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[whykikyouwhy]

MisanthropePrime wrote...

Here's something interesting (sorry if it's been pointed out before):

What beings have been shown to transfer consciousness to another body upon death? The Archdemons: something Corypheus has been said to mimic throughout the DLC. It also explains my question of "why didn't he possess someone instantly upon awakening"- because he needs to be killed, much like an archdemon, and will then possess the nearest tainted individual, like how the Archdemon goes to a Grey Warden or Morrigan's unborn child (who, being fathered by a warden, presumably carries the taint).

Of course, the question therein is why does it (theoretically) go to Larius or Janeka, rather than Carver, Bethany or Anders, if they're in your group. Now, Anders may not have any "room" in his body, due to justice being there, but you've got to wonder why he couldn't possess Carver or Bethany. I'd have loved if BW allowed an alternate ending if you brought along your sibling and they were a grey warden, wherein they get possessed by Corypheus instead of Larius or Janeka, and the NPCs only getting possessed if they are not brought along.

I would imagine that possessing or inhabiting a being is made much easier when there is some willingness, or the natural defenses of the mind (and soul?) are hindered somewhat. Both Larius and Janeka have the Taint - this certainly makes them more susceptible to things darkspawn (the Calling, the presence, etc). And Larius is certainly in a deeper state of decay, as it were - he would be a ready vessel. So too, Corypheus has been weakened in the battle - it would take much less effort on his part to inhabit a seemingly willing host rather than a Grey Warden sibling or a mage who would be in full possession of his/her resolve.

Though...dealing with a possessed sibling would be incredibly interesting. But probably not the best move. The outcry over Hawke not being able to prevent that would be tremendous.

Modifié par whykikyouwhy, 28 juillet 2011 - 09:22 .

[TheJediSaint]

MisanthropePrime wrote...

Here's something interesting (sorry if it's been pointed out before):

What beings have been shown to transfer consciousness to another body upon death? The Archdemons: something Corypheus has been said to mimic throughout the DLC. It also explains my question of "why didn't he possess someone instantly upon awakening"- because he needs to be killed, much like an archdemon, and will then possess the nearest tainted individual, like how the Archdemon goes to a Grey Warden or Morrigan's unborn child (who, being fathered by a warden, presumably carries the taint).

Of course, the question therein is why does it (theoretically) go to Larius or Janeka, rather than Carver, Bethany or Anders, if they're in your group. Now, Anders may not have any "room" in his body, due to justice being there, but you've got to wonder why he couldn't possess Carver or Bethany. I'd have loved if BW allowed an alternate ending if you brought along your sibling and they were a grey warden, wherein they get possessed by Corypheus instead of Larius or Janeka, and the NPCs only getting possessed if they are not brought along.

I would like to make the point that both Janeka and Larius had spent much more time exposed to Corypheus than either Anders or your potentally Grey Warden sibling.  I don't think your companions would have had enough time to fall under Corypheus' thrall. 

[The Earl Of Bronze]

MisanthropePrime wrote...

Here's something interesting (sorry if it's been pointed out before):

What beings have been shown to transfer consciousness to another body upon death? The Archdemons: something Corypheus has been said to mimic throughout the DLC. It also explains my question of "why didn't he possess someone instantly upon awakening"- because he needs to be killed, much like an archdemon, and will then possess the nearest tainted individual, like how the Archdemon goes to a Grey Warden or Morrigan's unborn child (who, being fathered by a warden, presumably carries the taint).

Of course, the question therein is why does it (theoretically) go to Larius or Janeka, rather than Carver, Bethany or Anders, if they're in your group. Now, Anders may not have any "room" in his body, due to justice being there, but you've got to wonder why he couldn't possess Carver or Bethany. I'd have loved if BW allowed an alternate ending if you brought along your sibling and they were a grey warden, wherein they get possessed by Corypheus instead of Larius or Janeka, and the NPCs only getting possessed if they are not brought along.

Hawkes already beaten him once, sort of, so he would probably not want to get too close to him, going into Larius or Janeka gives him a sort of freedom going into Carver or Bethany would not allow.

[whykikyouwhy]

On a side note, the possibility of possession by Corypheus makes me think of the movie Fallen,  with Denzel Washington. And if that plot is paralleled in the DA universe, with the body-hopping, chaos will reign. 

[TEWR]

Filament wrote...

Flemeth also possesses people. We do not know if the ritual includes her death.

Of course, demons possess people as well.

I'm thinking Flemeth's body swap ritual may be the same as Corypheus'. Perhaps Flemeth learned from the Tevinters? Or vice-versa?

I'm more inclined to believe the latter.

[Prince of Kemet]

Let's look at the facts...since I sided with Janeka, I will post based on the ending involving her.

