462 réponses à ce sujet

[House_Hlaalu]

AgentWhite1416 wrote...

House_Hlaalu wrote...

Jimbe2693 wrote...

If anyone has a problem with same sex romances just don't pursue them. Don't ruin other peoples fun.
Unless Bio does a DA2 job on it, which I'm sure nobody wants.

It ruins the fun for a lot of people when one of your favourite companions like Kaiden or Garrus turn out to be Bisexual and come onto you like Anders.

 

Could you blame garrus though, female turians are fuglyyyy

Then it would make sense that Garrus would like Human females, not human males... And in my mind, i think that members of their own species find the opposite gender of their species attractive. Otherwise, how come Hutts have not died out yet...

[Blacklash93]

ReconTeam wrote...

ElitePinecone wrote...
they probably deserve to be deprived of the experience, 

Well I might argue you don't deserve S/S romance options but then you would whine about me being a homophobe.

So we're back to who "deserves" content now? How cute.

I don't know if you really are a homophobe, Recon, but that's irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. Just accusing someone of being something and leaving it at that is only a way to cop yourself out of making a valid argument.

You are however, unreasonable. From what you see, there's absolutely nothing the gay community could possibly do to "deserve" content or really anything that asks a little more from someone. But with that attitude, gays could never hope to live with the same privileges as everyone else. And, in my opinion, people who adopt that attitude just so they can have a little more for themselves aren't very considerate and giving people.

On another note, if you're against the most vocal and active group getting what they want, then you have a problem with democracy.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 19 juillet 2011 - 09:56 .

[ElitePinecone]

BSN89000 wrote...

Why?

Take it up with the moderators. I have no idea. 

But if you can start a discussion about s/s romances without it turning into a slanging match complete with personal attacks and hate speech, be my guest. I'll give you a medal. 

Every single time we've tried to discuss this issue - even with people who are capable of being civil, on both sides - it descends into nonsense. 

Every single time. 

You ask why the mods are so harsh? Because this topic is toxic. It's impossible to discuss sensibly, given how many people have strongly held views and are willing to throw around nonsense. 

[Failed.Bard]

All people really need to consider, is that the moment Bioware's internal assessments say that including S/S relations in their games is hurting sales, they'll be gone. They can't legally add them if they know it will hurt sales.
By that same token, as long as they have fair reasons to believe they'll increase sales, either through expanding the player base or simply through the extra discussion and interest generated in the game due to it, they'll stay in. They're, again, obligated by law to try to sell the most copies of the game possible, thereby creating the most return to the shareholders possible.

It has nothing to do with political correctness, on the one side, or "pandering" on the other, it's simply the nature of business as a public company.

[easyt3hremember]

Failed.Bard wrote...

All people really need to consider, is that the moment Bioware's internal assessments say that including S/S relations in their games is hurting sales, they'll be gone. They can't legally add them if they know it will hurt sales.
By that same token, as long as they have fair reasons to believe they'll increase sales, either through expanding the player base or simply through the extra discussion and interest generated in the game due to it, they'll stay in. They're, again, obligated by law to try to sell the most copies of the game possible, thereby creating the most return to the shareholders possible.

It has nothing to do with political correctness, on the one side, or "pandering" on the other, it's simply the nature of business as a public company.

Why Would it hurt sales? I don't know why people are so against s/s or so for s/s? People need to Calm down about it.
Also New Mass effect 3 romance Trailer 

Modifié par easyt3hremember, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:06 .

[Comsky159]

The BSN overall consists of a very socially libertarian community. If you make any statement which conflicts with the view of the masses you will be condemned as a bigot (oh the irony). Hence why if a conservative posts and people assault it, the conservative is seen as a troll, whereas if the libertarians make a post and conservatives assault it, the conservatives are again seen as trolls.

A little less hypocrisy please!

