863 réponses à ce sujet

[Phaedon]

snip

Modifié par Phaedon, 24 juillet 2011 - 01:53 .

[Phaedon]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
Care for an exact quote?

Alexthehunted 
@
@CaseyDHudson I read an article in PC magazine about mass effect 3 and said that Tali was returning as a full time squad mate is this true

@CaseyDHudson
@
@Alexthehunted Yes, Tali will be back in #ME3 and you'll see a continuation of her story arc.



And that's not even the one I am referring to.

Therefore, we must be playing as the bad guys in ME3.

Cerberus has been confirmed as enemies for 40% of the game, therefore they are not your allies. It's pretty

You too.

Pretty sure I didn't give the base to a xenophobic group which attacks me in ME3 or killed off my squadmates and claimed that they won't return. 

You mean the one you messed up all the quotes in, just like in this one?

Nah, this one is the kind of paragraphs which you skip because they defeat your reasoning, that happens in every single post.

You haven't been able to reply in entire posts during the past pages, I wonder why. 

And that makes sacrificing the fleets and rescue shuttles less pointless how exactly?

It actually makes it utterly pointless.

If you have a superweapon but no population, then you eventually die.
If you have a superweapon and a population, you survive.

And that makes sacrificing what little we have less pointless how exactly?

Actually, it cancels it completely, if that didn't happen from the very beginning.

Saving the fleet makes no sense because they won't be able to fight for another day. If they hide away somewhere and wait for the invasion to pass, then they'll either become extinct by themselves, or get killed by pirates, slavers or the rogue states.

Not if the fleets are preserved. Not if the first generation takes advantage of those races that have sacrificed their fleets to save a fraction of their non-productive population.

Actually, they can't do that. They don't have the numbers to establish superiority. Even if all of the navies become extinct and the Alliance takes no losses during the invasion, they'll eventually either be killed in the obvious revolt that will come (Hint, the ration will be millions to one) or they'll become extinct.

By that way, they'll die off completely, because they decided not only not to rescue Earth, but also to find billions of enemies. Several billions.

Modifié par Phaedon, 24 juillet 2011 - 01:57 .

[atheelogos]

Fixers0 wrote...

So In the demo and trailers we can see Alliance shuttles evacuate civilians and marines combating  the Reapers.

But why?

There is ample background material in both games and other works that there is a clear seperation between, earth (Who is still a planet controlled by many nations) and the Alliance (an indepedant goverment that protects human interests outside of the sol system).

Basicly the Alliance has nothing to do with Earth security and goverment and each state on earth organises it's own defense against attacks, Maybe there is an unified 'Earth defense force'' with Spaceships and Orbital stations but it's certainly not the Alliance.

But the 'invasion' trailer clearly shows the Alliance sysmbols on news reports from different nations, even though they should be independant entities.

What?

Wrong. The Alliance is on Earth. They just don't have jurisdiction over any of the countries on the planet.

"Basicly the Alliance has nothing to do with Earth security " lol they are Earth's security. I mean really who else is going to protect Earth if not the organization they founded and funded to do said task?

Modifié par atheelogos, 24 juillet 2011 - 02:04 .

[DrNavi]

this is a stupid thread, why wouldn't they protect the homeworld of humanity, no doubt a number of resources, recruits and organisations come from or have major holdings on earth

[Zulu_DFA]

[quote]Phaedon wrote...
[quote]Zulu_DFA wrote...
Care for an exact quote?[/quote]
There is a source. Use it.
[/quote]
 
[quote]Phaedon wrote in his blog... 
Liara, Ashley/Kaiden, Garrus, Tali and James Sanders as confirmed squadmates. Also, James Sanders is not the Brittish sniper from the trailer. [30] [PCG]

Tali, Jack, Wrex, Mordin, Legion, and Anderson to appear, unknown if squad mates or not. [30] ,[PS3M][/quote]
I am confused ...



[quote]Phaedon wrote...

[quote]Zulu wrote...
Therefore, we must be playing as the bad guys in ME3.[/quote]
Cerberus makes up for 40% of the enemies. They are not your allies, end of story.
[/quote]
Um, that's quite natural. The good guys don't regulary ally themselves with the bad guys.




[quote]Phaedon wrote...

[quote]Zulu wrote...
You too.[/quote]
I am pretty sure I am not a TIM or Cerberus fan, and I definitely didn't save the base. 
[/quote]
That's why you'll have to do a lot of dealing with it.


