2469 réponses à ce sujet

[FlyingSquirrel]

happy_daiz wrote...
Actually, my personal favorite was watching the Yao Guai in FO3 napping. They curl up in a ball and wheeze. Too bad the Yao Guai in Zion resist my mad charms.

One thing I'd like to see in a future Fallout game, actually, is some sort of neutral/unclear setting for random animals and humans that you see from a distance. Real life does not have a little red marker to tell you if someone is hostile when you see them, and unless Pip-Boys can read minds, I don't see how anyone in the Fallout universe should be able to tell this either. Furthermore, in terms of animals, just because *some* Yao Guai or Mole Rats tend to attack any humans they see doesn't necessarily mean they all would. (In fact, even given the crazy alternate history of the Fallout universe, it's hard to imagine how they would have evolved and sustained a population in close proximity to humans if they all behave like that, unless we're only seeing ones that have wandered from their original habitats.)

I make a point of it, for the sake of immersion and role-playing, not to attack anyone in FO3 or FONV unless it's self-defense, but as far as I know, the games don't distinguish between, for example, shooting a Raider who sees you, announces that it's "killing time," and starts throwing grenades and shooting a Raider who's just sitting on a bench somewhere and doesn't even know you're there.

Instead, you should sometimes be able to walk past a Yao Guai taking a nap or a mole rat sniffing around a cave without anything happening, whereas at other times, it will suddenly turn hostile and attack. Similarly, you shouldn't be able to tell what most humans are up to just by seeing them, and if you can, it should only be if they are wearing the uniform of a known faction or otherwise behaving in a clearly friendly or threatening manner.

[SlottsMachine]

I think the people and animals have become so deranged that they attack everything on sight. You could argue that Yao Guai have evolved to see humans as easy prey. I guess it would be nice to have a few non-hostile animals or raiders though.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Well, I suppose most Raiders would probably logically turn hostile once you approach them. What I'm suggesting is more that you not always be able to tell if somebody's a Raider or otherwise hostile just by sight. So if you see some guy sitting on a bench somewhere, you'd never quite know what you're going to get - maybe he'll give you a sidequest, maybe he'll just say hello and have a short conversation, and maybe he'll pull a gun and try to kill your for your caps and equipment.

[Barbarossa2010]

happy_daiz wrote...

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

Now that New Vegas appears to be running well on my PC, after a fairly comprehensive overhaul, I think the cowboy character I've always wanted to play is probably going to be up next.

Yay!

So...Animal Friend this time around?

Absolutely. I think that fits well with the character...and I'll finally get to take the Cowboy perk!

Still have to finish this current playthrough though.

[Barbarossa2010]

BringBackNihlus wrote...

I think the idea of telling every faction in the Mojave to go to hell and securing a truly independent Vegas is much more appealing than being a pawn for the NCR, Legion or Mr. House. As a matter of fact (speaking of the Legion), one of my favorite things to do is infilitrate the Legion camp and kill every bastard in there, including Caesar.

If Yes Man ever gets any ideas I'll just put him down, too.

Independent is the absolute best playthrough imo.

Like I've said before, crossing the Colorado with Boone and ED-E and wiping out Fortification Hill is one of my favorite things to do. I just wish the slaves would acknowledge what's happening and run the hell away once they're free.

Then dealing with Oliver at the end...priceless. Moore...pfft. Hanlon's the only leader worth his salt in the NCR. The NCR is just charting the same course of all pre-war errors. The Legion is a walking error. House, admittedly, is the toughest for me to say no to.

[Giggles_Manically]

I like that JE Sawyer corrected Moore to have Evil karma in his mod.

I mean like Hanlon said she is just willing to do anything to anyone to achieve victory/improve her position.

[Master Warder Z_]

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

BringBackNihlus wrote...

I think the idea of telling every faction in the Mojave to go to hell and securing a truly independent Vegas is much more appealing than being a pawn for the NCR, Legion or Mr. House. As a matter of fact (speaking of the Legion), one of my favorite things to do is infilitrate the Legion camp and kill every bastard in there, including Caesar.

If Yes Man ever gets any ideas I'll just put him down, too.

Independent is the absolute best playthrough imo.

Like I've said before, crossing the Colorado with Boone and ED-E and wiping out Fortification Hill is one of my favorite things to do. I just wish the slaves would acknowledge what's happening and run the hell away once they're free.

Then dealing with Oliver at the end...priceless. Moore...pfft. Hanlon's the only leader worth his salt in the NCR. The NCR is just charting the same course of all pre-war errors. The Legion is a walking error. House, admittedly, is the toughest for me to say no to.

