539 réponses à ce sujet

[dragonfire100]

Auroras wrote...

 Hey guys, I'm not trying to troll, I honestly would like to know: why do people hate Hawke so much? S/he's not that bad of a character. I actually enjoyed playing as her. 

Could I get some non-flamey, non-troll-y opinions, please?

I really dont know so many people say he/she is a mid evil version of serperd which is not true.

[Thor Rand Al]

Persephone wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

xkg wrote...
snip

Hawk does nothing but stand around and do nothing. Yes or no?

No.

NO

[Persephone]

Alistairlover94 wrote...

LilyasAvalon wrote...

Hawke literally had no... purpose. No personality. S/he literally did nothing, they were in the right places at the right times but they certainly didn't 'rise' to power as the adverts so humorously suggest. We were built up to believe that Hawke's journey would be one rivaling Shepard's and the Warden's, nothing of such happened.

Shepard is on a mission to gather data and support for the defeat of the Reapers. The Warden gathered a makeshift army and stopped a Blight the same year it began.

...Hawke killed a crazy man and lady because of something Anders did.

...That's not as impressive in my eyes.

^That. The plot wouldn't have changed without Hawke, save for one quest which involves blood magic. That's about it. Someone else could've escorted Varric and Bartrand into the Deep Roads. Someone else could've handled The Arishok. Someone else could've defended Javaris from the spiders. Hawke isn't relevant to the larger scheme of things. Morrigan needed a Warden to do THAT(just to avoid spoilers).

Same thing can be said about the Warden.

Darkspawn Chronicles shows that rather nicely. If not for player-directed clownspawn, Alistair would have managed just fine.

[Addai]

dragonfire100 wrote...

Auroras wrote...

 Hey guys, I'm not trying to troll, I honestly would like to know: why do people hate Hawke so much? S/he's not that bad of a character. I actually enjoyed playing as her. 

Could I get some non-flamey, non-troll-y opinions, please?

I really dont know so many people say he/she is a mid evil version of serperd which is not true.

*scratches head*  I think you mean to say "medieval version of Shepard," yes?

Shepard is a dull character, but at least accomplishes something.  I don't care about Shepard, either, but don't feel the active distaste I do for Hawke.

[dragonfire100]

Addai67 wrote...

dragonfire100 wrote...

Auroras wrote...

 Hey guys, I'm not trying to troll, I honestly would like to know: why do people hate Hawke so much? S/he's not that bad of a character. I actually enjoyed playing as her. 

Could I get some non-flamey, non-troll-y opinions, please?

I really dont know so many people say he/she is a mid evil version of serperd which is not true.

*scratches head*  I think you mean to say "medieval version of Shepard," yes?

Shepard is a dull character, but at least accomplishes something.  I don't care about Shepard, either, but don't feel the active distaste I do for Hawke.

Well i dont feel that way to the warden reason why cuz he/she does not talk.

[Thor Rand Al]

Ok so seriously, what is it about Hawke that you guys don't like? 

1)They aren't our Wardens, big deal.  After playing DA2 I'm happy with my Wardens story.

2)Some didn't get the happily ever after that they wanted, not every game/story has a happy ending.

3)We didn't get more Morrigan in DA2, well whoever said her story wasn't finished.  She doesn't need to be in EVERY DA game but I don't think the devs are done with her.

Hawke has a VO which is a heck of a lot better then NO VO.  Really can't go back to DAO with a PC that has no VO after playing DA2.  Hawke has more emotion then the Warden ever did and it shows on face and voice.  You are litereally creating Hawke from scratch, you give Hawke a look, a personality, you build Hawke to your fightin specifications.  Their not already built and handed to you.  I love how you are in control of their personality, you can make them how you want them. 
I seriously would not want to go bk to a lifeless dull boring pc like DAO.  I love my Warden but that was yesterday, time to move on and embrass new stories, new characters.  I absolutely  Hawke and I love how I'm in control of how their built.  I HAVE THE CONTROL, it's not already prebuilt for me.   But this is my opinion, whether you guys agree or not  is up to you but for me, as far as character build I don't want a DAO pc, I want DA2 styled PC.