Have to say though, for lefties they are pretty bloody quick to crack down on what they consider "troublesome viewpoints". They're all for freedom as long as we share their opinion. I've found this attitude quite disappointing actually.

[AgentWhite1416]

"Pointless, Pointless waste of" TIME.

The game is going to be awesome even if everyone on the normandy has a big gay orgy at the end of it I feel like bored people are going out of there to make a pointless argument. I mean if something is optional then it shouldn't matter to anyone.

Did any of you think fox news was right when they said that sex in ME1 was horrible and the children were all going to see it, I doubt it. Mass effect is about a personal story of your Commander Shepard, to think that it really matters to anyone if someone wants the savior of the galaxy to prefer the same gender over another is one of the dumbest arguments I've ever heard.

Jane: Hey in my playthrough I romanced Kaiden.
John: Well in my playthrough I romanced Vega
Jane: I didn't know you made a Femshep
John: I didn't my Shepard is gay
Jane: This game is outrages I'm selling it BEAAAAAAAH
John: But I didn't care when you were hetrosexual
Jane: Well... Um... But... MY OPINION IS ALL THAT MATTERS!!!

/I"m going to bed.

[BSN89000]

Ryzaki wrote...

Like saying gay men aren't in the military and don't have experience. That's plain idiocy and bull****. <_<

Well, you asked for it. Don't be offended by the following technicalities.

Nobody (except Fox News maybe) gives a damn about  the f/f romance. That's just girls playing around.

But the m/m romance supposes that there are two types of gays: the "prenetrators" and the "penetrated". The "penetrators" are often bi, and have little trouble in getting to "experienced" positions in the military, if only they just don't jump every other guy's butt in the barracks. But the "penetrated" types are unheard of in the infantry and special forces, and indeed can never get to "experienced" positions. Call it an idiocy, bull**** or whatever, but it's the reality of real life, pardon the tautology. And it can't be just "repealed" by a lobbied congress.Therefore the prospect of a m/m romance between Shepard and Vega is completely unrealistic. That's what the guy from that locked thread was having in mind.

[House_Hlaalu]

Blacklash93 wrote...



On another note, if you're against the most vocal and active group getting what they want, then you have a problem with democracy.

Democracy is about voicing your opinion and the loudest (most numourous) voice wins. Going by your way, you want to drown out all opinions which don't support S/S, which is undemocratic.

Anyone can voice their opinion. Wether it is in agreement or if it conflicts with the loudest and most numourous is irrelevant. That is democracy. Everyone gets a voice.

Modifié par House_Hlaalu, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:08 .

[Failed.Bard]

easyt3hremember wrote...

Failed.Bard wrote...

All people really need to consider, is that the moment Bioware's internal assessments say that including S/S relations in their games is hurting sales, they'll be gone. They can't legally add them if they know it will hurt sales.
By that same token, as long as they have fair reasons to believe they'll increase sales, either through expanding the player base or simply through the extra discussion and interest generated in the game due to it, they'll stay in. They're, again, obligated by law to try to sell the most copies of the game possible, thereby creating the most return to the shareholders possible.

It has nothing to do with political correctness, on the one side, or "pandering" on the other, it's simply the nature of business as a public company.

Why Would it hurt sales? I don't know why people are so against s/s or so for s/s?

  They don't hurt sales, not in the big picture of it.  Some few players might be so upset about them that they don't buy the game at all, but most will eventually buy it and just not pursue that aspect of the game.  The new players potentially brought to the game through all the talk around it far outweigh the ones they'll lose.
  All I was saying, is that they're in because it makes business sense to have them in.  Likely it's still part of Bioware's decision to be as inclusive as possible in recent titles that led to the discussion of them being added in the first place, but it's still a business decision on whether or not they actually made it into the game.

[whywhywhywhy]

brainless78 wrote...

