863 réponses à ce sujet

[Candidate 88766]

Reciever80 wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

All the nation states are "affiliated beneath the overarching banner of the Systems Alliance", or so says the codex.

That's actually a rather strange part of the codex, that entry Displayes like the Alliance is some kind of UN. yet other entries i seem to hammer upon that Alliance is an independant Nation, and it's very unlikley that ll the goverments will resort to an indepedant entity for protection from attacks outer space,

"The Systems Alliance is the representative body of Earth and all human colonies in Citadel space. Backed by Earth's most powerful nations, the Alliance has become humanity's military, exploratory, and economic spearhead."

Which part of that is unclear to you? The Systems Alliance is humanity. They're not just going to sit back and watch Earth burn.

/end thread

<_<

The bit about the Alliance being the human military 'spearhead' bears repeating again. Seriously, this thread shouldn't still be going.

Modifié par Candidate 88766, 24 juillet 2011 - 08:58 .

[Gabey5]

the important people need to get out of dodge

[GodWood]

celuloid wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

celuloid wrote...
Take your fascist exploitation ultra right-wing fantasies somewhere you won't get arrested.

I'm pretty sure no one will arrest him here.

In civilized world someone should.

I'm sorry but isn't arresting someone simply because of their political views fascist?

Someone arrest this man!

[celuloid]

It is the sign of any authoritarian government. I shall fight fire with fire.

Modifié par celuloid, 24 juillet 2011 - 09:01 .

[GodWood]

celuloid wrote...
It is the sign of any authoritarian government. I shall fight fire with fire.

And in the process you become a fascist yourself.

It's okay bro, I don't mind.
I'm an authoritarian too.

[celuloid]

Although you might get arrested even in traditional democracies due to supporting extreme ideologies. We should somehow find a way.

Modifié par celuloid, 24 juillet 2011 - 09:08 .

[SandTrout]

celuloid wrote...

It is the sign of any authoritarian government. I shall fight fire with fire.

I prefer to fight that kind of fire with clear examples of why authoritarian governments typically do not turn out well for anyone involved, in the end.

[Chuvvy]

Yes, why would humanities main military force help fight during an invasion? That's stupid, bioware you're stupid.

[SandTrout]

Slidell505 wrote...

Yes, why would humanities main military force help fight during an invasion? That's stupid, bioware you're stupid.

This.

Also, the SA is the only human organization that has the material capabilities to evacuate a large propulation from any planet. I'm not saying that they will get everyone off earth, but they can get more than all of the planet's nations combined.

[celuloid]

SandTrout wrote...

celuloid wrote...

It is the sign of any authoritarian government. I shall fight fire with fire.

I prefer to fight that kind of fire with clear examples of why authoritarian governments typically do not turn out well for anyone involved, in the end.

Okay. Try to reason with him. I have got myself large bowl of popcorn.

Modifié par celuloid, 24 juillet 2011 - 09:33 .

[SandTrout]

celuloid wrote...

Okay. Try to reason with him. I have got myself large bowl of popcorn.

This a the common misconception about debate. I do not need to convince my oppenent of anything. The goal is to convince the audience. And I realy think that this entire point of debate is stupid enough that those claiming that the SA should not be trying to evacuate Earth are not going to gain any traction, and I would only need to make the simplest and most obvious points in order to win.

Claiming that the SA does not have a good reason to attempt to evacuate Earth is pretty damn dumb, and ignores a lot of history.

As for Zulu, he is really just a very dedicated devil's advocate. His entire purpose on these forums is to argue the unpopular side of arguments b/c occasionally the unpopular is better. He has to do a lot of mental gymnastics in order to create a potentially valid point on a lot of topics, but I can appreciate the role that he plays, even when my role is debunking his points.

Really, the most upsetting thing about this topic is that people have even bothered to discuss it for 10 pages when the clear and concise answer was given multiple times on pages 1 and 2.

[ShadowSplicer]

Hmm... The Alliance, a human organization meant to protect humanity and expand into the galaxy. And somehow people don't understand them saving human lives on Earth? Really? *Facepalm*

[An83dre]

Modifié par An83dré, 24 juillet 2011 - 10:37 .

[Phaedon]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
And you know what "being back" means in Casey's books, don't you?

You didn't really read what you quoted, did you? Anyway, the main quote comes from magazines, find the scans yourself.

Actually, they can't do that.

What exactly are you quoting and why are you skipping half of my post.

