3618 réponses à ce sujet

[khordlambert]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Veild insults aren't in short supply out here. Sometimes one responds in kind.

And not as good as I think? My good man, there's only 3-4 people in this discussion who defend the "keep the base" choice, and despite being heavily outnumbered by the base destroyers, we have so far pounded them mercilesly in this discussion.

So, yes, I'm quite happy so far. Thanks for asking.

It must be nice, living in your own world, because I have yet to see a single legit reason to save the base that doesn't clash with Cerberus' agenda.

Since when is "saving humanity" not part of Cerberus agenda?

Considering that they join up with the Reapers in ME3, I'd say since around there.

[Lotion Soronarr]

khordlambert wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

khordlambert wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

khordlambert wrote...

You should see him in the Dragon Age Boards. He actually tends to be a bit WORSE there if anything.

Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa......he can be any worse?

He drops the "I beleive in X so X must be the absolute truth and I will drop words like 'logic' and 'reasoning' cause I am so smart,I am so smart, s-m-r-t, I mean s-m-a-r-t." in dragon age too?

All that in the support of a lunatic who talks to a sword and tries to kill an entire population down to the last child.

Hopefully that didn't spoil anything.

:huh::huh:

You Sir..must be on some kind of veary heavy drugs...cause you seem to mistaken me for someone else.

So there are two Lotion's running around the forums? Well if that's the case then I apologize for mistaking you for the guy with a similar name and same avatar picture who is running around the Dragon Age forums.

Do apologize then...cause I never, EVER supported Meredith.

Once you stoop down to bloody lies and false accusation..then you truly sink low. Very low my friend.

[Lotion Soronarr]

khordlambert wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Veild insults aren't in short supply out here. Sometimes one responds in kind.

And not as good as I think? My good man, there's only 3-4 people in this discussion who defend the "keep the base" choice, and despite being heavily outnumbered by the base destroyers, we have so far pounded them mercilesly in this discussion.

So, yes, I'm quite happy so far. Thanks for asking.

It must be nice, living in your own world, because I have yet to see a single legit reason to save the base that doesn't clash with Cerberus' agenda.

Since when is "saving humanity" not part of Cerberus agenda?

Considering that they join up with the Reapers in ME3, I'd say since around there.

Meta-gaming arguments here again... Not relevant.

Do you even know how to debate??????

[Lotion Soronarr]

Goneaviking wrote...
They're making a sentient organic/synthetic machine god, they're going to want to ensure it's loyalty. The easiest way of doing that might well be to indoctrinate it at every stage of it's creation.

We don't know enough about Reapers to know whether they're immune to their own indoctrination devices, if not then constructing them in a base set up to create them makes perfect sense. We do know that the human reaper larvae had at least a minimal amount of intelligence to attack you at the finale of ME2, it most likely didn't have it's most sophisticate programming installed yet but it's simplistic programming could be enough to make the process viable.

Pure speculation of course, but it doesn't seem completely implausible.

Reapers are going to be indoctrinating themsleves??

Riiiight^_^

[khordlambert]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

khordlambert wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

khordlambert wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

khordlambert wrote...

You should see him in the Dragon Age Boards. He actually tends to be a bit WORSE there if anything.

Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa......he can be any worse?

He drops the "I beleive in X so X must be the absolute truth and I will drop words like 'logic' and 'reasoning' cause I am so smart,I am so smart, s-m-r-t, I mean s-m-a-r-t." in dragon age too?

All that in the support of a lunatic who talks to a sword and tries to kill an entire population down to the last child.

Hopefully that didn't spoil anything.

:huh::huh:

You Sir..must be on some kind of veary heavy drugs...cause you seem to mistaken me for someone else.

So there are two Lotion's running around the forums? Well if that's the case then I apologize for mistaking you for the guy with a similar name and same avatar picture who is running around the Dragon Age forums.

Do apologize then...cause I never, EVER supported Meredith.

Once you stoop down to bloody lies and false accusation..then you truly sink low. Very low my friend.

Again I'm sorry. i try to hold myself to a higher standard than that. It already ticks me off to no end when other people do that, let alone me.

[The Elder King]

khordlambert wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...



Since when is "saving humanity" not part of Cerberus agenda?

Considering that they join up with the Reapers in ME3, I'd say since around there.

 I agree with Lotion about that and meta-gaming. The info we have now about Cerberus shoudn't be relevant for the CB decision.

Modifié par hhh89, 05 août 2011 - 11:29 .

[Someone With Mass]

Well, for starters, I really doubt that Cerberus would share every ounce of their potential amazing discoveries with the rest of the races in the galaxy (besides the creepy husk things).

