597 réponses à ce sujet

[Wittand25]

God no. I never finished the first Witcher game and have absolutely no intention of even trying the second. BioWare should do what they do, and CDproject likewise. Trying to copy the style of another company would only end in disaster.

[The Earl Of Bronze]

RageGT wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

Yes  he knows that but what  he does not want is  DA to become a Witcher clone...which alot of people seem to want. Which in a amazing twist of Irony  alot of people  thought would happen when EA and Bioware  signed their deal. 

"Oh  know  DA is never going to orginal..." 

"I want DA  to be like the Witcher now because  The Witcher  is great."   

I for one much rather have Bioware suffer all this  bad feed back and "Outrage". Make a game that can stand on its own two feet with be coming  a clone of another game  just becasue that game was great. 

 

Can you quote a post, any post, that has such statement as you claim? The most devoted fan of The Witcher would never say such a thing. If you read all the posts in this thread you will not find it. And DA can be the "spiritual sucessor" of one game but not of any other? Because DA2 certainly is not the spiritual sucessor of Origins.

TW2 definitely is a milestone and a genre redefining game but no one will ever come close to the Poles in doing it. So no one will ever suggest a clone. What can be cloned from it, for sure, is: Take your time to develop and give the same love to the details and to the world as Origins did and don't rush a half-finished, lazy designed, lazy developed, dumbed down, hand helding, spoon feeding, instant gratifying, buttonawesome, with no real consequences for your choices, alpha stage with half content game.

Unless you think this is it:

Brockololly wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

The only thing DA ought to seriously consider taking from TW2 is the attention to detail when it comes to the setting and atmosphere - something they've said they deliberately went away from with DA2 (what with the so-called pointless books in the library).

And weapons that actually look like they were designed for human hands and not those of a giant. And bowstrings. And weapons that don't float and are actually sheathed.

And a decent day/night + weather cycle. And fairly open levels that aren't long corridors. And decent lighting. And actually visually interesting backdrops which give a sense of scale to levels.

Captain Sassy Pants wrote...

RageGT wrote...

If by that you mean, amazing graphics, mechanics, a real dark and mature game for adults, filled with really meaningful choices, clever humor, amazingly intrinsic politics, no hands holding, punitive of stupidity, no button awesome - at least until adrenaline bar is filled =) - a game which treats gamers at least as half intelligent beings who knows how to read...

All that combined with BioWare usual party-based combat and customizable protagonists (with all different races too) is certainly a winner.

This sounds good to me.

Genre redifining? Lol, should it even be considered an rpg if there is no character creation? More of an action adventure game with rpg elements. Or an action rpg I think they are called.

[luki1234567]

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Cosmetic character creation does not an RPG make.

TW 2 is genre redefining because of it's branching narrative which actually isn't new, but did it in a way that made people take notice.

[Alexander1136]

meteorswarm wrote...

Some deeply storytelling,one protagonist ,no companions and no teammates .The third person visual  is nearly the witcher 2 of course,better with the first person visual if it has.

No.  I liked the Witcher 2. but Dragon Age should not copy other games look what happened when the try'd to copy mass effect.  it needs to take its successful origins style and continue with that.

[Alexander1136]

Zanallen wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

drunk_monk wrote...

The witcher Is over-rated

In Your opnion. that you think so does not make it overrated

In your opinion.

Why did you response to this? srsly
His opinion or even yours or mine does not make sth a fact

In your opinion.

ROFL:O trolled the troll.

[The Earl Of Bronze]

luki1234567 wrote...

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

Are you saying character creation is not a part of an rpg?  

[Wittand25]

RageGT wrote...

And here's another thing DA3 might learn from TW2. This is how you write gay characters!

The Witcher 2 - Uncle Roche meets Uncle Dethmold

The Witcher 2 - Bad Bad Witch

That are the two worst gay characters I have seen in ages. The first has a gay man who manges to be old, ugly, clearly a villain, flaming to the point of caricature and ends up being gelded with the main characters help.

The second has the perverted young naked lesbian S/M pair.

If BioWare ever does anything as bad as this, it will be the first game ever that I will resale, right after writing them a long rant demanding a refund for the money I spend and compensation for the time I wasted playing.

[The Earl Of Bronze]

mrcrusty wrote...

Cosmetic character creation does not an RPG make.

TW 2 is genre redefining because of it's branching narrative which actually isn't new, but did it in a way that made people take notice.

You would rather play as a pre-determined character rather than create your own? All else been equal?

