108 réponses à ce sujet

[charmingcharlie]

Captain Crash wrote...

Of course the majority prefer the mouse keyboard setup and that should remain top priority.  However if they can find the time to set up that option I would welcome it.

There isn't a way to do it ECONOMICALLY the only way to do it is to design the PC version with the joypad in mind and let mouse and keyboard users "slum it".  It is far easier for a mouse and keyboard user to use a joypad interface than it is for a joypad user to use a mouse and keyboard interface.  Now why should I as a mouse and keyboard user have to lose out just because you and a small minority want joypad control on the PC when the option is already open to you on the console ?

Mesina2 wrote...
I'm a PC gamer that can run ME2 on max settings, but I can barely afford to buy games often, let alone console as well.

Then you might want to consider a cheaper hobby or alternatively if the control scheme is that important to you then sell your PC and buy a cheap laptop and a console.

Fredvdp wrote... And I want to try and play it with a controller at a 1080p resolution. What should I do?

I want to play all the console exclusives at 1080p and use a mouse and keyboard to do it what should I do ?  Oh yeah I should just accept I am not going to get what I want and decide whether it is WORTH IT to me to  buy a console and put up with 720p and a crappy joypad to play those games.  Incase you are wondering I decided it wasn't worth it to put up with 720p and no mouse/keyboard control on consoles so I don't game on consoles (see how it works ?).

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 20 juillet 2011 - 05:45 .

[TheWarofArt]

I'm not sure if ME3 would be better with a controller. With a keyboard I can bind many more skills than on a controller. Things like warp bombs seem much harder to pull off with a controller, as you'll need to go to the power wheel and aim every time.
I can't think of much of a reason to not allow controller support but personally I would pick keyboard/mouse every time for Mass Effect.

[Daiyus]

I can't believe there's so much negativity towards an option. You know, one of those things you can choose to use or not. Now I'll admit, I do prefer a joypad. That being said, some games on PS3 support Mouse and Keyboard setups (Unreal Tournament 3 for example) and that's great. People can play how they like. I know of a few PC games that come with native Controller support as well (Fallout 3 is the first to come to mind).

Did those games have odd UI problems? Sure. But I've yet to play a game on any platform where the UI and controls are perfect. Therefore offering an alternative input device is fairly sensible (especially as EA are known to try and branch out).

I honestly don't think that adding joypad support will hurt the M+K UI. As people have mentioned, it was vaguely in ME2 already (required some .ini modification though). If I were BioWare I'd get the M+K running well, then use the console template and add that too.

Seriously, there's no losers in this if both are included. Everyone plays how they want. I hate using the term, but some attitudes towards anything console related around here seem to border on PC Elitism sometimes.

[Captain Crash]

Daiyus wrote...

Seriously, there's no losers in this if both are included. Everyone plays how they want. I hate using the term, but some attitudes towards anything console related around here seem to border on PC Elitism sometimes.

This is what I believe to.   It seems perfectly feasible as an option and some people are putting up very strong barriers, mostly illogically I think.  Just because you prefer a controller doesnt mean anything and saying things like "ditch your £800 gaming PC and buy a console instead" is just damn right silly.


No one wants to take away from the mose/keyboard experience.  Thats obviously top priority as I said.  But having an option to use a different interface would be great!

[Nab20]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Shooters on consoles... lol.

TPS on PC... lol

[jamesp81]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Shooters on consoles... lol.

That pretty much captures it.

[jamesp81]

Luc0s wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Shooters on consoles... lol.

Clearly you have never played Gears of War. GoW is far superior on Xbox360 compared to the PC port.

I have to agree that first-person shooters don't belong on consoles, but Gears of War really changed my perspective on third-person shooters on consoles. Gears of War has proven that third-person shooters can work fantastically well on consoles. Mass Effect 2 follows the GoW's big example and is also excellent on consoles.

In my opinion:

FPS belong on PC.

TPS belong on consoles.

There's no functional difference.  The ability to aim precisely in a TPS and an FPS are the same skill; I don't even SEE Shepard when I'm playing, as I'm concentrating on the aiming point.

I guess controllers just work for some people, but if Mass Effect had never been released on PC, I literally would've never played it.  Trying to play a shooter, any shooter, with a controller is so craptastic that I can't enjoy the game.  This is why I never really played Halo.  The PC port of Halo 2 was craptastic, as the controls didn't port over well.