Much as i depise the NCR even their cancer ridden society is a fair sight better then letting the Anarchy that is "independence" loose upon the Wastes. Partially why i'd take the NCR over House is that in both Indie and House runs you are basically reliant upon a third party for the majority of your defense.

And i resent the Legion being represented as a "walking error" Its a survialist culture nothing wrong with that.

[Splinter Cell 108]

Nope, I'm with House, I don't like independent Vegas, especially if a faction like the Brotherhood is left around. In my opinion it will basically end up as a free for for all with the likes of the fiends, the Vegas families and the Brotherhood, provided that they weren't blown up.

In my opinion House is what is best for everyone, the Legion gets beaten and battered badly, the next time(if there is a next time) they try something they won't be as strong, the NCR will learn a valuable lesson and hopefully abandon its expansionist policies and New Vegas stays the same. House may not focus on improving everything for everyone but he has the right idea.

[Master Warder Z_]

Splinter Cell 108 wrote...

Nope, I'm with House, I don't like independent Vegas, especially if a faction like the Brotherhood is left around. In my opinion it will basically end up as a free for for all with the likes of the fiends, the Vegas families and the Brotherhood, provided that they weren't blown up.

In my opinion House is what is best for everyone, the Legion gets beaten and battered badly, the next time(if there is a next time) they try something they won't be as strong, the NCR will learn a valuable lesson and hopefully abandon its expansionist policies and New Vegas stays the same. House may not focus on improving everything for everyone but he has the right idea.

Before the NCR the Legion encountered nothing it could not overcome and from what i know of FO? There isn't anything stronger then the NCR that is known of in the Region, It overcomes them? I see little to no issue for their conquest in the Imediate future short of arranging logistical lines and maintaing such a large population but those issues aren't an imediate concern.

And whatever Lesson the NCR may or may not get out of the Mojave is ultimately? Pointless; Too unstable, too corruption and too large to maintain. It's go be divided into warring states within the decade once mass starvation starts to kick in. And i think that if House was aware of the fact they were approaching a critcal mass in so far as their likely hood to distergrate within the next short while he wouldn't vest some much hope into using them for a shield and a fuel for restarting his economy.

Ultimately? House likely won't see his vision anywhere near to completion because again as i said, he is far to reliant upon a third party that isn't going to last.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Master Warder Z wrote...
And i resent the Legion being represented as a "walking error" Its a survialist culture nothing wrong with that.

I guess it depends how you define terms, but I don't see the Legion as "survivalist" in the sense of prioritizing survival above all else. I'd say they are first and foremost an authoritarian culture. They seem to revere Caesar in a way that goes beyond just a pragmatic "well, somebody has to be in charge," they are openly disparaging of women, they will sometimes call the Courier a "degenerate" if they aren't attacking, and they see it as their right and duty to punish people like the residents of Nipton for moral corruption.

In fact, even if you look at these things through a purely amoral prysm, some of them are at best neutral in terms of survival chances:

1) The absolute allegiance to a ruler increases the efficiency of making decisions and keeping order, but also leaves them vulnerable to a disaster if they follow their leader in a particularly bad decision. If the Courier doesn't side with them, then trying to capture and hold the Dam is arguably an example of this, in that they suffer pretty severe losses.

2) Routinely treating women in the way they do, especially when there are viable alternative societies around (NCR, New Vegas, other towns and settlements), also reduces their odds of survival - they need to reproduce to survive, and what woman in her right mind would willingly associate with them, or not try to escape and go somewhere else if captured?

3) Their judgmental attitude towards people who don't share their philosophy is going to lead them into more conflicts. Apparently they were able to get away with it once in Nipton, but sooner or later, they'll run into a more determined and well-armed populace that's going to fight back. A society focused primarily on survival wouldn't pick fights like that.

Modifié par FlyingSquirrel, 18 février 2014 - 10:06 .

[Master Warder Z_]

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...
And i resent the Legion being represented as a "walking error" Its a survialist culture nothing wrong with that.

I guess it depends how you define terms, but I don't see the Legion as "survivalist" in the sense of prioritizing survival above all else. I'd say they are first and foremost an authoritarian culture. They seem to revere Caesar in a way that goes beyond just a pragmatic "well, somebody has to be in charge," they are openly disparaging of women, they will sometimes call the Courier a "degenerate" if they aren't attacking, and they see it as their right and duty to punish people like the residents of Nipton for moral corruption.