[luki1234567]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

Are you saying character creation is not a part of an rpg?  

That's not the part that makes sth rpg for example planescape tronment, gothic , the witcher...

srsly i understand poeple that don't like the witcher beacuse of lack of character creation but that's just different type of rpg.
Why all rpgs have to do evyrything the same way?

Modifié par luki1234567, 03 août 2011 - 02:51 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

mrcrusty wrote...

Cosmetic character creation does not an RPG make.

TW 2 is genre redefining because of it's branching narrative which actually isn't new, but did it in a way that made people take notice.

You would rather play as a pre-determined character rather than create your own? All else been equal?

Depends how it's done.

I don't consider cosmetic character creation to mean crap. Give me meaningful character creation options, or just give me a well defined, fleshed out character who I can mould.

In the case of Planescape: Torment, you get the best of both worlds.

Games with great meaningful character creation (as some examples):
Darklands (Age)
Arcanum (Intelligence, Beauty)
Fallout (Intelligence)
Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines (Clans)
Dragon Age: Origins (Origins)
Elder Scrolls (Races - different bonuses, NPC dispositions, starting skills, etc)

A game like say, Dragon Age 2, or either Mass Effect has zero meaningful character customisation to me. Except the classes I guess, but even then it barely means anything since it's a party game and most people play a balanced party. Alternate methods for quest completion aren't given, your specialisations aren't plot related, they don't contribute to the game outside of combat and Mage Hawke doesn't get recognised by the game accordingly.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 03 août 2011 - 02:57 .

[Uccio]

nitefyre410 wrote...

Ukki wrote...

hornedfrog87 wrote...

Keep the Witcher out. This is Dragon Age, if I wanted Witcher I would play Witcher. And if I'm not playing Witcher that must mean I really do not think it is extraordinarily spectacular. I'm sure Witcher 2 is a great game, but DA is where I go to get my D&D fix and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Just out of curiosity, have you played TW2? It is indeed a spectacular game.

Yes  he knows that but what  he does not want is  DA to become a Witcher clone...which alot of people seem to want. Which in a amazing twist of Irony  alot of people  thought would happen when EA and Bioware  signed their deal. 

"Oh  know  DA is never going to orginal..." 

"I want DA  to be like the Witcher now because  The Witcher  is great."   


I for one much rather have Bioware suffer all this  bad feed back and "Outrage". Make a game that can stand on its own two feet with be coming  a clone of another game  just becasue that game was great. 

 

My point being that since DA2 went so much downhill regarding rpg aspects and because they announced how they will not go back to DAO style I was wondering should there be way to save the game by going a bit into TW2 direction. We all know TW2 beats DA2 hands down in every aspect.

ps. with the exception of companions though should TW2 include companions later on it would become just totally awesome (button).

Modifié par Ukki, 03 août 2011 - 02:58 .

[Wittand25]

mrcrusty wrote...
A game like say, Dragon Age 2, or either Mass Effect has zero meaningful character customisation to me. Except the classes I guess, but even then it barely means anything since it's a party game and most people play a balanced party. Alternate methods for quest completion aren't given, your specialisations aren't plot related, they don't contribute to the game outside of combat and Mage Hawke doesn't get recognised by the game accordingly.

That is not true. Alternate ways to end quests exist they do not depend on class but on personality. A aggressive Hawke for example often intimidate people and avoid fights or at least have an easier time at it. You can form a character out of the possible responses.

It does not go far enough and I really would want a bigger effect of Hawke`s class\\stats\\skills\\personality on the general game but outright saying that they do not exist is not true (Hawke as mage does get some special dialog throughout the game and other subtle things also change)

[DragonRageGT]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...
Genre redifining? Lol, should it even be considered an rpg if there is no character creation? More of an action adventure game with rpg elements. Or an action rpg I think they are called.

I'll take the NYT review over your opinion any time about what is RPG, plus my own over 500 hours with it, of course:

But every once in a while a game arrives out of the blue that redefines expectations for an entire genre. A game like The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings. If you enjoy single-player role-playing games on PC, you simply must play The Witcher 2. Innovative, unflinchingly mature and richly imagined, it is driven by fascinating, finely nuanced characters navigating a fantasy world of dark political intrigue and ambiguous morals.

http://www.nytimes.c...ame-review.html

[The Earl Of Bronze]

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

Are you saying character creation is not a part of an rpg?  

