3618 réponses à ce sujet

[Lotion Soronarr]

Phaedon wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Sauce.. which nation? When and where?

Unless it specificly states they the nation surrendered, then it's nothing definite.. (and what nation would be pathetic neough to surrender so easily?)

Oh, actually, no, you are wrong.

He defeated a nation with a single shot. Unless you say that he comitted genocide, then that nation was disbanded or surrendered.

And for your argument to stand, you would really really really rather he just had that nation surrender. 

SAUCE.

tioehrwise it's rubbish.

If you try to base all that on jsut one line, then its' rubbish.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Phaelducan wrote...

Wow, holy wall of text Batman. Phaedon, that was brutal. For the sake of mine eyes, please parcel.

Lotion, you are being very closed minded here. You are clinging very hard to a stark black and white reality when I would wager there are very few decisions any player made (through their Shepard's) that they feel 100% about one way or they other.

There is no positive equaling the negative, there is no 100 ships for or against us. The results will be what they are, and you have to deal with the consequences you actually have rather than the consequences you may have incurred.

I'm not taking about what WILL happen, I'm taking about what is most logicly to assume CAN be the best and worst alternative.

So, if best is all rachni for you, then the worst is all rachni against you. Equal number of rachni either way.

And b.t.w - I can consider it immoral to gamble with millions of lives.

[Phaelducan]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Phaelducan wrote...

Wow, holy wall of text Batman. Phaedon, that was brutal. For the sake of mine eyes, please parcel.

Lotion, you are being very closed minded here. You are clinging very hard to a stark black and white reality when I would wager there are very few decisions any player made (through their Shepard's) that they feel 100% about one way or they other.

There is no positive equaling the negative, there is no 100 ships for or against us. The results will be what they are, and you have to deal with the consequences you actually have rather than the consequences you may have incurred.

I'm not taking about what WILL happen, I'm taking about what is most logicly to assume CAN be the best and worst alternative.

So, if best is all rachni for you, then the worst is all rachni against you. Equal number of rachni either way.

And b.t.w - I can consider it immoral to gamble with millions of lives.

Your logic, not mine. Logically I can deduce that the Rachni on my side could tip the sides of any interstellar conflict.. as it did previously. If you want to deduce the opposite, knock yourself out, but that doesn't make me wrong, no matter how much you wish it were so. 

Your entire premise is a thinking error. If paragon shep turns out to be right about the Rachni, and they are a huge help in ME3, then the entire possibility of your worst case scenario is invalidated. It's not immoral, Shep did what he thought was best for the interest of the welfare of the galaxy. If he's wrong, then he's wrong, but it doesn't make the choice immoral.

B.t.w. who cares whether you think it's immoral to gamble with millions of lives. It's a game set-up within the context that you have to make hard choices, choices that will effect billions of lifeforms. You roll the dice and hope you are making the right call, but there are no guarantees. In ME3 we'll get to see what choices have what results, but in no way does the process of making them indicate true morality. That's why we have paragon/renegade and NOT good/evil for our axiom in ME.

You are trying to turn this into Knights of the Old Republic, and it's not.

[Someone With Mass]

Just FYI:

Army, ar-my: An organized military force equipped for fighting on land.

Cerberus has an army by that definition.

[xxSgt_Reed_24xx]

Phaelducan wrote...

Bunch of Xenophobes I tell ya...

Rachni are 2 tons of teeth-gnashing gnarly in a 1 ton carapace. Just the thing for shredding through hordes of Reaper Husks.

Until the reapers make that sour yellow note trumpet call to arms and the rachni turn on you. 

[Lotion Soronarr]

Phaelducan wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Phaelducan wrote...

Wow, holy wall of text Batman. Phaedon, that was brutal. For the sake of mine eyes, please parcel.

Lotion, you are being very closed minded here. You are clinging very hard to a stark black and white reality when I would wager there are very few decisions any player made (through their Shepard's) that they feel 100% about one way or they other.

There is no positive equaling the negative, there is no 100 ships for or against us. The results will be what they are, and you have to deal with the consequences you actually have rather than the consequences you may have incurred.

I'm not taking about what WILL happen, I'm taking about what is most logicly to assume CAN be the best and worst alternative.

So, if best is all rachni for you, then the worst is all rachni against you. Equal number of rachni either way.

And b.t.w - I can consider it immoral to gamble with millions of lives.

Your logic, not mine. Logically I can deduce that the Rachni on my side could tip the sides of any interstellar conflict.. as it did previously. If you want to deduce the opposite, knock yourself out, but that doesn't make me wrong, no matter how much you wish it were so. 