[quote]Phaedon wrote...
And I didn't kill of my squadmates thinking that they won't return. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]
[/quote]
To each their own. I can't blame you for loving the calibrations. They are so elementary, after all...


[quote]Phaedon wrote...
[quote]Phaedon wrote...
You mean the one you messed up all the quotes in, just like in this one?[/quote]
Nah, I am talking about the two posts of mine which you have yet to reply. Not just paragraphs, two posts. Also, there are many paragraphs that you couldn't answer.
[/quote]

And you still have to stop messing up quotes.


[quote]Phaedon wrote...
[quote]
And that makes sacrificing the fleets and rescue shuttles less pointless how exactly?[/quote]
Is that a serious question?
If you have a superweapon, but lose 99.7% of your population, you'll die eventually either way.[/quote]
Look, the 99.7% of the population is going to die either way. If the fleets go down with it while trying to save 0.0001% of the population, there won't be anything to mount my superweapon on.

And there were times that had less than 10 thousand humans in existence, so I guess beating the odds with 30 million might be a bit easier. If the fleet is up there, that is.


[quote]Phaedon wrote...
[quote]
And that makes sacrificing what little we have less pointless how exactly?[/quote]
Same as above.
In fact, it makes NOT sacrificing ships meaningless, stupid and not renegade like at all. 
[/quote]
WHAT IS THE POINT OF THROWING ABLE SERVICEMEN INTO A BANZAI CHARGE???


[quote]Phaedon wrote...
[quote]Zulu wrote...
Not if the fleets are preserved. Not if the first generation takes advantage of those races that have sacrificed their fleets to save a fraction of their non-productive population.
[/quote]
Even if there are some thousand people there, and they somewhat don't have their asses kicked by the Reapers, there are the pirates, slavers, and well, time, itself.
[/quote]
The pirates and slavers will prey on your defensless turians who accepted the fight and pointlessely expended their fleet to evacuate a fraction of people from Palaven. They will not be preying on the Alliance Fleet if it is at least somewhat operational. Like I said, the Alliance Fleet may as well join in the party. Go read some f***ing ancient or early medieval history for additional insights.

Modifié par Zulu_DFA, 24 juillet 2011 - 02:24 .

[Zulu_DFA]

DrNavi wrote...

this is a stupid thread, why wouldn't they protect the homeworld of humanity, no doubt a number of resources, recruits and organisations come from or have major holdings on earth

Yes, they come from Earth. That doesn't mean they are willing to go back and die with the rest out of solidarity.

[Phaedon]

You quoted a wrong post and messed it up, try with the new one.

[DTKT]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

DrNavi wrote...

this is a stupid thread, why wouldn't they protect the homeworld of humanity, no doubt a number of resources, recruits and organisations come from or have major holdings on earth

Yes, they come from Earth. That doesn't mean they are willing to go back and die with the rest out of solidarity.

Was that particular element ever discussed or is it just conjecture on your end.

I mean, it's a great topic to address. When we reach the stars, how will those who are so far away view our small blue planet? 

I don't think ME ever gave an answer to how the colonies view Earth. Or at least, I totally missed it.

[Someone With Mass]

Just FYI, when you're referring to James Sanders (AKA James Vega in the new world), you're probably going with old material.

[atheelogos]

Also if you were paying attention OP you'd know the most of the Alliance personal have always been on Earth.

It's math. "The Council regards the Alliance as a "sleeping giant" as only 3% of humans volunteer for military service"masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Systems_Alliance

Human population just on Earth is over 11 billion. So do the math and you get 330 000 000 soldiers. Where do you think all those people are? There aren't enough ships to hold that many people nor is there enough room on any station to hold that amount of people, so where are they?

On Earth.

[DrNavi]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

DrNavi wrote...

this is a stupid thread, why wouldn't they protect the homeworld of humanity, no doubt a number of resources, recruits and organisations come from or have major holdings on earth

Yes, they come from Earth. That doesn't mean they are willing to go back and die with the rest out of solidarity.

why doesn't it? why wouldn't the protectors of humanity protect humanity?

[Zulu_DFA]

DTKT wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

DrNavi wrote...

this is a stupid thread, why wouldn't they protect the homeworld of humanity, no doubt a number of resources, recruits and organisations come from or have major holdings on earth

Yes, they come from Earth. That doesn't mean they are willing to go back and die with the rest out of solidarity.

