7323 réponses à ce sujet

[LTiberious]

BentOrgy wrote...

Right, but Prothy wasn't part of the assimilated races, he was pure Prothean. So I still don't understand.

Even if they did have castes (Which is still unlikely, we're talking about entire races of people, throughout the entire galaxy. That would like saying all whites are workers, all africans are traders, all asians are teachers, etc.) Prothy wouldn't look like a Collector, because if the True race looked like the Ilos Statues, that would make him part of the "Scientist," race. And of course, we know he isn't a scientist.

So basically: if you're saying the Statue Species are scientists, but also the true race, then Prothy can't look like a Collector, but neither could he be a Scientist. Its a paradox, because its fact that Prothy is a "True," Prothean,

i Repeeat.

Lets take he have 3 races : Putnists, capitalists, Ananas. (Take that BW's writers)
They live in the prothean empire. So - they ARE prothean. There was no differentiation by race name in their empire.

[Someone With Mass]

Well, it wasn't that hard to figure out, considering that "Prothean" was the only word capitalized when the other races weren't.

[GodWood]

Armass81 wrote...
It's not just him, lot of Cerberus fanboys are up about this game, cause it turned out their precious terrorist organization might not be so good after all(dun dun duuuun)...

I do agree though that they could have done a little more with TIM, but still it is mostly pure malice from them not getting it exactly as they wanted it.

Get over it, I say...

It's funny how despite not mentioning Cerberus it keeps being brought up. Although, yes, I do take issue with how they've been handled it's hardly the only issue I have with the game.

EDI, the squad roster, some of the consequences and of course the prothean are all things I take issue with.

Arcian wrote...
Also, stay on f***ing topic or get the f**k out. I don't crash the TIM thread with meaningless taunts and rants, and I expect you to show the same courtesy in this thread.

So long as it's not just pointless spam I'm sure we wouldn't mind.

Discussion is fun.

[hawat333]

Please consider changing the topic title, putting "spoiler" before anything else.
I didn't know about a possible prothean squadmate, but "The Enkindler lives" gave it away.
I didn't even visit the character forums, just saw it in the main topic menu.

Not that much of a big deal, but it would be nice to do it in my opinion.

[Ice Cold J]

Arcian wrote...Things you do not like =//= Plot holes.

The lack of a mind-meld by the Asari Councilor.
Ash's "suit recordings" of Saren and Sovereign.
The happenstance of taking ALL your specialists with you when the Collectors hit the SR-2.

The first two for sure, the third I just threw in for sheer spite, but I think most will agree that was kinda convenient.

LTiberious wrote...

You know... there's a derelict reaper lying there for 37million years... and yet was found only recently.

+1 for you. Don't know WHY no one would notice that, though. Maybe it was too close to the brown dwarf?

Volc19 wrote...

Right, Ice Cold. How dare he not wake himself up, whilst being in stasis in a buried research facility with his entire species dead. He should have been able to project his consciousness into a physical form, and deactivate his own stasis pod. For shame, Prothy. For shame.

You telling me there's no timer on that thing? Or a VI to open it?

What's the point of going into stasis if you're just going to sit there until the galaxy implodes on itself?

If he turns out to be, like, a Prothean criminal or something, where he was locked away and not released while the others were being Reap'd, then I would ALMOST accept that. But if he is one of the survivors who built the Conduit and he just jumped into a stasis pod with NO exit date or resting in someplace no one would find him...
C'mon...

[Nissun]

Ice Cold J wrote...

 if he just jumped into a stasis pod with NO exit date or resting in someplace no one would find him...
C'mon...

I'd say it's a good way to kill himself in that situation.

Imagine you are left alone in a facility with that kind of technology. Your whole team is killed. You try to contact somebody off world but everywhere you look, there's Reapers.

You wait, as long as you can, isolated in there. But there is no contact from outside, nothing you can do. Would you simply kill yourself? I think putting himself on stasis would be a wiser alternative.

