129 réponses à ce sujet

[CroGamer002]

Finis Valorum wrote...

An ask EDI feature could cover all the points you make for Vega and asking EDI about the genophage for example could indeed also be fun for older players if they keep the AI's deadpan delivery.

A) Only possible in Normandy not to look stupid and/or unnatural
It would be stupid for Shepard to ask all those things he/she already knows


Vega is far better to be natural and Shepard can be mentor again like with Garrus in ME1. Really neat for old players.

[In Exile]

essarr71 wrote...
I'm selling a really great toaster!  Oh, but to know how to use it, you need to buy these two older toasters.

Ignoring the fact that you could just not talk to Vega, it IS possible that his fuction will be well written and unfold in an interesting way.  Just because he's there to be a bridge for new players doesnt mean it won't be subtle or interesting.

I just struggle to see why you think keeping new players out is a good idea.

One issue we had (and ME3 promises to address) is emotion for Shepard. If Vega & Shepard re-cap choices like the Council, Shepard can editorialize with player input. Just one possibility.

[who would know]

essarr71 wrote...

I just struggle to see why you think keeping new players out is a good idea.

Character whose concept is devoted to familiarizing new players means time and energy will be drained from other causes maybe more appealing to both old and new players. Improved intra-squad relations among the already large and diverse cast is one.

Newcomers will have a blast, but alienation due to starting with the third part of a trilogy should be expected, unless the hand holding is explicitly advertised. Instead of their confusion being an impetus to play ME3, have a blast, and then go back for the story they missed (or not), their confusion will be an impetus to play ME3, have a blast, and consult Vega on the way.

essarr71 wrote...

It's very possible older players might find conversing with him interesting.

Yes. I don't dread Vega. I'm cool with new characters. The concept behind his character simply seems misinformed and misguided.

Modifié par who would know, 16 juillet 2011 - 01:36 .

[nhsk]

I still says he is the new guy, and last man assigned, first man to go.

But BW probably makes him the only unkillable since he an entry point character...

[Cutlass Jack]

who would know wrote...

Yes. I don't dread Vega. I'm cool with new characters. The concept behind his character simply seems misinformed and misguided.

I think you're probably juding his concept from lack of information yourself. He represents the point of view of someone new to the franchise. But no one ever said thats the entirety of his character concept. He could be someone new, but with some ability, information, or story connection that's critical.

If the entirety of his role is just being a newbie, then he's no better than Jenkins. But I suspect there is far more to him than just that.

[l DryIce l]

 As of now, the idea of a character who has no idea of what's going on seems unnecessary. There was no clueless character in ME2. Noone asked Shepard what the Reapers were, or why the Quarians/Geth were fighting. If they are going to have a comic, why have a Vega?

I'm fine with new characters, but if the character is there primarily for introducing new player, I fear he's going to be a waste of space. And it's not like new players are going to buy the game knowing that there's going to be a character that helps them along the way. I fail to understand how that's a selling point for new players. 

[essarr71]

l DryIce l wrote...

 As of now, the idea of a character who has no idea of what's going on seems unnecessary. There was no clueless character in ME2. Noone asked Shepard what the Reapers were, or why the Quarians/Geth were fighting. If they are going to have a comic, why have a Vega?

See that's the big issue.  People hear one thing and run with it. 

Everyone in ME2 already KNEW about the reapers, either from being around in ME or being a part of a Cerberus team, or Geth.  Fact is, the average person has no idea about the Reapers or what's going on between Quarians and the Geth or anything else Shep is involved in, except thru news trickled down thru media.

A guy like Vega won't be clueless ("What's a Quarian? "Whats the Genophage?"), he just will be in the dark about the events of the past two games.  Considaring he could very well have been stationed in the middle of no where doesn't break his character in this regard, it only enhances it.  Vega could very well be a good grunt, assigned to some security force during shep's trial and gets caught up in an invasion he has no idea was coming - like the vast majority of people.

So after, when you're taking him across the galaxy, he won't say "What's a Geth?", he'll say: "I thought the Geth were our enemies after Eden Prime?" or "Wasn't the citadel made by the protheans?"  He doesn't need to come off as an idiot, just someone who has been in the dark.. much like a new player.  Explaining the last few games won't need to happen all at once in long boring bursts, but in a realistic, natural way.  Besides, a character with a fresh view on the events doesn't sound like a bad idea. 