[Lotion Soronarr]

khordlambert wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Do apologize then...cause I never, EVER supported Meredith.

Once you stoop down to bloody lies and false accusation..then you truly sink low. Very low my friend.

Again I'm sorry. i try to hold myself to a higher standard than that. It already ticks me off to no end when other people do that, let alone me.

Apology accepted.

Seems I might have judged you too harshly;)
Hope you keep surprising me pleasantly in the future too.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, for starters, I really doubt that Cerberus would share every ounce of their potential amazing discoveries with the rest of the races in the galaxy (besides the creepy husk things).

You think thed'y rather die?

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, for starters, I really doubt that Cerberus would share every ounce of their potential amazing discoveries with the rest of the races in the galaxy (besides the creepy husk things).

You think thed'y rather die?

No. GIven their past, I'd imagine that they think it's an opportunity to get rid of their enemies, by denying them help.

Not to mention that I don't think TIM has any control over his cells in ME3, since they can apparently do whatever they feel like at times. Like, falling for indoctrination, going rogue, die out because of clumsy mistakes, etc etc.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Would be pretty wicked to see TIM betray you after you give up the base and Shep pulls a
TIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!!

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, for starters, I really doubt that Cerberus would share every ounce of their potential amazing discoveries with the rest of the races in the galaxy (besides the creepy husk things).

You think thed'y rather die?

No. GIven their past, I'd imagine that they think it's an opportunity to get rid of their enemies, by denying them help.

Not to mention that I don't think TIM has any control over his cells in ME3, since they can apparently do whatever they feel like at times. Like, falling for indoctrination, going rogue, die out because of clumsy mistakes, etc etc.

By denying them help they also die. Humanity cannot stand alone agaisnt the repaers.
TIM himself is urging Sheppard to forge alliances!

All those idea of Cerberus wanthing to eradicate everyone but humans is silly and completely unsopported by anything.

[Sebby]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

Would be pretty wicked to see TIM betray you after you give up the base and Shep pulls a
TIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIM!!!!!

Don't worry Bioware has you covered. The renegade path is just the paragon one with joke dialogue,less content and not much else.

[Sisterofshane]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

Trout blew up the base,he is just...neutral? He is shooting down everyone's reason for blowing the base.

Nah, he's playing devil's advocate.  Even though he had legitamate reasons for destroying CB, he sees on here that people are behaving illogically as to why the base should be destroyed.

It's like how some people believe in God because they are afraid to go to heck.  Any jehovah's witness, while believing in God, would tell you that your reasoning is faulty, they don't believe that heck exists. (Religion is a BAD topic to bring up, and will probably incite many ragefaces amongst unreasonable people, but it was the best example I could come up with)

I feel the same way, there are legitimate reasons for keeping AND blowing up the base, and there are illegitimate reasons for each decision as well.

I have one playthrough of both.  I'm REALLY interested to see how the whole situation plays out, and who the devs decide to punish, or if they pick anyone at all.

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

By denying them help they also die. Humanity cannot stand alone agaisnt the repaers.
TIM himself is urging Sheppard to forge alliances!

All those idea of Cerberus wanthing to eradicate everyone but humans is silly and completely unsopported by anything.

Part of domination is to get rid of/outdo the competition.

[Sisterofshane]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, for starters, I really doubt that Cerberus would share every ounce of their potential amazing discoveries with the rest of the races in the galaxy (besides the creepy husk things).

You think thed'y rather die?

No. GIven their past, I'd imagine that they think it's an opportunity to get rid of their enemies, by denying them help.

Not to mention that I don't think TIM has any control over his cells in ME3, since they can apparently do whatever they feel like at times. Like, falling for indoctrination, going rogue, die out because of clumsy mistakes, etc etc.

Not so true.  TIM has control over "teh moniez".  Fall in line, show me some results, or you lose your funding.  He doesn't necessarily care how they get from point A to point B, but he has the power to stop them all together.

Example, Project Overlord.  Gavin Archer was so afraid he would be "shut-down", that he connected his Autistic brother to a VI to control the Geth.  This method may not control everyone, but I think money proves to be a pretty effective motivator.

And, if you tick him off enough, he's not beyond using his influence to screw you over.  Look at Grayson, or even when he contemplates taking "action" against the Blue Suns after the Purgatory fiasco to teach them a "lesson".  I think the threat of TIM using his influence would be enough to keep many others (not motivated by money alone) in line.

Only people like Shepard truly don't care about either of the above.

[Sebby]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

By denying them help they also die. Humanity cannot stand alone agaisnt the repaers.
TIM himself is urging Sheppard to forge alliances!

All those idea of Cerberus wanthing to eradicate everyone but humans is silly and completely unsopported by anything.

