677 réponses à ce sujet

[Bogsnot1]

Saphra Deden wrote...

pablodurando wrote...

Well that can't be proven or disproven.:mellow:lol

How did this end up going horribly off topic?

I don't know, but frankly, I think you're full of crap and so is any quantum physicist who says rocks are alive.

Geth are basically just rocks seeing as they are merely code and literally nothing more than that.

Geth have no minds, it's impossible.

Saphra Tactic #2 : When proven wrong, insult the person who is making the logical argument. Just refer to the thread listed in Saphra's signature for more evidence of it.

[joriandrake]

Saphra Deden wrote...

pablodurando wrote...

Well that can't be proven or disproven.:mellow:lol

How did this end up going horribly off topic?

I don't know, but frankly, I think you're full of crap and so is any quantum physicist who says rocks are alive.

Geth are basically just rocks seeing as they are merely code and literally nothing more than that.

Geth have no minds, it's impossible.

yes they are all just dumb stones standing around all day in the same spot... <_<

someone here ignored my post entirelly, and reason itself which makes the whole discussion arkward 

[Inverness Moon]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Thus something with no brain can't have it.

Geth do not have brains. They don't have anything even resembling a brain.

Explain why that is.

I've already explain why that is not the case and you have done nothing to address my points. It's very irritating.

[joriandrake]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Inverness Moon wrote...

Don't be silly, consciousness is a product of how the brain functions, not the brain itself.

Thus something with no brain can't have it.

Geth do not have brains. They don't have anything even resembling a brain.

The Thorian had no brain either, or a humanoid body when we're at it, and it was basicly a plant/mushroom, don't try to say it was not sentient or I laugh in your face


You make less and less snese, and the whole debate is pretty pointles to begin with as Bioware already proved again and again that they consider it very much possible that artifical lifeforms evolve, have personalities, souls, emotions, and can become a species of their own, which means even if you disagree this is the truth in Mass Effect.

Modifié par joriandrake, 31 juillet 2011 - 06:59 .

[Inverness Moon]

joriandrake wrote...


The Thorian had no brain either, or a humanoid body when we're at it, and it was basicly a plant/mushroom, don't try to say it was not sentient or I laugh in your face

The thorian is a fictional creature, that isn't proof of anything.

Trying to say something is possible by pointing at a fictional creature is quite different from trying to deny that something is impossible when examining reality.

Modifié par Inverness Moon, 31 juillet 2011 - 07:02 .

[joriandrake]

Inverness Moon wrote...

joriandrake wrote...


The Thorian had no brain either, or a humanoid body when we're at it, and it was basicly a plant/mushroom, don't try to say it was not sentient or I laugh in your face

The thorian is a fictional creature, that isn't proof of anything.

We frakkin discuss a fictional species in a fictional universe on the forums of Bioware that created these in its game, so yes it does frakkin prove everything


You two are like children debating on why a bird should be red in the forest while all the birds around you in that very forest are blue

Modifié par joriandrake, 31 juillet 2011 - 07:03 .

[Bogsnot1]

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the very person who is arguing that AI does not actually have a brain, or intelligence, or consciousness, has chosen a primitive VI as their avatar?  

[Inverness Moon]

joriandrake wrote...

Inverness Moon wrote...

joriandrake wrote...


The Thorian had no brain either, or a humanoid body when we're at it, and it was basicly a plant/mushroom, don't try to say it was not sentient or I laugh in your face

The thorian is a fictional creature, that isn't proof of anything.

We frakkin discuss a fictional species in a fictional universe on the forums of Bioware that created these in its game, so yes it does frakkin prove everything

I doesn't prove anything.

Here is what I just added to my post:

"Trying to say something is possible by pointing at a fictional creature is quite different from trying to deny that something is impossible when examining reality."

Bogsnot1 wrote...
Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the very person who is arguing that AI does not actually have a brain, or intelligence, or consciousness, has chosen a primitive VI as their avatar? &nbsp;

Ad hominem much? 

Modifié par Inverness Moon, 31 juillet 2011 - 07:04 .

[joriandrake]

Bogsnot1 wrote...

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the very person who is arguing that AI does not actually have a brain, or intelligence, or consciousness, has chosen a primitive VI as their avatar?  

actually I have a pretty well based (on last few days various comments) idea that certain people here just love to troll

[BrotherCorvid]

Trolling on these forums?

NEVER.

[joriandrake]

Inverness Moon wrote...

joriandrake wrote...

We frakkin discuss a fictional species in a fictional universe on the forums of Bioware that created these in its game, so yes it does frakkin prove everything

I doesn't prove anything.

