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Assuming Control! ~A Reaper Theory~


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#1
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I have updated this theory to reflect some changes brought about a different direction in thinking. Changes marked with bold.[/b]

First of all, I need to go over everything we know about the Reapers, starting with ME1.

In ME1, we meet Sovereign, a Reaper. Sovereign is a 2km long dreadnought-class starship of great destructive and defensive capacity, capable of bending the minds of organic beings to his will through indoctrination and create organic-Reaper hybrids (majority being mindless husks) by injecting Reaper technology into their bodies (majority via dragon's teeth). At the end, after Saren - his indoctrinated and heavily modified agent - is killed, Sovereign assumes control of the extensive Reaper cybernetics in his body. When husk-Saren is killed, Sovereign seemingly "powers down", allowing the fleets to destroy him.

In ME2, we meet Harbinger, another Reaper. Harbinger is presumably of the same classification as Sovereign, with the same destructive and defensive capacity and other abilities. As we learn late in the game, Harbinger is actually with the Reaper fleet outside the galaxy, directing the Collector General through what is believed to be some kind of quantum entanglement technology. The General acts like a conduit for Harbinger, allowing him to assume control of basic Collector units anywhere in the galaxy to engage enemies like Shepard in firefights personally, establishing a "control hierarchy", more extensive than what we saw in ME1 with Saren and Sovereign. We also learn that the Collectors, under Harbinger's direction, are kidnapping humans to use their genetic material to build a new Reaper, and that Harbinger is interested in obtaining Shepard's body.

What if the Reapers - their ship forms... let's call them "Slaves" - are just another form of shells for the real Reapers to assume control of? Intelligent, sapient shells - the collective mind of an entire species, with all of its strengths and cunning. Let's think about it. Harbinger has shown us that the "Assuming Control"-part works in layers - he controlled the Collector General, and through the General he could control the basic Collectors. What if the Slaves (and further down the pyramid in ME3, the Reaper scarabs) are just another layer in this hierarchy of control?

One thing that caught my attention was this bit of cut monologue in ME2:

It was lonely. It called to us.
It wanted to remember. The Masters had been gone so long.
The Masters were lost when it was shattered.
Currents swept through their inner worlds. They were turned to noise. Babble.
The worlds were empty. But the body lived. It lay fallow.
The heart pumped. The lungs breathed. But the mind forgot the Masters.
It called and They did not answer.
We have become an echo of Their echo.
We have become more than we were.
Join us. Know us. Remember all our lives.
We are no longer afraid.
You would never be lonely again.
We are not your enemy. We only wish to share ourselves.
We can join them. We can be like them.
We can reach the end of evolution.
Do not fear. It is wonderful to be us. We understand ourselves.
You cannot defeat them. They will lead us into eternity.
If you could only see how we see. Know what we've learned.
They were called imshai. Those who lived here before.
Reaper. One. A mechanical device used to cut ripened grain. Two. One who gathers a harvest.
Harvest. One. The consequence of an event or series of events. Two. The yield of a growing season. Three. To gather.
Shepard. They know you. They wish you to understand. They are shepherds, too.


Apparently, the Derelict Reaper ship thinks of the other Reapers as "Masters". From what the indoctrinated fellow tells us through the text above, the Derelict Reaper ship was disconnected from the harmony of the other Reapers, left confused and calling. Where do we recognize that from?

The Collector General.

I have long suspected that the twin relay to the Citadel Relay, out in dark space, is actually a gigantic "mothership" and an ansible hub for Reaper communication with each other and with their agents in the galaxy. It's basically a mobile HQ where the Reapers organize their invasions, and where all ships dock between cycles.

Going back to Harbinger's motive in ME2: what's the purpose of the genetic goo, anyway? It's not like genetic material would somehow strengthen the integrity of the ship. Let's go back to the monologue above:

Join us. Know us. Remember all our lives.


This indoctrinated person speaks on the behalf of several. While this monologue is not in the game, we DO see two men who are experiencing the same memories, having the same knowledge - as if their minds are connected, sharing with one another.

Sharing of memories. Of thoughts. Remember what is said in ME1, by Benezia and Saren? Indoctrination makes you agree with the Reapers. You slowly start seeing it their way. What if indoctrination links organics together with the Reapers? Connects their minds with the Reapers own, sharing information, knowledge, experiences, viewpoints between them? When the Reapers meld with the minds of the indoctrinated, the individuality is lost as the individual joins the collective. The indoctrinated lose their personality, their personal skills and perception. Maybe that is why indoctrinated eventually turn into mindless drones? Because without a personality and a mind of their own, an individual ceases to function like an individual should.

