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Who do you kill in the Suicide Mission?


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#1
Quething

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Orchestrating a particular Suicide Mission outcome has become something of a science around here, I know a lot of us do it, for varying reasons -- dislike of certain characters, a desire to make the whole "we're all gonna die" driving theme of the game slightly less of a joke, an interest in testing certain outcomes in ME3, whatever -- so I want to know who you guys target, how, and why?

Me, for example, on my charismatic, strongly paragon main!Shep, I like to strip Zaeed's loyalty at the last minute with Gibbed, and send him back to the ship with Chakwas. I really like the story there, the idea that his loyalty to a paragon Shepard has finally taught him to respect self-sacrifice and that a man whose whole life has been one long string of being the only one to make it out alive finally met his end by saving everyone else.

On my broken, Cerberus-loathing, clan-oriented Sole Survivor Shep, I killed Miranda, because I kind of like kicking that Shepard in the teeth, and having Miranda shatter her whole worldview by turning on the Illusive Man in favor of the team, and then five minutes later making her yet one more clanmate she couldn't save, was exactly the kind of tragedy that defines that playthrough for me.

On my Colonist/Sole Survivor "walking death" Shepard, I kill Samara, Mordin, Thane and Zaeed, because lots of people dying around him is his thing, but he's pretty well-balanced and philosophical about it, so it seemed appropriate that the ones he lost would be the ones most at peace with the idea of their own deaths, and therefore the ones he'd be most able to continue to be philosophical about.

And... okay, my very second playthrough I sent Jacob through the vents out of sheer frustration with the Chinese water torture of trying to befriend him as a femShep. I'm sorry Jacob :crying:

#2
Avilia

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Odd you should mention Miranda - she's the only squad mate I've deliberately killed off. Usually I'm Ms Careful about keeping everyone alive.

Also oddly my reaction was pretty much what you describe, right up until that moment when she tells TiM to shove it, I really didn't like her. Her death was sad but as you say it did the give the mission more meaning.

She's now part of my canon save and I'm keen to see what happens in ME3 without her.

I'm starting a new play though now - full renegade from ME1 - never tried that before. Might see how many others that affects in the final run in ME2.

Modifié par Avilia, 21 juillet 2011 - 10:36 .


#3
Guest_Aotearas_*

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Lot's of Collectors.

Other than that, I have one dead Tali, one dead Miranda and am most probably trying to get one Garrus dead, though that might be hard. Just to see how that plays out in ME3.

#4
sgt0pimienta

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Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

Lot's of Collectors.

Other than that, I have one dead Tali, one dead Miranda and am most probably trying to get one Garrus dead, though that might be hard. Just to see how that plays out in ME3.


YOU IDIOT you don't deserve ME 3,WHY TALI!?
nOOohohoh! i have a romance with her!
:(

well back on topic,Zaeed and Mordin (DOUH ! now i have no scientist to upgrade myself!) were the ones that died,Mordin was killed by the collectors holding the door and zaeed had a huge chunk of metal fall on him on the final boss.

im still thinking,how can you kill someone deliberately on that mission,i made my choices very well so that noone would die,i always kept garrus as the fire team leader because he's been there scince ME 1,he is strong and is a really good person in the inside despite that he sometimes is really dark,also i have always trusted him,scince the beggining,and til the end!

i sent legion through the vents because of three things:

he is a robot with a networked inteligence to all the geth,he doesn't make mistakes so easily
his armor and circuits are resisitant,not organic meat
he is,after all a super tech specialist,i was sure he would make it.

I took Samara to make the anti swarm shield as she was the strongest biotics,even if miranda is "perfect",Samara is still a Justicar.

I kept Taali on my squad half the mission because i didn't want her to die,then i switched her for Zaeed for heavier fire and guess what,HE DIED! D: Tali you almost didn't make it.

Actually it was quite...sentimental and philosophical,a good story...the great hunter goes to hte batlle,from wich he will never return,his last job...R.I.P Zaeed,the greatest merc of the galaxy.

That ****er gave his life doing the only "right" thing he ever did....

by the way,did you blow the station or kept it?

Modifié par sgt0pimienta, 22 juillet 2011 - 12:54 .


#5
Humanoid_Typhoon

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I kill jacob every time. It's not as simple as "He isn't interesting" he sort of puts of this illusion of being enigmatic or like he has a back story or he has no baggage,I have no problem with the simple "grunt" (not the krogan) character type,a simple " isn't anything to know I just shoot things." kind of guy,but he is standoffish,questions every person I bring onto MY ship,and his acting is terribad,he puts up walls to guard nothing and that just makes a box,which is what he is, I liked him for 15 minutes until the first time I talked to him on the ship and all the sudden him and Miranda switch personalities.
I feel like the punisher when I romance Miranda and kill jacobs dad and then him, I killed your dad,I stole your woman,and now...now I've killed you.


TL:DR I kill "The priiiize" because he has the gift of uselessness...and hes an empty box.

#6
Really Sad Panther

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I have killed Jacob, Samara and Thane, those are the three that irritate me the most. Jacob in the tubes. Samara as second team leader. And Thane during the long walk, that's what happens listening to Miranda.

