132 réponses à ce sujet

[Sarge034]

KingNothing125 wrote...

The thing about Conrad and Sha'ira is...

Yeah, Conrad says you shoved a gun in his face no matter what, and the radio says Sha'ira is leaving the Citadel in disgrace... but if those brief ME2 mentions are the ends of their story arcs, then so what? Sha'ira in particular will have been a very minor character, and (let me guess) Conrad's ME2 mission is exactly the same if you correct the bug with the PC mod, save for slightly different introduction dialogue.

And if Sha'ira's story does continue into ME3, then the question you have to ask is, will BioWare even bother to write a continuation of the story where she doesn't leave the Citadel? After all, only a tiny portion of PC players will have the "correct" version. Everyone else will have the version where she leaves, even if you give Septimus' data to the Elcor embassador.

Wrong, there are two very different outcomes for Conrad in ME2. The mission if you went renegade in ME1 and a letter if you went paragon in ME1.

Please actually know what you are talking about before you post. I suggest a good place to start is the wiki page I have linked in my first post.

And your second part is advocating what? Because they screwed up we should just roll with it? How about they just fix the mistake? You know they do advertise that "your decisions will shape the galaxy". Well those two decisions got overridden so what is the point?

[Stofsk]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm more frustrated with the fanbase than I am the actual game.

This. Forever.

[streamlock]

Sarge034 wrote...

It is painful to say as I love the series, but I will not be buying ME3 when it comes out. I was going to pre-order the most expensive edition but I have decided that, at most, I will be buying ME3 used. Bioware has refused to patch the porting issues from ME to ME2. The PC community can, and has, modded the game to port the saves correctly. That leaves people who play consoles high and dry. I cannot justify giving my money to a company that advertises my ability to shape my own universe and then tells me that my choices don't matter. I have spoken to several people offline who feel the same way so I wanted to see what the community thought.  So, what do you all think?
 
If Bioware doesn’t care about my choices in game, I wonder if they will care about my choices out of game?
NO $ FOR YOU! 
 
So please come, post, support, and help make a great series truly magnificent.
Or just post to tell me I’m being stupid and help keep the thread active...



>Edit<

People seem confused about what glitch I am talking about. I am talking about ALL of the porting bugs.

"The Fan"
"The Consort"
"Besieged Base" (Sirta Foundation)

Just look in the "Mass Effect 2 consequences" section of the missions to see which ones have glitches.
http://masseffect.wi...iki/Assignments

I understand your frustration-Though I think in total the series has turned out pretty darn good, the lack of post release support is borderline insulting to an otherwise great piece of entertainment.

I had written a post a while back calling for more post release support (other then just DLC) a while back-don't know if anybody from Bioware read it, and maybe was not as will written as it could have been.  You can take a look at it, or maybe write a version with better prose then I can muster.  Read it here.

[SNascimento]

I'm not.
.
Actually I never liked a gaming franchise as much as I like Mass Effect. So keep the good work, Bioware!

[Bogsnot1]

Sarge034 wrote...

KingNothing125 wrote...

The thing about Conrad and Sha'ira is...

Yeah, Conrad says you shoved a gun in his face no matter what, and the radio says Sha'ira is leaving the Citadel in disgrace... but if those brief ME2 mentions are the ends of their story arcs, then so what? Sha'ira in particular will have been a very minor character, and (let me guess) Conrad's ME2 mission is exactly the same if you correct the bug with the PC mod, save for slightly different introduction dialogue.

And if Sha'ira's story does continue into ME3, then the question you have to ask is, will BioWare even bother to write a continuation of the story where she doesn't leave the Citadel? After all, only a tiny portion of PC players will have the "correct" version. Everyone else will have the version where she leaves, even if you give Septimus' data to the Elcor embassador.

Wrong, there are two very different outcomes for Conrad in ME2. The mission if you went renegade in ME1 and a letter if you went paragon in ME1.

Please actually know what you are talking about before you post. I suggest a good place to start is the wiki page I have linked in my first post.

And your second part is advocating what? Because they screwed up we should just roll with it? How about they just fix the mistake? You know they do advertise that "your decisions will shape the galaxy". Well those two decisions got overridden so what is the point?

You could try taking your own advice.
Watch this;

[Sarge034]

Bogsnot1 wrote...