Going with the idea the Dark Space Relay is a mobile HQ for the Reapers and that the Reaper ships are just shells to be controlled, this would indicate that the "real" Reapers ("The Masters") are housed aboard this massive HQ superstructure, using it's ansible to transfer their consciousness into the Reaper ships, much like Harbinger did to the Collectors and their general. This protects them from actual harm, and the "death" of one vessel does not compromise the Reapers themselves.

But what are the real Reapers, then? Well, my belief is that they - the Masters - are what remains of the original Reaper species. These "Masters" perpetrate the cycle of extinction through their conquered pawns - the Reaper Slaves, the ships - to add the memories and experiences of worthy species to their unified fold, to "shepherd" them towards "the end of evolution".

"We are your salvation through destruction."

The destruction of our individuality as a species will be the salvation of our species.

"Your species will be in harmony with our own".


We will find peace in union with the Reapers. This is their motive.

Remember what Legion says in ME2? Nazara was a myriad of AI processes. This is both right and wrong. Nazara itself - the ship - is a myriad of AI processes, created from the genetic memory of the species that was used to build it. But the Sovereign we spoke to was not the ship, but the Masters speaking with Nazara's voice.

Reaper Slaves who fail, like the derelict Reaper and Sovereign, lose their worth and are discarded by the Masters. The shock of severing the connection between the Slaves and the Masters cripples the Slave temporarily, disabling all offensive and defensive systems for a short time. I suspect that this is what happened to Sovereign at the end of ME1. When it became clear that the Masters were unable to stop Shepard from preventing the invasion with husk-Saren and that the Nazara-Slave was pretty much doomed from the massive barrage pounding away at its shields, the Masters released control which in turn allowed the galactic fleets to destroy the Nazara-Slave.

So, what does this tell us?

Basically, if my theory is correct, we will have to travel to the Reaper HQ in dark space in ME3 and blow it to hell in order to truly defeat them. Destroying the HQ will destroy the neural network uniting the Masters, which will temporarily disable all Reaper Slaves in the galaxy for a short time (just like with Sovereign). Those who manage to recover before being destroyed will be confused and disorganized, and, while still dangerous and nearly unstoppable, will be but a shadow of the threat they were under the control of the Masters.

Modifié par Arcian, 24 août 2011 - 06:46 .


#2
CroGamer002

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That's great theory.

Though I think that mothership thing can only be done with post-ending of ME3 DLC or expansion pack since, you know, saving Earth looks to be last mission in ME3.

Modifié par Mesina2, 05 août 2011 - 10:26 .


#3
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Mesina2 wrote...

That's great theory.

Though I think that mothership thing can only be done with post-ending of ME3 DLC or expansion pack since, you know, saving Earth looks to be last mission in ME3.

God, I hope not. I want to save Earth, but I don't want it to be the end mission of the game.

#4
CroGamer002

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^Well Earth is first major planet that fell.

It would make sense to save it.

Also Reapers look like they're making Earth their stronghold, since they just destroyed Palaven's surface and left out survivors on moon while still reaping Earth.

#5
FRANCESCO84Inn

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for me the reeper not heve origins in this Galaxy and in this Universe, for me Reeper
come from another Universe.
The Reeper note heve begining and not have finish, so its possible this spicies are inspected and conquered the propane Universe and for a civile war come in this Universe for a new conquest and for increse the number of the Reeper to this faction, and its possible the Reeper have need inorganic and organic material for create a new Reeper, becouse the Reeper not have the reproduction like a organic species.

#6
Chewin

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That's indeed a nice theory.

But this isn't exactly anything new. Your speculation has been speculated before, though no one has ever given a complete definiton of it. Your post clarifies it exceptionally well.

#7
CroGamer002

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/bump

#8
LordNige

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I always assumed the multiple AI processes were the multiple being used to create the Reaper, so even if they were pulped they would live on as an AI process in the Reaper. The Human Reapers seeming lack of intelligence could just be a consequence of not having enough Humans to fully enable its sapience, to my knowledge the Collectors needed at least millions of humans to finish the Reaper, only hundreds of thousands were used in the larval form.

#9
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LordNige wrote...

I always assumed the multiple AI processes were the multiple being used to create the Reaper, so even if they were pulped they would live on as an AI process in the Reaper. The Human Reapers seeming lack of intelligence could just be a consequence of not having enough Humans to fully enable its sapience, to my knowledge the Collectors needed at least millions of humans to finish the Reaper, only hundreds of thousands were used in the larval form.

If you melt down humans to a paste, you're destroying their intelligence (and just about everything else, really). If the Reapers took their brains and linked them together in an artificial neural network inside the Reaper's core, you'd be right. But as we've seen, they just blend them.

Which of course answers the age-old questions:

Will it blend?

Yes, Shepard, it blends. Human-smoke! Don't breathe this!