[charmingcharlie]

Daiyus wrote... Seriously, there's no losers in this if both are included. Everyone plays how they want. I hate using the term, but some attitudes towards anything console related around here seem to border on PC Elitism sometimes.

Yes there are losers and it is usually the keyboard and mouse users that lose out just so they can put in joypad control.  As I have said before it is a hell of a lot easier to use a mouse and keyboard in a joypad interface than it is to use a joypad in a mouse and keyboard interface.  So usually devs just cater for the joypad user and let mouse and keyboard users slum it.

I notice you roll out the old "PC Elitism" crap, if it is elitist to want developers to cater for only the native control scheme of the PC platform (just like they do for the consoles) then fine I am a damn PC Elitist and proud of it. It seems some on here just want to play the console version of ME 3 on the PC.  I don't if I want to play the console version with joypad support then shock, horror I will buy a console and play that version.

Captain Crash wrote...
It seems perfectly feasible as an option and some people are putting up very strong barriers, mostly illogically I think.  Just because you prefer a controller doesnt mean anything and saying things like "ditch your £800 gaming PC and buy a console instead" is just damn right silly.

Not as silly as gaming on a platform that doesn't natively support your preferred control system.  The control system is integral to the game and enjoyment of that game.  If you do not like the mouse and keyboard control scheme then what the hell are you doing playing games on a PC ?

Captain Crash wrote... No one wants to take away from the mose/keyboard experience.  Thats obviously top priority as I said.  But having an option to use a different interface would be great!

It doesn't matter if you don't want it to "take away from the mouse and keyboard experience" it WILL because that is the only economic way to include both joypad and mouse/keyboard control.  It isn't just a case of turning on joypad support the whole game has to be designed and balanced to support the joypad.  Now no company is going to do that for both joypads and mouse/keyboard so inevitably the mouse and keyboard users lose out.

Luc0s wrote...
Clearly you have never played Gears of War. GoW is far superior on Xbox360 compared to the PC port.

Yeah clearly you are wrong there, nearly all reviews and comments state that the PC version of Gears of War was a lot better than the console version. 

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 20 juillet 2011 - 07:16 .

[Nab20]

Aim in Gears Of War ? AH AH I'm sure a PC player would kick everyone's ass in multiplayer with his ability to aim more precisely ! AH AH

Yeah clearly you are wrong there, nearly all reviews and comments state that the PC version of Gears of War was a lot better than the console version.

You should play the game instead of reading fanboys reviews who never touched a controller in there life...

Modifié par Nab20, 20 juillet 2011 - 07:49 .

[sEsHo]

We all beat Mass Effect 2 on Insanity with a controler , so there's no problem ...

[charmingcharlie]

Nab20 wrote...

You should play the game instead of reading fanboys reviews who never touched a controller in there life...

I have played both the PC and 360 version (I briefly owned a console for a while but could never adapt to the joypad) and the PC version is miles better than the Xbox version.  It certainly felt a hell of a lot better with a mouse and keyboard than it every did with a joypad.

If you don't believe how radically different the two control schemes are then at least make an effort to read and understand this :-

http://www.penny-arcade.com/2011/1/24/

That is an article from a developer explaining some of the difficulties and differences between the two control methods.  A game properly done for the mouse and keyboard with proper balancing for the mouse and keyboard will be next to unplayable on a joypad.

sEsHo wrote...
We all beat Mass Effect 2 on Insanity with a controler , so there's no problem ...

If that is the case then in my books Bioware failed with the control scheme in the PC version then.  A game properly designed and balanced for the mouse and keyboard would be virtually unplayable with a joypad.

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 20 juillet 2011 - 08:55 .

[Gavinthelocust]

It's really about what you're used to, I personally think that the mouse/keyboard is the worst thing right above the Wii to play a shooter/action game on. This is because I grew up playing these kind of games on consoles and my hands have adapted to it's strange formation, I can't help it that's just how things work. Opinion and different experience is what makes a game better on one platform and worse on the other.

That said some games are optimized for a certain style but that shouldn't get too much in the way of playing ME3. If you finished ME2 on PC so I'm sure you'll have no problem adapting to the slightly more fast paced nature. Just as long as it's not the Wii I'm sure you can find a comfortable way to enjoy a game.

[Malanek]

Daiyus wrote...

