370 réponses à ce sujet

[Beerfish]

Any one that has heard Silverman before should know that he is there to try and sell to a different type of person than the avg rpger. They want to expand the sales base into true block buster range and thus they have to try to appeal to all gamers whether they be hardcore prgers, soft core rpgers or just shooter action players.

I can't stand his style but clearly he is not trying to appeal to me. I'm surprised that some of you are getting so upset over Silverman, you guys should know better.

[Pride Demon]

Phaedon wrote...

Pride Demon wrote...

Like I said, as far as I know he is not the PR, that's Chris Priestly... Mr. Silverman is the Marketing director...
Also, like I said, courtesy would dictate one to try and understand what a position requires and how it works before attacking the one performing it...

I never saw Mr. Silverman do anything that is in any way worse than what any other Marketing person I saw in action would do...

Well, technically, it doesn't seem like a PR agent exists, not with the classic definition anyway, Priestly is the Community Director, whereas Silverman seems to be the Marketing director. Well, technically, PR has been more succesful with Silverman, though there may of course be more factors that come into play.

I am referring to this: http://social.biowar...3/index/7715615

I see... Interesting read there in the link, Phaedon... Thanks for bringing it to my attention... 
I guess my original point that Mr. Silverman is actually good at what he does is confirmed... ;P

I was aware BioWare hasn't a person whose sole job is to be the PR, but since I always defined a PR as "the one responsible for managing the relationship between an establishment and its customers" I always saw Mr. Priestly as being that more than Mr. Silverman who actally caters not on established customers but on those that could become customer...
Though I guess marketing and PR do encroach on each other area of expertise, I always guesses Mr.Priestly to be the one as he brings us buying customers the news from the devs and oversees the Community of said buying customers...

It's just my opinion anyway, but thanks for clearing things up...

[Varen Spectre]

Phaedon wrote...

Well that's the new argument against "Stats make RPGs".

Mmmm, that's a very clever wording in my opinion. Because one can hardly argue that only  "stats" do make RPGs. I agree, they, in themselves, don't. They just heavily contribute / used to contribute to it.

But I don't think that implementation of feature which is or at least used to be characteristic core component of one genre into a game from different genre in any way or form devaluates the role of that feature in the original genre.

If I exagerate it a lot, it would be like saying that implementation of racing elements in Mafia 1 



is an argument, that somehow... supports devaluation of the role of racing elements... in racing games, I guess. Unless I missed or misunderstood something..

Modifié par Varen Spectre, 22 juillet 2011 - 12:51 .

[Phaedon]

Well, it's quite complicated. We don't know if it's Priestly or Silverman who are responsible of events such as Comic Con, or the policies we do, etc.

Varen Spectre wrote...
Mmmm, that's a very clever wording in my opinion.[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/joyful.png[/smilie] Because one can hardly argue that only  "stats" do make RPGs. I agree, they, in themselves, don't. They just heavily contribute / used to contribute to it.

But I don't think that implementation of feature which is or at least used to be characteristic core component of one genre into a game from different genre in any way or form devaluates the role of that feature in the original genre.

If I exagerate it a lot, it would be like saying that implementation of racing elements in Mafia 1 



is an argument, that somehow... supports devaluation of the role of racing elements... in racing games, I guess. Unless I missed or misunderstood something..

I personally think that stats exist in RPGs only to ensure that the roleplaying doesn't go insane. I can perfectly roleplay (describe the actions of my character), without stats, but complications may occur that stats resolve.

They definitely don't make RPGs, they just help. I really don't understand why everyone thinks that they do.

Modifié par Phaedon, 22 juillet 2011 - 12:53 .

[MarauderESP]

no awesome buttons for me3 pls...... i had enough with the one on da2..........¬¬

[Siven80]

Meh i see nothing wrong with that interview tbh. Sure he gets a little hyper, so what.

Its target audience is those who are maybe looking at getting ME3 and want more info.

Maybe you just dont know how marketing works?

Or maybe you just nitpick over everything Bioware say.

Correct me if i'm wrong but ME2 was far more successfull, critically and comercially than ME1, so if they carry on that for ME3 which seems to be the perfect blend of ME1+ME2, I certainly wont be complaining.

[Pride Demon]

Phaedon wrote...

Well, it's quite complicated. We don't know if it's Priestly or Silverman who are responsible of events such as Comic Con, or the policies we do, etc.