In fact, even if you look at these things through a purely amoral prysm, some of them are at best neutral in terms of survival chances:

1) The absolute allegiance to a ruler increases the efficiency of making decisions and keeping order, but also leaves them vulnerable to a disaster if they follow their leader in a particularly bad decision. If the Courier doesn't side with them, then trying to capture and hold the Dam is arguably an example of this, in that they suffer pretty severe losses.

2) Routinely treating women in the way they do, especially when there are viable alternative societies around (NCR, New Vegas, other towns and settlements), also reduces their odds of survival - they need to reproduce to survive, and what woman in her right mind would willingly associate with them, or not try to escape and go somewhere else if captured?

3) Their judgmental attitude towards people who don't share their philosophy is going to lead them into unnecessary conflicts. Apparently they were able to get away with it once in Nipton, but sooner or later, they'll run into a more determined and well-armed populace that's going to fight back. A society focused primarily on survival wouldn't pick fights like that.

Before i get into this let us establish one thing, The Legion has yet to enter its penultimate Anthesis state yet so therefore its society cannot be agrued complete.

Look to my post above it's been more then two decades of conquest, growth and expansion.

Before the NCR? There was nothing remotely that could challenge the Legion from its days in the shadows of Arizonia's Flat Lakes to Camp Munda to Flagstaff its grown from an army of under a hundred to something that parrels the NCR's population if not execeding it.

And while i do find their de-humanization of women to be an agruably immoral practice there is a certain logic to the line of thought, when you see women merely as a source of reproduction and thus centralize them in such way it implants that ideal into the populace. And what women you say? One that grew up under the Legion banner, that understand that the Legion exists to serve them as much as it does for them to serve it? Whom do you think caters to the lack of a better word.

"citizens" of the Legion, Or people living within its territory? Do you think the Legion wouldn't control the water, power and food supplies that cross through it? Independent trading may exist there but i doubt they would entrust the vast majority of such vital resources to them. Therefore the majority of those resources that make their way to people at at least two of them most to survive in the wasteland would come from the Legion. 

So while the priror generations to this change likely could learn of how life was before (Hellish, Brutal and often short) To how it is now. I like how Sawyer described it. "They aren't free but they don't mind it much considering they were never free". The Legion is a source of stability and life to those beyond the borders of the Colorado. So do i expect people who don't know what the Legion represents to serve them by choice if they are a female? No, Do i expect those beyond the Colorado to do so? If they grew up in it? Yes.

And finally? There attidude is for the most part correct in the world of FO. Societies, Civilizations and Nations are a rarity, Not common place. Anything beyond tribes or roving Raider Bands is beyond rare. Do you think that such people have prospects for the future? The Legion can offer them that and more, Purpose is lacking in the Wastes and that's a shame.

[Splinter Cell 108]

Master Warder Z wrote...

Before the NCR the Legion encountered nothing it could not overcome and from what i know of FO? There isn't anything stronger then the NCR that is known of in the Region, It overcomes them? I see little to no issue for their conquest in the Imediate future short of arranging logistical lines and maintaing such a large population but those issues aren't an imediate concern.

And whatever Lesson the NCR may or may not get out of the Mojave is ultimately? Pointless; Too unstable, too corruption and too large to maintain. It's go be divided into warring states within the decade once mass starvation starts to kick in. And i think that if House was aware of the fact they were approaching a critcal mass in so far as their likely hood to distergrate within the next short while he wouldn't vest some much hope into using them for a shield and a fuel for restarting his economy.

Ultimately? House likely won't see his vision anywhere near to completion because again as i said, he is far to reliant upon a third party that isn't going to last.

I'm not going to get into these poitnless arguments again. You can believe what you want, like who you like, dislike who you want to. I don't care. The only thing I'm going to say is that once Caesar dies so does the Legion, just like very other dictatorship that has ever existed in the world. You can't change human nature and that is something that Caesar does not comprehend apparently. 

Modifié par Splinter Cell 108, 18 février 2014 - 11:45 .

[Master Warder Z_]

Splinter Cell 108 wrote...

Master Warder Z wrote...

Before the NCR the Legion encountered nothing it could not overcome and from what i know of FO? There isn't anything stronger then the NCR that is known of in the Region, It overcomes them? I see little to no issue for their conquest in the Imediate future short of arranging logistical lines and maintaing such a large population but those issues aren't an imediate concern.

