40 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryoufu]

I have played this game numerous times and only a few occasions did I feel that Hawke was actually the champion of Kirkwall: The prologue with your Hawke and Bethany/Carver fighting off hordes of darkspawn, The Arishok duel(despite being a hit n' run thing), and the Legacy DLC. anything else that happened in between was either Hawke being an errand boy,sword-for-hire,and a ghostbuster<_<

I thought being the Champion ment being this powerful,infuential figure? the powerful part maybe somewhat correct and being an influential figure in Kirkwall ment nothing. I like DA2 but I more or less was playing the role of someone who just "goes with the flow".

anyone feel the same about this?

[whykikyouwhy]

Well, Hawke is given the title for vanquishing the Arishok, who was ravaging Kirkwall - so s/he saved the city and ended the Qunari threat.

I think the codex entry for the Champion's armor/outfit makes mention of there being several "Champions." It's an honorific title.

[Ryoufu]

So being a champion is like being a noble then?

[whykikyouwhy]

I don't think there are any lands or such bestowed with the title. Maybe it's more like being knighted. There's a wiki article here with the description - it's lenghty, otherwise, I'd copy and paste.

[KotorEffect3]

This thread again?

[TEWR]

The idea of a Champion is someone who wields great influence and power and is either a protector or a person of intimidation.


Hawke is just a person of intimidation, but has no influence, no power, no connections. His rise to power was just him stumbling into it. I'm not saying he should've planned on becoming Champion, but he definitely should've made connections to help solidify his mother's attempt at getting back the estate. Then when **** hit the fan in Act 2 he could've called upon his allies to help fight back against the Qunari, and then his being named Champion would've been believable.

I could give a long dissertation on how I would've done it, but I need to get some sleep. I'm sure someone else will post how it should've been done.

[Ryoufu]

ooohh I understand now. After rereading my original post, I think my problem wasn't with the Champion, but with Hawke being the Champion

[jlb524]

I was under the impression that Champions have no power and are under no obligations to continue protecting people...the title is an 'honor' that means people have to be nice to you cuz you saved them and they love/fear/respect you for your past deeds....and that's about it. However, they have no power or responsibility unlike someone who's made a Grey Warden or a Viscount, etc.

Meredith even threatens to send my mage Champion to the Gallows in Act 3 and has the power to do so. She doesn't do this out of respect for what Hawke did and what that symbolizes to the people.

[TEWR]

Meredith also says that as Champion you have a duty to protect Kirkwall.


But she is a bat**** insane woman.

[Morroian]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Hawke is just a person of intimidation, but has no influence, no power, no connections. His rise to power was just him stumbling into it. I'm not saying he should've planned on becoming Champion, but he definitely should've made connections to help solidify his mother's attempt at getting back the estate. Then when **** hit the fan in Act 2 he could've called upon his allies to help fight back against the Qunari, and then his being named Champion would've been believable.

But thats not the story they were presenting, powerlessness is probably the main theme of the game.

[TEWR]

No one wants to play a powerless loser.

Granted I don't want Hawke to have magically been able to solve everything.

[Morroian]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

No one wants to play a powerless loser.

Granted I don't want Hawke to have magically been able to solve everything.

Being powerless doesn't automatically make 1 a loser. But yeah I question having such a theme in a game. I personally liked it but can see why others wouldn't.

[Demx]

Basically instead of reviving a medal for a job well done, you get a title. It's probably more in line with receiving the Key to the City. You're a civvie and you went beyond what is expected of you in order to protect this city. So here's a cookie.

Modifié par Siradix, 03 août 2011 - 01:58 .

[jlb524]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Meredith also says that as Champion you have a duty to protect Kirkwall.


But she is a bat**** insane woman.

Doesn't she say that when she's trying to guilt you into doing her dirty work or siding with her when she wants to slaughter mages? 