I have had Grunt, Legion and Mordin die but those were during early run-through, before there was a guide to the SM. Grunt and Legion during the long walk, and Mordin at hold the line.

But I also have some Shepards were everyone survived.
So in ME3 I will have some variety, and see what will change depending on who lives.

#7
BentOrgy

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Guess I'm a freak, I love having all of my party members alive.

Bigger cast makes a more interesting story. Even if you don't like a character (Lord knows I can't stand Miranda and her constant arrogance.) they can still provide information, dialogue, and character reaction.

#8
Bourne Endeavor

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None of my canon Shepard files have any of the squad dead. This primarily due to the fact I prefer doing every loyalty mission and any attempts to kill a loyal character demonstrates a vast amount of shortsightedness on that particular Shepard. For instance, I cannot justify seriously choosing Miranda for the biotic bubble babe when I have two of the world's most powerful biotics at my disposal. Likewise for any other death sequence. Even Hold the Line to a certain extent since it seems far more logical to leave your heavy hitters to hold the position.

So unless I Gibbs away loyalty or am playing a Shepard who simply is not playing attention. My entire squad always makes it out in one piece. It does help I happen to fancy all of them in their own unique was, yes even Jacob, who seems more of a bro than Garrus at times. (OMG BLASPHEMER! Don't say you didn't think it. :P)

#9
Commander_Adept

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I've got 11 playthroughs of Mass Effect 2, and as of the last one, I've finally killed everyone at some point (Took me 11 to kill Garrus... Still hate that I did...)

Then again, I also am getting Mass 3 for my ps3 and pc, so I can take one or two of those away since I'm not playing it on my xbox anymore... Crap. That means I have to kill Jack again. I don't want to kill Jack, I love her the bestest... I just want to see all the ways that Mass 3 is different depending on who's dead and who's not.

Some of the times, I think that Shepard's "stupid" decisions aren't really that stupid in the first place. Zaeed, as a former leader of the Blue Suns, should be able to lead a team. Thane, who's very used to living inside of ventilation shafts (AS WE SAW IN HIS RECRUITMENT) should be able to successfully do the vents portion of the SM. Miranda, who always talks about being engineered to be perfect and a super-biotic, should be able to be the biotic bubble person (Though I absolutely loathe her and love that she fails at it). It also stands to reason that having the toughest people in your party with you against the Reaper is a logical assumption, and that there's safety in numbers as far as the hold the line portion. In addition, not everyone should be able to escort the crew back safely. While I can see it being a select few, some should be able to fail it (even if loyal). Mordin comes to mind. Not only are Salarians VERY squishy, but he's a scientist, not a warrior. You'd think that Grunt, Zaeed, Jacob, Garrus or Kasumi would make the best choices, as they seem to command respect and seem to be very tough (With Kasumi being a different case because I could see her invisibility power to be amazingly useful in helping the crew).


All of that being said, I absolutely love the Suicide Mission. It brings a certain something to the game that I've not seen anywhere else and I love it.

#10
Quething

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Normandy upgrades are a good place to skip out, too. If you simply never select the dialog options for the shields, armor or canon, then those options never existed in your game, any more than, say, the Jacob romance existed in your dudeShep game. It's not dumb of Shep to not take an option she doesn't have.

@Commander_Adept: I agree that the escort should have been a specialized choice as well. I'd have said Garrus, Mordin, Jacob and Samara would be the optimal choices, though. Mordin may be squishy, but it's not a stand-up fight, it's a firing retreat; the people who'll be good at that are the ones with a certain protective instinct, who can keep a small group hidden, lay traps, and find clever and unexpected exits, while keeping their charges calm. Sounds like Special Ops to me. And our first introduction to Mordin's prowess as a fighter is him protecting a bunch of people too wounded to protect themselves.

Grunt types would make it back to the ship fine themselves, but they're not liable to get the crew back with them. Grunt doesn't strike me as the type to be particularly good at keeping anyone else alive. Or even to pay attention to whether his allies still are.

Modifié par Quething, 23 juillet 2011 - 07:03 .


#11
Bourne Endeavor

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@Commander_Adept

Hence why I called it shortsightedness in lieu of stupidity, although you could make an argument for either. My qualm stems from why would not forgo the optimal choice? Thane may be good at sneaking through ducts but he lacks any tech potency, at least when held in comparison to Tali or Legion, who are in fact legendary at such a task. This is primarily why I have always thought Thane ought to be merged with Kasumi since he really is the only completely useless squadmate.

Moving on, while Miranda is quick to offer, choosing her when you have a Justicar and the strongest human biotic just seems silly. Her only saving grace is you believe her improved biotic capability is enough to rival Jack, which actually might have been a decent plot point. With the final confrontation, it stands to reason you would leave more of your heavy hitters behind to fortify your position since they are liable to take the brunt of the assault.