Political correctness. 'Nuff said.

politically correct is not morally correct.  If they get to make pro S-S relations others should be allowed to make Non s-s relation threads.  If I'm pissed off enough and I vote with my wallet and rally friends and family to do the same type of guy so that's how I strike back. 

edit: I feel the need to clarify.  To strike back at being silenced by locked threads.

Modifié par whywhywhywhy, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:51 .

[House_Hlaalu]

ElitePinecone wrote...

BSN89000 wrote...

Why?

Take it up with the moderators. I have no idea. 

But if you can start a discussion about s/s romances without it turning into a slanging match complete with personal attacks and hate speech, be my guest. I'll give you a medal. 

Every single time we've tried to discuss this issue - even with people who are capable of being civil, on both sides - it descends into nonsense. 

Every single time. 

You ask why the mods are so harsh? Because this topic is toxic. It's impossible to discuss sensibly, given how many people have strongly held views and are willing to throw around nonsense. 

Again, this thread seems to be a pretty good and not full of hate speech etc.

And in my experience, its usually the proS/S people that post all those popcorn eating giffs and homophobe accusations which prevent discussion and get a thread locked.

[ElitePinecone]

BSN89000 wrote...
snippy

This isn't a personal attack, but your characterisation of m/m romances is woefully ignorant. 

It's not a simple dichotomy, people don't fall down clearly divided lines, and the stereotypes you read about are neither common nor that obvious - at least from my perspective. 

I highly doubt Bioware want to get into the finer technical details of male sex, but suffice it to say that I've been plenty of couples where both members are stereotypically 'strong', or stereotypically 'slim'. I'd go so far as to say most real-life people I've met have been impossible to categorise the way you just did. 

Again, not a personal attack, but your post is fundamentally wrong on a number of levels. 

[bleetman]

Because you're apparently not supposed to debate whether something should or should not be included in ME3 here, because the threads go somewhere thoroughly unpleasant very, very quickly, and because there's been dozens of them before now.

On a side note:

Comsky159 wrote...

Have to say though, for lefties they are pretty bloody quick to crack down on what they consider "troublesome viewpoints". They're all for freedom as long as we share their opinion.

No, not really. The political right is more concerned with focuses on freedom. The left - depending on how far into it you go - would rather trade that for equality. I'll resist the urge to go into why the rest of your crackpot theory has no merit.

BSN89000 wrote...

Well, you asked for it. Don't be offended by the following technicalities.

Nobody (except Fox News maybe) gives a damn about  the f/f romance. That's just girls playing around.

But the m/m romance supposes that there are two types of gays: the "prenetrators" and the "penetrated". The "penetrators" are often bi, and have little trouble in getting to "experienced" positions in the military, if only they just don't jump every other guy's butt in the barracks. But the "penetrated" types are unheard of in the infantry and special forces, and indeed can never get to "experienced" positions. Call it an idiocy, bull**** or whatever, but it's the reality of real life, pardon the tautology.

Oh, and stuff like this? This is why the "homophobe" accusation starts to fly around. "I have nothing against homosexual people, but they aren't people like you and me" isn't a terribly compelling stance to take.

Modifié par bleetman, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:17 .

[House_Hlaalu]

Comsky159 wrote...

The BSN overall consists of a very socially libertarian community. If you make any statement which conflicts with the view of the masses you will be condemned as a bigot (oh the irony). Hence why if a conservative posts and people assault it, the conservative is seen as a troll, whereas if the libertarians make a post and conservatives assault it, the conservatives are again seen as trolls.

A little less hypocrisy please!

Have to say though, for lefties they are pretty bloody quick to crack down on what they consider "troublesome viewpoints". They're all for freedom as long as we share their opinion. I've found this attitude quite disappointing actually.

As have I. That is why i have refrained from posting in S/S threads on my main account becuase you are always called a bigot or a homophobe.

[Comsky159]

bleetman wrote...

Because you're apparently not supposed to debate whether something should or should not be included in ME3 here, because the threads go somewhere thoroughly unpleasant very, very quickly, and because there's been dozens of them before now.