[TEWR]

Champion: an honor unique to the Free Marches. Other terms of reverence suffer the stains of their holders, the lingering baggage of office and entitlement. But champion is not an appointment that can be sought. It cannot be owned or willed, and the process by which it is bestowed is not argued through policy or guile.[b] It is earned with blood and sweat and leadership in times of great turmoil. Always worthy, as their deeds are of true importance, a champion is greeted not by debate, but by nods of reverence.

The title was most recently granted in Tantervale, 8:82 Blessed, on the resolution of the bloody expansion of Nevarra. Their king, emboldened by the taking of Perendale and the quick yielding of Hasmal, thought the remainder of the Free Marches as easy claim. He who became the Champion. Cade Arvale of Rivain, did what Orlais had not: He stopped a nation in its tracks. There was blood and barter, but Tantervale is still free against all odds.

There is the contradiction of the honor. Champion is not itself a sign of approval. He or she can be respected or feared, their coming dreaded as much as desired. All that is common is that they have an effect and lives are changed.

Kirkwall now adds to the history of the title, a first for the city, on this 9:34 Dragon. The Qunari are repelled by the means respected or reviled, and it remains to be seen what follows for this Hawke, the Champion of Kirkwall.

[i]—From The Champion: History, Ancient and Current, excerpted by Philliam, a Bard!

--From Codex entry: Mantle of the Champion



Just so we have this somewhere in the thread.


Champions are leaders.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 03 août 2011 - 02:03 .

[Ryoufu]

meh, I still think that Hawke is more qualified to be a ghostbuster than a champion:lol:

[TEWR]

jlb524 wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Meredith also says that as Champion you have a duty to protect Kirkwall.


But she is a bat**** insane woman.

Doesn't she say that when she's trying to guilt you into doing her dirty work or siding with her when she wants to slaughter mages? 

I did say she was bat**** insane


But Champions are leaders, and as such leaders of that stature do have a responsibility to their city.

[Ulicus]

I'm still a little sad that "Champion" didn't turn out to be a new title to replace Viscount.

[Ryoufu]

Ulicus wrote...

I'm still a little sad that "Champion" didn't turn out to be a new title to replace Viscount.

I felt the same after my first playthrough

[Sepewrath]

How does killing Darkspawn at the beginning make you feel like a Champion? Physical skill alone wont make someone Champion, you have to do something of note and killing a bunch of Darkspawn is not exactly something of note. And you do realize your influence is why you got to chat it up with the brass of the city right, people don't get to just see the Viscount, Knight Commander and such on a whim.

On a side note TC is your name in reference to Ryofu Housen?

[Sajuro]

Ryoufu wrote...

meh, I still think that Hawke is more qualified to be a ghostbuster than a champion:lol:

Glyph of Paralysis + Glyph of Repulsion= crossing the beams?

[Sepewrath]

Streams, don't cross the streams.

[Ryoufu]

Sajuro wrote...

Ryoufu wrote...

meh, I still think that Hawke is more qualified to be a ghostbuster than a champion:lol:

Glyph of Paralysis + Glyph of Repulsion= crossing the beams?

LOL but i was thinking more along the lines of

1)get quest
2)find blood mage
3)blood mage summons demons
4)???????
5)PROFIT

[Ryoufu]

Sepewrath wrote...

How does killing Darkspawn at the beginning make you feel like a Champion? Physical skill alone wont make someone Champion, you have to do something of note and killing a bunch of Darkspawn is not exactly something of note. And you do realize your influence is why you got to chat it up with the brass of the city right, people don't get to just see the Viscount, Knight Commander and such on a whim.

On a side note TC is your name in reference to Ryofu Housen?

I always thought of a champion as this really powerful person in combat. I guess I watch too much Spartacus When I said influence, I meant that the common folk support him  or revere him.didn't see that at all through act 3 except for the occasional "look,the champion!" from random npc's.

as for your question, that would be a no. It comes from the japanese version of the name Lu Bu.a cookie to anyone who gets that:happy:

Modifié par Ryoufu, 03 août 2011 - 06:07 .