[TEWR]

Hawke had no drive, no purpose. And he just stumbled into being a Champion. I realize it's not something he could've planned to acquire, but he could've made an actual Rise to Power that would've made his being named Champion likable.

Add into that the very sloppy story of the Mage-Templar conflict they told in DA2 and people like Hawke even less.

Then there's the three year gaps and for some reaason the cut dialogue where Varric says to Cassandra that Hawke did actually do something during those gaps.

All in all, DA2 and Hawke are mediocre. DA2 is indeed enjoyable. I don't deny that. But it didn't live up to its potential.

[Ryzaki]

BanksHector wrote...

I dislike Hawke because one of my companions is more important to the story then I am.

This.   


And Hawke could only wish he/she was a medieval version of Shepard. Shepard maybe ranting about the end of the world but he/she is just more interesting. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 03 août 2011 - 01:50 .

[DarkDragon777]

Hawke's "personality" is what threw me off. He/she is basically a pawn, anyway.

[Thor Rand Al]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Hawke had no drive, no purpose. And he just stumbled into being a Champion. I realize it's not something he could've planned to acquire, but he could've made an actual Rise to Power that would've made his being named Champion likable.

Add into that the very sloppy story of the Mage-Templar conflict they told in DA2 and people like Hawke even less.

Then there's the three year gaps and for some reaason the cut dialogue where Varric says to Cassandra that Hawke did actually do something during those gaps.

All in all, DA2 and Hawke are mediocre. DA2 is indeed enjoyable. I don't deny that. But it didn't live up to its potential.

There are flaws with DA2, Bioware has said they know this, they even gave us a DANG excellent Legacy DLC which they took the time to hear what people said and improved on in the DLC.  They have even said that there's some things in DA2 that they'll never do again.
Yes I admit there are gaps, I would love to know what happened inbetween those yrs, but I also see those "gaps" as fillers for future DLC's.  Sometimes things like this have gaps for a reason n hopefully Bioware has one lol

But as far as purpose, it's how you rp Hawke that gives purpose.  I'm glad I don't have an already pregenerated character with their story already lined out in front of them.  You make Hawke your own story.  I see a lot of people saying how Hawke had no purpose or life, Hawke has those but it's you the player that has to give it in how you rp them.  I don't dislike havin a story already mapped out in front of me but I most definitely love the idea of having to make my own story and that's what you got to do with DA2.  You become Hawke so to speak and I think that's where a lot of frustration comes in, DA2 has to be rp'd a different way then DAO.  DA2 makes you think where DAO is basically already set. 

[TEWR]

Thor Rand Al wrote...


There are flaws with DA2, Bioware has said they know this, they even gave us a DANG excellent Legacy DLC which they took the time to hear what people said and improved on in the DLC.  They have even said that there's some things in DA2 that they'll never do again.

Yes I admit there are gaps, I would love to know what happened inbetween those yrs, but I also see those "gaps" as fillers for future DLC's.  Sometimes things like this have gaps for a reason n hopefully Bioware has one lol

Yes I know Legacy is amazing. I agree. It's what DA2 could've been. The flaws though in the year skipping are not inherently wrong, even for a video game. And frankly, I too think the gaps will be filled with DLC. My only issue is that they cut out the damn Varric dialogue where he says to Cassandra regarding the gaps "Well Seeker, that's another story." or something to that effect.

My question to Bioware is.... "Why cut that?!?!"

But as far as purpose, it's how you rp Hawke that gives purpose.  I'm glad I don't have an already pregenerated character with their story already lined out in front of them.  You make Hawke your own story.  I see a lot of people saying how Hawke had no purpose or life, Hawke has those but it's you the player that has to give it in how you rp them.  I don't dislike havin a story already mapped out in front of me but I most definitely love the idea of having to make my own story and that's what you got to do with DA2.  You become Hawke so to speak and I think that's where a lot of frustration comes in, DA2 has to be rp'd a different way then DAO.  DA2 makes you think where DAO is basically already set. 

I'll have to get back to you on this one. I'm really tired right now and I can barely think straight. I have a vague idea of what I want to say, but I can't really phrase it properly. 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Thor Rand Al wrote...
But as far as purpose, it's how you rp Hawke that gives purpose.