1.Corypheus says..."If I can't leave with you, I will leave through you.

2.Janeka makes a failed attempt to bind Corypheus using a spell that had no effect on him at all. My theory is, this spell was actually implanted into her mind by Corypheus. I also think that the spell was a rouse to give Janeka a false sense of security so that she would attempt to pursue Hawke and Bethany/Carver to begin with.

3.Janeka says after everything has concluded that she will take the long walk. Since we all know what the long walk is, I won't get into it but, I feel that this version means that Janeka will take the long walk to unite the remaining Dark Spawn to find the remaining 2 old gods.

4.I think that based on what we've learned, Flemeth and Corypheus are both Magisters that invaded the Black City.
 
5.Either Sandal is a Magister as well or he is in fact an old god. Remember Bodahn saying that he was found in the Deep Roads, hmm. Let us not forget the power that Sandal has.....remember the Fort Draken carnage??? Remember the carnage in the Deep Roads from DA2??? Remember Sandal telling Hawke about the scary lady?... possibly Flemeth?

5.It was Flemeth that hatched the plan for Morrigan to go with the Grey Warden in order to possible gain access to the soul of an old god.

I think that the old Tevinter Magisters are once again gathering to free the remaining old gods so that they once again can make an attempt to enter the Black City.

What do you guys and gals think?

Modifié par Prince of Kemet, 28 juillet 2011 - 11:57 .

[MisanthropePrime]

For all those saying Janeka and Larius were "corrupted" for longer or "more susceptible", remember: Loghain could take the consciousness of the Old God after becoming a Grey Warden after the Landsmeet, which shouldn't be that long, and Morrigan's baby could despite only being CONCEIVED right before the fight. How long you've had the taint or how long you've been near the old god, conceivably, shouldn't affect it.

[The Earl Of Bronze]

MisanthropePrime wrote...

For all those saying Janeka and Larius were "corrupted" for longer or "more susceptible", remember: Loghain could take the consciousness of the Old God after becoming a Grey Warden after the Landsmeet, which shouldn't be that long, and Morrigan's baby could despite only being CONCEIVED right before the fight. How long you've had the taint or how long you've been near the old god, conceivably, shouldn't affect it.

Corypheus isn't an archdemon/old god, but a magister, who is able to influence/control through the blight/taint.

[Rifneno]

I'm not sure the switch is actually related to the darkspawn taint, it may have simply been a highly advanced magic. Watch the scene where Hawke strikes Cory down. Cory isn't fighting back or even defending. He's staring directly at the soon-to-be-possessed Warden in the background. I think the switch happened then, right before the deathblow. And that it was a switcharoo, not the type of possession that the archdemon uses. Meaning the warden became the mind/spirit/soul/whatever in the ancient magister's body.

I don't know why Flemeth is coming into this much. We don't know that she possesses anyone. Morrigan claimed it, but Morrigan's not what you'd call trustworthy (Shale even called her out on it... when statues are calling you out on your bull****, you need to at least TRY to be a better liar) and she later says in Witch Hunt that she didn't really know Flemeth's intentions. As for her being one of those magisters herself, the only thing I've seen that hinted that way was her response to Carver on Sundermount. The way she talks about regret... I've never heard her use that tone. Her being one of those magisters would explain it. Now the Architect, there's another magister. There was something... wrong with him. Beyond the taint. Cory had it too. Now that deformation makes sense. It looks like he went through some kind of supernatural transportation and didn't come back together exactly right. Because that's what happened.

That said, I do hope Flemeth IS one of the magisters. She seems to be overall a force of good. I trust she'll find Cory and enlighten him, hopefully persuading him to her less evil ways. It's possible he may not be the supervillain that we expect in the future. He carried the original taint... but was it a taint of the body, or the soul? The OGB story indicates it's of the body and not the soul. The eldritch abomination body is now dead. If he's going to be a problem, I believe it'll be as Irenicus 2.0 rather than as a Reaper indoctrination device like he was. (Sweet, a BG reference in the same sentence as an ME reference, about DA.)

[Prince of Kemet]

Rifneno wrote...

I'm not sure the switch is actually related to the darkspawn taint, it may have simply been a highly advanced magic. Watch the scene where Hawke strikes Cory down. Cory isn't fighting back or even defending. He's staring directly at the soon-to-be-possessed Warden in the background. I think the switch happened then, right before the deathblow. And that it was a switcharoo, not the type of possession that the archdemon uses. Meaning the warden became the mind/spirit/soul/whatever in the ancient magister's body.

