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Stop catering to newcomers


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#326
Ghost Lightning

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cljqnsnyc wrote...

Ghost Lightning wrote...

cljqnsnyc wrote...

...and as I stated before if James Vega were Jamie Vega instead...a California busty bleached blonde, with the IQ of a pencil sharpener,  NO WAY would there be protest on the same scale. NO WAY!


But what if she replaced Miranda? I'm sure many people would rather have her back than some ditsy blonde XD


I'm guessing a good number of the Vega detractors would prefer Jamielyn over Miranda...IQ and all that goes with it.


I'm not particularly fond of Vega, but I know I'm against any new Squadmate. Now I like the idea of Vega, he's for new people. I get it, perfect. But for the love of god Bioware make him optional! Please! I want Jack back!!!

#327
The Spamming Troll

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marshalleck wrote...

MajorStranger wrote...

Here's one of my biggest issue.

Human: 9
Shepard
Ashley
Kaidan
Jack
Jacob
Kasumi
Miranda
Zaeed

And now Vega

Asari: 2 (possible 3)
Liara
Samara
Morith

Krogan: 2
Wrex
Grunt

Quarian: 1
Tali

Turian: 1
Garrus

Salarian: 1
Mordin

Drell: 1
Thane

Geth: 1
Legion

There more human than all species combined! Most of them are plain boring or caricatural.

A Batarian would be nice, or another Quarian, or maybe a Turian? anything but a boring human douche!

I don't see the problem. Mass Effect has always been about humanity's first big steps in the galaxy.


you did say galaxy, a galaxy in which humans are entirely new to. ive seen more huans playing ME then all other species combines. i understand restrictions in creaing a million different species, but i cant see the reasoning why theres more humans then aliens.

#328
Guest_lightsnow13_*

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tbh, I think its a great way to introduce a new character. Bring it on Vega!

Can't wait

#329
The Spamming Troll

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marshalleck wrote...

I fully intend to screw with Bioware's metrics for this Vega character. I'm never going to talk to him, never take him on missions, and never do any personal missions related to him, if there are any. The only way I'll use him is if I'm forced to, and the only time I'll converse with him is if he initiates it. In which case I'll end the conversation as soon as possible. If it's possible to get him killed, I'll do it every time. 

Bioware don't really pay attention to what people say on the BSN. They do use metrics to see how people play their games though if you leave the option to send anonymous gameplay statistics back home enabled. So I'll just do my part to rig that data.


wait a minute! bioware is following how many times ive banged miranda???!?!??

or the time i played as femshep and had lebian love with liara?!?!?!?

or danceing with that one girl on omega searching for morinth???!??

i feel violated.

#330
marshalleck

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The Spamming Troll wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

I fully intend to screw with Bioware's metrics for this Vega character. I'm never going to talk to him, never take him on missions, and never do any personal missions related to him, if there are any. The only way I'll use him is if I'm forced to, and the only time I'll converse with him is if he initiates it. In which case I'll end the conversation as soon as possible. If it's possible to get him killed, I'll do it every time. 

Bioware don't really pay attention to what people say on the BSN. They do use metrics to see how people play their games though if you leave the option to send anonymous gameplay statistics back home enabled. So I'll just do my part to rig that data.


wait a minute! bioware is following how many times ive banged miranda???!?!??

or the time i played as femshep and had lebian love with liara?!?!?!?

or danceing with that one girl on omega searching for morinth???!??

i feel violated.

Not you specifically. They just know that someone out there activated the cuddle scenes with Miranda 892 times in the first 6 months of the game being live.

#331
Nizzemancer

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Massadonious1 wrote...

Iron Man 1 movie gross: $585,174,222
Iron Man 2 movie gross: $622,056,974

It's safe to assume that $36,882,752 difference is from people who haven't seen the first.

Movie analogy = fail.


Or people saw the second movie several times...

#332
Icinix

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marshalleck wrote...

The Spamming Troll wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

I fully intend to screw with Bioware's metrics for this Vega character. I'm never going to talk to him, never take him on missions, and never do any personal missions related to him, if there are any. The only way I'll use him is if I'm forced to, and the only time I'll converse with him is if he initiates it. In which case I'll end the conversation as soon as possible. If it's possible to get him killed, I'll do it every time. 

Bioware don't really pay attention to what people say on the BSN. They do use metrics to see how people play their games though if you leave the option to send anonymous gameplay statistics back home enabled. So I'll just do my part to rig that data.


wait a minute! bioware is following how many times ive banged miranda???!?!??

or the time i played as femshep and had lebian love with liara?!?!?!?

or danceing with that one girl on omega searching for morinth???!??

i feel violated.