Because if somebody manages to rescue him after a long time, good. But if not, a malfunction on the stasis machine would kill him eventually. Or a planetary cataclism would wipe out the continent the facility he is in. Hell, he can even wait until the sun on that system goes supernova, that's a guaranteed death.

[hawat333]

Arcian wrote...

In the perfect world where spoilers were contained, I would... but there's no real point to it with what BSN being a spoiler minefield these days. Get out while you've yet to be blown up by something that's actually harmful.

Coming to think of it, that would be the right to do.


Unless I fail to resist the urge to check here and there for promotional items and such.
Which I will do.

[Nissun]

Hey, maybe it CAN last that long. We don't know. The Ilos stasis failed because there was a lot of people there, and the survivors decided to leave anyway. Prothy would be a single person to keep.

And besides, we're talking about a videogame that managed to bring a man back from the dead after falling from the upper atmosphere of a planet.

[Volc19]

Or, perhaps his mindset entering Stasis as more of "One of four things is going to happen. One, I stay in the pod until it dies of old age and I wake up. Two, some husks find me, wake me up, I kill them and then get back in stasis. Three, I'm found by friendlies and we get back to Reaper killing. Or four, something happens and the pod is destroyed, killing me. I'm liking these odds."

[Ice Cold J]

Arcian wrote...

Ice Cold J wrote...

Arcian wrote...Things you do not like =//= Plot holes.

The lack of a mind-meld by the Asari Councilor.
Ash's "suit recordings" of Saren and Sovereign.
The happenstance of taking ALL your specialists with you when the Collectors hit the SR-2.

The first two for sure, the third I just threw in for sheer spite, but I think most will agree that was kinda convenient.

The first two are lore errors, and the third is just a violation of common sense.

As for Prothy, we've already seen prothean mass effect technology remain functional for over 50,000 years (Therum, Ilos, Eletania, Kopis, Mars, Beacons etc), so a SINGLE stasis pod isn't that big of a stretch.

Hence why I assume you see it as a plot hole only because you dislike the idea of a living prothean. You wouldn't be the first, and you most certainly wouldn't be the last. That line of logic is pretty much the standard here on the BSN.

Ice Cold J wrote...

But if he is one of the survivors who built the Conduit and he just jumped into a stasis pod with NO exit date or resting in someplace no one would find him...
C'mon... 

If you're going to complain about something, do the f***ing research. He is NOT part of the Ilos team.

1. What the hell is the difference between a "lore error" and a "plot hole?"

2. I said "IF," didn't I? Pay attention. Hell, you even bolded it yourself. I'm not gonna do the goddamn research on something I'm trying to avoid until the game comes out. I'm guessing and offering my opinion. Apparently, since you're such a big expert on a game that hasn't come out yet, he's not part of the Ilos team. Fine then. Maybe his forced story arc will make sense.
I wasn't looking up a confirmed Prothean squadmate when I first checked this thread. I thought it was a "support" thread like every other character seems to have.
Chill out.

Nissun wrote...

Ice Cold J wrote...

if he just jumped into a stasis pod with NO exit date or resting in someplace no one would find him...
C'mon...

I'd say it's a good way to kill himself in that situation.

Imagine you are left alone in a facility with that kind of technology. Your whole team is killed. You try to contact somebody off world but everywhere you look, there's Reapers.

You wait, as long as you can, isolated in there. But there is no contact from outside, nothing you can do. Would you simply kill yourself? I think putting himself on stasis would be a wiser alternative.

Because if somebody manages to rescue him after a long time, good. But if not, a malfunction on the stasis machine would kill him eventually. Or a planetary cataclism would wipe out the continent the facility he is in. Hell, he can even wait until the sun on that system goes supernova, that's a guaranteed death.

It's funny how some people here can make a logical, well-formulated response and not resort to flaming.

Good point. Still a little iffy to me, but it at least makes sense.

[OmegaBlue0231]

Ice Cold J wrote...
1. What the hell is the difference between a "lore error" and a "plot hole?"

The ammount of changes you have to make to make it fit.

Modifié par OmegaBlue0231, 21 janvier 2012 - 06:19 .

