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Garrus and Tali do not care about reapers


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#1
trobbins777

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 Before you guys start flaming me, hear me out(also I hope you like the Kanye West reference in the title). Let me start off by saying that Garrus and Tali have helped us tremendously during mass effect 2 by being squadmates and helping upgrade the ship. However, I would argue that during the two years Shepard was dead they did absolutely nothing to help prepare for the reapers.

Garrus turned down an opportunity to get ahead in c-sec and goes to Omega to help fight crime, and while that's a noble cause, the reapers are going to destroy everything. Wouldn't it make more sense to try to take over C-Sec and use some influence to help prepare council forces against the reapers (even if they don't believe it to be a real threat)? I know Garrus hates red tape but when the fate of the galaxy is at stake I didn't
think he would try to be batman in Omega instead of trying to do everything in his power to prepare.


Tali went back to helping her Father with the war against the Geth, which is another noble goal don't get me wrong, but like I said with Garrus, the fate of the galaxy is at stake. Shouldn't she be trying to convince her father, an Admiral in the migrant fleet, to focus on the reaper threat rather than indulge his old hatreds? The quarian fleet is the largest in the galaxy and will be instrumental in the defeat of the reapers.They will need to be preparing for a war with the Reapers, not the Geth.



Also Liara, to a certain extent, is guilty of negligence.

Liara gets some points for handing us over to Cerberus, but then she immediately sets off on a quest for revenge against the Shadow Broker, and (once again) while taking down the shadow broker is a noble goal, the reapers are a much more dangerous threat. Why doesn't she try and return to prothean dig sites in order to find some kind of evidence proving the reapers existence? Then she could publish the findings and the council might
not use that lame “Ah yes, Reapers.” line.



That being said, Liara being the shadow broker is definitely going to be helpful in Mass
effect 3.




Two examples of characters who I feel are preparing for the reaper threat, andtherefore deserve commendation are.



Wrex(If he's alive), who returns to his home-world of Tuchanka in order to help the krogan. I can't complain that he isn't doing everything he can to stop the reapers because he, in the process, becomes extremely powerful with the krogan, successfully uniting many krogan clans under Urdnot's banner. It doesn't matter that his intent wasn't necessarily to help destroy the reapers because that is going to be the end result.  I think it's safe to say that when the reapers arrive he'll have the common sense to use his forces in conjunction with Shepard's in order
to save the day.



Ashley Wiliams/Kaiden Alenko, otherwise known as the Virmire Survivor, have been working with Anderson over these last few years on becoming a spectre and a number of classified ops for the Alliance . The latest one being an investigation into Cerberus' relation with missing human colonies. This eventually led to Horizon and while I wouldn't call their reaction to Shepard being alive pleasant. They do try to prove that the collectors and reapers are behind the missing colonies. We know that in Mass Effect 3 the Virmire survivor will be a spectre, and as such will have authority in and beyond the alliance, and access to cutting edge technology to use against the reapers.

Modifié par trobbins777, 25 juillet 2011 - 04:20 .


#2
James2912

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 They thought the Reapers were finished once soveriegn was destroyed and the Reapers plans failed. 

#3
Homebound

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they dont care about the reapers but they do care about shepard. sometimes in war, soldiers dont go out there to die for their country, instead they die for their fellow soldiers.

#4
da_hizz_nizz

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Image IPB:P

In all honesty tho how could they have helped more? everbody thought the reapers were defeated:huh:

#5
GoG ToXiC

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They had no reason to believe that the reapers were still out there. At the end of ME1 I though the reapers were pretty much gone.

#6
Guest_mrsph_*

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There isn't really anyone could do without the resources Shepard had at his disposal. Which is why s/he had the Council backing him/her in 1 and Cerberus in 2.

Modifié par mrsph, 25 juillet 2011 - 02:45 .


#7
Chun Hei

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I am not going to blame the characters since the writers put them in their positions for gameplay reasons.

Neither characters had Specter clearance without Shepard so it is probable that they ASSUMED that the Council would take the threat seriously and they had no idea how dumb the Council and Alliance brass were.

#8
James2912

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GoG ToXiC wrote...

They had no reason to believe that the reapers were still out there. At the end of ME1 I though the reapers were pretty much gone.


THIS END OF THREAD

#9
DarkDragon777

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Huh? Liara did a lot to help.

#10
Guest_mrsph_*

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It would have probably helped if they split up the things Liara did in between 1 and 2 between Garrus and Tali as well.

#11
George-Kinsill

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Tali actually helped in a way very similar to what Wrex did on Tuchanka, if not better. She goes back and tells them about the Reapers, and apparently convinced them as in ME Ascension the Admirals and every Captain convene to talk about the impact of the Reapers on the Geth. Further, through all her special ops missions, she earns the gratitude of the fleet, and if you didn't get her exiled (by charm/intimidate option) she is recommneded to fill the spot left by her father. By having her and all the other admirals believing in Reapers, Shep gains access to the largest fleet in the galaxy.