Yeah, you're right... I guess it depends on how you define Public of PR, whether it's the customers/gaming community (Priestly), or the media (Silverman)...
I imagine the only way to know for sure would be asking them, but it may well be that they actually both are the PR in their area of expertise...

Phaedon wrote...

I personally think that stats exist in RPGs only to ensure that the roleplaying doesn't go insane. I can perfectly roleplay (describe the actions of my character), without stats, but complications may occur that stats resolve.

They definitely don't make RPGs, they just help. I really don't understand why everyone thinks that they do.

Agreed. Stats are a marker not the core of RPGs.

I remember a thread some time ago that argued why there were no phisical stats for Shep in ME1, the counter argument I favoured was that they were not needed as they would have sense only to make a "weak" Shepard for Rolepleying reasons, but since Shep is an N7 it's obvious his/her stats would NEED to be above average, what sense do stats controlled by the player make if Shep's physical prowess is already determined by lore?

Modifié par Pride Demon, 22 juillet 2011 - 01:06 .

[Il Divo]

Siven80 wrote...

Correct me if i'm wrong but ME2 was far more successfull, critically and comercially than ME1, so if they carry on that for ME3 which seems to be the perfect blend of ME1+ME2, I certainly wont be complaining.

This. ME2 stands as my second favorite Bioware game, behind KotOR. My only problem was the lack of skills/weapon customization, which seems to have been addressed with Mass Effect 3. His comment about romances bothers me a bit, but I see no problem with their reference to ME3 as a "blockbuster" or being action-filled (as it should be).

[Icinix]

...

*looks back in thread*

I just want my elevators back, and ditch the loading screens and linear corridor missions.

*slams thread door*

[InfiniteCuts]

Lumikki wrote...

InfiniteCuts wrote...

I'm just not seeing how all of this downplaying of the precedents set in the first two games is going to work to anyone's benefit.

Do, you see how marketing example ME2 would be good for hardcore classic RPG fans?

I'm not sure what you're getting at here... but I seem to recall ME2 getting a lot of flack from "hardcore classic RPG fans" (and I am not part of that group).  I know the reasons why BioWare might think playing up the "actiony" parts of ME3 will bring in new customers... but if there's this sense of disappointment that keeps rearing its head within your core base, who cares what Johnny-come-lately thinks about ME3 action?

Isn't it possible that the negativity surrounding DA2 probably had more impact on it's success or failure (depending how you look at it) than any marketing initiative on BioWare's part?  Why not sell the game to existing fans more aggressively than new ones?  I guess I'm not convinced its a clear-cut winning strategy to market to new gamers by copying other popular games and consistently downplaying aspects of your IP or the genre it is very much a part of.

Modifié par InfiniteCuts, 22 juillet 2011 - 01:09 .

[tonnactus]

efrgfhnm wrote...

Well the thing is the PR department doesn't need to attract more RPG players, Mass Effect is already selling hugely well to that crowd.

Compared to what games? Two Worlds maybee.

[Remus Artega]

Terror_K wrote...

Phaedon wrote...

Terror_K wrote...
I'd say it's a better argument for "even most shooters these days do RPG better than ME2 did, and it was supposed to be an RPG" 

Actually ME2 weapons have two times the stats displayed there. Check the wiki.

Why should I need to look at a friggin wiki. Why can't I see them IN THE GAME?

Saying ME2 has stats with that logic is like saying any shooter has stats if you look in the code. I know, for example, that The Enforcer in UT does up to 25 damage without damage amp. That doesn't make it a stat. All games have stats for everything if you want to get down to the nitty gritty.

In addition to that logic I could say every game has RPG elements since every game has some kind of coding behind each weapon used in the game which somehow predetermine it's ingame behaviour and  therefore it has "stats"...

[squee365]

So wait, a Marketing/content guy is blowing things out of proportion and making fans angry? Thats never happened before...


*cough* Frankie from Bungie *cough*

Modifié par squee365, 22 juillet 2011 - 01:13 .

[Nozybidaj]

This guy still has a job after the "button = awesome" nonsense? Apparently that little tirade wasn't enough so now he carries on about "who cares about relationships" for a BW game? What I see here is a man who hates his job and is trying to get fired but his bosses won't take the hint....

[squee365]

Nozybidaj wrote...