[LTiberious]

Because the existance of this thread is a spoiler

[BentOrgy]

LTiberious wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

Right, but Prothy wasn't part of the assimilated races, he was pure Prothean. So I still don't understand.

Even if they did have castes (Which is still unlikely, we're talking about entire races of people, throughout the entire galaxy. That would like saying all whites are workers, all africans are traders, all asians are teachers, etc.) Prothy wouldn't look like a Collector, because if the True race looked like the Ilos Statues, that would make him part of the "Scientist," race. And of course, we know he isn't a scientist.

So basically: if you're saying the Statue Species are scientists, but also the true race, then Prothy can't look like a Collector, but neither could he be a Scientist. Its a paradox, because its fact that Prothy is a "True," Prothean,

i Repeeat.

Lets take he have 3 races : Putnists, capitalists, Ananas. (Take that BW's writers)
They live in the prothean empire. So - they ARE prothean. There was no differentiation by race name in their empire.

And I repeat;

If you're saying that the "Collector Protheans," are the "Warrior," Caste, but also saying that the "Ilos Protheans," are a "Scientist," Caste, and they're also the "True Prothean," race, Prothy would "Have," to be a "Scientist." 

Because regardless of their Empire's dominated races taking the name, there was still and actual Prothean Species, and that's what Prothy is. It all hinges on what you're saying the actual race looked like.

Besides, I can't imagine a galactic caste system. Just me, but it sounds too feudal, and more than a little improbable that all the races will be constricted in such a way. "You're people can only be this, your's can only be this, etc." We know the Protheans weren't the most delicate species, but sounds like too much of  hassle.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 21 janvier 2012 - 11:05 .

[Ice Cold J]

Arcian wrote...

Mind-melding with the asari councilor and Ash having "recordings" of Saren and Sovereign aren't plot holes in the story, but holes in your arguments. Let me explain:

First of all, the councilor can't just go around and meld with anyone - she is in a position of power threatened by dissidents and assassins, and melding with someone requires a relationship of trust that simply does not exist between her and Shepard.

Secondly, mind-melding would have proved nothing, seeing how neither Shepard nor Ashley actually spoke to Saren - his guilt was implied by a dockworker whose tesimony was discarded from the start. That was the only thing Shepard and Ash saw besides geth, and it was not circumstantial evidence.

Which, of course, brings the same issue to the suit recordings - how would Ash have recorded Saren on Eden Prime if she never met him? And Sovereign? The Normandy had recordings of Sovvy that was forwarded to the Citadel, and they discarded it as a geth dreadnaught.

As for melding with Shepard to find out about the Reapers, well... that could have provided some interesting responses, but it's near-impossible that she would have agreed to it anyway.
__________________________________________________________________________________
Then perhaps you shouldn't complain about it until the game comes out. And you definitely shouldn't be in this thread, because it's one of the, if not THE, most spoiler-heavy threads in the character section.

Ice Cold J wrote...  

I wasn't looking up a confirmed Prothean squadmate when I first checked this thread.

I thought the big ****SPOILER WARNING**** in the title was obvious.

Ice Cold J wrote...  

I thought it was a "support" thread like every other character seems to have.

It is. It's also a spoiler minefield.

1. Oh boy...
The Asari mindmeld refers to the last thing you brought up. Do what Liara does with Shep. See his visons. That would give her an idea of what he'd seen in his vison from the beacon. Don't know why she wouldn't have agreed to it. It would've settled the dispute. Or, at least verified what he had seen/experienced, right? I think it would be her duty to do it and consider it if the safety of the galaxy is at stake.
The suit recordings aren't mentioned by Ashley until they're discussing the events on Virmire, where they talk directly to Sovereign. They're not sending video footage of "him" to the council, they are playing back his voice and what Saren says on Virmire. Eden Prime has nothing to do with what I was discussing.
2. People throw ****SPOILER WARNING**** on every thread because they assume no one has been following the advertising. Anyway, I'm not mad that I found out about it. I'm mad that they seem to be forcing a character into the game that "pulls a Doestoyevsky (spelling sucks)" and discredits much of what the game has established to this point. Besides, Prothean "support" thread implies to me that it's a wishful thinking/petition thread, which there have been dozens of in the forums.
At any rate, MAYBE they will do a decent job of explaining it, but, at this rate, they might as well make up an excuse to bring the Virmire Victim back from the dead.
3. Apparently. Perhaps the OP could've labelled it "MAJOR SPIOLERS" or "LEAKED SCRIPT SPOILERS" or something a little more descriptive.

