me.

lol... wow... that one takes the cake for sure.  I had no idea that was the case... who voted Varric leader?  Hell, as I remember it, I always gained rivalry with Varric for accepting the quest with him in the party...

[Icy Magebane]

... double post ...

Modifié par Icy Magebane, 15 juillet 2011 - 09:01 .

[Areksu]

Torax wrote...

The worst of any of them is actually when despite refusing to escort ketojan? Varric will agree and then you're sitting in the room still and your quest log will still force you to escort him in the first place. Do not offer the player a decision only to slap them in the face by forcing them to do it anyway despite it. Granted there were things like that in many games. Just that one in DA2 was just worst and most obvious to me.

Actually, the fact that you can't kill her after she sends you on a suicide mission is an even bigger slap to the face. You can even say that you want to kill her, pointing you to the fact that there really isn't anything stopping you from doing so. No one will miss her disappearance in lowtown anyway. But nope, the game doesn't let you dispose of her even though we have the means and motive to do so.

Modifié par Areksu, 15 juillet 2011 - 10:20 .

[Torax]

Areksu wrote...

Torax wrote...

The worst of any of them is actually when despite refusing to escort ketojan? Varric will agree and then you're sitting in the room still and your quest log will still force you to escort him in the first place. Do not offer the player a decision only to slap them in the face by forcing them to do it anyway despite it. Granted there were things like that in many games. Just that one in DA2 was just worst and most obvious to me.

Actually, the fact that you can't kill her after she sends you on a suicide mission is an even bigger slap to the face. You can even say that you want to kill her, pointing you to the fact that there really isn't anything stopping you from doing so. No one will miss her disappearance in lowtown anyway. But nope, the game doesn't let you dispose of her even though we have the means and motive to do so.

Well I stayed out of that part of wanting to kill her since it falls inline with not even being able to kill Grace when she threatens to turn in either you or your friends if you brought a mage with you. On top of that Grace was already asking you to commit homicide on some templars. Not exactly a pillar of the community. But those are basically choices that never exist. I was talking about an actual choice given to you by a response that then slaps you in the face immediately after clicking it.

[DRTJR]

Rifneno wrote...

It depresses me people actually give a rat's ass about Elthina. That **** should've been burned at the stake. I understand the sympathy for the actual innocents in the Chantry, but Elthina? All the atrocities that led to the situation blowing up (no pun intended) are her fault.

well the fault for the situation could be laid at the feet of Isabella since if she had not fled to Kirkwall or taken the Tome of Koslun to begin with then the events in kirkwall may never had happened or gone as far as they did.

[Macropodmum]

Rifneno wrote...

It depresses me people actually give a rat's ass about Elthina. That **** should've been burned at the stake. I understand the sympathy for the actual innocents in the Chantry, but Elthina? All the atrocities that led to the situation blowing up (no pun intended) are her fault.

* Spoilers ahead if you haven't done Sebastians quests*



Actually I did the quest last night where you meet up with Leliana in the Viscoun'ts throne room and she mentioned that Elthina should flee to the grand chantry, but upon relaying this to Elthina she refused to go saying she wouldn't abandon the people she swore to protect.  My immediate thoughts were that she wasn't really doing much other than waiting to see what happened anyway, but then she mentioned something about dying for another to prove a point (something along those lines) and I have to wonder if she didn't have some idea all along what was going to happen.  She could just have been terribly ineffectve or maybe she left things so that they would get to the point mages actually revolted...be interesting to see how things pan out....

[Rifneno]

Areksu wrote...

Actually, the fact that you can't kill her after she sends you on a suicide mission is an even bigger slap to the face. You can even say that you want to kill her, pointing you to the fact that there really isn't anything stopping you from doing so. No one will miss her disappearance in lowtown anyway. But nope, the game doesn't let you dispose of her even though we have the means and motive to do so.

True, but the plot armor that irritated me most was Cullen's. When he's stealing Bethany, there is exactly zero chance that both of us would still be breathing in 5 minutes. Hawke even gets the option to say "Over my dead body!" two seconds before s/he stands aside and lets Cullen take his/her baby sister to a goddamn concentration camp.

Torax wrote...

Well I stayed out of that part of wanting to kill her since it falls inline with not even being able to kill Grace when she threatens to turn in either you or your friends if you brought a mage with you. On top of that Grace was already asking you to commit homicide on some templars. Not exactly a pillar of the community. But those are basically choices that never exist. I was talking about an actual choice given to you by a response that then slaps you in the face immediately after clicking it.

To be fair about the "homicide" part, only one of those templars didn't deserve to be drawn and quartered. And he was certainly an exception to the rule.

DRTJR wrote...

well the fault for the situation could be laid at the feet of Isabella since if she had not fled to Kirkwall or taken the Tome of Koslun to begin with then the events in kirkwall may never had happened or gone as far as they did.

That makes no sense on multiple levels, but the most glaring of which is that there's no real connection between the Arishok's murdering spree and the mage/templar war breaking out. If anything, it was the only time in the game that the two were united.

[Torax]

Just figured I should ask this since no one has brought it up that I know of? Did anyone at least find the name of this thread semi funny? "Anders Outcome" hehe.

[Rawr23]

Areksu wrote...

Actually, the fact that you can't kill her after she sends you on a suicide mission is an even bigger slap to the face. You can even say that you want to kill her, pointing you to the fact that there really isn't anything stopping you from doing so. No one will miss her disappearance in lowtown anyway. But nope, the game doesn't let you dispose of her even though we have the means and motive to do so.

Good point, but I wouldn't change a thing.  My love for the Qunari and hatred for Sister Petrice made me relish her death scene.

I could watch it over and over and over.    One in the chest... let her feel it... feel it... Headshot.  Elthina looks back... doesn't give a flying ****... continues walking.  Justice served.

Rifneno wrote...

It depresses me people actually give a rat's ass about Elthina. That **** should've been burned at the stake. I understand the sympathy for the actual innocents in the Chantry, but Elthina? All the atrocities that led to the situation blowing up (no pun intended) are her fault.

I disagree.  Elthina is the only person in the "Meet the four most important people in Kirkwall!" achievement that I could stand.  I normally dislike the Chantry's harsh views of the world and those who wish to find solace outside of their beliefs, but Elthina, in my humble opinion, made the best case for the Chantry I've seen in the DA world yet.  I especially love when Meredith and Orsino are fighting in the Gallows and, when asked of her opinion, (if I remember correctly) she states how the Chantry never intended for it to elevate to this. 

Haven't played in a long while due to my incessant love of DA:O, so forgive me if I'm wrong!