Was that particular element ever discussed or is it just conjecture on your end.

I mean, it's a great topic to address. When we reach the stars, how will those who are so far away view our small blue planet? 

I don't think ME ever gave an answer to how the colonies view Earth. Or at least, I totally missed it.

Yes, I'm sure it's a great topic to discuss, and maybe that's what David Traitor to the Alliance Andeson had in mind, but the members of the Alliance military who know what the chain of command is and what it is for, will not be at liberty to go to Earth to die with the 99.7%, unless their superiors order them to. And the superiors will not order them to becasue they are selected and trained on the basis of maximising the chances of military victory.

[Zulu_DFA]

DrNavi wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

DrNavi wrote...

this is a stupid thread, why wouldn't they protect the homeworld of humanity, no doubt a number of resources, recruits and organisations come from or have major holdings on earth

Yes, they come from Earth. That doesn't mean they are willing to go back and die with the rest out of solidarity.

why doesn't it? why wouldn't the protectors of humanity protect humanity?

They will protect humanity by giving up what can't be protected for the sake of what can be.

One who tries to defend everything defends nothing.
- Sun Tsu.

[Phaedon]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
I am confused ...

One magazine confirms her appearance, another her status, and you have yet to address my actual post.

Um, that's quite natural. The good guys don't regulary ally themselves with the bad guys.

I understand that words and common logic are too difficult to grasp sometimes, but out of the enemies that you will face in-game, Cerberus, husks or geth, 40% of them are Cerberus.

Let's say that you have 10 apples on a bench. And you take 4 of those apples with you.

How many apples do you then have?

That's why you'll have to do a lot of dealing with it.

Well, I know that I didn't give a WMD to a confirmed antagonist who controls 40% of the in-game enemies. What did you do again? 

To each their own. I can't blame you for loving the calibrations. They are so elementary, after all...

Apparently not for all people, it seems.

You see, I saved a squadmate who will come back in ME3 and will be a useful ally, you don't seem to be going very well with the ally part, at least. You might have needed some, what with some giant machines attacking Earth because of Shepard.

And you still have to stop messing up quotes.

Irony, thy name is Zulu.

Look, the 99.7% of the population is going to die either way. If the fleets go down with it while trying to save 0.0001% of the population, there won't be anything to mount my superweapon on.

Evacuating from every base and then going back to save Earth = 0.0001%. Amazing. Still gives you a disadvantage.

And there were times that had less than 10 thousand humans in existence, so I guess beating the odds with 30 million might be a bit easier. If the fleet is up there, that is.

I can't think of a time when we had 10 thousand ****** sapiens harvested by a few thousand killing machines, slavers, pirates and rogue states, actually.

I can't actually think of many ****** sapiens who could have both a superweapon and their population but decided to go with just a superweapon, some extra rescue shuttles and no population at all.

In fact, I can't think of many ****** sapiens who actually had to survive with no food and water in space.

WHAT IS THE POINT OF THROWING ABLE SERVICEMEN INTO A BANZAI CHARGE???

That's your utter BS.

The Alliance is evacuating, and is bringing along civillians, sacrificing entire fleets is your wishful thinking.

And by the way,
WHAT IS THE POINT OF SAVING A FLEET THAT HAS NO CHANCE OF FIGHTING THE REAPERS AND RENDERING THE HUMAN RACE EXTINCT???

/caps

The pirates and slavers will prey on your defensless turians who accepted the fight and pointlessely expended their fleet to evacuate a fraction of people from Palaven. They will not be preying on the Alliance Fleet if it is at least somewhat operational. Like I said, the Alliance Fleet may as well join in the party. Go read some f***ing ancient or early medieval history for additional insights.

Defenseless? Hahah, even if they sacrifice their entire fleet they have billions of civillians, all of which have weapons have have served on the military.

In fact, should the Alliance try to join the party, they'll be outnumbered to what is likely to be a million to one, in the best of cases, thousands of crewmen that are probably unfit for ground battle against billions of turians who have finished military service and are armed.

[Phaedon]

Zulu_DFA wrote...
One who tries to defend everything defends nothing.
- Sun Tsu.

Evacuation=Defence

-iniate slow clap-

[marshalleck]

The Systems Alliance can't spare Kodiak shuttles and freighters for evacuation because they're needed to fight the Reapers. 

