721 réponses à ce sujet

[PanosSmirnakos]

Overall Legacy is a good and enjoyable DLC. Propably it's the best DLC so far for the Dragon Age series, (not that the bar was set high with the previous ones though...)

PROS:

- The battles make more sense now and are more "realistic" with more attention to detail. The positioning and more complex strategy the enemies use reminded me of Origins battles. The waves mechanic is reduced dramatically and is used more logically. They are unique in design and fortunately don't use the copy & paste repetitive formula of DA II (which was a survival mode through hordes and waves of enemies).

- IMO, the structure (plotwise) and content (storywise) of Legacy's story easily makes it the most well designed mission of DA II. To be fair though, the Qunari invasion at the end of act 2 in the core game was also well designed.

- I liked the puzzles, the new party banter, the villain and the dark atmosphere (a la DAO Deep Roads) of the grey wardens prison enviroments.

CONS:

- I felt that the story of Legacy had no real connection with the main plot. The whole story of DA II feels like a series of mini stories though, so I guess one more is ok. DLC like the Return to Ostagar and Warden's Keep weren't as rich and creative as Legacy but I felt that they truly were part of the story. I mean that it was the most safe choice to make a DLC with wardens and darkspawn (again), things which were more connected to the grey warden of Origins though than a DLC which should be about the mages VS templars or about the politics of Kirkwall, you know, things which are Hawke's speciality.

- The new enviroments weren't impressive. Too empty and simple. Some places in the warden prison were ok. IMO, Dragon Age : Awakening has still the most well designed and creative enviroments of all DA games / DLC. In my humble opinion DA needs badly a new graphics engine. I don't want to compare its enviroments with other games to make my point so I'll stop here.

- The DA II darkspawn design is still a joke. The hurlock alpha and genlock design were ok (compared to simple hurlocks, ogres and emissaries), but I can't stand their ninja-metallic-tin looking armor.

For a DLC I'd rate Legacy around 7-8. So let's say a 7.5/10.

[Droma]

btw mr barrett, did you won your bet concerning the reveal of the super secret or was i too late? =D

[King Cousland]

PanosSmirnakos wrote...

Overall Legacy is a good and enjoyable DLC. Propably it's the best DLC so far for the Dragon Age series, (not that the bar was set high with the previous ones though...)

PROS:

- The battles make more sense now and are more "realistic" with more attention to detail. The positioning and more complex strategy the enemies use reminded me of Origins battles. The waves mechanic is reduced dramatically and is used more logically. They are unique in design and fortunately don't use the copy & paste repetitive formula of DA II (which was a survival mode through hordes and waves of enemies).

- IMO, the structure (plotwise) and content (storywise) of Legacy's story easily makes it the most well designed mission of DA II. To be fair though, the Qunari invasion at the end of act 2 in the core game was also well designed.

- I liked the puzzles, the new party banter, the villain and the dark atmosphere (a la DAO Deep Roads) of the grey wardens prison enviroments.

CONS:

- I felt that the story of Legacy had no real connection with the main plot. The whole story of DA II feels like a series of mini stories though, so I guess one more is ok. DLC like the Return to Ostagar and Warden's Keep weren't as rich and creative as Legacy but I felt that they truly were part of the story. I mean that it was the most safe choice to make a DLC with wardens and darkspawn (again), things which were more connected to the grey warden of Origins though than a DLC which should be about the mages VS templars or about the politics of Kirkwall, you know, things which are Hawke's speciality.

- The new enviroments weren't impressive. Too empty and simple. Some places in the warden prison were ok. IMO, Dragon Age : Awakening has still the most well designed and creative enviroments of all DA games / DLC. In my humble opinion DA needs badly a new graphics engine. I don't want to compare its enviroments with other games to make my point so I'll stop here.

- The DA II darkspawn design is still a joke. The hurlock alpha and genlock design were ok (compared to simple hurlocks, ogres and emissaries), but I can't stand their ninja-metallic-tin looking armor.

For a DLC I'd rate Legacy around 7-8. So let's say a 7.5/10.

You hit the nail on the head about the art style/graphics. It's too cartooish, detracts completely from the idea of a gritty, dakr fantasy, in fact, I don't think there was one moment in DAII that was truly chilling or dark, and the art style was at fault. All That Remains could have sent shivers down the spine, instead it ended up looking like a cliched, over the top Frankenstinian B movie. Regarding the darkspawn, they should go back to their Origins design. The Hurlock Alphas was decent, but as for the rest...ugh. They look like a 7 year old designed them based off of  God of War monsters. Gorilla genlocks? Just...ugh. 