That's not the part that makes sth rpg for example planescape tronment, gothic , the witcher...

srsly i understand poeple that don't like the witcher beacuse of lack of character creation but that's just different type of rpg.
Why all rpgs have to do evyrything the same way?

Why couldn't it include an option for character creation, you could play as the fixed character if you want. There is no loss in adding character creation to a game, having the choice is better than none at all.

[luki1234567]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

Are you saying character creation is not a part of an rpg?  

That's not the part that makes sth rpg for example planescape tronment, gothic , the witcher...

srsly i understand poeple that don't like the witcher beacuse of lack of character creation but that's just different type of rpg.
Why all rpgs have to do evyrything the same way?

Why couldn't it include an option for character creation, you could play as the fixed character if you want. There is no loss in adding character creation to a game, having the choice is better than none at all.

\\
The story in tw would make no sense without geralt.

[DragonRageGT]

Alexander1136 wrote...

meteorswarm wrote...

Some deeply storytelling,one protagonist ,no companions and no teammates .The third person visual  is nearly the witcher 2 of course,better with the first person visual if it has.

No.  I liked the Witcher 2. but Dragon Age should not copy other games look what happened when the try'd to copy mass effect.  it needs to take its successful origins style and continue with that.

This!

[The Earl Of Bronze]

mrcrusty wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

mrcrusty wrote...

Cosmetic character creation does not an RPG make.

TW 2 is genre redefining because of it's branching narrative which actually isn't new, but did it in a way that made people take notice.

You would rather play as a pre-determined character rather than create your own? All else been equal?

Depends how it's done.

I don't consider cosmetic character creation to mean crap. Give me meaningful character creation options, or just give me a well defined, fleshed out character who I can mould.

In the case of Planescape: Torment, you get the best of both worlds.

Games with great meaningful character creation (as some examples):
Darklands (Age)
Arcanum (Intelligence, Beauty)
Fallout (Intelligence)
Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines (Clans)
Dragon Age: Origins (Origins)
Elder Scrolls (Races - different bonuses, NPC dispositions, starting skills, etc)

A game like say, Dragon Age 2, or either Mass Effect has zero meaningful character customisation to me. Except the classes I guess, but even then it barely means anything since it's a party game and most people play a balanced party. Alternate methods for quest completion aren't given, your specialisations aren't plot related, they don't contribute to the game outside of combat and Mage Hawke doesn't get recognised by the game accordingly.

Deciding how your character looks is very important to the whole game, you will be looking at him/her most of the time. If you hate the way your character looks will you enjoy the game? Been able to customise your character and decide class/weapons/clothing/armour etc all contribute to the whole experience. Why would it not be a good idea to have character creation in a game, even if you use the pre-determined character, at least you get the choice.

[The Earl Of Bronze]

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

Are you saying character creation is not a part of an rpg?  

That's not the part that makes sth rpg for example planescape tronment, gothic , the witcher...

srsly i understand poeple that don't like the witcher beacuse of lack of character creation but that's just different type of rpg.
Why all rpgs have to do evyrything the same way?

Why couldn't it include an option for character creation, you could play as the fixed character if you want. There is no loss in adding character creation to a game, having the choice is better than none at all.

The story in tw would make no sense without geralt.

No freedom or choice at all is hardly the definition of an rpg.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Like I said, if the only customisation for my character is cosmetic (equipment doesn't count since it matters in gameplay), I'd much rather have a preset character with depth that I can mold to my liking through the story and character system.

Because at this rate, sports games have better and more meaningful character customisation than most RPGs.

Btw, have you played Planescape: Torment?

Modifié par mrcrusty, 03 août 2011 - 03:22 .

[luki1234567]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

Are you saying character creation is not a part of an rpg?  

That's not the part that makes sth rpg for example planescape tronment, gothic , the witcher...

srsly i understand poeple that don't like the witcher beacuse of lack of character creation but that's just different type of rpg.
Why all rpgs have to do evyrything the same way?

Why couldn't it include an option for character creation, you could play as the fixed character if you want. There is no loss in adding character creation to a game, having the choice is better than none at all.

The story in tw would make no sense without geralt.

No freedom or choice at all is hardly the definition of an rpg.

lol you mean a character choice? tell me why every rpg has to do the same? Don't want to play ready character don't play the game = stop whining about character creation
Some popele like me like to play a pre defined character

[The Earl Of Bronze]

RageGT wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...
Genre redifining? Lol, should it even be considered an rpg if there is no character creation? More of an action adventure game with rpg elements. Or an action rpg I think they are called.