[javierabegazo]

Darth Death wrote...

For someone that has been with ME since day one, "Vega's concept as entry point for newcomers" does pose a sense of disinterest. But as stated he is meant for the people who probably didn't play the last two previous games. I can't say if I would like the presents for someone like him on my squad. Hopefully there's a "no duh" or "have you been living under a rock" options of dialogue.

By that logic, As a player since ME1, None of the characters in ME2 are "meant" for me.

[Nicodemus]

Personally I would prefer him as a new character for people with non imported games to help fill out the squad. For folks who import game saves it would be nice if he is an option but not a necessity.. e.g

If you killed Wrex in ME1 then Vega is available, if Wrex is alive he isn't.

I personally am not that enamoured with the concept of his character for established players, and my over riding instinct is to introduce him to an airlock. Maybe time and some more info may change my mind, but as it is, I'm not convinced yet.

[CheeseEnchilada]

I don't mind him. We need a new perma-squaddie for those who botched the suicide mission, and it'll be interesting to see his perspective on the galactic issues and how he views Shepard. I just wish I knew more about the guy--they're pretty mum on his personality so far, and that's what I'm most interested in.

That being said, I'd prefer that Vega be the only new squadmate. We've got plenty already, and I'd rather focus on them. Flesh the existing characters out, and let us finish the game with our favorites, with Vega tagging along for the ride.

[SalsaDMA]

Mesina2 wrote...

Finis Valorum wrote...

An ask EDI feature could cover all the points you make for Vega and asking EDI about the genophage for example could indeed also be fun for older players if they keep the AI's deadpan delivery.

A) Only possible in Normandy not to look stupid and/or unnatural
It would be stupid for Shepard to ask all those things he/she already knows


Vega is far better to be natural and Shepard can be mentor again like with Garrus in ME1. Really neat for old players.

Wrong.

It could be so simple, really.

Add an option at the start of the game that is automaticcaly chosen to start with but can be unselected: "I haven't played the previous games mass effect games"

Then whenever Vega would have blurbed his silliness, EDI would instead have made a comment over voice-com reminding Shepard about the details in her own way.

Wouldn't need a new character to be shoehorned in, would allow new players the info they want, would have allowed old timers at least one more of the old characters in their party. Overall it would have been alot more eatable than Vega I feel.

But I guess marketing REALLY wanted a 'buff marine grunt' in the party to attract a certain demographic of gamers according to their misguided charts... <_<

[lazuli]

How many threads does this guy need?

[SalsaDMA]

essarr71 wrote...

So after, when you're taking him across the galaxy, he won't say "What's a Geth?", he'll say: "I thought the Geth were our enemies after Eden Prime?" or "Wasn't the citadel made by the protheans?"  He doesn't need to come off as an idiot, just someone who has been in the dark.. much like a new player.

Because a new player would be well aware of Eden prime, right?

[SalsaDMA]

CheeseEnchilada wrote...

I don't mind him. We need a new perma-squaddie for those who botched the suicide mission, and it'll be interesting to see his perspective on the galactic issues and how he views Shepard. I just wish I knew more about the guy--they're pretty mum on his personality so far, and that's what I'm most interested in.

That being said, I'd prefer that Vega be the only new squadmate. We've got plenty already, and I'd rather focus on them. Flesh the existing characters out, and let us finish the game with our favorites, with Vega tagging along for the ride.

I would go so far as to claim that anyone having enough deaths on their team as to actually require more members than supplied inherently just by adding VS and Liara would feel that their suicide mission wasn't a "botch up" but a carefully planned happening.

I don't think you can even go below 2 survivors in addition to Shepard, meaning you at the very least should have had access to 4 squadmates if you count in VS and Liara. Unless ME3 drastically changes squad mechanics and actually allows us to field more squadmates at a time than previously (and GOD would I love if they did that!) I really don't see basicly undoing the effort those people put into their saves as anything more than a slap with the back of the hand.

[habitat 67]

CheeseEnchilada wrote...

 I'd prefer that Vega be the only new squadmate. We've got plenty already, and I'd rather focus on them. Flesh the existing characters out, and let us finish the game with our favorites, with Vega tagging along for the ride.