Your entire premise is a thinking error. If paragon shep turns out to be right about the Rachni, and they are a huge help in ME3, then the entire possibility of your worst case scenario is invalidated. It's not immoral, Shep did what he thought was best for the interest of the welfare of the galaxy. If he's wrong, then he's wrong, but it doesn't make the choice immoral.

B.t.w. who cares whether you think it's immoral to gamble with millions of lives. It's a game set-up within the context that you have to make hard choices, choices that will effect billions of lifeforms. You roll the dice and hope you are making the right call, but there are no guarantees. In ME3 we'll get to see what choices have what results, but in no way does the process of making them indicate true morality. That's why we have paragon/renegade and NOT good/evil for our axiom in ME.

You are trying to turn this into Knights of the Old Republic, and it's not.

Again, I'm not saying your wrong.
Seem we have a misunderstanding.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Just FYI:

Army, ar-my: An organized military force equipped for fighting on land.

Cerberus has an army by that definition.

I said "true" army.

1000 troops with minimal support ins't a proper army when your opponent has 10000000 troops with large support.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

oh lotion,lotion,lotion,well tell me then since you seem to be so all knowing

How? How do you defeat Cerberus?



Also scenario


                           Cerberus kills or buys alliance leaders then replaces the rest with their own hand picked agents
Cerberus has now taken over the Alliance without neccesarily firing a single shot,they now have much more funding and a much greater ability to cover things up.

Modifié par Humanoid_Typhoon, 31 juillet 2011 - 05:50 .

[Pulletlamer]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Just FYI:

Army, ar-my: An organized military force equipped for fighting on land.

Cerberus has an army by that definition.

I said "true" army.

1000 troops with minimal support ins't a proper army when your opponent has 10000000 troops with large support.

The NVA's were a recognised army by definition. And they used guerrilla and hit and run-tactics, had poor support and had to rely on the enviroment, and traps / ambushes they set.

That you have 100 guys but the enemy has 10 times your force doesn't mean you don't have an army. You still do.

Modifié par Pulletlamer, 31 juillet 2011 - 05:51 .

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

I said "true" army.

1000 troops with minimal support ins't a proper army when your opponent has 10000000 troops with large support.

Oh. Then I guess Cerberus can't be a threat since they don't have a "true" army. 

It's not like they can resort to the same tactic they've been using all this time.

And a million soldiers are useless if you don't have any ships that can take them to other planets. Ships, which Cerberus can sabotage or delay.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Pulletlamer wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Just FYI:

Army, ar-my: An organized military force equipped for fighting on land.

Cerberus has an army by that definition.

I said "true" army.

1000 troops with minimal support ins't a proper army when your opponent has 10000000 troops with large support.

The NVA's were a recognised army by definition. And they used guerrilla and hit and run-tactics, had poor support and had to rely on the enviroment, and traps / ambushes they set.

That you have 100 guys but the enemy has 10 times your force doesn't mean you don't have an army. You still do.

So now just imagine the NVA is the US Navy SEALs and now you have Cerberus.

[Pulletlamer]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

[So now just imagine the NVA is the US Navy SEALs and now you have Cerberus.

Exactly. I don't get why Lotion still tries to deny it.

Also, from  N7 OPS: masseffect.bioware.com/me3/n7ops/enemies/

"Cerberus Trooper:

Fearless, disciplined and unrelenting, Cerberus Assault Troopers are the backbone of the Illusive Man's army. Outfitted with custom-designed armor and rifles, these well-equipped soldiers function with determined precision. The first to rush in to a fight, the assault troopers are often supported by more powerful units on the battlefield. As the galaxy crumbles, their loyalty to Cerberus only grows more absolute."

There you have the official source. Now let's leave the army topic.

Modifié par Pulletlamer, 31 juillet 2011 - 06:00 .

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Pulletlamer wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

[So now just imagine the NVA is the US Navy SEALs and now you have Cerberus.

Exactly. I don't get why Lotion still tries to deny it.

Also, from  N7 OPS: masseffect.bioware.com/me3/n7ops/enemies/

"Cerberus Trooper:

Fearless, disciplined and unrelenting, Cerberus Assault Troopers are the backbone of the Illusive Man's army. Outfitted with custom-designed armor and rifles, these well-equipped soldiers function with determined precision. The first to rush in to a fight, the assault troopers are often supported by more powerful units on the battlefield. As the galaxy crumbles, their loyalty to Cerberus only grows more absolute."