Not at all, because the game provides us with no option to fullfill the purpose that we supposdely can rp, especially seeing how there is only one way to play it. The only purpose I can see Hawke doing is enjoying life, taking care of family and friends, and being as little involved as possible in the larger scheme of things until they start knocking his door disturbing him from his meal when it's already too late. And the extent of his contribution is solely constant massacre.  That's it.

Any other purpose is not supported by the game, thus rping it is an illusion.

[TEWR]

It would've been nice to RP Hawke in different ways in regards to purpose.


Free Mages by becoming leader of the Mage Underground, crush the Underground secretly or blatantly because you think Rogue Mages are a threat, work on your political connections and savvy so you can better Kirkwall, etc.

All Hawke did get to do is what you said KoP. He's pretty much Prince Stabbity

[Thor Rand Al]

Hey I Prince stabbity stab Hawke

But this playthrough I've rp'd it to where I kill any Templer that I can (which btw is quite a few throughout the game lol), no I'm not a mage but my sis is but she's with the Wardens so anything that I do that might come bk on her I'm not worried about because she is safe.  Now if she was in the Circle then I'd be more cautious.  But I'm rpin it to where Meredith is slowly losing her Templers group by group and eventually she's goin to wonder wtf is goin on lol.  Yes I'm promage in act 3 cause I just get off on telling that psyco lunny where she can shove it bascially, lol. 

Carver on the other hand, he joins the Templers for personal vindictive reasons, and mage Hawke who's promage from the begiinin is furious but won't bk down.  It's all about how you rp it in your head and with DA2 it gives you more freedom to do so.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Thor Rand Al wrote...
It's all about how you rp it in your head and with DA2 it gives you more freedom to do so.

It certainly gives me no freedom at all to RP it how I'd want to. Not even close to giving me that freedom. In fact it does the opposite. It slaps me in the face and outright tells me that my rping is utterly rejected. It doesn't even give me the freedom to play what I'd see as an intelligent and competent character.

So you'll forgive me if I am not interested in RPing things that do not interest me in my head, to give myself the illusion that the game plays any differently.

[Teddie Sage]

I love my sarcastic Hawke and can see myself playing him on my Mages supporter, Anders LI DA3 file. I played this on The Martyr's default scenario and I was satisfied with Hawke. I want to see more of him and his companions. I hope DA3 will have most of them back. If DAs are going to be more like Mass Effects, that's the way it should be.

Modifié par Teddie Sage, 03 août 2011 - 02:37 .

[Thor Rand Al]

Lmao, heya KoP, nice of u to stop by   was wonderin how long it take u lol.  Anyways u n I have had this discussion on other places lol, n we both agree to disagree .    You're one that I do enjoy a good debate with but this one we've had before lol.  So we'll leave it at that

[lady constance]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

Ok so seriously, what is it about Hawke that you guys don't like? 

1)They aren't our Wardens, big deal.  After playing DA2 I'm happy with my Wardens story.

2)Some didn't get the happily ever after that they wanted, not every game/story has a happy ending.

3)We didn't get more Morrigan in DA2, well whoever said her story wasn't finished.  She doesn't need to be in EVERY DA game but I don't think the devs are done with her.

Hawke has a VO which is a heck of a lot better then NO VO.  Really can't go back to DAO with a PC that has no VO after playing DA2.  Hawke has more emotion then the Warden ever did and it shows on face and voice.  You are litereally creating Hawke from scratch, you give Hawke a look, a personality, you build Hawke to your fightin specifications.  Their not already built and handed to you.  I love how you are in control of their personality, you can make them how you want them. 
I seriously would not want to go bk to a lifeless dull boring pc like DAO.  I love my Warden but that was yesterday, time to move on and embrass new stories, new characters.  I absolutely  Hawke and I love how I'm in control of how their built.  I HAVE THE CONTROL, it's not already prebuilt for me.   But this is my opinion, whether you guys agree or not  is up to you but for me, as far as character build I don't want a DAO pc, I want DA2 styled PC.

Most of your points had nothing to do with Hawke, but with Dragon Age 2 in general.  To answer your original question, I didn't like Hawke because I found him/her dull. It's as simple as that. Some didn't, and good for them, but a large number of players did.