I'll take the NYT review over your opinion any time about what is RPG, plus my own over 500 hours with it, of course:

But every once in a while a game arrives out of the blue that redefines expectations for an entire genre. A game like The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings. If you enjoy single-player role-playing games on PC, you simply must play The Witcher 2. Innovative, unflinchingly mature and richly imagined, it is driven by fascinating, finely nuanced characters navigating a fantasy world of dark political intrigue and ambiguous morals.

http://www.nytimes.c...ame-review.html

Unflinchingly mature? Not quite.

Why do you need a review, which is just an opinion, no more than that, to back up your posts?

[nitefyre410]

Ukki wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

Ukki wrote...

hornedfrog87 wrote...

Keep the Witcher out. This is Dragon Age, if I wanted Witcher I would play Witcher. And if I'm not playing Witcher that must mean I really do not think it is extraordinarily spectacular. I'm sure Witcher 2 is a great game, but DA is where I go to get my D&D fix and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Just out of curiosity, have you played TW2? It is indeed a spectacular game.

Yes  he knows that but what  he does not want is  DA to become a Witcher clone...which alot of people seem to want. Which in a amazing twist of Irony  alot of people  thought would happen when EA and Bioware  signed their deal. 

"Oh  know  DA is never going to orginal..." 

"I want DA  to be like the Witcher now because  The Witcher  is great."   


I for one much rather have Bioware suffer all this  bad feed back and "Outrage". Make a game that can stand on its own two feet with be coming  a clone of another game  just becasue that game was great. 

 

My point being that since DA2 went so much downhill regarding rpg aspects and because they announced how they will not go back to DAO style I was wondering should there be way to save the game by going a bit into TW2 direction. We all know TW2 beats DA2 hands down in every aspect.

ps. with the exception of companions though should TW2 include companions later on it would become just totally awesome (button).

That would not save the game that would just make it the TW and I don't want  DA to be the Witchter. The need  too and must exist seperate from each other.  We see that happening the FPS market EVERY game is trying to be Call of Duty and now  you have an over satuated FPS market  where everything is basically  Call of Duty made by this company save a few ( Borderlands, Bioshock, Halo, are expamles.)     DA has to stand on its own two feet and doing the means suffering some outrage and growing pains  learning from the mistakes and making the game. Better not by  copying another game in same gerne that did something really well. Trust me if DA 3 did that we back having discussion about how DA 3 is a rip off  of the Witcher and if you think  outrage about DA 2 is bad.... that would be  FAR  worst.  

BTW when  the TW 2 comes in 2012 for 360  I'm buying day one.  Just like I will be buying  King of Fighters 13 day one when that hits.  

A good example would SNK/Playmore with  King of  Fighters XII oh man you want to  talk about Outrage. Some people  swore the series off. They went  back in the lab and did  they try to come out a Street Fighter 4 clone- No. They went back made their game better. Now  KoF 13 from the what I heard from those my friends who played at Otakon this year it was  well recieved.   The fastest way to kill DA would be to try and copy  the TW 2 

RPG developers could take a lesson from  Fighting game  gerne. It was dead for years  now  you have list of games that are unique and great in there own way and the Gerne is going through  a rebirth.  

    

[The Earl Of Bronze]

mrcrusty wrote...

Like I said, if the only customisation for my character is cosmetic (equipment doesn't count since it matters in gameplay), I'd much rather have a preset character with depth that I can mold to my liking through the story and character system.

Because at this rate, sports games have better and more meaningful character customisation than most RPGs.

Btw, have you played Planescape: Torment?

If you disliked the way a character looked what would you do?

[The Earl Of Bronze]

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

luki1234567 wrote...

If charcter creation defines an rpg than planescape troment is not an rpg lol srsly learn something about genre before you start writing nonsense

Are you saying character creation is not a part of an rpg?  

That's not the part that makes sth rpg for example planescape tronment, gothic , the witcher...

srsly i understand poeple that don't like the witcher beacuse of lack of character creation but that's just different type of rpg.
Why all rpgs have to do evyrything the same way?

Why couldn't it include an option for character creation, you could play as the fixed character if you want. There is no loss in adding character creation to a game, having the choice is better than none at all.

The story in tw would make no sense without geralt.

No freedom or choice at all is hardly the definition of an rpg.

lol you mean a character choice? tell me why every rpg has to do the same? Don't want to play ready character don't play the game = stop whining about character creation
Some popele like me like to play a pre defined character

Every game does not have to be the same, but why ignore individual preferences and create an inflexible system?