#12
Guest_Saphra Deden_*

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Tali is probably just paying lip-service to the Reapers thing to get into Shepard's pants.

#13
trobbins777

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GoG ToXiC wrote...

They had no reason to believe that the reapers were still out there. At the end of ME1 I though the reapers were pretty much gone.


In mass effect 1 you kill 1 reaper

Shepard's last words in Mass Effect are about how Sovereign was just a vanguard of the Reapers

Soveriegn tells you on virmire that their are enough reapers to darken the sky on every world. Even if that is an exaggeration. It confirms that their is a reaper fleet.

besides they were called reapers not reaper

#14
James2912

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trobbins777 wrote...

GoG ToXiC wrote...

They had no reason to believe that the reapers were still out there. At the end of ME1 I though the reapers were pretty much gone.


In mass effect 1 you kill 1 reaper

Shepard's last words in Mass Effect are about how Sovereign was just a vanguard of the Reapers

Soveriegn tells you on virmire that their are enough reapers to darken the sky on every world. Even if that is an exaggeration. It confirms that their is a reaper fleet.

besides they were called reapers not reaper




But the whole point of ME1 is to prevent them from entering the galaxy they did as far as they knew problem solved. 

#15
Xarathox

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Tali's quite young. Now while she would receive acknowledgments for her actions to help defeat Saren/Geth/Sovereign she'd have little pull with much of anyone, even her own people since she doesn't sit in a position of authority. It's really hard to rally anyone to prepare for something that's universally believed to be a hoax. Even more so when you have 0 power.

Garrus is, more or less, disillusioned with bureaucracy and all the stone walls that comes with the territory. He may be loyal to Shepard, but if I was in his shoes, I'd care little about the rest of the galaxy too. Only those who hold the highest administrative positions have the actually ability to affect change, and if the only person who you truely cared for died, wouldn't you just say f*ck it and go off on your own and await the end?

#16
da_hizz_nizz

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James2912 wrote...

trobbins777 wrote...

GoG ToXiC wrote...

They had no reason to believe that the reapers were still out there. At the end of ME1 I though the reapers were pretty much gone.


In mass effect 1 you kill 1 reaper

Shepard's last words in Mass Effect are about how Sovereign was just a vanguard of the Reapers

Soveriegn tells you on virmire that their are enough reapers to darken the sky on every world. Even if that is an exaggeration. It confirms that their is a reaper fleet.

besides they were called reapers not reaper.




But the whole point of ME1 is to prevent them from entering the galaxy they did as far as they knew problem solved. 

Exactly.
End of Line.

#17
trobbins777

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James2912 wrote...

trobbins777 wrote...

GoG ToXiC wrote...

They had no reason to believe that the reapers were still out there. At the end of ME1 I though the reapers were pretty much gone.


In mass effect 1 you kill 1 reaper

Shepard's last words in Mass Effect are about how Sovereign was just a vanguard of the Reapers

Soveriegn tells you on virmire that their are enough reapers to darken the sky on every world. Even if that is an exaggeration. It confirms that their is a reaper fleet.

besides they were called reapers not reaper




But the whole point of ME1 is to prevent them from entering the galaxy they did as far as they knew problem solved. 


There is more than one way to enter the galaxy. The end of mass effect 1 made it clear that this was just a set back for the reapers.

Modifié par trobbins777, 25 juillet 2011 - 03:19 .


#18
trobbins777

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Xarathox wrote...

Tali's quite young. Now while she would receive acknowledgments for her actions to help defeat Saren/Geth/Sovereign she'd have little pull with much of anyone, even her own people since she doesn't sit in a position of authority. It's really hard to rally anyone to prepare for something that's universally believed to be a hoax. Even more so when you have 0 power.


I never sai that Tali had power within the quarian people. However her father, who is an admiral in the migrant fleet, does. The least she could do is mention "Hey dad, reapers are coming, could you do something about that?" 

#19
George-Kinsill

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trobbins777 wrote...

Xarathox wrote...

Tali's quite young. Now while she would receive acknowledgments for her actions to help defeat Saren/Geth/Sovereign she'd have little pull with much of anyone, even her own people since she doesn't sit in a position of authority. It's really hard to rally anyone to prepare for something that's universally believed to be a hoax. Even more so when you have 0 power.


I never sai that Tali had power within the quarian people. However her father, who is an admiral in the migrant fleet, does. The least she could do is mention "Hey dad, reapers are coming, could you do something about that?" 


She did essentially do that, an because of it, in ME: Ascension, the Quarians are looking for new planets tocolonize to have their populace wait while they wage war with the Reapers, or take back their homeworld for the same purpose. And because of her, the admirals believe in Reapers, which is saying a lot, as the council had detailed reports from Shep on the Reapers and saw an actual reaper, and not only don't believe in Reapers, but think Shepard is crazy for believing in them. So yeah,Tali helps a lot.