I can't believe there's so much negativity towards an option. You know, one of those things you can choose to use or not. Now I'll admit, I do prefer a joypad. That being said, some games on PS3 support Mouse and Keyboard setups (Unreal Tournament 3 for example) and that's great. People can play how they like. I know of a few PC games that come with native Controller support as well (Fallout 3 is the first to come to mind).

Did those games have odd UI problems? Sure. But I've yet to play a game on any platform where the UI and controls are perfect. Therefore offering an alternative input device is fairly sensible (especially as EA are known to try and branch out).

I honestly don't think that adding joypad support will hurt the M+K UI. As people have mentioned, it was vaguely in ME2 already (required some .ini modification though). If I were BioWare I'd get the M+K running well, then use the console template and add that too.

Seriously, there's no losers in this if both are included. Everyone plays how they want. I hate using the term, but some attitudes towards anything console related around here seem to border on PC Elitism sometimes.

Whether there are losers depends on how much effort is required from Biowares part. There are already generic third party options for this and I really don't see it being particularly popular. Thus, if it was even a moderate amount of work from Bioware, it would be an expenditure of resources that would diminish another, much more important area, for more people.

[ryoldschool]

@charmingcharlie, chill a bit. The squad commands are better on PC than consoles in ME2, and that is why some console players ( like me ) would like to play the PC version. But if you are used to the console controls, wasd is hard to get used to. Your statements that PC is better in every respect is your bias. The visuals are the same ( I have both PC and xbox versions of ME2 ) and hooked them to the same Hi def TV @1080p. At this point I don't want them to spend any time on controller support for PC because I'd rather they just make the game as good as possible without adding more features to support.

[termokanden]

If you claim shooters don't won't properly on consoles, you really don't know what you're talking about. I don't even have to be amazing at it myself. I've seen what better players can do with a controller.

That said, I'm a PC gamer. I learned to play with a mouse and keyboard. I'm looking forward to playing ME3 that way. If they come up with better controls for consoles (more ability bindings are sorely needed), then maybe it could make sense to hook up a controller to your PC. But I really doubt it will be better than mouse and keyboard.

ryoldschool wrote...

@charmingcharlie, chill a bit. The squad commands are better on PC than consoles in ME2, and that is why some console players ( like me ) would like to play the PC version. But if you are used to the console controls, wasd is hard to get used to. Your statements that PC is better in every respect is your bias. The visuals are the same ( I have both PC and xbox versions of ME2 ) and hooked them to the same Hi def TV @1080p. At this point I don't want them to spend any time on controller support for PC because I'd rather they just make the game as good as possible without adding more features to support.

The visuals aren't the same. You can hook the two versions up to the same 1080p TV, but the 360 version is actually only running it in 720p.

Modifié par termokanden, 20 juillet 2011 - 09:54 .

[sEsHo]

charmingcharlie wrote...

sEsHo wrote...
We all beat Mass Effect 2 on Insanity with a controler , so there's no problem ...

If that is the case then in my books Bioware failed with the control scheme in the PC version then.  A game properly designed and balanced for the mouse and keyboard would be virtually unplayable with a joypad.

You master the controller in time  ... add to that that I was a Vanguard .

And if that's the case then everybody out there have failed because I'm sure there are people who beat Call of Duty on veteran with a controller .

[TheLostGenius]

I played ME2 on 360 with a controller. Played ME2 on PC with keyboard and mouse. They both work fine. Any game that allows for a radial pause could have the worst controls and it would still play well.

[termokanden]

TheLostGenius wrote...

I played ME2 on 360 with a controller. Played ME2 on PC with keyboard and mouse. They both work fine. Any game that allows for a radial pause could have the worst controls and it would still play well.

But I would argue that there are unused buttons that should be available for keybindings. Sure they're used for other things, such as viewing the map (which everyone does while engaging in CQC).

[young fox]

Mouse/keyboard is way better for shooters than a controller. I don't mind if people prefer playing with a controller, at all, but it should be obvious to anyone that mouse/keyboard offers more flexibility and precision.

[charmingcharlie]

ryoldschool wrote...   Your statements that PC is better in every respect is your bias. The visuals are the same ( I have both PC and xbox versions of ME2 ) and hooked them to the same Hi def TV @1080p. At this point I don't want them to spend any time on controller support for PC because I'd rather they just make the game as good as possible without adding more features to support.