Part of domination is to get rid of/outdo the competition.

The Salarian/Asari/Turian dominance trio didn't get rid of the Volus,Hanar,Elcor,etc. :happy:

[Sisterofshane]

Seboist wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

By denying them help they also die. Humanity cannot stand alone agaisnt the repaers.
TIM himself is urging Sheppard to forge alliances!

All those idea of Cerberus wanthing to eradicate everyone but humans is silly and completely unsopported by anything.

Part of domination is to get rid of/outdo the competition.

The Salarian/Asari/Turian dominance trio didn't get rid of the Volus,Hanar,Elcor,etc. :happy:

Yes, but remember humanity is considered to be the "Jack of all trades" amongst species in the galaxy.
The turians have no sense of intelligence gathering, diplomacy, and finance, therefore they need the Salarians, Asari, and the Volus.
The Asari have a very weak military, therefore they need the Salarians for intelligence gathering, and the Turians for military might.
I don't think the salarians would ever do anything that wasn't at least MUTUALLY beneficial to themselves (at least as a whole species, can't speak towards the individual).
Pretty much any species to have been "invited" to have an embassy on the citadel has been considered to be a potentially beneficial species.

The humans don't have any problems in those areas.  They can be just as effective diplomatically as the Asari, have just as strong of a military as the Turians, espionage the likes of the salarians etc. etc. etc.  And not only are we capable of this, but our species as a whole STRIVES to be better then anyone else.

So, why would it be necessary to keep the other races around?

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Sisterofshane wrote...
So, why would it be necessary to keep the other races around?

Teh lulz?

Modifié par Humanoid_Typhoon, 06 août 2011 - 02:39 .

[Sisterofshane]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

Sisterofshane wrote...
So, why would it be necessary to keep the other races around?

The lulz?

It would be tragic to deny the galaxy Francis Kitt's "Hamlet" as portrayed by an all-Elcor cast.
A sad, sad day indeed.

[Unpleasant Implications]

I destroyed the CB based on long view. Even if we did win because of it, the knowledge and the possibility of building a reaper would be out in the universe. The information on harvesting species to create super constructs... would be available to the universe. We may say that Cerberus would keep it secret but look at Wilson. TIM said himself Wilson was one of his most trusted agents. Imagine how many other "trusted agents" are on a payroll. This information can't be kept secret forever, it will be leaked, it will be known. Our world has extremists, the universe has extremists, those who would use this information to fuel their own goals and create their own Reaper. It would be starting another cycle of destruction. In my opinion, the sheer possibility of this information existing is reason enough to destroy the base.

[jbblue05]

didymos1120 wrote...


Given that they didn't specify, how can you possibly know this?  And no, her using thermal emissions to detect the massive seeker swarm doesn't mean the SR-2 was only capable of TE scanning.

We saw EDI installed on the Collector Ship we never see her installed at the base.  Their was a strong emphasis EDI was in control of some of the systems at the Collector Ship.
On the CB all we hear is she's repairing the SR2, TE scans on the base blueprints, seeker swarms and Human Reaper.  EDI was guessing about data on the Reaper.
 

The cinematic at the end and Walters' tweet seem to disagree with that assertion.

The CInematic could imply a lot of things.  Its more likely the blueprints came from the Derelict Reaper.
I can't comment on Walters tweet I've never seen it

[TMA LIVE]

jbblue05 wrote...

The CInematic could imply a lot of things.  Its more likely the blueprints came from the Derelict Reaper.
I can't comment on Walters tweet I've never seen it

http://twitter.com/#...530567091097600

TMA: At the end of ME2, Joker gives Shepard a datapad showing a Reaper. Does that mean we gained some kind of data on Reapers?

Mac: It is safe to assume that the Collector base yielded a great deal of
information on the Reapers (even if destroyed). So... Yes .

Modifié par TMA LIVE, 06 août 2011 - 03:32 .

[Sisterofshane]

TMA LIVE wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

The CInematic could imply a lot of things.  Its more likely the blueprints came from the Derelict Reaper.
I can't comment on Walters tweet I've never seen it

http://twitter.com/#...530567091097600

TMA: At the end of ME2, Joker gives Shepard a datapad showing a Reaper. Does that mean we gained some kind of data on Reapers?

Mac: It is safe to assume that the Collector base yielded a great deal of
information on the Reapers (even if destroyed). So... Yes .

So, we know from a dev that no matter the decision, we DO get information regarding the CB.  It doesn't say "vital", but it does say "a great deal".
Still, this cinematic occurs AFTER the SM, so by then Shep has already made the choice to blow up or keep the base.  Any argument made based on this info would be made in hindsight.
It may, however, confirm many people's suspicions.