Hawke is also more "built and handed to [us]" than the Warden is, so I fail to see your point here. The Warden can be customized; you can choose the Warden's race and story, whereas Hawke can only be human and there is only ONE story. By having a silent PC, you can also choose his/her voice, but you're forced to listen to some crappy VA in DA2 (at least I thought they sucked). I can get onboard with a voiced PC if done correctly, however - I love Shepard

[Thor Rand Al]

@ Lady constance
See I've never played ME so as far as Sheppard I have no clue. But ok I see as far as race where that be fubared for some. I've always choosen human cause thats what I prefer but I do understand where other's would want a diff race, understandable.

As far as VO, I absolutely love male Hawke's voice but I have issues with fem, but it's not enough for me to sit here n say I hate Hawke. N I don't see how Hawke is more prebuilt then the Warden, explain please so I can understand. With Hawke you give them personality with the dif snarky, diplomatic n aggressive responses n thats a BIG win for me there, which you couldn't in Origins, tech that's about the only difference now that I think about it besides race. Hawke has personality and a voice, big step up from Origins. But I do understand the race issue. N tech there are 2 stories, promage and Templer. But again it's the story you make for them that gives them life.

[Davasar]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

I seriously would not want to go bk to a lifeless dull boring pc like DAO.  I love my Warden but that was yesterday, time to move on and embrass new stories, new characters.  I absolutely  Hawke and I love how I'm in control of how their built.  I HAVE THE CONTROL, it's not already prebuilt for me.   But this is my opinion, whether you guys agree or not  is up to you but for me, as far as character build I don't want a DAO pc, I want DA2 styled PC.

You must really hate reading books where characters with no VO that are apparently full of 'lifeless dull boring' folks 

Control?  With Hawke?

*Laughs for about 5 minutes*

You are guided by the nose on the story with Hawke. That's it.  There isnt even a modicum of choice (while there is at least a little in DAO).

Rogues use daggers and bows, nothing else.  That's not control.

Warriors cannot two weapon wield.  That's not control.

DOA was not prebuilt either with their classes and you had MUCH more choice regarding abilities.

But you are entitled to your opinion, as opinions do not have to be based on fact after all

[FieryDove]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

There are flaws with DA2, Bioware has said they know this, they even gave us a DANG excellent Legacy DLC which they took the time to hear what people said and improved on in the DLC.  They have even said that there's some things in DA2 that they'll never do again. 

They haven't said what things they thought were flaws and I don't recall them saying that "they won't do it again." Just vague recycled areas was a risk type comments. (I could have missed some of course).

Also the story of legacy was already written some time ago before damage control kicked in.

I was dissappointed with Hawke due to the fact he/she was not more powerful/important/awesome than the warden which was partly my fault for reading anything before the game sold. But it wasn't just marketing hype it was everywhere, the Dr.'s and other interviews stated such. *Rise to Power* and the ground shakes. Um, no.

If my Hawke was squashed by an ogre at the start I fully expect the game world would have continued almost exactly the same. The spotlight went to...some of the companions, they made things happen.

Even so I don't hate Hawke. I am...meh.

[J.C. Blade]

My great dislike for Hawke doesn’t come solely from being forced to play human and voiced character, or that the game shows how powerless she is in the events to come. But it comes from the fact that I am seemingly forced to accept that Hawke is a genuinely stupid person with no semblance of observation of situations surrounding her despite them being so incredibly obvious. And if the details of the plot is made obvious for the sake of the player then it must be obvious to Hawke as well since we are looking at the world through her/his eyes.

And finally, the moment Hawke opened her mouth and started “bantering” with party members without my input and saying most ludicrous things I’d never even dream for Hawke I’ve been trying to roleplay the entire game would say, I shut down the game and went to get some coffee.

I can swallow the voice thing, it’ll cause severe stomach pains but I can swallow it, but that dominant personality thing and “I-will-speak-when-I-want-to-and-not-when-you-tell-me-to” Hawke need to go.

[Thor Rand Al]

Davasar wrote...

Thor Rand Al wrote...