Other than that, a great DLC.

[Merilsell]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...
I've played it a second time now. I've chosen the opposite options of the first run. Instead of a rogue I played a mage. Everything plays out the same. In te end you have dialogue with another character, but you still fight the same boss. That means, just ike the main game, any decisions have only cosmetic impact. I hope DA3 is better than that. Because of the warping back to the main story line (i.e. defeating the end boss) the dialogues become just as rationalized as DA2. It feels constructed and does not satisfy me. Still, I stick with my overall conclusion that when compared to some of the DA:O DLCs this one is much better.

Yeah, I noticed that too. Mind you I haven't played the DLC and aren't going to buy it, but I have watched the walkthrough with both outcomes. I was perplexed to see that they were both...well, the same.

Nice lore-drop, nevertheless.

[Brockololly]

PanosSmirnakos wrote...
- The new enviroments weren't impressive. Too empty and simple. Some places in the warden prison were ok. IMO, Dragon Age : Awakening has still the most well designed and creative enviroments of all DA games / DLC. In my humble opinion DA needs badly a new graphics engine. I don't want to compare its enviroments with other games to make my point so I'll stop here.

Yeah, visually DA2's environments are just so barren and sterile looking that they suck the atmosphere and ambiance right out of the game. Its nice they created new areas but (and this was a problem in Origins too) the assets used to create the areas are just recycled too much at times. Like at the Altar of Dumat or whatever, you have the recycled Jade Empire reject monster statue that was in the cave during Merill's quest. Why not just a dragon statue?

And you still have the problem where outdoors, you see next to nothing in the distance. Maybe a couple of clumpy looking mounds, but when you're given a broad expansive vista, it would be nice to see something impressive as opposed to brown sand.


And that gets to my last bit environment wise with this DLC in particular, but DA overall. This was supposedly in the Vinmark Mountains north of Kirkwall, right? So this would be the same range as Sundermount? Yet Sundermount and the surrounding area looked more like Ireland with a cool, rainy sky with green/gray mountains as far as you could see. Yet, the Vinmark Mountains in DA2 look more like a Tatooine desert wasteland. What's the deal? Sure climate/geography/weather can change quickly over distance but especially with no active travelling from one spot to the next, this kind of vastly disparate environment design makes it feel like you may as well be on a different continent.

Just have some damn environmental/geographical consistency!

[Blessed Silence]

mdtalbot wrote...

Am I the only one that wasn't that keen on the last boss fight? It just seemed like it was a simple strategy whose execution was made unnecessarily difficult by the game's control scheme, thus making me feel like I was fighting the UI rather than the boss.

Eh I have to agree with this.  Even on Casual I got my butt handed to me because no matter where I clicked, dummy Varric and Sebastian ran the opposite or long way around (especially during those rocks from the ground part).  Needless to say .. they died alot. 

[Blessed Silence]

happy_daiz wrote...

Cutlass Jack wrote...

john-in-france wrote...

Good party chatter going on, and even better references to the state of the LI plotline. Apparently my Hawke is now married to the Prince (?!) and the wedding was beautiful. Bethany apologised for not being there. Huzzah!
Lots of chat from Sebastian too... (now all you need to do is show us the wedding in a Starkhaven DLC...hint.)

Whoa, really? That's a pretty big bombshell to drop offscreen. But nifty though.

So much for no spoilers.   Makes me want to try it with my Sebastian rivalmance playthrough.

That sucks because my Sebastian was VERY quiet through the whole game outside of 3 cutscenes ...

[Blessed Silence]

R2s Muse wrote...

I *really* appreciate, in principle, the acknowledgement the Sebastian friendmance receives (I hear), but this makes me doubly sad about a big con: that with my 100% rivalmanced Sebastian there is no mention at all of our romance from lil bro Carver or anyone else. I know he's waiting to "offer" me a prince, but it'd be nice to know we were at least ...dating?? Or mooning? Or something?

Can anyone tell me WHEN does this happen?  I'm going to be seriously ticked if I have to keep restarting this DLC for anyone to say anything ...

I friendromanced Sebastian through to the end and played a post campaign .. and the little prince barely said a word the entire time, trigger points or cutscenes (I count 3 coutscenes and maybe 3 lines outside battle that's it).  No mention of our romance from him or anyone else.

This is what has me angry how it seems to have worked for other people but not for me.  *growl*  I killed Anders for you you Starkhaven dandy! 