And whatever Lesson the NCR may or may not get out of the Mojave is ultimately? Pointless; Too unstable, too corruption and too large to maintain. It's go be divided into warring states within the decade once mass starvation starts to kick in. And i think that if House was aware of the fact they were approaching a critcal mass in so far as their likely hood to distergrate within the next short while he wouldn't vest some much hope into using them for a shield and a fuel for restarting his economy.

Ultimately? House likely won't see his vision anywhere near to completion because again as i said, he is far to reliant upon a third party that isn't going to last.

I'm not going to get into these poitnless arguments again. You can believe what you want, like who you like, dislike who you want to. I don't care. The only thing I'm going to say is that once Caesar dies so does the Legion, just like very other dictatorship that has ever existed in the world. You can't change human nature and that is something that Caesar does not comprehend apparently. 

Like Klein said its not an agrument when one is clearly right.

Ignoring the speculation that the Legion will collapse with out Caesar when every one in game mentions his death will have little short term effect at all, And Lanius replaces him with out incident for a singular moment.

The OSI  the NCR's Sceince Branch has confirmed that unless proactive measures are taken the NCR heartland will suffer crippling foodshortages, Mass starvation and etc within a decade or so.

Add that their unpopular habit of trampling over people, their utter corruption and the fact the common people have had enough of it, and you have all the ingredients needed for a nation killing event, a revolution or famine would be bad enough but mix the two together? And the Four State republic is going to crumble.

Its just the only plausible outcome, Unless if things somehow get better and their birthrate, and resource production fall into syche which unforunately isn't likely to happen, People are living longer again, Resources continue to be consumed longer, production hasn't kept up and it will fall short.

.-. And history is filled with how Human nature has shifted and twisted into it's current persona.

Greed can be beat.

[Splinter Cell 108]

Seriously,you're saying an opinion is a fact? There are also those who state Caesar's death will bring about the Legion's ruin. How are they going to beat greed, by placing explosive collars on everyone's head. The Legion's important people will start fighting just like the failed society they try to emulate did . Want some more examples of dictatorships that went bad when their leaders died? There's the Soviet Union, **** Germany, Yugoslavia, and countless more.

Your opinions are not fact, deal with that, and like I said I'm not going to get into this, it is pointless, nothing you say will change my mind and nothing I say will change yours.

[Master Warder Z_]

._. How is in game source material opinion i wonder.

"Mission into the Grass" Pretty much covers everything i said in game.

The NCR is doomed with out a miracle, Hence why they send you there and given the results cannot provide the result they need...Well there you go.

No Miracle, So doomed.

And just for one correction more...The final Premier of the USSR is still alive.

The USSR dissolved and a fair bit of Europe fell into Chaos for a Year or six but that wasn't a result of a Leader Dying, It was a result of Communism losing the cold war.

[Splinter Cell 108]

In game source material of what? You're going to make up stuff like last time, going to give me a Base Id to find a supposed text file, even though that's not really what Base Ids are for anyway ? Most of what they say is that the Legion won't stop from trying to take Hoover Dam, no one mentions the long term or short term. Marcus says the Legion will fall apart when Caesar dies, I guess that means he's right because its "in game source material".

You should be aware that New Vegas is anything but black and white, which is the appeal most factions have anyway. What someone believes about a faction is not necessarily right or wrong, its an opinion. So I believe Caesar's Legion will fall apart and you don't, nobody is correct in that, because they're opinions.

Who do you think made the foundations for the ideas of the Soviet Union? Stalin, when he died it was the beginning of the end, sure it didn't disappear right there, but no one was ever as effective as keeping the USSR efficient. Just like the Legion won't fall apart right there on the spot but it has the same tendencies, namely a delusional madman who thinks he can re-shape human instinct and who thinks he can do all that by himself.

[Giggles_Manically]

So I got my Legion RP down before I start.
My character will be a combination of:


More from the Abridged series.



and finally:


Should be fun

[Master Warder Z_]

Splinter Cell 108 wrote...

In game source material of what? You're going to make up stuff like last time, going to give me a Base Id to find a supposed text file, even though that's not really what Base Ids are for anyway ? Most of what they say is that the Legion won't stop from trying to take Hoover Dam, no one mentions the long term or short term. Marcus says the Legion will fall apart when Caesar dies, I guess that means he's right because its "in game source material".

You should be aware that New Vegas is anything but black and white, which is the appeal most factions have anyway. What someone believes about a faction is not necessarily right or wrong, its an opinion. So I believe Caesar's Legion will fall apart and you don't, nobody is correct in that, because they're opinions.