I don't know why Flemeth is coming into this much. We don't know that she possesses anyone. Morrigan claimed it, but Morrigan's not what you'd call trustworthy (Shale even called her out on it... when statues are calling you out on your bull****, you need to at least TRY to be a better liar) and she later says in Witch Hunt that she didn't really know Flemeth's intentions. As for her being one of those magisters herself, the only thing I've seen that hinted that way was her response to Carver on Sundermount. The way she talks about regret... I've never heard her use that tone. Her being one of those magisters would explain it. Now the Architect, there's another magister. There was something... wrong with him. Beyond the taint. Cory had it too. Now that deformation makes sense. It looks like he went through some kind of supernatural transportation and didn't come back together exactly right. Because that's what happened.

That said, I do hope Flemeth IS one of the magisters. She seems to be overall a force of good. I trust she'll find Cory and enlighten him, hopefully persuading him to her less evil ways. It's possible he may not be the supervillain that we expect in the future. He carried the original taint... but was it a taint of the body, or the soul? The OGB story indicates it's of the body and not the soul. The eldritch abomination body is now dead. If he's going to be a problem, I believe it'll be as Irenicus 2.0 rather than as a Reaper indoctrination device like he was. (Sweet, a BG reference in the same sentence as an ME reference, about DA.)

You made some very good points Rifneno. What about Sandal?

[Prince of Kemet]

Does anyone know how many Tevinter Magisters there were to begin with?

[MisanthropePrime]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

MisanthropePrime wrote...

For all those saying Janeka and Larius were "corrupted" for longer or "more susceptible", remember: Loghain could take the consciousness of the Old God after becoming a Grey Warden after the Landsmeet, which shouldn't be that long, and Morrigan's baby could despite only being CONCEIVED right before the fight. How long you've had the taint or how long you've been near the old god, conceivably, shouldn't affect it.

Corypheus isn't an archdemon/old god, but a magister, who is able to influence/control through the blight/taint.

Of course he isn't, but my theory hinges on him being close enough to an old god that his method of possessiong Larius/Janeka is similar to the way an old god possesses the closest darkspawn/tainted individual when it's killed. If it follows the same rules, which it might not, I wonder why Anders, Bethany and Carver weren't viable possession targets.

[MisterJB]

Prince of Kemet wrote...

Does anyone know how many Tevinter Magisters there were to begin with?

During the cinematic intro to DA:O, they were consistently shown to be five.

[Prince of Kemet]

MisterJB wrote...

Prince of Kemet wrote...

Does anyone know how many Tevinter Magisters there were to begin with?

During the cinematic intro to DA:O, they were consistently shown to be five.

Thanx.

[Prince of Kemet]

MisanthropePrime wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

MisanthropePrime wrote...

For all those saying Janeka and Larius were "corrupted" for longer or "more susceptible", remember: Loghain could take the consciousness of the Old God after becoming a Grey Warden after the Landsmeet, which shouldn't be that long, and Morrigan's baby could despite only being CONCEIVED right before the fight. How long you've had the taint or how long you've been near the old god, conceivably, shouldn't affect it.

Corypheus isn't an archdemon/old god, but a magister, who is able to influence/control through the blight/taint.

Of course he isn't, but my theory hinges on him being close enough to an old god that his method of possessiong Larius/Janeka is similar to the way an old god possesses the closest darkspawn/tainted individual when it's killed. If it follows the same rules, which it might not, I wonder why Anders, Bethany and Carver weren't viable possession targets.

Remember...he was inprisoned by Hawke blood therefore, had he taken Bethany/Carver he may have been going from a typical prison cell to solitary confinement...so to say.

[The Earl Of Bronze]

MisanthropePrime wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

MisanthropePrime wrote...

For all those saying Janeka and Larius were "corrupted" for longer or "more susceptible", remember: Loghain could take the consciousness of the Old God after becoming a Grey Warden after the Landsmeet, which shouldn't be that long, and Morrigan's baby could despite only being CONCEIVED right before the fight. How long you've had the taint or how long you've been near the old god, conceivably, shouldn't affect it.

Corypheus isn't an archdemon/old god, but a magister, who is able to influence/control through the blight/taint.

Of course he isn't, but my theory hinges on him being close enough to an old god that his method of possessiong Larius/Janeka is similar to the way an old god possesses the closest darkspawn/tainted individual when it's killed. If it follows the same rules, which it might not, I wonder why Anders, Bethany and Carver weren't viable possession targets.

Anders is most likely protected from such by Justice, Bethany and Carver possibly protected by their blood. Also Corypheus says during the battle that he didn't expect Hawke to be so strong or something like that, so maybe he is a bit fearful or wary of the Hawkes.

[FaeQueenCory]

It wouldn't be too surprising if the Magisters responsible for the taint could ride it just as the Archdemons do.... They display the ability to manipulate the Song, so why not the soul-jumping too?

[FieryDove]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...