[Tyrium]

I absolutey adored it - it was well paced, the storyline was consistently interesting, the combat was enjoyable, and the banter was inspired. If this is the way Dragon Age is going, I'm 100% on board. I also loved the references to my Anders/F!Hawke romance.

One thing - might want to look at some triggers - Anders asked me if I'd heard from Carver in the Wardens at all, while he was standing right next to them both...

Modifié par Tyrium, 28 juillet 2011 - 12:37 .

[lillegraa]

alright so here we go:

Pros:
-new and varied enviroments was nice
-romance (or at least with Anders, have only just finished my first playthrough) acknowledged
-engaging story (I had to leave a little while after starting the DLC to go to my grandparents house, and I was very much curious as to why they wanted Hawkes blood, who/what Corypheus was, etc)
-waves made more sense and were less "fifty ninjas pop out of nowhere to attack you"-esque.
-lovely tactical combat (especially the last one. It was one great big cluster**** of spells and weirdness and I loved it)
-cute and funny banter
-took me about 3-3½ hour to finish, which I thought was a nice length
-the sidequests were good too; didn't take too much attention from the main quest, but at the same time added a little "spice", so to speak
-puzzles!
-it was cute when Leandra and Hawke were talking at the fireplace after finishing the DLC, it sort of made Hawke feel more "real"; that she still thought about and missed her (or his) mother (uhh, if certain stuff had happend). Same goes for the Carver bit (or Bethany, I assume, if you're not a mage), that was very sweet also and it felt nice that they could still connect, even if Carver was no longer part of the team. It was good to see that they could talk about what had happend as brother and sister, without any rivalry or mage-templar arguing (don't get me wrong, I like the sibling-rivalry, but it's nice when it's acknowledged that they still love eachother)
-featured Anders being absolutely adorable and tragic and conflicted and I wanted to hug him

Cons:
-environments were still very, well, brown. It goes with the "way out in the middle of nowhere" setting of this DLC nicely, but in the future I would also like to see some more colours (pink forest yay). I did like the warden tower though.
-I would have liked it if the story had felt a little more connected to the continuation of the story after the main game is finished. Like if it had seemed a bit more important to finding out Hawke's whereabouts after she (or he) runs off into the sunset; then again, I don't know the future DLC so maybe it will prove to have been important to the Seekers' quest? hmm...
-there should have been an option to give Anders a great big hug :<

Anyway, I really enjoyed this DLC and I feel a lot of the areas that were problematic in DA2 have been greatly improved upon. I will definitely be buying the next DLC

edit: after reading a bit more on these forums, it seems some people were/are having a hard time with the last boss. I played on normal and wiped once because Anders died in the beginning of the battle. Second time I paid a lot more attention (damn suicidal companions!) but I feel it helped make it all the more of an enjoyable and fulfilling battle when you had to keep your eyes open like that The Arishok duel had a similar "oh ****" vibe to me. That's a good thing.

Modifié par lillegraa, 28 juillet 2011 - 01:39 .

[oui_je_danse]

It would be my pleasure and honor to offer some feedback on Dragon Age II Legacy. I made a point of NOT reading any other comments on the forums before writing this, but I hope the general reaction is similar to mine.


I loved Dragon Age II Legacy.


Story: Overall I thought the story was entertaining and immersive. There were moments where I actually felt physically tense because the music and environment were working with the narrative so well.

Normally I wait until later to read codex entries, but I was so intrigued by what was happening I read the new ones and rechecked older entries as well. Legacy is a treat to people interested in DA lore.

Hawke’s Family: Beautifully done. It’s not just that you learn more about Malcolm Hawke. It’s seeing how Hawke and Bethany/Carver react. Their discussions and side comments with one another. The family dynamics are much stronger in Legacy than I think a lot of DA2. I really dug their grappling with the memory of their father and re-examining it based on events.

Party Interactions: Oh BioWare, I’d pay $10 just for more party banter. I played through with Hawke/Varric/Circle!Bethany/LI!Anders. While there may be parties with more hilarious banter (tumblr exploded with people trading quotes), I really appreciated the emotional gravitas of my mix. I’ll probably try multiple playthroughs to see how different companions change the mood of the DLC.

I thought the characters’ writers did a great job of providing a mix of funny and weighty dialogue. None of it felt like “fanservice”. Just… the characters reacting honestly to the situation. Bringing all the voice actors back was completely the right call.

On a personal note – Anders! Anders in Legacy! *Not typing spoilers despite urges* Someone give that writer specifically a gold star from me.

Setting: The outside vistas were quite nice and I liked how all the different sections were split at different heights. It made the place FEEL big and sprawling. Going through one section and being able to look up/across does more for the player than a larger overall map with closed off segments.