PS: This thread makes my intelligence hurt.

Modifié par marshalleck, 24 juillet 2011 - 02:46 .

[DrNavi]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

DrNavi wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

DrNavi wrote...

this is a stupid thread, why wouldn't they protect the homeworld of humanity, no doubt a number of resources, recruits and organisations come from or have major holdings on earth

Yes, they come from Earth. That doesn't mean they are willing to go back and die with the rest out of solidarity.

why doesn't it? why wouldn't the protectors of humanity protect humanity?

They will protect humanity by giving up what can't be protected for the sake of what can be.

One who tries to defend everything defends nothing.
- Sun Tsu.

without earth, which has most of humanity on, humanity would pretty much become an endangered species, we'd be the new quarians...but with a few scattered colonies  

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

It's called "retcon". Shepard's trial on Earth makes even less sense.

I wonder if the Arcturus station and the Alliance colonies even get mentioned in ME3...

Well you'll just have to check the variables to find out!

[Zulu_DFA]

Phaedon wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...
Care for an exact quote?

Alexthehunted 
@
@CaseyDHudson I read an article in PC magazine about mass effect 3 and said that Tali was returning as a full time squad mate is this true

@CaseyDHudson
@
@Alexthehunted Yes, Tali will be back in #ME3 and you'll see a continuation of her story arc.

And you know what "being back" means in Casey's books, don't you?

Phaedon wrote...

And that's not even the one I am referring to.

So what were you referring to???

Phaedon wrote...



Actually, they can't do that.

Actually, they can, and will.

Phaedon wrote...



They don't have the numbers to establish superiority.

Superiority comes not in numbers, but in the integrity of command and conrol, and whose side the deadliest SoB in space is currently on.

Proof, again: the population of the Geth "realm", as well as the crew of their fleet is 0. Not billions, not millions, not thousands, and not dozens. It's zero. Zulu-Echo-Romeo-Oscar. Just equipement. Didn't help Ashley's platoon though...

Phaedon wrote...



Even if all of the navies become extinct and the Alliance takes no losses during the invasion, they'll eventually either be killed in the obvious revolt that will come (Hint, the ration will be millions to one) or they'll become extinct.

By that way, they'll die off completely, because they decided not only not to rescue Earth, but also to find billions of enemies. Several billions.

The Reapers. They are just ships. No crew, no population, no homeworld. But they don't get pawned by your "billions", do they?

[silentfall]

I'd like to add that, since 99% of humanity is on Earth, it stands to reason that 99% of the Alliance troops and leaders also hail from Earth. Human discipline ends at a certain point, and I'm fairly certain that watching your home planet and basically everyone you ever knew that isn't serving with you burn and die is well past that point. Even if the Alliance did order the troops to hold position, we'd be seeing a fairly large mutiny and a huge drop in morale. After all, what the hell are the soldiers fighting for if everything they have is already lost?

[MajorStranger]

Hey Zulu, remember me? Would you kindly dig yourself an hole and bury yourself alive? We've got enough troll here as it is.

[RyuGuitarFreak]

What is this I don't even...

Is the OP and some people here dumb or what? The answer couldn't be more in the face.

Ffs question is: why the hell wouldn't they?

[Zulu_DFA]

DrNavi wrote...

without earth, which has most of humanity on, humanity would pretty much become an endangered species,

Endangered by who?

DrNavi wrote...



we'd be the new quarians...

Chances are all races will take a hit in the groin, so don't fret just yet. Especailly, since there won't be any problems with settling on new planets, as  
we are now in control of the Council... Or are we?

DrNavi wrote...



but with a few scattered colonies  

What a small unremarkable difference, don't you think?


In any case, how miserable a fate Humanity might face after the Reapers are gone, it'll be a lot more miserable without the fleet, than with it. Simple as that.

And there is no way you can even evac even 10 million people off Earth, let alone 10 billion. There is simply no difference and no point in sacrificing the fleet to save such a small fraction of the population.

It's like suggesting that in 1940 the British should have sacrificed their expeditionary force and evacuated French civilians instead.

[Zulu_DFA]

MajorStranger wrote...

Hey Zulu, remember me?

No... Who are you?

MajorStranger wrote...
Would you kindly dig yourself an hole and bury yourself alive?

Why?

MajorStranger wrote...


We've got enough troll here as it is.

I can see that.