I agree with this. Whatever on the fresh meat character but let's focus on already existing characters to end this trilogy.
We only need a few Admiral Ackbars at this point.

[JamieCOTC]

Say what you want, but I'd rather have Vega be the greenhorn who has no clue as to what is going on instead of Shepard.

Shepard: Who are you?
Jacob: We're Cerberus. We rebuilt you.
Miranda: Our job was to bring you back exactly the way you were, same body, same mind, same morals. same personality.
Shepard: Who the hell is Cerberus?
Jacob: And our 100% fail rate continues.
Miranda: TIM didn't say anything about memories!
TIM: *sigh*

Modifié par JamieCOTC, 16 juillet 2011 - 05:20 .

[TexasToast712]

javierabegazo wrote...

What trilogy has not included a new character somewhere?

Halo 3 is the only one that comes to mind. I cant recall any new characters added to Halo 3 after Halo 2.

[CroGamer002]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Wrong.

It could be so simple, really.

Add an option at the start of the game that is automaticcaly chosen to start with but can be unselected: "I haven't played the previous games mass effect games"

Then whenever Vega would have blurbed his silliness, EDI would instead have made a comment over voice-com reminding Shepard about the details in her own way.

That's just ridiculous suggestion that would be really be out of place.

New players might even get annoyed to have "here's something you don't know moron".

Wouldn't need a new character to be shoehorned in, would allow new players the info they want, would have allowed old timers at least one more of the old characters in their party. Overall it would have been alot more eatable than Vega I feel.

But I guess marketing REALLY wanted a 'buff marine grunt' in the party to attract a certain demographic of gamers according to their misguided charts... <_<

For starters, new squadmates are necessary.

Only 1 squadmates get's back in ME3 100%, while for Ashley and Kaidan is 50% for one of them.


New ones are needed.

And with James Vega Bioware killing 2 birds with 1 stone.
New squadmate in case of death of old ones and for new player to learn without something very out of place.

Also we're getting another chance for Shepard to be a mentor to someone, like with Garrus in ME1. Very neat for old players.

[Sebby]

My biggest fear is that James will be a manifestation of all Shepard's dumbest moments from the past two games like comparing the genophage to the FCW, asking Tali if she's royalty, being surprised that Asari can mate with each other,etc

[Vertigo_1]

Mesina2 wrote...

Only 1 squadmates get's back in ME3 100%, while for Ashley and Kaidan is 50% for one of them.


New ones are needed.

And with James Vega Bioware killing 2 birds with 1 stone.
New squadmate in case of death of old ones and for new player to learn without something very out of place.

Also we're getting another chance for Shepard to be a mentor to someone, like with Garrus in ME1. Very neat for old players.

/nitpicking

It's 100% for VS to return too, just which one is up to the player

/end nitpicking

Otherwise I agree, but I'd prefer if they kept the amount of 'new' people to a minimum for the last game in the trilogy.

[CaptREDKangaroo]

Long as there's no Metal Gear Solid 2 and you play as Vega for most of the game instead of Shepard, which I KNOW won't be the case, I can see a small section as Vega tho for newcomers a tutorial like thing... frankly majority of ppl won't be new - I understand a need for a type of character but not if it makes things annoyingly redundant for those who've played the series already, aka most.

Modifié par CaptREDKangaroo, 16 juillet 2011 - 06:42 .

[CroGamer002]

Vertigo_1 wrote...

/nitpicking

It's 100% for VS to return too, just which one is up to the player

/end nitpicking

Well, Kaidan and Ashley are 2 different characters so I labeled it to 50%.

Just to be clear on that one.

[Saberchic]

There's nothing wrong with newbies coming to the series in the last installment. Vega is a good way for a player to get introduced to what's going on.

Also, he could also be a good way for Shep to get new information for returning players. Shep has been out of touch with the Alliance for awhile. Vega could very well be giving us a pulse on what the Alliance attitude and focus is in this game.

[Art3m]

I don't like the big guy soldier-tank concept. Big guys were nessesery in medieval when there wasn't firing guns. In modern caombat the smaller the soldier is the better. Just because when you are small you are not making a good target for your enemy.

[DTKT]

Do you really need a character to help you ease into the story? Does he really need to be a squadmate?