54 réponses à ce sujet

[Seboist]

I'm worried that not enough important characters are going to die.

[Uzrbital]

I don't want too many deaths, because ME2 just made me so sad that it've been following me for days now. Luckily, I managed to save everyone but Miranda, but I dun give a **** about her.

[Drone223]

SInce this is the end of shepards story it should be fesiable for squad members (Liara and the VS in particular) to die by our choices not like a vimire situation, The SM is just too easy to save everyone
 

[Uzrbital]

Drone223 wrote...

SInce this is the end of shepards story it should be fesiable for squad members (Liara and the VS in particular) to die by our choices not like a vimire situation, The SM is just too easy to save everyone
 

I can't save Miranda whatever I do. She's the only team mate who isn't loyal, but I'm not picking her for fireteam leader or specialist, and not my team mate. But she still dies.

[Tonymac]

I remember learning the playthroughs as it were - before I was on the BSN boards. I used to have a lot of trouble with Jack's loyalty. I used to play as a renegon or a paragade - choosing answers about how I felt and not sticking with the paragon / renegade options.
I also never had read that wonderful post by Pacifen and Occam's Razor about hold the line. Until it was explained I was clueless - it would have been a nightmare to figure out. Sure, its logical (in a way) but from the view of an outsider it's insanity. For those of us who were just playing to have fun and not following the developers 'pipeline' ideas, you are lost.
I used to have to work very hard to keep Mordin and Jack alive. Seeing the Collectors walk over Mordins corpse used to make me so sad - but I knew there was a way to save him. Thats why I came to the boards - to learn how to save them all. The Suicide Mission is easy - only once you knew how to do it though - and it takes a lot of work donig everything in order and getting the upgrades in place for your squad and the ship.
Normally, when I play I want everyone to live - thats just my style. I think it takes extra effort to have them live, and I am willing to put it in to see that they make it.
I would like to see that kind of a thing work for ME3

[Bathorite]

I don't think anyone's death should be unavoidable. No plot armor but also no being painted into a corner either. Any deaths should be consequences of choices, actions or chance not forgone conclusions. A death that is forced upon you doesn't somehow add drama and depth to the story, a death you fail to prevent or narrowly avoid or inadvertently cause is far better. The Virmire choice was great, failing to talk Wrex down from attacking, also great, the Morinth/Samara battle was great too. If any character was just unavoidably killed, including Shepard I would find it annoying.

In a game with so much depending on choice and actions there should be a range of consequences ranging from utter catastrophe to flawless victory and many stages in between. I am fine with some death, just don't force it.

Before someone says it, I know that unavoidable death happens in real life, I just hate it in games, games are fantasy.

[racer700]

Uzrbital wrote...

Drone223 wrote...

SInce this is the end of shepards story it should be fesiable for squad members (Liara and the VS in particular) to die by our choices not like a vimire situation, The SM is just too easy to save everyone
 

I can't save Miranda whatever I do. She's the only team mate who isn't loyal, but I'm not picking her for fireteam leader or specialist, and not my team mate. But she still dies.

i keep miranda's loyalty because i can keep jack alive through the ending, when you chose the final squad mates, pick Thane and Miranda, doesn't matter what order and jack will live, it worked for me.

Modifié par racer700, 28 juillet 2011 - 01:35 .

[Worrywort]

It's the end of the world but don't you dare let my favorite characters die that would be completely unfeasible.

[Ieldra]

Uzrbital wrote...
I can't save Miranda whatever I do. She's the only team mate who isn't loyal, but I'm not picking her for fireteam leader or specialist, and not my team mate. But she still dies.

Leave Garrus, Zaeed and Grunt to hold the line. Then one unloyal team member, whoever it is, will survive.

[Ieldra]

As for people dieing, I think that yes, people should die. If we can save them, that should come at a cost - some NPC's death, another planet harvested by the Reapers, that kind of cost. I can also see another Virmire-like situation.

Unavoidable deaths of specific team members should be avoided, though. Except for those where it is foreshadowed, like Thane. If you want X to survive, you should be able to save him or her. You might not like the cost, though.

[nightcobra]

i liked how you could save your members if you prepared well enough in ME2.

doesn't anyone like happy endings anymore? for some reason it HAS to be either bittersweet or dark nowadays.
in a choice driven game i'd rather have the whole spectrum in which i can choose the story's outcome (black, white and grey, not just black and grey)

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 28 juillet 2011 - 02:37 .

[Ianamus]

I hope that all important characters can die in some way or another in Mass Effect 3, but I do not want to see a main character, new or old, die no matter what. If you really want a certain character to survive, that should always be possible, although you may have to sacrifice other characters to see that happen.

[mineralica]

Seboist wrote...

I'm worried that not enough important characters are going to die.

This. In the most of saves now the only dead persons is VV and Morinth/Samara. Three games fighting the impossible odds, the machines who easily wiped the life in galaxy earlier, and only two deaths, one of which is completely unrelated to plot? Sounds a bit... not so serious.

What stroke me is that even with worst pre-suicide mission scenario, with all 12 companions not loyal and no upgrades were made, you still can save 5 companions. More than a third. How exactly suicide mission is suicide after that?