On a side note:

Comsky159 wrote...

Have to say though, for lefties they are pretty bloody quick to crack down on what they consider "troublesome viewpoints". They're all for freedom as long as we share their opinion.

No, not really. The political right is more concerned with focuses on freedom. The left - depending on how far into it you go - would rather trade that for equality. I'll resist the urge to go into why the rest of your crackpot theory has no merit.

You're referring to the economic scale, not the social counterpart as I intended to. I understand why you're confused though, technically I should have said libertarian or anarchist rather than leftists (which refers to economic socialists).

Edit: This should help explain what I mean. Trust me when I say authoritarians aren't freedom fighters. The economic right is supportive of free trade and the removal of restraints like government protectionism. http://www.political...s.org/analysis2

Modifié par Comsky159, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:41 .

[whywhywhywhy]

GodWood wrote...

The Japanese games industry isn't falling apart.
The Wii sells more then all the other game systems put together.

hahahahahaha  No, it is.

[Blacklash93]

House_Hlaalu wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...



On another note, if you're against the most vocal and active group getting what they want, then you have a problem with democracy.

Democracy is about voicing your opinion and the loudest (most numourous) voice wins. Going by your way, you want to drown out all opinions which don't support S/S, which is undemocratic.

Anyone can voice their opinion. Wether it is in agreement or if it conflicts with the loudest and most numourous is irrelevant. That is democracy. Everyone gets a voice.

But everyone IS getting a voice. If you choose not to use it, then your side will inevitably be drowned out by criticism. That's how democracy works. You must participate.

The S/S crowd doesn't worry about being called whiners and fanatics, why should you be worried about being called a bigot for your opinion?

Modifié par Blacklash93, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:28 .

[whywhywhywhy]

JPanzerj wrote...

Just my two cents, I don't mind same-sex romance as long as characters established to have a certain sexual preferences don't suddenly change. Garrus and Tali spring to mind. If new characters are introduced who happen to be homosexual or bisexual or whatever I wouldn't mind.

And I think we have a S/S megathread so thats why other threads about the same topic are being locked.

I agree with the quoted parts above. 
And also the thing about the COD fanbase is true and I guarentee they'd be less then "politically correct" in how they express their opinions.  Those types of fans scare gamers away from games.

[House_Hlaalu]

Blacklash93 wrote...

House_Hlaalu wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...



On another note, if you're against the most vocal and active group getting what they want, then you have a problem with democracy.

Democracy is about voicing your opinion and the loudest (most numourous) voice wins. Going by your way, you want to drown out all opinions which don't support S/S, which is undemocratic.

Anyone can voice their opinion. Wether it is in agreement or if it conflicts with the loudest and most numourous is irrelevant. That is democracy. Everyone gets a voice.

But everyone IS getting a voice. If you choose not to use it, then your side will inevitably be drowned out by criticism. That's how democracy works. You must participate.

The S/S crowd doesn't worry about being called whiners and fanatics, why should you be worried about being called a bigot for your opinion?

I know everyone is getting a voice, i didn't say we are not in a democracy, im saying that what you said is undemocratic.

@second point. On this site, gay people don't have to worry about being called whiners or fanatics, because it seems to be inhabited largly by liberals, plus, you don't get banned, but it seems that people like me do. Im not going to lose my account, which i use all the time for non-S/S related discussion get banned for voicing my opinion. Im gonna have to use an Alt.

[Ryzaki]

BSN89000 wrote...

Well, you asked for it. Don't be offended by the following technicalities.

Nobody (except Fox News maybe) gives a damn about  the f/f romance. That's just girls playing around.