Combat: I never fuss too much over this. It felt better? One of my favorite moments of the DLC was early on when I spun the camera around and, surprise!, there was a line Carta assassins just standing there behind me. It’s hard to explain. It was both perfectly explicable and a good “eep” moment.

I liked how the boss battle was a multi-step process and ended with a one-on-one featuring my poor, battered Hawke. It added to the tension.


Conclusion: Legacy was great. More like this! Dragon Age II’s strength really is the interpersonal relationships and this DLC was just a feast of companion/family interactions.

I’m not sure how helpful my feedback is (I sort of just gushed), but I have no doubt all the sour apples have already posted every imaginable criticism (many undeserved).

[Weltenschlange]

My Legacy express-review (this is just one person's personal opinion):


Good:
- varied locales
- challenging fights
- interesting puzzles
- nice side-quests
- cool reveal concerning the big bad's identity
- fits perfectly into Act 3 (adds much needed content and I especially like the little talk with Mama Hawke at the end)
- the Grey Warden Armor looks great (rogue version)
- cheesewheel


Bad:
- storage chest and party gather horn in the middle of the dungeon were a bit immersion-braking, the quick-travel-griffins would have sufficed
- the 'Key' is ugly as sin (rogue version) - seriously again like with the item pack DLC, WHY? It looks like a tainted darkspawn weapon - blades can in fact be deadly AND elegant...
- and as much as I like the final boss - I LOATHE the final boss fight! It comes down to me having to herd four cats equipped with HerpDerp pathfinding through a deadly labyrinth and frantically trying to keep them from being toasted - very hard but not in a good way - definitely NOT FUN! Oh and the fact that you have to kill the shades before you can proceed although the statues are visibly deactivated - BAD IDEA! (No Varric, don't run that way! No Aveline don't get stuck behind that rock! AARGH, YOU ZARKING PORMWRANGLERS, HOW DARE YOU PEOPLE DIE!?!)


Overall rating:
4 out of 5 smoldering companion corpses

Modifié par Weltenschlange, 28 juillet 2011 - 01:47 .

[Tommy6860]

My two cents:

I gave the DLC two complete play-throughs and I didn't like it overall. Felt no different than what the DA2 gameplay was to me, that being, the lack of playing the game as an RPG, my choices still mattered little to none. 1st run I used my Rogue with Varric, Merrill and Bethany, 2nd run I used my Mage with Aveline, Isabela and Bethany (I used Bethany both times in case of the need for healing, I was correct both times).

What I did like:

- The convos were good and funny as well. Having Aveline and Isabela is a treat. Isabela's first remark at the beginning had me off my chair (no, I won't say what she said).
- The removal of the wave drops with enemies being there, or coming out behind me, that was good.
- More loot and more useful as well.
- More open world, though linear still, it felt large.
- I like the puzzles when taking a side in both runs, they were different.

What I didn't like:

- The Genlocks; they didn't even act like the sentient Genlock did in Origins, as they suddenly change into a derpy looking mini-me of the DA2 Orge. It also looked and moved like a hairless tainted avatar of Donkey Kong.
- Still no interaction with companions, nothing but ambient convos, total bummer.
- Still too much junk, why? (what's with all of the stale biscuits, though I know who used that term in DA2, was that supposed to allude to something)?
- Ending boss looks were too reminiscent of The Architech from Awakening (just like Orsino turning into a remake of The Harvester at the end of Act III in DA2, where's your originality Bioware?) .
- No real alternative ending, and after it's all done and said, the home convos are still the same no matter.
- Doesn't give any more real definition on the Hawke family, other than what little bit is explained that had been done through the Legacy storyline regarding certain family members. At the end, the story felt disjointed and without much purpose as to why this adventure was needed. (Maybe that is just me though)

LotSB is (still) hands down, the best DLC ever put out by Bioware.

Modifié par Tommy6860, 28 juillet 2011 - 02:03 .

[Blacklash93]

Tommy6860 wrote...


- Ending boss looks were too reminiscent of The Architech from Awakening (just like Orsino turning into a remake of The Harvester at the end of Act III in DA2, where's your originality Bioware?) .

He's supposed to look like the Architect. And the two battles were nothing alike.

- Still no interaction with companions, nothing but ambient convos, total bummer.

There was plenty of non-ambient dialogue with Anders and the sibling. Varric had some, too.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 28 juillet 2011 - 01:59 .

[Reptillius]

I didn't have any pathing issues or anything in the last fight... Wonder if it's just because of My PC or what.