At the end of the day, your choices always seem to boil down to. "Yes, you can pick other people but there is obviously a clearly defined better one. So why not choose that person?" Personally I would have liked to see a little variety and challenge to the Suicide Mission. For example, a race against the clock, where you have to fit a specific route as the second fire team keeps the collectors at bay. The longer you take, the more your squad dies, which would help provide a sense of urgency.

That's just my opinion. No need go spreading it around. :P

#12
KotorEffect3

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I'm not one kill off people deliberatly but if I were then Miranda would be the one I kill off. Stuckup pro-cerberus b!tch

#13
eternalnightmare13

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Samara died taking the crew back. A noble death for that self righteous ****.

#14
thedekker

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sgt0pimienta wrote...

YOU IDIOT you don't deserve ME 3,WHY TALI!?
nOOohohoh! i have a romance with her!
:(



Because its an open choice game and we can do what we want. I deliberatly ****** her off on the loyalty mission, and kill her off every time. Useless if you ask me. I have never had her as a sqad mate on any of my 200 playthroughs. Different strokes for different folks

SHE doesnt deserve ME3.

#15
The h0bb1t

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In my first, and main, play-trough Garrus died bij getting a flame bomb in the head. He was the only one who died (except from Wrex in ME, who got killed on accident by Shelly), and i didn't reload any saves, because.. well... PEOPLE DIE >:D.
I did a re-run of ME and ME2 where everyone, except for Ashley survived.
And i'm doing one run where only Garrus and Tali survive. Which is quite hard...

#16
KotorEffect3

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thedekker wrote...

sgt0pimienta wrote...

YOU IDIOT you don't deserve ME 3,WHY TALI!?
nOOohohoh! i have a romance with her!
:(



Because its an open choice game and we can do what we want. I deliberatly ****** her off on the loyalty mission, and kill her off every time. Useless if you ask me. I have never had her as a sqad mate on any of my 200 playthroughs. Different strokes for different folks

SHE doesnt deserve ME3.



Even if you don't like her character I don't see how she is uselss,  she gets you the shield upgrade for the normandy and her drone is pretty handy when you take her into battle.

#17
Sebby

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I've never deliberately killed anybody in the SM but I'm considering doing it after playing through ME3 and knowing the roles of all the characters in it.

#18
Guest_Aotearas_*

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Why don't we take this topic, which simply got blown out of proportions, and blow it into nice, small, irrelevant pieces?
That way the OP might endulge in a normal discussion without incursions.

#19
Quething

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You know I thought about putting a line at the end of my post to the effect of "I know I'm pretty much asking for a flamewar about competence vs. story and which characters suck, but can we please not?" but I figured it would be futile, so why bother.

#20
EternalPink

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BentOrgy wrote...

Guess I'm a freak, I love having all of my party members alive.

Bigger cast makes a more interesting story. Even if you don't like a character (Lord knows I can't stand Miranda and her constant arrogance.) they can still provide information, dialogue, and character reaction.


Ya not the only one, i can understand not using characters you don't particularly like but having his squaddies die on him would make shepard look bad, i'm sure the only reason the turians give a medal to the VS in ME2 is to keep in the news how you left someone to die

#21
Estyss Eon

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 I think I might end up deliberately targeting people now that you mention it.

However Jacob and Garrus died on my first mission... I guess I "just got over it". :huh:

If I had to choose, it'd be Samara (I don't take threats lightly) and Jacob (He's useless in most of my gameplay.)

#22
Dirchy

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Deliberately targeting characters had never actually occurred to me.
I don't think I'd find myself doing it, since I prided myself on getting all my team through the mission, rather than doing it any cost. That was my ideology on ME1 as well, I was pretty upset on Virmire.

However I think I'd have to find myself getting rid of Jacob and Jack. Jacob always seemed to be a very empty character and that it wouldn't of greatly changed that course of events and I found Jack insufferable. Especially because of the amount of effort I go throw to build up high enough paragon scores because of the Jack and Miranda clash.

Modifié par Dirchy, 26 juillet 2011 - 12:59 .


#23
Commander_Adept

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Dirchy, you should romance her before you kill her off. I mean a paragon romance, not the casual sex that you can get.

After you romance her, you might not want to kill her off... Trust me, she's one of the best characters in the game when you get to know her and I'm guaranteeing that she's going to be even better in Mass 3 if you continue the romance. She's grown "softer and more mature" since the events of Mass 2.

#24
gloowacz

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Lots of Collectors + Collector General.

Oh, and work relationship with Illusive Man

#25
Estelindis

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I've never been able to figure out how to kill off Miranda (and no one but Miranda) on an all-loyal playthrough with all the upgrades bought. Really, since she's a sentinel, she should have been an option for the vents. If anyone's had more success than me, can they explain how?

That said, my first playthrough (which is always my "canon" playthrough) had no casualties, and I like that. While it would be poignant and appropriate to lose some squaddies, I like the fact that making the sensible choices results in no losses. If Mass Effect was a deeper series, then a surprise that had been faintly foreshadowed earlier coming out of left field to hit Shepard in an unexpected way would make sense and be appropriate. At its present level of emotional depth, however, the possibility to bring off the suicide mission with no losses is just fine.