You could try taking your own advice.
Watch this;

That was a custom mod bud.  See the wiki or better yet.  I'll bring the wiki to you.



Mass Effect 2 Consequences Edit
If you chose to Charm or Intimidate Conrad in Mass Effect and carry your save over to Mass Effect 2, he will be wearing knock-off N7 armor, and threatening a bartender on Illium, stating that when Shepard shoved a gun into his face (regardless of whether you did or not—see below), it inspired him to be extreme.

TriviaEdit

Content within Mass Effect 2 game files suggests that if Conrad was charmed in Mass Effect, he should send an e-mail thanking Shepard and never appear on Illium in Mass Effect 2 (news about his foundation would still be heard). However, a glitch in Mass Effect causes the Conrad encounter to be flagged both as "Intimidated" and "Charmed" in the importable save file, apparently leading to Mass Effect 2 picking the former over the latter and triggering Conrad's presence on Illium.

[Obsidian Gryphon]

^ Oh! That's interesting. I didn't know it's a glitch. Now I know why he said Shep shoved a gun at him when no such thing happened.   Oh well, opportunity to earn para/regned points!

[charmingcharlie]

Sarge034 wrote...

TriviaEdit

Content within Mass Effect 2 game files suggests that if Conrad was charmed in Mass Effect, he should send an e-mail thanking Shepard and never appear on Illium in Mass Effect 2 (news about his foundation would still be heard). However, a glitch in Mass Effect causes the Conrad encounter to be flagged both as "Intimidated" and "Charmed" in the importable save file, apparently leading to Mass Effect 2 picking the former over the latter and triggering Conrad's presence on Illium.

I have to call that into question, the Conrad Paragon bug has been fixed and Conrad Verner is still on Illium if you charmed him.  There is even an entirely different greeting cutscene if you charmed Conrad in Mass Effect 1.  You can see the Paragon greeting here :-



It is possible that the email happens if you never fully met Conrad all three times in ME 1 (that is just speculation on my part).  However the evidence is pretty clear that whether you charmed or intimidated Conrad in ME 1 he would still appear in ME 2.  The only difference between the two is how you are greated by the Asari bar tender and what Conrad says to you.

Edit :-

Sarge034 wrote...
That was a custom mod bud.  See the wiki or better yet.  I'll bring the wiki to you.../../../images/forum/emoticons/cool.png

Ah I see some one tried to tell you that you were WRONG already and you just went "derp derp that is a mod".  It is NOT a mod all you do to get the Paragon greeting is FIX the Conrad flag that does not get flagged in ME 1, that is it. 

YOu might not want to rely too much on the wiki, it is written by normal users and they can be wrong.  It doesn't even make sense to cut Conrad out of a paragon play through but keep him for a renegade play through.  The evidence suggests that Conrad is on illium regardless of whether you charmed or intimidated him.

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 06 août 2011 - 03:04 .

[JBONE27]

The Shi'ra thing I always thought of not as Bioware neglecting and alternate version, but more of them saying, "The damage was done before you got involved." It's like if someone high profile was accused of a crime then got acquitted. In the public minds, that person is still guilty.

[Xeranx]

charmingcharlie wrote...

Sarge034 wrote...
That was a custom mod bud.  See the wiki or better yet.  I'll bring the wiki to you.../../../images/forum/emoticons/cool.png

Ah I see some one tried to tell you that you were WRONG already and you just went "derp derp that is a mod".  It is NOT a mod all you do to get the Paragon greeting is FIX the Conrad flag that does not get flagged in ME 1, that is it. 

YOu might not want to rely too much on the wiki, it is written by normal users and they can be wrong.  It doesn't even make sense to cut Conrad out of a paragon play through but keep him for a renegade play through.  The evidence suggests that Conrad is on illium regardless of whether you charmed or intimidated him.

For quite a while that bug wasn't easy to fix.  Before the last update of gibbed's save editor earlier versions allowed you to make changes, but it still resulted in the same renegade outcome conversation.  A website and the aforementioned updated gibbed save editor allows for the correction to take effect.  

Mod is short for modification or modify.  Anything outside the boundaries of a program that is used to fix or make changes allows you to modify the program contrary to how it used to run.  This extends to fixes/patches as well.  So technically it is a mod that allows for Conrad's Paragon event to play out.

[Gorosaur]

stofsk wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm more frustrated with the fanbase than I am the actual game.

This. Forever.