This guy still has a job after the "button = awesome" nonsense? Apparently that little tirade wasn't enough so now he carries on about "who cares about relationships" for a BW game? What I see here is a man who hates his job and is trying to get fired but his bosses won't take the hint....

He's a marketing guy, he doesn't actually make decisions in development. His job is to hype the dumb people for this game. I think he's managed that at least. 

Modifié par squee365, 22 juillet 2011 - 01:15 .

[CaptainZaysh]

Orkboy wrote...

The guy's a muppet. All he manages to do is rub people up the wrong way and making it seem more and more that Bioware care only about cattering to the mindless plebians, no longer giving a rats arse about the loyal fans that have been with them from the beginning. Without whom thay wouldn't be where they are in the first place.

Hey Orkboy, you pompous twat, smug intellectual superiority doesn't come across so well when you can't even spell words like "catering" or "plebeian" correctly.

[tobynator89]

wooo, made the leaderboard on pod training

[Pride Demon]

InfiniteCuts wrote...

but if there's this sense of disappointment that keeps
rearing its head within your core base, who cares what
Johnny-come-lately thinks about ME3 action?

Actually since the Johnny-come-lately outnumber hardened-veteran-Fred by several orders of magnitude the most money-grabbing way of acting would be totally ignoring what we say and go for the most commercially successful way... So whether veterans, who are few, are disappointed would be irrelevant in the face of the newcomers, who can be much much more...

The very fact this Social Network exists to allow our voices to be heard is a testament to the fact BioWare cares about us and our opinions... Otherwise this whole Forum is a colossal waste of time and money, might as well shut it down...

[Il Divo]

squee365 wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

This guy still has a job after the "button = awesome" nonsense? Apparently that little tirade wasn't enough so now he carries on about "who cares about relationships" for a BW game? What I see here is a man who hates his job and is trying to get fired but his bosses won't take the hint....

He's a marketing guy, he doesn't actually make decisions in development. His job is to hype the dumb people for this game. I think he's managed that at least. 

I think the easy answer is to just ignore everything he says. I'm less concerned what some moron in PR says than what an actual developer working on the game has to say.

[The Elder King]

tonnactus wrote...

efrgfhnm wrote...

Well the thing is the PR department doesn't need to attract more RPG players, Mass Effect is already selling hugely well to that crowd.

Compared to what games? Two Worlds maybee.

I'm curious, there's a method to know how many RPG players bought ME2?

Modifié par hhh89, 22 juillet 2011 - 01:17 .

[who would know]

InfiniteCuts wrote...

I guess I'm not convinced its a clear-cut winning strategy to market to new gamers by copying other popular games and consistently downplaying aspects of your IP or the genre it is very much a part of.

I get you. If I want unadulterated action that indulges my inner kid, I'm probably not gonna play Mass Effect.

[Pride Demon]

squee365 wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

This guy still has a job after the "button = awesome" nonsense? Apparently that little tirade wasn't enough so now he carries on about "who cares about relationships" for a BW game? What I see here is a man who hates his job and is trying to get fired but his bosses won't take the hint....

He's a marketing guy, he doesn't actually make decisions in development. His job is to hype the dumb people for this game. I think he's managed that at least. 

Judging by the link in Phedon's post he managed greatly, regardless of what the "Awesome Button" crowd says...

[squee365]

Il Divo wrote...

squee365 wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

This guy still has a job after the "button = awesome" nonsense? Apparently that little tirade wasn't enough so now he carries on about "who cares about relationships" for a BW game? What I see here is a man who hates his job and is trying to get fired but his bosses won't take the hint....

He's a marketing guy, he doesn't actually make decisions in development. His job is to hype the dumb people for this game. I think he's managed that at least. 

I think the easy answer is to just ignore everything he says. I'm less concerned what some moron in PR says than what an actual developer working on the game has to say.

Exactly, we're only making it worse by making a big deal out of what he says. Now if Mr. Hudson was saying stupid stuff like this, I'd be flipping tables. But Mr. Hudson is actually really professional and loves his job, listens to fans, and gives out some good info on the game. Awesomebuttonman is making a fool of himself, and thats alright because I've worked with marketing/advertising people before and they're all like that.

[TexasToast712]

 Just shut up and buy the game. We know everyone who ****es is going to anyways.

[MassFrost]

How the hell did this guy get a job in marketing? Everything he said aside, just looking at some of his past interviews I'm genuinely confused how this guy landed that job.