Superiority comes not in numbers, but in the integrity of command and conrol, and whose side the deadliest SoB in space is currently on.

Proof, again: the population of the Geth "realm", as well as the crew of their fleet is 0. Not billions, not millions, not thousands, and not dozens. It's zero. Zulu-Echo-Romeo-Oscar. Just equipement. Didn't help Ashley's platoon though...

You can't "enslave" someone without the numbers don't be ridiculous. Integrity? I bet there will probably only be a bunch of humans who would sacrifice Earth, fight against the turian and Reaper fleet and then somehow want to enslave other races.

Most people are normal enough not to want to enslave each other.

The geth fleet is zero? You mean that the Eden Prime fleet consists only of one Reaper.
And if you wish to know, the geth greatly outnumbered the humans, so there you go. Defeating your own argument.

The Reapers. They are just ships. No crew, no population, no homeworld. But they don't get pawned by your "billions", do they?

Except that the Reaper army isn't just ships. Oh dear. Ever played of any of the previous games?

Also, the Reapers can survive without food or water.

And they live for billions of years, they don't need reproduction.

And they take more than two shots from an AA gun to take them down.

Try again without skipping 80% of posts.

Modifié par Phaedon, 24 juillet 2011 - 10:46 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

ARGH!!!


THE STUPID IN THIS THREAD!!

IT BUUUUURNSS!!!

[Phaedon]

Saphra Deden wrote...

While I disagree with Zulu's assertions that the Earth is worthless and a hindrance to human expansion, I do agree with him that the Alliance destroying itself in a futile attempt to evacuate a planet of 11 billion people, or even to liberate it, is foolish. Don't fight a fight you can't win.

Like saving your fleet to fight the Reapers?

And who said about sacrificing your fleets? The Alliance is evacuating all of their bases on Earth, and not to use their thousands of shuttles all over the world to save civillians is plain stupid.

The sacrifice will have to come later, but that will be with Shepard's involvement, and the involvement of other fleets as well.

[Homebound]

why is this even a question?

[celuloid]

SandTrout wrote...

This a the common misconception about debate. I do not need to convince my oppenent of anything. The goal is to convince the audience.

You, sir, hold the higher moral ground.

As for Zulu, he is really just a very dedicated devil's advocate. His entire purpose on these forums is to argue the unpopular side of arguments b/c occasionally the unpopular is better. He has to do a lot of mental gymnastics in order to create a potentially valid point on a lot of topics, but I can appreciate the role that he plays, even when my role is debunking his points.

He is the real entertainer. He only needs a contract in circus.

Really, the most upsetting thing about this topic is that people have even bothered to discuss it for 10 pages when the clear and concise answer was given multiple times on pages 1 and 2.

This thread ends in two ways:
A) Moderator stops increasingly hostile verbal discussion.
You give up.

[Phaedon]

Saphra Deden wrote...
Zulu basically said that using the fleet to evacuate people from Earth would be a waste and would just weaken the fleet by having some of it destroyed.

Better to stay back until you've got a strategy and the weapons to evict the Reapers from the planet.

I wouldn't keep my ships (on Earth, in my bases) around long enough for any civilians to hitch a ride on. Those ships are more valuable than the civilians are. I want those ships off-planet and in a safe place as soon as possible.

Kodiak shuttles have FTL capability, but zero offensive capability, so I think that we can dismiss the claim of sacrificing important parts of the fleet.

Modifié par Phaedon, 24 juillet 2011 - 11:16 .

[LOLandStuff]

Because they're bored and have nothing better to do. And since they're in the area they might as well start evacuating Earth if only people would stop dying left and right.

[DCarter]

Fixers0 wrote...

So In the demo and trailers we can see Alliance shuttles evacuate civilians and marines combating  the Reapers.

But why?

There is ample background material in both games and other works that there is a clear seperation between, earth (Who is still a planet controlled by many nations) and the Alliance (an indepedant goverment that protects human interests outside of the sol system).

Basicly the Alliance has nothing to do with Earth security and goverment and each state on earth organises it's own defense against attacks, Maybe there is an unified 'Earth defense force'' with Spaceships and Orbital stations but it's certainly not the Alliance.

But the 'invasion' trailer clearly shows the Alliance sysmbols on news reports from different nations, even though they should be independant entities.

What?

Because the alliance controls the fleets which make sense since they are earths represntitve in space and marinses are part of the fleet and not the army just like in real life.