[Sidney]

Blessed Silence wrote...

mdtalbot wrote...

Am I the only one that wasn't that keen on the last boss fight? It just seemed like it was a simple strategy whose execution was made unnecessarily difficult by the game's control scheme, thus making me feel like I was fighting the UI rather than the boss.

Eh I have to agree with this.  Even on Casual I got my butt handed to me because no matter where I clicked, dummy Varric and Sebastian ran the opposite or long way around (especially during those rocks from the ground part).  Needless to say .. they died alot. 

Yeah final boss battle was a bad idea (it is a cheese-tasic boss instead of a stand up fight) and the ability to execute the batte was grossly hamper by a terrible control where you allies would neither follow you nor stand still properly.

[Tommy6860]

Blacklash93 wrote..


He's supposed to look like the Architect. And the two battles were nothing alike.

By whose definition? That isn't what the ending boss was from the historical perspective. Both ending battles were exactly the same (and the battle was designed poorly to be honest, as my companions were clueless in battle) and the outcome, exactly the same.The only difference is the choice I make in the middle of the run,  who I side with and then who dies from that choice. Not much to speak of really.

There was plenty of non-ambient dialogue with Anders and the sibling. Varric had some, too.

No, there was not. I could not initiate convos on my own, that is what I am talking about. I don't want the game (or any RPG) to do it for me.

Modifié par Tommy6860, 28 juillet 2011 - 02:11 .

[Blacklash93]

Tommy6860 wrote...


By whose definition? That isn't what the ending boss was from the historical perspective. Both ending battles were exactly the same (and the battle was designed poorly to be honest, as my companions were clueless in battle) and the outcome, exactly the same.The only difference is the choice I make in the middle of the run,  who I side with and then who dies from that choice. Not much to speak of really.

I meant the battles with the Architect and Corypheus were completely different.

No, there was not. I could not initiate convos on my own, that is what I am talking about. I don't want the game (or any RPG) to do it for me.

Ambient dialogue = Dialogue outside of conversations.

Party memebers involved themselves plenty of times in conversations. Whether or not it was initiated by you is irrelevant.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 28 juillet 2011 - 02:18 .

[Morroian]

Tommy6860 wrote...

LotSB is (still) hands down, the best DLC ever put out by Bioware.

I don't see how LOTSB is much different especially in terms of choice. I've only played LOTSB once but doesn't it come down to either restarting the Liara romance or not and if you didn't romance her there's even less. 

[Dave of Canada]

Morroian wrote...

I don't see how LOTSB is much different especially in terms of choice. I've only played LOTSB once but doesn't it come down to either restarting the Liara romance or not and if you didn't romance her there's even less. 

"Ending" the romance doesn't end it in the context of ME2 either (saying you want her when you've "cheated" on her doesn't end the other romance, nor does saying you moved on make the photo disappear from your desk). Whatever happens, it always ends up with Liara somehow being your best friend (regardless of how you treated her before LOTSB) and she becomes the Shadow Broker. All Shepard can do is say "Good job!" or "Bad job!".

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 28 juillet 2011 - 02:28 .

[Tommy6860]

Blacklash93 wrote...

I meant the battles with the Architect and Corypheus were completely different.

Well, of course that's true, but you didn't say that before, now did you?

Ambient dialogue = Dialogue outside of conversations.

Party memebers involved themselves plenty of times in conversations. Whether or not it was initiated by you is irrelevant.

What part of my review did you get when I stated, and this will be essentially a third time now I state that I cannot iniitiate the convos on my own. It was a major gripe of mine in DA2 and still is in Legacy (though claims of change were there, just only in combat). I want to convos to happen when I click on companions and then chat, not scripted to do engage in convos. Ambient convos are fine and I like them, but they have no input from my behalf.

Modifié par Tommy6860, 28 juillet 2011 - 02:29 .

[Morroian]

Tommy6860 wrote...

- Doesn't give any more real definition on the Hawke family, other than what little bit is explained that had been done through the Legacy storyline regarding certain family members. At the end, the story felt disjointed and without much purpose as to why this adventure was needed. (Maybe that is just me though).

Just on this bit it adds greatly to the lore and it gives further background to Hawke.

[In Exile]

After much thought, here is a major complaint I have with Legacy: it had no connection at all to Kirkwall. I suppose it was available from the mansion because it was post-campaign... but it would have been nice for the action (the Carta attack) to occur in-game at the house, leading Hawke to Vinmark. As it is, the quest seems like it has *nothing* to do with the main game content wise (it just starts, no connection to anything).