Here is what I just added to my post:

"Trying to say something is possible by pointing at a fictional creature is quite different from trying to deny that something is impossible when examining reality."
 

You people lost already track of what your debate is originally about, huh?

It was about the GETH, a fictional species in the very same fictional universe the Thorian is from, and where  a few holopeople also have shown intelligence, and where there is also EDI.

Who the heck cares if you argue if the sun is red or yellow if the creator (in this case Bioware) says it is purple? Keep your so-called forced reality out of here, this is like arguing how a lightsaber works for Christ's sake!

As the situation stands, this is a Bioware game and it is already determined what geth are like, so for me the sun is purple as this is the reality that matters here.

[Inverness Moon]

joriandrake wrote...

Bogsnot1 wrote...

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the very person who is arguing that AI does not actually have a brain, or intelligence, or consciousness, has chosen a primitive VI as their avatar?  

actually I have a pretty well based (on last few days various comments) idea that certain people here just love to troll

I have to agree with this. It's one of the more reasonable explanations for some of the stupid **** seen on this forum, and in this thread.

Saphra, unless you want to actually try to refute my argument, I'll just assume you're either trolling me or are close minded (which is worse).

[Melra]

Geth are a blessing, Quarians are a plague, that needs to be wiped out. *nods*

[Bogsnot1]

joriandrake wrote...

Bogsnot1 wrote...

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the very person who is arguing that AI does not actually have a brain, or intelligence, or consciousness, has chosen a primitive VI as their avatar?  

actually I have a pretty well based (on last few days various comments) idea that certain people here just love to troll

Trolling is normally appreciated by some person or group. If Saphra is trolling, the only person who would be appreciative of it would be Smudboy. Says a lot about Saphra. 

[joriandrake]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Even within the Mass Effect universe certain parties don't regard the geth as life. I think those people are correct.

those are npc-s making an ingame stand on things, but Bioware has shown us via the existence of Legion, the Thorian, EDI, and various others what the truth in ME is

We know the hanar worship the proheans, ingame that is their stance, but we also know due to Bioware's data given directly to the player that this idea is incorrect as far they were no gods, we also know via data given to us ingame ("data" meaning firsthand experiencing artifical characters like EDI and Legion and their feelings and characteristics) that for the reality/truth of ME artifical liveforms are very much much more than you say here


as said, I don't care what your RL opinion is on this as Bioware already decided how it works for ME and that truth stands until Bioware decides to retcon it



I have a very simple method to clasify stuff:

- If it thinks, feels, and acts on its own then it is a living thing
- If it uses tools and/or has a method to record history or communicate with other species then it is a sentient thing







and that's it, i am out of this thread before the nukes come, I had enough trying to properly discuss things as certain people don't even try to view the opinion of others objectively

Modifié par joriandrake, 31 juillet 2011 - 07:24 .

[Sharn01]

I have a hard time placing the Geth into a category, primarily because they are not individuals. They collectively function as a hive mind, all the geth combined pretty much form the equivalent of a single human mind in regards to how a person sees themselves as an individual and has self awareness. Killing an individual geth is no more harmful to the geth mind then a human trimming a fingernail. The geth cannot really be described as a race or a people , the entirety of the geth population is a single individual.

[Inverness Moon]

Sharn01 wrote...

I have a hard time placing the Geth into a category, primarily because they are not individuals. They collectively function as a hive mind, all the geth combined pretty much form the equivalent of a single human mind in regards to how a person sees themselves as an individual and has self awareness. Killing an individual geth is no more harmful to the geth mind then a human trimming a fingernail. The geth cannot really be described as a race or a people , the entirety of the geth population is a single individual.

Even if there was only one human left in the galaxy there wouldn't cease to be a human race.

[Inutaisho7996]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Inverness Moon wrote...

Don't be silly, consciousness is a product of how the brain functions, not the brain itself.

Thus something with no brain can't have it.

Geth do not have brains. They don't have anything even resembling a brain.

Geth do have brains. They may be made of different materials than human brains, but they still do the same thing.

[Inverness Moon]

Saphra Deden wrote...

What is your argument?

Did you just not see/read my posts or what?

Modifié par Inverness Moon, 31 juillet 2011 - 07:44 .

[Sisterofshane]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Even within the Mass Effect universe certain parties don't regard the geth as life. I think those people are correct.

Popping in from another thread here.

You don't consider the Geth to be a life form, and yet you've created a thread in which you clearly state that the pinnacle of our evolution is for our species to become a Reaper?

Pick a position.  Stick with it.

As for my two cents, the Geth were an accident.  And not necessarily a bad one.
Remember how the Reapers regard organic life?  Is that how we should treat the Geth?