#20
trobbins777

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George-Kinsill wrote...

trobbins777 wrote...

Xarathox wrote...

Tali's quite young. Now while she would receive acknowledgments for her actions to help defeat Saren/Geth/Sovereign she'd have little pull with much of anyone, even her own people since she doesn't sit in a position of authority. It's really hard to rally anyone to prepare for something that's universally believed to be a hoax. Even more so when you have 0 power.


I never sai that Tali had power within the quarian people. However her father, who is an admiral in the migrant fleet, does. The least she could do is mention "Hey dad, reapers are coming, could you do something about that?" 


She did essentially do that, an because of it, in ME: Ascension, the Quarians are looking for new planets tocolonize to have their populace wait while they wage war with the Reapers, or take back their homeworld for the same purpose. And because of her, the admirals believe in Reapers, which is saying a lot, as the council had detailed reports from Shep on the Reapers and saw an actual reaper, and not only don't believe in Reapers, but think Shepard is crazy for believing in them. So yeah,Tali helps a lot.


Oh, sorry i've never read the books. Wait so was the mission on Haestrom about the Reapers?

Modifié par trobbins777, 25 juillet 2011 - 04:23 .


#21
StellarMagic

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The entire Dark Energy subplot (Dholen, Haestrom's sun being destabilized because of this) will probably be how the Reapers are destroyed or something... an Achillies Heel of some sort.

#22
AVPen

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trobbins777 wrote...

Ashley Wiliams/Kaiden Alenko, otherwise known as the Virmire Survivor, have been working with Anderson over these last few years on becoming a spectre and a number of classified ops for the Alliance. The latest one being an investigation into Cerberus' relation with missing human colonies. This eventually led to Horizon and while I wouldn't call their reaction to Shepard being alive pleasant. They do try to prove that the collectors and reapers are behind the missing colonies. We know that in Mass Effect 3 the Virmire survivor will be a spectre, and as such will have authority in and beyond the alliance, and access to cutting edge technology to use against the reapers.

I'm not going to get into a big discussion over this (because frankly, I had enough of it with trying to read through the "Restoring Trust with the VS" thread <_< ), but this whole notion that the VS has been working with the Alliance and/or the Citadel to uncover information of the Reapers while Shepard has been gone is at best, total speculation, and at worst, total bullsh*t.

In ME2, we learn flat out that Shepard was the only one trying to warn the galaxy of the Reapers and when he died, both the Citadel and the Alliance starting backsliding on the entire Reaper threat, to the point where they all denied that the Reapers even exist at all and that Soveriegn was merely a Geth creation. The Alliance didn't even suspect that the Reapers or Collectors were even involved with the missing human colonies - they thought Cerberus was involved which was the entire reason why the VS was sent to Horizon (of course, the entire thing was also a ploy by TIM to lure the Collectors in the first place, the sneaky bastard). And judging from the VS's response at the end of the mission with Shepard, it's fairly clear that he/she do not believe that the Reapers are involved in the missing colonies and are still convinced that Cerberus are the ones responsible for the disappearing human colonists (otherwise, why would they say that they'll let the Citadel decide whether to believe Shepard's story or not?). The only Alliance officials that we have seen that truly believe that the Reapers are a true threat is David Anderson and Admiral Hacket, not the VS.

Furthermore, we still have no idea as to why or even how the VS became a Spectre. For all we know, it was just a political ploy by the Alliance and Council to create a new "ideal" human Spectre to replace Shepard who's now on trial for being a mass terrorist. Simple fact is, we won't find out what happen till ME3 comes out, everything else is pure speculation and opinion on the players part.

Modifié par AVPen, 25 juillet 2011 - 05:45 .


#23
Mongerty2

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I agree that they did little against the Reapers in from the situation they were in. This is more because they were powerless, but should still be attributed to their character.

Do not be surprised if it comes to sacrificing in Mass Effect 3 and one of them gets upset/ leaves. (Think in terms of sacrificing a part of the flotilla to take out Reapers)

#24
Sepewrath

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Well with the Reapers out of the picture, what were they going to do? Its not like Shepard would have been able to do anything during those two years either, except the same thing they did in ME2, try and stop the Collectors, once the abductions started. And specifically on Tali, since at that point, the idea was the Geth were working with the Reapers, coming up with a way to take out of the Geth, would actually be very helpful.

#25
AngelicMachinery

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trobbins777 wrote...


Tali went back to helping her Father with the war against the Geth, which is another noble goal don't get me wrong


Oh  you... 

It's not noble,  it's lulzy and silly.

The Geth are too cute too be destroyed.

Modifié par AngelicMachinery, 25 juillet 2011 - 06:01 .