But the m/m romance supposes that there are two types of gays: the "prenetrators" and the "penetrated". The "penetrators" are often bi, and have little trouble in getting to "experienced" positions in the military, if only they just don't jump every other guy's butt in the barracks. But the "penetrated" types are unheard of in the infantry and special forces, and indeed can never get to "experienced" positions. Call it an idiocy, bull**** or whatever, but it's the reality of real life, pardon the tautology. And it can't be just "repealed" by a lobbied congress.Therefore the prospect of a m/m romance between Shepard and Vega is completely unrealistic. That's what the guy from that locked thread was having in mind.

That's not reality. That's idiocy. Pardon the tautology. 

Really the amount of facepalm inducing crap in this post...you sound like a yaoi fangirl stuck on uke and seme. And I say this AS a yaoi fangirl. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:47 .

[lillegraa]

Ok I am a straight girl who has never used the s/s romance option in any of the BW games it has been included in, but I still think it's absolutely great that they are doing it. I cannot see any reasons why not to. On my "canon" Shepard, I romanced Garrus, I think he's a lovely character. I would not like him any less at all if he was to be an s/s romance in ME3. I don't really see how it freaking matters.

It's like some people have an entirely screwed up perception of homosexuality, especially male homosexuality. Like they expect that any guy who happens to dig other guys to strut around in a hot pink feather boa. Like gayness or any association with anything remotely gay damages your masculinity beyond repair.

uhh, yes. And about why the threads not wanting homosexual romances are labelled as trolls; they might not be trolls, but they are asking for a game that restricts the options of others for no good reason. Like in that thread you mentioned, some people definitely took ridiculing him a little far, even after he admitted he was wrong, but I think a lot of people are simply tired of seeing threads going "I do not want to play a game wherein I can be exposed to something that goes against my personal beliefs, and I would like Bioware to take steps in order to ensure that anything of aforementioned nature is not present in my game", because really, it is a little silly.

[Wittand25]

House_Hlaalu wrote...
I know everyone is getting a voice, i didn't say we are not in a democracy, im saying that what you said is undemocratic.

@second point. On this site, gay people don't have to worry about being called whiners or fanatics, because it seems to be inhabited largly by liberals, plus, you don't get banned, but it seems that people like me do. Im not going to lose my account, which i use all the time for non-S/S related discussion get banned for voicing my opinion. Im gonna have to use an Alt.

Paranoid much ?

As long as you stay civil and stick to forum rules there is no danger of getting a temporary ban. Lots of people who disagree with s/s content did not face negative consequences and several pro s/s posters did get temporary bans for violating the forum rules.
Please refrain from painting yourself as victim or claiming that there is a deliberate, unfair bias amongst the moderators.

[House_Hlaalu]

lillegraa wrote...

Ok I am a straight girl who has never used the s/s romance option in any of the BW games it has been included in, but I still think it's absolutely great that they are doing it. I cannot see any reasons why not to. On my "canon" Shepard, I romanced Garrus, I think he's a lovely character. I would not like him any less at all if he was to be an s/s romance in ME3. I don't really see how it freaking matters.

It's like some people have an entirely screwed up perception of homosexuality, especially male homosexuality. Like they expect that any guy who happens to dig other guys to strut around in a hot pink feather boa. Like gayness or any association with anything remotely gay damages your masculinity beyond repair.

uhh, yes. And about why the threads not wanting homosexual romances are labelled as trolls; they might not be trolls, but they are asking for a game that restricts the options of others for no good reason. Like in that thread you mentioned, some people definitely took ridiculing him a little far, even after he admitted he was wrong, but I think a lot of people are simply tired of seeing threads going "I do not want to play a game wherein I can be exposed to something that goes against my personal beliefs, and I would like Bioware to take steps in order to ensure that anything of aforementioned nature is not present in my game", because really, it is a little silly.

To be fair, he didn't ask for it to be removed, he asked for an option, which is entirely reasonable, since it is offensive to a lot of people.

[A-K-M]

As long as heterosexual LIs won't become extinct in ME3 or be relegated to a tiny minority(most likely outcome) I see no problem with s/s romance.

Modifié par A-K-M, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:50 .