[LTiberious]

BentOrgy wrote...

LTiberious wrote...

BentOrgy wrote...

Right, but Prothy wasn't part of the assimilated races, he was pure Prothean. So I still don't understand.

Even if they did have castes (Which is still unlikely, we're talking about entire races of people, throughout the entire galaxy. That would like saying all whites are workers, all africans are traders, all asians are teachers, etc.) Prothy wouldn't look like a Collector, because if the True race looked like the Ilos Statues, that would make him part of the "Scientist," race. And of course, we know he isn't a scientist.

So basically: if you're saying the Statue Species are scientists, but also the true race, then Prothy can't look like a Collector, but neither could he be a Scientist. Its a paradox, because its fact that Prothy is a "True," Prothean,

i Repeeat.

Lets take he have 3 races : Putnists, capitalists, Ananas. (Take that BW's writers)
They live in the prothean empire. So - they ARE prothean. There was no differentiation by race name in their empire.

One thing - Salarians/Turians. Scientist-Warrior caste.

Protheans are all. "Pure Protheans" are otu of the question due to everyone being prothean. And we dont have a clear confirmation. 

Ah yes. Prothean - means "That who was before". So Prothean is just a term used.

And I repeat;

If you're saying that the "Collector Protheans," are the "Warrior," Caste, but also saying that the "Ilos Protheans," are a "Scientist," Caste, and they're also the "True Prothean," race, Prothy would "Have," to be a "Scientist." 

Because regardless of their Empire's dominated races taking the name, there was still and actual Prothean Species, and that's what Prothy is. It all hinges on what you're saying the actual race looked like.

Besides, I can't imagine a galactic caste system. Just me, but it sounds too feudal, and more than a little improbable that all the races will be constricted in such a way. "You're people can only be this, your's can only be this, etc." We know the Protheans weren't the most delicate species, but sounds like too much of  hassle.

[LTiberious]

When the thread was made we had no leaked script.

And yes- dont want spoilers - dont go to bsn.

that simple.

Hell, i've already spoiled to ending to many people, accidently Even though i've posted "MAJOR HUGE SPOILERS" in the name.

[Volc19]

LT, there is a main species known as the Protheans. They started the empire and subjugated all other species into their empire. While these other species still had names, they were subsidiaries of the Prothean Empire. Prothy refers to the annexed species impersonally, implying heavily that he is of the original, ruling species.

[LTiberious]

Volc19 wrote...

LT, there is a main species known as the Protheans. They started the empire and subjugated all other species into their empire. While these other species still had names, they were subsidiaries of the Prothean Empire. Prothy refers to the annexed species impersonally, implying heavily that he is of the original, ruling species.

Okay, lets put it this way.

Prothean - is based on "proto" meaning first in latin (Surprise). Thus every race before the current civ is "prothean"

But if we put this aside, and say that they themselves called themvelves Protheans....

So Ilos statues can be a different race. not the original Protheans.

They can vary Prothy's looks as much as they want. As long as protheans are "citadel races 50k yrs ago".

So even if he is from the main race, he still isnt obliged to look like those pesky Ilos statues.

Ah yes, confirming the idea of "Protheans" being multicultured - remember "The Zha" race? So even if we met their ruins in ME1/Me2 they would still be called "Prothean" ruins. Why? Because we dont know **** 'bout protheans. 

Yes i spoiled you with intel on the race Zha. Yes they are quarians 50k years ago. Yes and the Zha-Ro were Geth 50k years ago. yes im that bad of a person, to spoil you 3 lines of text, irrelevant to the story, or even any minor side mission.