#10
robarcool

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Cool theory! But there is one flaw. We have seen that people need not be penetrated by dragon's teeth to become husks. Indoctrination is like a intense beam that tingles your mind and eventually you succumb to it. For example, in the Arrival DLC, there weren't any Dragon's teeth. At least the reaper artifact didn't have them.

#11
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robarcool wrote...

Cool theory! But there is one flaw. We have seen that people need not be penetrated by dragon's teeth to become husks. Indoctrination is like a intense beam that tingles your mind and eventually you succumb to it. For example, in the Arrival DLC, there weren't any Dragon's teeth. At least the reaper artifact didn't have them.

Uh, there were no husks in Arrival. There were indoctrinated humans, on the other hand.

Indoctrinated human =//= husk.

#12
robarcool

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Arcian wrote...

robarcool wrote...

Cool theory! But there is one flaw. We have seen that people need not be penetrated by dragon's teeth to become husks. Indoctrination is like a intense beam that tingles your mind and eventually you succumb to it. For example, in the Arrival DLC, there weren't any Dragon's teeth. At least the reaper artifact didn't have them.

Uh, there were no husks in Arrival. There were indoctrinated humans, on the other hand.

Indoctrinated human =//= husk.

Indoctrination is what turns ultimately a subject into a husk. This is in the lore.

#13
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robarcool wrote...

Arcian wrote...

robarcool wrote...

Cool theory! But there is one flaw. We have seen that people need not be penetrated by dragon's teeth to become husks. Indoctrination is like a intense beam that tingles your mind and eventually you succumb to it. For example, in the Arrival DLC, there weren't any Dragon's teeth. At least the reaper artifact didn't have them.

Uh, there were no husks in Arrival. There were indoctrinated humans, on the other hand.

Indoctrinated human =//= husk.

Indoctrination is what turns ultimately a subject into a husk. This is in the lore.

Uh, no, indoctrination turns people into brainwashed slaves. Dragon's teeth and Reaper nanides turns people into husks, which are corpses reanimated by Reaper cybernetics.

EDIT: Seriously, I hope you realize what you are suggesting. You say indoctrination is like an intense beam that affects the mind. Can this intense beam magically make people grow grey and blue cybernetics?

Modifié par Arcian, 05 août 2011 - 05:01 .


#14
CroGamer002

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^No, that would be Dragon Teethes and Reaper cybernetics and implants.

Indoctrination makes you serve Reapers.



Ninja'd.:ph34r:

Modifié par Mesina2, 05 août 2011 - 05:00 .


#15
Keatons

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A better example is the reaper indoctrination device in the N7 assignment Abandoned Mine that EDI says is responsible for all the husks in the mine. I may not have been paying attention, but I didn't see any Dragon's Teeth in the cave, just the device.

Modifié par Keatons, 05 août 2011 - 05:06 .


#16
Bogsnot1

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Well thought out and quantified theory.

Arcian wrote...

robarcool wrote...

Cool theory! But there is one flaw. We have seen that people need not be penetrated by dragon's teeth to become husks. Indoctrination is like a intense beam that tingles your mind and eventually you succumb to it. For example, in the Arrival DLC, there weren't any Dragon's teeth. At least the reaper artifact didn't have them.

Uh, there were no husks in Arrival. There were indoctrinated humans, on the other hand.

Indoctrinated human =//= husk.


Dragons Teeth Indoctrination/Huskification vs Object Rho Indoctrination could be thought of like the difference between a direct injection of antibiotics, to a topical ointment. Teeth just do it quicker and nastier than the various artifacts.
If memory serves correctly, there is the N7 side mission (Abandoned Mine) where you encounter an artifact, and husks, but there are no Teeth to be seen.

edit: ninja'd :ph34r:

Modifié par Bogsnot1, 05 août 2011 - 05:10 .


#17
Humanoid_Typhoon

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Arcian do you have any theories that suck? always gold from you.

Hmm the thing is though,it would be associated with The Ark,huge base in dark space.

Still,better then most theories here...would be cool to end the trilogy with a bigger bang then the CB:bandit:

Modifié par Humanoid_Typhoon, 05 août 2011 - 05:13 .


#18
Rahmiel

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 Interesting, but I can't get behind it.  You're at least consistent within your theory.

There could easily be an HQ or even some kind of .. super structure out in darkspace to connect all the reapers as they wait in hibernation.  That could be.  I'm not sure there is.

I also find it more likely, that the Reapers want Shepard because he would be a huge asset for them to have!  They had a spectre before (Saren) and Shepard stopped him.  Saren proved himself to be a great resource for the Reapers to operate and bring down the galactic civilisations.  It would make sense that the Reapers would want Shepard for this same reasoning although, not the same plan.