Not you specifically. They just know that someone out there activated the cuddle scenes with Miranda 892 times in the first 6 months of the game being live.


Look - it was a rough time for me ok? No need to keep brining it up.


On that metrics though - its such a new field throughout all industries, and almost everyone involved in it is saying "We've got the raw data, but we're still learning how to utilise it."

So I fully expect the occasional massive fail, with the occasional piece of pure awesome.  Its just we seem to have had more fails and a few semi victories with them. But, things can only get better.

Hopefully.

#333
Ghost Lightning

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Nizzemancer wrote...

Massadonious1 wrote...

Iron Man 1 movie gross: $585,174,222
Iron Man 2 movie gross: $622,056,974

It's safe to assume that $36,882,752 difference is from people who haven't seen the first.

Movie analogy = fail.


Or people saw the second movie several times...


I saw it thrice and I think the first was far better 

#334
shepskisaac

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MajorStranger wrote...

and 10 (optional by in-game choice): Morith

Having Math problems lol?

I stand corrected :) On the aliens count. But not that there's more humans than aliens. 9 humans. 10 aliens. 9 aliens excluding Morinth. In no case there's more humans than aliens. And you shouldn't be even including Shepard in that list, since you don't talk to yourself lol.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 20 juillet 2011 - 03:15 .


#335
Icinix

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Ghost Lightning wrote...

Nizzemancer wrote...

Massadonious1 wrote...

Iron Man 1 movie gross: $585,174,222
Iron Man 2 movie gross: $622,056,974

It's safe to assume that $36,882,752 difference is from people who haven't seen the first.

Movie analogy = fail.


Or people saw the second movie several times...


I saw it thrice and I think the first was far better 


How many times did you see the first?

#336
cljqnsnyc

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MajorStranger wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

MajorStranger wrote...
There more human than all species combined! Most of them are plain boring or caricatural.

Urhmmm you've listed 9 humans and 11 aliens. Having math problems lol?



No, there's actually 10 character including one I never had as a teammate, which make it 9

1-Liara
2-Samara
3-Tali
4-Wrex
5-Grunt
6-Mordin
7-Legion
8-Garrus
9-Thane

and 10 (optional by in-game choice): Morith

Having Math problems lol?




There are also 2 dlc characters, Kasumi and Zaeed.

#337
cljqnsnyc

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So far Bioware, at least where ME is concerned, has been on point with writing good stories. I have no doubt they will implement all the characters, including Vega in a way befitting the overall story without stepping on too many toes.

#338
Xarathox

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Terror_K wrote...

I still think that you guys wasted too much potential for the series to be a true trilogy by making it cater too much towards newcomers to the series with ME2 and again with ME3 (especially with comments like, "ME3 is the BEST place to jump in" which just makes it sound like those who have already jumped in are missing out on something) and by styling the entire trilogy as three stand-alone titles instead of a proper trilogy consisting of three parts. Each title being stand-alone I think has isolated them a bit too much and lost a good deal of flow and consistency from the overall story and even style. ME2 felt so damn removed from ME1 story-wise and made it seem like far too much that was supposed to be important was either pushed into the background, swept under the rug or just made nowhere near as important as it seemed via some cop-outs and minimal focus on the subjects.

Star Wars keeps being brought up, but the original Star Wars films didn't get created as stand-alone movies where they were designed for anybody to just jump-in: they were designed as a proper trilogy where the viewer was somewhat expected to have seen the previous movie. Empire and Jedi were very much dependent on the prior films for proper clarity and followed on from each other directly, and were never stand-alone entries. They didn't have a whole bunch of pipe or recaps for newcomers and they didn't change the story so much so that it only had the tiniest links to the previous one(s) so that it could begin a whole new arc. Same goes for the Lord of the Rings movies. Even the Harry Potter ones (I saw Dealthy Hallows: Part I earlier this year, and the only other films I'd seen were the first two. It confused the hell out of me.). When it came to the flow and narrative, jumping from Mass Effect 1 to Mass Effect 2 felt less like going from A New Hope to Empire and more like going from Phantom Menace to A New Hope.

Mass Effect really had great potential to be a proper trilogy that was truly one big story dependent on the other titles to function properly, but it wasted it by this "stand alone game" approach, IMO.


This, I think, sums up the perfect argument towards the topic.

While both Me 1 & 2 are both fantastic games, their connection to each other is pretty thin. If ME3 can pull them both together and intgrate both story arc's seamlessly to a proper conclusion (Other than Must.Stop.Reapers), that would be fantastic. I do, however, feel that the final entry will take as much of a departure from the previous installment as it did with ME1.