There you have the official source. Now let's leave the army topic.

So when you have an army of Navy SEALs fighting hundreds of phantom wars...

[Someone With Mass]

HomelessGal wrote...

Man, I still want that armor available in ME3. I don't care if there's some horrific moral choice tied to it, if it can be unlocked then I am unlocking it.

I bet people want to unlock the Nemesis armor for femShep too.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

HomelessGal wrote...

Haha; Cerberus is an equal-opportunity employer, so I'm sure the Assault Trooper armor will have a boobplate option.

lol,everyone needs formfitting armor,cleavage serves an important function...I think.That or they are all dressed like MirandaB)

Modifié par Humanoid_Typhoon, 31 juillet 2011 - 06:26 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

oh lotion,lotion,lotion,well tell me then since you seem to be so all knowing

How? How do you defeat Cerberus?



Also scenario


                           Cerberus kills or buys alliance leaders then replaces the rest with their own hand picked agents
Cerberus has now taken over the Alliance without neccesarily firing a single shot,they now have much more funding and a much greater ability to cover things up.

A concetrated effort to infiltrate, isolate and eradicate their cells with overwhelimg forceturian kicked Cerberus in the nads hard...and that's just turians.


As for the scenario. Nope.
It's not realistic to think that Cerberus can do that. It might be able to buy off a few representatives, but the Alliance has a lot of people in it's leadership. It will enver be able to fully dominate it.

It's basicly similar to thinking the KGB can take control or he EU parlamet or the US senate. And KGB was fully backed by a super-power of the time.

Cerberus is just a rougle Black Ops cell. You think the Alliance doesn't have more, working  for them? That there aren't other factions trying to influence things to their advantage?


And note, while it sould impressive that Cerberus has a income of a few billion, the Alliance has income measured in trillions.

Everything Cerberus can do, the Alliance can do better...

[didymos1120]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

I said "true" army.

Is a "true army" anything like a "true scotsman"?

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Everything Cerberus can do, the Alliance can do better...

Except the things the Alliance can't do, but Cerberus can, like illegal AI research, biotic advancements and all that, because that's why Cerberus was funded in the first place. 

[Kaiser Shepard]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Everything Cerberus can do, the Alliance can do better...

Except the things the Alliance can't do, but Cerberus can, like illegal AI research, biotic advancements and all that, because that's why Cerberus was funded in the first place.

The Sidon and Ascension Projects say hi.

Granted, Cerberus greatly surpassed the former with EDI, whereas they had a hand in the latter (and possibly surpassed that one with Jack as well), but still: the Alliance isn't afraid to get its hands dirty.

Modifié par Kaiser Shepard, 31 juillet 2011 - 07:16 .

[Clara Shepard]

blew it the f--- up, never needed it, I'm better than the reapers and could scrap each one with my eyes closed.... or so I hope I can in the next game, the devs could just decide we are all going to die and that's the end of that - since the said that Mass Effect is only starting... maybe shepard will die but in the next 50 thousand years someone else will use what shepard knew and used it to advance civilization to something different from what the reapers wanted and kick their asses sky high

Modifié par Clara Shepard, 31 juillet 2011 - 07:33 .

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Clara Shepard wrote...

blew it the f--- up, never needed it, I'm better than the reapers and could scrap each one with my eyes closed.... or so I hope I can in the next game, the devs could just decide we are all going to die and that's the end of that - since the said that Mass Effect is only starting... maybe shepard will die but in the next 50 thousand years someone else will use what shepard knew and used it to advance civilization to something different from what the reapers wanted and kick their asses sky high

"I'm Commander Shepard and I'm the deadliest son of a **** on The Citadel."

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

I said "true" army.

1000 troops with minimal support ins't a proper army when your opponent has 10000000 troops with large support.

Oh. Then I guess Cerberus can't be a threat since they don't have a "true" army. 

It's not like they can resort to the same tactic they've been using all this time.

And a million soldiers are useless if you don't have any ships that can take them to other planets. Ships, which Cerberus can sabotage or delay.

And yes, they universe crumbled because of it...No, wait, the universe hardly acknowledges their resistance.

Adn yes...Cerberus super-spies that can infiltrate everywhere and do evrything. Sabotage hunderds of ships? Puh-lease.
Cerberus would be lucky if it manages to dealy 2-3 ships.

Cerberus is turning into an all power Chuck Norris around here it seems - tehy do anything to anyone with ease!