I'm thinking Flemeth's body swap ritual may be the same as Corypheus'. Perhaps Flemeth learned from the Tevinters? Or vice-versa?

I'm more inclined to believe the latter.

Or maybe there is no body swapping ritual. It could have been a ruse to throw people off on who/what she really is.

I wonder which is the *safer* choice. A mage or a warrior. I say warrior so Larius it is for me. We have enough rabid mages as-is.

[BigEvil]

whykikyouwhy wrote...

On a side note, the possibility of possession by Corypheus makes me think of the movie Fallen,  with Denzel Washington. And if that plot is paralleled in the DA universe, with the body-hopping, chaos will reign. 

I just imagined Merril randomly turning to Hawke and singing "time is on my side" in a creepy tone. On a completely unrelated note, I'm not going to sleep well tonight.

[kablekarr]

I don't know whether anyone else noticed this (I'm going to guess they have) But just before you finish Corypheus, his eyes seem to leak some black gunk (Or smoke) and I think he smiles,

[Macropodmum]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

MisanthropePrime wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

MisanthropePrime wrote...

For all those saying Janeka and Larius were "corrupted" for longer or "more susceptible", remember: Loghain could take the consciousness of the Old God after becoming a Grey Warden after the Landsmeet, which shouldn't be that long, and Morrigan's baby could despite only being CONCEIVED right before the fight. How long you've had the taint or how long you've been near the old god, conceivably, shouldn't affect it.

Corypheus isn't an archdemon/old god, but a magister, who is able to influence/control through the blight/taint.

Of course he isn't, but my theory hinges on him being close enough to an old god that his method of possessiong Larius/Janeka is similar to the way an old god possesses the closest darkspawn/tainted individual when it's killed. If it follows the same rules, which it might not, I wonder why Anders, Bethany and Carver weren't viable possession targets.

Anders is most likely protected from such by Justice, Bethany and Carver possibly protected by their blood. Also Corypheus says during the battle that he didn't expect Hawke to be so strong or something like that, so maybe he is a bit fearful or wary of the Hawkes.

Add too this that possesion of your sibling would be easier to identify (having known them your entire life) than a stranger..

[Rifneno]

kablekarr wrote...

I don't know whether anyone else noticed this (I'm going to guess they have) But just before you finish Corypheus, his eyes seem to leak some black gunk (Or smoke) and I think he smiles,

Someone needs to photoshop this into a Marlboro ad.  It will be glorious.

[AcidRelic]

Prince of Kemet wrote...

*Snip*


4.I think that based on what we've learned, Flemeth and Corypheus are both Magisters that invaded the Black City.
 
5.Either Sandal is a Magister as well or he is in fact an old god. Remember Bodahn saying that he was found in the Deep Roads, hmm. Let us not forget the power that Sandal has.....remember the Fort Draken carnage??? Remember the carnage in the Deep Roads from DA2??? Remember Sandal telling Hawke about the scary lady?... possibly Flemeth?  ACID RELIC -- and lets not forget the prophecy he says in DA2 when you click him enough

5.It was Flemeth that hatched the plan for Morrigan to go with the Grey Warden in order to possible gain access to the soul of an old god.

I think that the old Tevinter Magisters are once again gathering to free the remaining old gods so that they once again can make an attempt to enter the Black City.

What do you guys and gals think?

I never thought of this(except for the Sandal thing, that's for another thread), it seems interesting. I can see Flemeth and Corypheus either working together or being enemies as the old Magisters we're known not to share power and have the need to get stronger than the others.

[Fangirl17]

AcidRelic wrote...

Prince of Kemet wrote...

*Snip*


4.I think that based on what we've learned, Flemeth and Corypheus are both Magisters that invaded the Black City.
 
5.Either Sandal is a Magister as well or he is in fact an old god. Remember Bodahn saying that he was found in the Deep Roads, hmm. Let us not forget the power that Sandal has.....remember the Fort Draken carnage??? Remember the carnage in the Deep Roads from DA2??? Remember Sandal telling Hawke about the scary lady?... possibly Flemeth?  ACID RELIC -- and lets not forget the prophecy he says in DA2 when you click him enough

5.It was Flemeth that hatched the plan for Morrigan to go with the Grey Warden in order to possible gain access to the soul of an old god.

I think that the old Tevinter Magisters are once again gathering to free the remaining old gods so that they once again can make an attempt to enter the Black City.

What do you guys and gals think?

I never thought of this(except for the Sandal thing, that's for another thread), it seems interesting. I can see Flemeth and Corypheus either working together or being enemies as the old Magisters we're known not to share power and have the need to get stronger than the others.

OoooOOoooo thats a VERY interesting theory! Remember when that statue mention something about magisters rising again in Witch Hunt? XD I like this theory very much.