whykikyouwhy wrote...
I think part of the problem with trying to theorize on the City and the use of the Eluvians is that by using the word "city" we expect an actual location or physical place. It how our brains wrap around an intangible concept. Maybe it was never meant to be something physical - and whatever the Magisters accessed was either not physical, or was not the City they were looking for. Just as we paint heaven to have pearly gates and fluffy clouds in order to make it accessible for our minds, Thedans may be doing the same with the two Cities.
That is actually quite true. We (and Thedans) try to relate things to what we already know of. But the thing is there is also the element of the "physical" involved. We sort of see that with Morrigan as she physically disappears into the Eluvian. One could question whether she actually went somewhere beyond the Fade or not, but such are things as they stand. Quite annoyingly out of grasp.
I think Esbatty is on to something though.
I honestly thought he was joking.
The wiki states this:
"The Chantry also holds that when a person dies, their spirit passes through the Fade to the afterlife. Those who have turned away from the Maker are doomed to wander the Fade forever as lost souls.
That is the Chantry's world-view. What that doesn't explain are the possessions, the way the spirts can travel across the Veil into Thedas, and so on. As I said earlier, an element of the "physical" is heavily involved.
Fade spirits such as Justice claim that the dead pass to a realm beyond the Fade but are uncertain where.
But is Justice actually certain about it? And does he claim that they "pass through" the Fade? I haven't played Awakening, so I don't know. But his uncertainty about where those dead end up makes me think that there is an element of belief involved as far as his statements go - just as we believe things about life and death, and the beyond.
So the Fade is a super highway of sorts. In order to seemingly teleport across large distances and planes, you need to merge into the soul traffic and get shuttled along through the Fade. So the Eluvians may link across the Fade, and use the Spirits as conduits or fuel in order to operate - a person using an Eluvian doesn't step into the Fade, but uses its properties. Like the moving walkway in an airport. The Fade would be the gears under the conveyor belt - you step on the belt (through the mirror) and are moving along without actually touching the gears/motor/etc. The City accessible through an Eluvian may be planar in actuality, or just another form of ether (intangible heaven or a bundle of energy/spirit). But that goes into my Twinkie theory, which may be completely wrong...but I think I just like talking about Twinkies.
You certainly have a good imagination, and an art for interpreting things. I never thought about thinking about Esbatty's whole "wormhole" theory this way. :happy:
I'll say this. The Fade isn't just a highway - yes, it could also be a highway to the beyond. It is also a world in its own right. And as you noted earlier, it is a domain of spirits that were supposedly cast out. That leads to this whole concept of three worlds - the "real" Thedas, the beyond where the dead supposedly end up, and the middle etherial Fade, where spirits that are not welcome in the beyond have ended up.
The Eluvians could work just as you described. But, actually, as I think about it, I don't seem to recall ever hearing that the Eluvian can actually lead to anywhere through the Fade; just that it may be implied with the demon as you say below.
A tainted Eluvian could be one that opens to the Fade somewhat instead of passing over it - a fissure of crack allows some of the actual Fade to seep in and touch the user. Which could explain how a demon could pass through the Eluvian, or can be seen through the Eluvian.
The explanation could also be that Eluvians by their very operation tear the Veil. And I mean not just to the Fade, but also beyond it. The latter could explain how the corruption ended up into Thedas from the Black City, and the former how the demon can pass through. They could just be multi-functional, depending on how they are activated - depending on which frequency band of the beyond they tune into, sort of. Touch the wrong button/channel, and you get undesirable effects. Which is why I suppose it has a user manual.
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