About "who will be the victims" - I hope that, as it was suggested, it will be someone from favs. Virmire had a little meaning if player didn't care about at least one of human companions, so let's throw some serious choices now? Virmire-like choice between two favs with "Shepard, you may assign on this job only the most trusted people" justification?

[lacross328]

I think its entirely the way you play it. The only person I think that will die is Anderson

[Uzrbital]

If you can save them, alright. If it's a forced death, I'm gonna ragequit and never look back.

[alperez]

Ieldra2 wrote...

As for people dieing, I think that yes, people should die. If we can save them, that should come at a cost - some NPC's death, another planet harvested by the Reapers, that kind of cost. I can also see another Virmire-like situation.

Unavoidable deaths of specific team members should be avoided, though. Except for those where it is foreshadowed, like Thane. If you want X to survive,you should be able to save him or her. You might not like the cost, though.

Very well said.

While characters should all have the potential to die, they should also all have the potential to live as well, it should just require that much more effort to ensure they live and even with that effort there still should be a high price to pay.

Just killing off characters in order to create emotion is not only cheap but it never works out or creates the emotion its supposed to.

Making a characters death or survival actually mean something that's where the emotional aspect comes in, while the SM was too easy it at least subscribed to a logical view, make the wrong choices or don't do the things you should = death of certain characters.

To just create a scenario where character A or character B must be sacrificed for no real benefit other than to create a so called emotional response is lazy writing, make it more meaningful and then your much more likely to acheive the emotional impact your aiming for.

[Fata Morgana]

Seboist wrote...

I'm worried that not enough important characters are going to die.

This.

I feel that the game won't have enough emotional gravitas if everyone gets to live.

[alex90c]

I can understand that squadmates dying makes it more dramatic, but I'm a bit of a squeamish loser when it comes to the darker side of things like that - I love my happy endings

[Uzrbital]

alex90c wrote...

I can understand that squadmates dying makes it more dramatic, but I'm a bit of a squeamish loser when it comes to the darker side of things like that - I love my happy endings

Happy endings please! :innocent:

[TheWerdna]

As for Shepard dieing I think it will be based on your decisions. Bioware has already stated that there will be several different ending of differing good and bad. Perhaps if you made some bad choices but still win Shepard dies in the end, but if you make really good choices he will live.

[ladyvader]

Uzrbital wrote...

Drone223 wrote...

SInce this is the end of shepards story it should be fesiable for squad members (Liara and the VS in particular) to die by our choices not like a vimire situation, The SM is just too easy to save everyone
 

I can't save Miranda whatever I do. She's the only team mate who isn't loyal, but I'm not picking her for fireteam leader or specialist, and not my team mate. But she still dies.

I have a playthough that I lost Miranda's loyality because of the conflict between her and Jack.  Picked Jack because I knew I could get Miranda's back.  This one playthrough I didn't get it back even though my paragon meter was full.  I picked her to lead the 2nd fire team during the boitic bubble portion.  She doesn't die there.  If you leave her holding the line, she won't die there either.  The only way Miranda dies during the SM is she is unloyal and you take her with you to kill baby terminator reaper and even then she tell TIM to stuff it.  I was like oh no, she's not going to die this time.  I was killing off her and Jacob on purpose for that play through to see what happens in ME3.  

I did that with other characters too.  Every character dies at least once during the SM except Garrus.  And Tali's death was an accident.  I just can't kill off the ME1 squad mates on purpose.   Or Mordin.  Even though he bit it twice on me before I took him with me for the final portion.

[TheWerdna]

I recently came up with a good idea how they to make sure characters die no mater what while avoiding having specific characters forced to die.

1) Have a Suicide Mission moment in which you have to select two squad mates to do a job. Picking the wrong person for those roles has a penalty (randomly lose one member of your party, fail to do something that could help stop the Reaper's in that mission, or otherwise have something bad happen) though that character does not die.

From there you have a repeat of the Vermire situation and have to pick who to save between the two characters. This means the characters who are in danger is based on your decisions, and since certain roles are needed to be filled this stopped people from sacrificing characters they don't care about.

2) Have a situation in which you must sacrifice a character to help complete a mission or otherwise acomplish a task. From here the player has three choices.

-The player can choose not to sacrifice a character at all, but failing to do so will have large consequences
-Sacrifice a character unsuited for the job. Will complete task, but will have a small consequence or lower benefits for doing so.
-Chose one of 2-3 characters suited for task. they die but are able to complete task, having no consequences in the long run or even are benefits to doing so.

(To be effective this sort of situation has to happen atleast 2-3 times. If the player fails to sacrifice any characters it could cause the game to have a bad ending or atleast stop the player from getting the best ending)

3) those two preventions scenarios should be mixed in with lots of SM-like situations in which characters will die unless the correct choices are made. This way there are a at-least 4-6 points in the game where a character could die, but it is avoidable. Then have a few points in which someone has to die, but as to who it is can differ.

[wetnasty]

Mykel54 wrote...

Yeah, the whole point of the game and the galactic war is that you need some kind of loss, to make the victory feel like it was worth it. If you just destroyed the reapers without suffering a single casualty (ex. ME2 not-so-suicide mission), it would feel cheap and boring.

In your opinion. There can be deaths and destruction without them all having to be in your main party. Having high up military soldiers all be senselessly slaughtered doesn't make sense to me. Especially considering how much else they had survived through.