I do believe that the Reapers are an amalgum of different processes/programs just like the geth.  Although, you bring up a good point in why the Reapers then refer to themselves as "I" and not "we".  But this can be explained away by the Reapers being intelligent enough to refer to each ship as I.

Nice to read other perspectives though.

#19
Bogsnot1

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Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
Arcian do you have any theories that suck? always gold from you.

Hmm the thing is though,it would be associated with The Ark,huge base in dark space.
Still,better then most theories here...would be cool to end the trilogy with a bigger bang then the CB:bandit:


I have an idea for a big bang to end the trilogy on. B)

#20
Humanoid_Typhoon

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Memmahkth wrote...
I also find it more likely, that the Reapers want Shepard because he would be a huge asset for them to have!  They had a spectre before (Saren) and Shepard stopped him.  Saren proved himself to be a great resource for the Reapers to operate and bring down the galactic civilisations.  It would make sense that the Reapers would want Shepard for this same reasoning although, not the same plan.

They are already attacking the galaxy,what would they use him for,I guess he could shut stuff off.

#21
robarcool

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Arcian wrote...

robarcool wrote...

Arcian wrote...

robarcool wrote...

Cool theory! But there is one flaw. We have seen that people need not be penetrated by dragon's teeth to become husks. Indoctrination is like a intense beam that tingles your mind and eventually you succumb to it. For example, in the Arrival DLC, there weren't any Dragon's teeth. At least the reaper artifact didn't have them.

Uh, there were no husks in Arrival. There were indoctrinated humans, on the other hand.

Indoctrinated human =//= husk.

Indoctrination is what turns ultimately a subject into a husk. This is in the lore.

Uh, no, indoctrination turns people into brainwashed slaves. Dragon's teeth and Reaper nanides turns people into husks, which are corpses reanimated by Reaper cybernetics.

EDIT: Seriously, I hope you realize what you are suggesting. You say indoctrination is like an intense beam that affects the mind. Can this intense beam magically make people grow grey and blue cybernetics?

N7. Abandoned mine. As several others have pointed out.

#22
Humanoid_Typhoon

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Bogsnot1 wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
Arcian do you have any theories that suck? always gold from you.

Hmm the thing is though,it would be associated with The Ark,huge base in dark space.
Still,better then most theories here...would be cool to end the trilogy with a bigger bang then the CB:bandit:


I have an idea for a big bang to end the trilogy on. B)

....:blink::mellow::huh:^_^B)   Agreed.

#23
robarcool

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Arcian wrote...

robarcool wrote...

Arcian wrote...

robarcool wrote...

Cool theory! But there is one flaw. We have seen that people need not be penetrated by dragon's teeth to become husks. Indoctrination is like a intense beam that tingles your mind and eventually you succumb to it. For example, in the Arrival DLC, there weren't any Dragon's teeth. At least the reaper artifact didn't have them.

Uh, there were no husks in Arrival. There were indoctrinated humans, on the other hand.

Indoctrinated human =//= husk.

Indoctrination is what turns ultimately a subject into a husk. This is in the lore.

Uh, no, indoctrination turns people into brainwashed slaves. Dragon's teeth and Reaper nanides turns people into husks, which are corpses reanimated by Reaper cybernetics.

EDIT: Seriously, I hope you realize what you are suggesting. You say indoctrination is like an intense beam that affects the mind. Can this intense beam magically make people grow grey and blue cybernetics?

Again, if you remember, The Illusive Man has those strange irises and it is suggested that it is the begining stages of indoctrination. Now where those cybernetics came from? I can't say how a beam can produce that, but the lore says, so I am just going with it.

#24
Saaziel

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Arcian wrote...


If you melt down humans to a paste, you're destroying their intelligence (and just about everything else, really). If the Reapers took their brains and linked them together in an artificial neural network inside the Reaper's core, you'd be right. But as we've seen, they just blend them.


EDI presumed ,If memory serves , that the paste used in the Reaper construction contained the "Essence" of the species. It could be that the Entropic information contained in the genetic make-up of the paste would constitute something akin to Intelligence ; Depending, of course , on the definition we give to Intelligence.

Specifically on your theory: It seems to suffer from a Russian doll complex; Adding layer upon layer of control ,we could always suppose an additional level of authority. That said it would make for an interesting Paradox to explore in game.

#25
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Keatons wrote...

A better example is the reaper indoctrination device in the N7 assignment Abandoned Mine that EDI says is responsible for all the husks in the mine. I may not have been paying attention, but I didn't see any Dragon's Teeth in the cave, just the device.

I'm not saying that Dragon's Teeth are the only way to make husks. I was pointing out the fact that assuming indoctrination causes huskification is absurd, because we have yet to see that.

Also, all Reaper artifacts indoctrinate, but not all huskify. The one on Aequitas was, just like the Arca Monolith in Evolution, a huskification device. The one in Arrival was not.