I seriously would not want to go bk to a lifeless dull boring pc like DAO.  I love my Warden but that was yesterday, time to move on and embrass new stories, new characters.  I absolutely  Hawke and I love how I'm in control of how their built.  I HAVE THE CONTROL, it's not already prebuilt for me.   But this is my opinion, whether you guys agree or not  is up to you but for me, as far as character build I don't want a DAO pc, I want DA2 styled PC.

You must really hate reading books where characters with no VO that are apparently full of 'lifeless dull boring' folks 

Control?  With Hawke?

*Laughs for about 5 minutes*

You are guided by the nose on the story with Hawke. That's it.  There isnt even a modicum of choice (while there is at least a little in DAO).

Rogues use daggers and bows, nothing else.  That's not control.

Warriors cannot two weapon wield.  That's not control.

DOA was not prebuilt either with their classes and you had MUCH more choice regarding abilities.

But you are entitled to your opinion, as opinions do not have to be based on fact after all

 That's it, u didn't like that they took dw out for warriors, n that rogues only get daggers n bows, hmmm. OK.  Ya know I had issue's with the no dw warriors myself n that I couldn't use bow n arrow for my warrior.  I moaned and complained about that too but you know what?  I started actually PLAYING DA2 and found out I don't care that my warrior can't dw, or even use a bow.  Big deal, I've actually come to love two-handed.  But my biggest preference which I didn't like in Origins was a mage. I have had so much fun playing a mage that it's hard to go bk to a warrior.  But bottom line is, I gave the game a chance even though I swore I wouldn't like it because they took my favorite fighting style out of DA2, now I wouldn't care if they did put them bk in.  I actually like how they've set it up.  But  you seem to be sayin I'm not using facts.  Well facts are not everything stays the same, games actually evolve and facts are DA2 despite the flaws is going in a direction that a lot of people do like.  Not everyone which is evident in the forums but there are some who actually SURPRISE  like DA2.

[Elywyn]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

As far as VO, I absolutely love male Hawke's voice but I have issues with fem, but it's not enough for me to sit here n say I hate Hawke. N I don't see how Hawke is more prebuilt then the Warden, explain please so I can understand. With Hawke you give them personality with the dif snarky, diplomatic n aggressive responses n thats a BIG win for me there, which you couldn't in Origins, tech that's about the only difference now that I think about it besides race. Hawke has personality and a voice, big step up from Origins. But I do understand the race issue. N tech there are 2 stories, promage and Templer. But again it's the story you make for them that gives them life.

Yes, I agree with you about Hawke's personality. Only Player can give a PC personality. You can be evil person only think about yourself and your purse or You can be good person you always help others without wait for reward.

But(). I can't agree with you one way. You can't give Hawke "purpose", -a big one of course-. For Warden This was end the blight. And warden when started to think about how they can end the blight. He was nothing but a Warden. He had no experience, had no ally, no friends. And even He was traitor for people of Ferelden. But He tried to do something, anyway. And "this" is a purpose. Besides You can give personality much more effective to Warden. Because he have to do so much work than Hawke.

Let's get back to the Hawke . I say he just a survivor. Why?. Ok, he ran away to Kirkwall to protect his family. If I were Hawke I do exactly the same. Because he is nothing but a brother and a son. But, Despite spending so much years, He did nothing at Kirkwall. He still just took care of his family and did nothing. So he had no purpose. He saved Kirkwall because he was there. when a fighting(Mage-Templar) happening at Gallows. They call Champion, so he goes there. Except that he is just sitting on his chair. He became Champion Because Meredith came late. He sided with mages/templars Because "Anders" blew up the Chantry. He sided because he was just there. So don't tell me Hawke has a purpose or We can give Hawke a purpose. That's impossible.

Ok, You can say Hawke a Leader. But If Warden is a General than Hawke is a Captain. Warden made friends. Hawke made friends. But Warden also made Allies who Hate each others.

And for that I'm wanting back my Warden. Again I don't hate Hawke. But Because of Warden's story, purpose and Love (Morrigan) I have much more deep connection than I have with Hawke.

Modifié par Elywyn, 03 août 2011 - 09:53 .

[Jestina]

Hawke is like a sound you make when you are about to throw up.