Perhaps you could point to a single statement I have made in this topic that even remotely says "the PC is better in every respect".  I suggest you read my comments more clearly next time before assuming I am trying to "laud" it over consoles.  I prefer the PC's native control scheme which is the mouse and keyboard.  I do not state that it is better than a joypad I said I PREFER IT.  As such if I wish to play Mass Effect with joypad controls there is an option open to me and that is buy the console version.

Oh and it has been shown that the PC version does have improved visuals but that has nothing to do with the topic.

sEsHo wrote... And if that's the case then everybody out there have failed because I'm sure there are people who beat Call of Duty on veteran with a controller .

Yes there are a great  many companies out that that fail to implement the mouse and keyboard properly into their games and yes the developer/s behind COD are some of the main culprits.  Their games are never balanced and designed for mouse and keyboard control.  They are balanced and designed for joypad control because it is quick and easy for them to do that and mouse and keyboard users can just slum it as perusual.  Just because other companies do it doesn't mean I want Bioware to do it.

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 20 juillet 2011 - 10:50 .

[They call me a SpaceCowboy]

I'm not sure if everyone got what I was talking about in my OP. There was a recent article where some reviewer had tried ME3, maybe at E3?

I wish I could find the article but lost to the ether now.

Anyway, to be honest I've only tried controller s a few times and hated them. Mouse and keboard for me. heh. I was just concerned with the suggestion in the article that even the PC version was being made with a controller in mind.

[ryoldschool]

charmingcharlie wrote...

Nab20 wrote...

You should play the game instead of reading fanboys reviews who never touched a controller in there life...

I have played both the PC and 360 version (I briefly owned a console for a while but could never adapt to the joypad) and the PC version is miles better than the Xbox version.  It certainly felt a hell of a lot better with a mouse and keyboard than it every did with a joypad.

If you don't believe how radically different the two control schemes are then at least make an effort to read and understand this :-

http://www.penny-arcade.com/2011/1/24/

That is an article from a developer explaining some of the difficulties and differences between the two control methods.  A game properly done for the mouse and keyboard with proper balancing for the mouse and keyboard will be next to unplayable on a joypad.

sEsHo wrote...
We all beat Mass Effect 2 on Insanity with a controler , so there's no problem ...

If that is the case then in my books Bioware failed with the control scheme in the PC version then.  A game properly designed and balanced for the mouse and keyboard would be virtually unplayable with a joypad.

Charmingcharlie: "Perhaps you could point to a single statement I have made in this topic that even remotely says "the PC is better in every respect". I suggest you read my comments more clearly next time before assuming I am trying to "laud" it over consoles."

Charlie: I bolded the part where I got that idea.  chill.

Modifié par ryoldschool, 20 juillet 2011 - 11:34 .

[charmingcharlie]

Shinian2 wrote...

I'm not sure if everyone got what I was talking about in my OP. There was a recent article where some reviewer had tried ME3, maybe at E3?

The only version that has been shown to the press is the Xbox 360 version (it was the Xbox 360 version at E3).  I believe Bioware has said nothing or shown anything of the PC version other than commenting on what the PC requirements might be.

ryoldschool wrote...  Charlie: I bolded the part where I got that idea.  chill

Yes Gears of War was better on the PC it should've been it was released nearly a year later.  That is not "lauding" it over console users it is stating a damn basic fact.  If you don't believe me that Gears of War was better on the PC
then how about you check out a few reviews of the PC version where they all say "The PC version is better".

However just because I said that GeOW was better on the PC is hardly me saying " "the PC is better in every respect".  The main reason GeOW was better was down to the extra dev time, extra included content, enhanced graphics and a better framerate.  It was also MY PERSONAL opinion that the game benefited greatly from the mouse and keyboard control but that is down to the fact I like the mouse and keyboard.

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 20 juillet 2011 - 11:43 .

[Captain Crash]

charmingcharlie wrote...

I have played both the PC and 360 version (I briefly owned a console for a while but could never adapt to the joypad) and the PC version is miles better than the Xbox version.  It certainly felt a hell of a lot better with a mouse and keyboard than it every did with a joypad.

ahhhh so this is why you hate the concept so much.   You didnt like your controller experience and never adapted to it. Therefore the mouse and keyboard is superior and the controller should be kept well away from PC because you will never use it...


Hold on a moment, its still not stopping people who did have a good experience asking for the option is it.

Modifié par Captain Crash, 20 juillet 2011 - 11:53 .