Who do you think made the foundations for the ideas of the Soviet Union? Stalin, when he died it was the beginning of the end, sure it didn't disappear right there, but no one was ever as effective as keeping the USSR efficient. Just like the Legion won't fall apart right there on the spot but it has the same tendencies, namely a delusional madman who thinks he can re-shape human instinct and who thinks he can do all that by himself.

Making it up? well the quest is very real and its implications are also very well, not surprised you are ignorant of it after all whom can keep track of every NCR side Quest eh?



There stands in the grass, a short and utimately rather pointless NCR quest given by the chief OSI officer in the Mojave and yet its implcations? Startling, beyond the 

There is a link to the video and while the PC in this instance didn't go back and chat with Hildarn again thus missing out the hidden agenda behind the vault (mass starvation) if you look even vaguely into the quest you will find the reason on many diffrent websites i'd agrue the FO Wikia or Vault would be the best bet to go to.

That's a laughable Notion, Out of the four founders of the USSR you pick the insane nut who ruined every principle it was about made himself dictator and ruled it like a king and then claim he gave it stability when his replacement did more for it then he ever did.

Course i have a bit more knowledge of the USSR then most folks i guess and thus a comparsion to the Legion wouldn't strike home, Legion is as far from communist as the political spectrum goes, Even Stalinism pales in comparsion to the Legion's Ultitarian Autocracy.

But its beyond politics as well, Namely in the beliefs and ideology of the Legion; Stalin didn't foster a "for the nation" mentality that Caesar did, He ruled through brute force, Aka secret police forces, Massive spy networks and mass imprisionment. 

Caesar might have to force his vision upon people but he imparts his ideology upon the survivors regardless.

[happy_daiz]

General Slotts wrote...

I think the people and animals have become so deranged that they attack everything on sight. You could argue that Yao Guai have evolved to see humans as easy prey. I guess it would be nice to have a few non-hostile animals or raiders though.

See, that's why I always get the Animal Friend perk. Once you do, the only animals that attack are mutated ones.

So that means Bighorners, Yao Guai, Coyotes, Nightstalkers, Mole Rats, Geckos, Dogs (including Legion, NCR, Fiend, and Vicious Dogs), and Giant Rats are all friendlies...

I know, it's a lot of XP lost by not killing them, but if you take the second AF perk, they'll fight nearby hostile human enemies for you. That has saved my butt more than once. Then I feel terrible if one of them dies.

I loved Ruzka in Point Lookout/FO3. The poor little bear still plays with her beach ball.



It's too bad that the high Charisma required for Animal Friend doesn't have an effect on Fiends and Raiders. Can you imagine just being able to walk up to them and say hey, what's up? The Fiends in Vault 3 if you're doing Aba Daba Honeymoon always cracked me up.

Modifié par happy_daiz, 19 février 2014 - 07:22 .

[Barbarossa2010]

I know right? I walked into Vault 3 for Jack and Diane with my gun drawn the whole time, and was freaked out a little as I went through to meet Motor Runner. I'm so used to raiders and Fiends attacking me on sight that I was not prepared to walk by them, as they took little notice of me, overhearing their conversations about how bad they're tripping!

[happy_daiz]

Speaking of Vault 3, were you ever able to release the prisoners? I know there was a Fiend you had to speak to, and I found him, but I wasn't able to initiate dialogue with him. All I kept getting was a canned response.

And every stinking time I'd go exploring in there, I'd forget about that one staircase with the grenade clusters and floor traps, and I'd blow my Courier to smithereens. Oops.

P.S. That vault is huge.

Modifié par happy_daiz, 19 février 2014 - 07:43 .

[SlottsMachine]

 @HD

LOL, you're really pushing the animal friend perk. I don't think I've ever used it in New Vegas (too many good perks), but I've taken it a few times in Fallout 3. 

Warning read at your discretion (Contains violence against Yao Guai)

I remember in Fallout 3 watching a friendly Yao Guai walking between two rock walls, and a Deathclaw jumped off the one side and beheaded the Yao Guai mid-jump. I couldn't believe what I was seeing. 

Modifié par General Slotts, 19 février 2014 - 07:59 .

[happy_daiz]

Hehe, I know, I must be terribly annoying.

OMG, I would cry. Like literally cry. Sometime after picking my jaw up off the floor.

OK, maybe not, but I do love them. I have been witness to many Geckos biting it, especially in Zion. Dang those stupid White Legs.

Modifié par happy_daiz, 19 février 2014 - 08:03 .