Of course, this is probably a major learning curve for BioWare themselves, seeing as though they've made absolutely fantastic games over the years, but have a spotty track record concerning sequels (i.e Baldurs Gate is the only other game they've made to recieve a follow up, and that was a decade ago).

#339
Seboist

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marshalleck wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

cljqnsnyc wrote...

I wonder why some people seem threatened by Vega? Hmmm.....


If Vega was a big, busty blonde instead, would she meet with such reprisals? ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, UNDENIABLY NOT! These same people complaining would be singing her praises, no matter what kind of personality she had.

To some people, he's obviously a 'competition' to their mSheps. Others think his looks equals his personality. Well, if that was the case, Miranda should be a stupid bimbo with absolutely no depth at all.


Or they don't want to be saddled with the task of babysitting some annoying noob just because Bioware think people who hop into the series with the final game deserve a character tailored specifically for them. 



Vega already comes off as being worse of a character than Jacob due to that.

#340
Ghost Lightning

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Icinix wrote...

Ghost Lightning wrote...

Nizzemancer wrote...

Massadonious1 wrote...

Iron Man 1 movie gross: $585,174,222
Iron Man 2 movie gross: $622,056,974

It's safe to assume that $36,882,752 difference is from people who haven't seen the first.

Movie analogy = fail.


Or people saw the second movie several times...


I saw it thrice and I think the first was far better 


How many times did you see the first?



Twice

#341
cljqnsnyc

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Malanek999 wrote...

cljqnsnyc wrote...

Malanek999 wrote...

Ghost Lightning wrote...
Now that's silly. They aren't mad cause he's a new male that "threatens" them. They're mad cause they want their favorites back. Casey Hudson specifically said there will be less squad mates in ME3 than in ME2 so every space is precious for people that want to see their favorite in the series conclusion. Forcing us to take up one of those spaces with new character that's designed for people that never played ME before can be seen as insulting to previous fans. I don't completely agrre (I think he should be optional) but they have a point.  

I think this is closer to the truth. I understand people want to see their favourite characters back. It was always going to be tricky to manage this with so many able to be killed. The second part however I don't agree with. It is probable IMO, that Vega will be important to the story for new and existing players alike.

Oh really?

So they all must have been ready to burn Bioware down when ME2 came out...sans most of the previous team......

I didn't really like ME1 that much so didn't follow the ME2 development but....I do recall an enourmous amount of moaning about the absence of the ME1 squad and the demands that the VS have their own DLC.


I guess I must have missed it. The only moaning that I remember when ME2 came out was the lack of rpg elements compared to ME1...which is why they have mentioned it over and over again. ME3 promises to bridge the gap.

#342
WilliamShatner

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Chris Priestly wrote...

Answer: No, sorry.

We will work to cater to ALL Mass Effect fans. Those who have been here since before the first game was released and those who pick up Mass Effect 3 as their first entry into the series.



:devil:


How can someone be a fan of something without playing it first?

#343
slimgrin

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What's wrong with the codex as a means to get new players up to speed?

#344
Les_Carver

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Seboist wrote...

Vega already comes off as being worse of a character than Jacob due to that.


Hahaha

Condemning a character without knowing him first... And just because he's not familiar with space politics.

That's a new one.

/sarcasm

Modifié par Les_Carver, 20 juillet 2011 - 03:41 .


#345
Ghost Lightning

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slimgrin wrote...

What's wrong with the codex as a means to get new players up to speed?


My friend, you have just exibited more common sense in this one comment than I have seen in this whole thread. 

#346
marshalleck

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slimgrin wrote...

What's wrong with the codex as a means to get new players up to speed?

Reading is too hard. Bioware hate literacy.

Also, the guy who wrote most of Mass Effect's codex quit the company, so lol. 

Modifié par marshalleck, 20 juillet 2011 - 03:42 .


#347
didymos1120

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slimgrin wrote...

What's wrong with the codex as a means to get new players up to speed?


Based on the BSN, I'd say it's the fact that hardly anyone ever seems to read it.

#348
Ghost Lightning

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didymos1120 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

What's wrong with the codex as a means to get new players up to speed?


Based on the BSN, I'd say it's the fact that hardly anyone ever seems to read it.


Why not have another comic like they did for PS3 people?

#349
CaptREDKangaroo

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I don't know first nobody knows what exactly getting new players up to speed means or how they'll do it - I really think it's being overdramatized in this thread. The Devs can balance making it open to new players, who there WILL be - and hopefully want to play the previous ones... and not making that annoying to the majority who have played ME1 and ME2 (or at least ME2). I don't think we'll be beat over the head with stuff.

#350
didymos1120

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Ghost Lightning wrote...

Why not have another comic like they did for PS3 people?


Well, they're doing that too, apparently.