I'll join your ranks.

[charmingcharlie]

Xeranx wrote...
Mod is short for modification or modify.  Anything outside the boundaries of a program that is used to fix or make changes allows you to modify the program contrary to how it used to run.  This extends to fixes/patches as well.  So technically it is a mod that allows for Conrad's Paragon event to play out.

You are not modifying the game though are you ?  When you apply this fix you do not alter the actual game in anyway whatsoever.  When you apply the fix (and I call it a fix I think it is a bit of a stretch to call it a "mod").  So you apply the fix to the save game and the actual game remains unmodified it just reads the save game and behaves how it should've in the first place.

But aside from whether it is a mod or not it is pretty clear that Conrad was meant to be in ME 2 regardless of whether you charmed or intimidated him.  So the wiki and Sarge034 are wrong and his attempt to make it seem like the game was "custom modded" to get the paragon greeting is wrong.  The game was not altered in any way whatsoever, all that was done is the flag for conrad was properly flagged and hey presto you get the correct paragon greeting.

[The Interloper]

Sarge034 wrote...

You mean like they fixed this problem?  Am I not trying to start an outcry?


The simple truth is that there is fix because the PC community has already found it, but Bioware has refused to patch the game for those of us on the console that don't mod.

As you yourself said, "try." Sorry, but last time I checked, "outcry" connotes more than one person.

The simple truth is that the glitches are over minor details. Lazy? Yes. A portent of future actions or an escalation of negligence? Not at all. Not by itself.

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm more frustrated with the fanbase than I am the actual game.

Fanbases tend to get finnicky, yes. Though the people who blow their tops whenever someone criticizes anything for any reason get on my nerves too.

[Bogsnot1]

charmingcharlie wrote...

I have to call that into question, the Conrad Paragon bug has been fixed and Conrad Verner is still on Illium if you charmed him.  There is even an entirely different greeting cutscene if you charmed Conrad in Mass Effect 1.  You can see the Paragon greeting here :-



It is possible that the email happens if you never fully met Conrad all three times in ME 1 (that is just speculation on my part).  However the evidence is pretty clear that whether you charmed or intimidated Conrad in ME 1 he would still appear in ME 2.  The only difference between the two is how you are greated by the Asari bar tender and what Conrad says to you.

Edit :-

Sarge034 wrote...
That was a custom mod bud.  See the wiki or better yet.  I'll bring the wiki to you.../../../images/forum/emoticons/cool.png

Ah I see some one tried to tell you that you were WRONG already and you just went "derp derp that is a mod".  It is NOT a mod all you do to get the Paragon greeting is FIX the Conrad flag that does not get flagged in ME 1, that is it. 

YOu might not want to rely too much on the wiki, it is written by normal users and they can be wrong.  It doesn't even make sense to cut Conrad out of a paragon play through but keep him for a renegade play through.  The evidence suggests that Conrad is on illium regardless of whether you charmed or intimidated him.

This. I believe CharmingCharlie summed it up, and much more politely than I would have. :innocent:
This happens to be the benfit of playing a game on PC. Quite often, we dont have to wait for patches, because we can find out how to fix them on our own, and share them with the community at large.
Nor do we face unrealistic bans for modding/tweaking single player games (Xbox Live), or being sued for tinkering with the hardware we rightfully own (Sony)

[Xeranx]

charmingcharlie wrote...

Xeranx wrote...
Mod is short for modification or modify.  Anything outside the boundaries of a program that is used to fix or make changes allows you to modify the program contrary to how it used to run.  This extends to fixes/patches as well.  So technically it is a mod that allows for Conrad's Paragon event to play out.

You are not modifying the game though are you ?  When you apply this fix you do not alter the actual game in anyway whatsoever.  When you apply the fix (and I call it a fix I think it is a bit of a stretch to call it a "mod").  So you apply the fix to the save game and the actual game remains unmodified it just reads the save game and behaves how it should've in the first place.

But aside from whether it is a mod or not it is pretty clear that Conrad was meant to be in ME 2 regardless of whether you charmed or intimidated him.  So the wiki and Sarge034 are wrong and his attempt to make it seem like the game was "custom modded" to get the paragon greeting is wrong.  The game was not altered in any way whatsoever, all that was done is the flag for conrad was properly flagged and hey presto you get the correct paragon greeting.

A fix or a mod doesn't have to have an effect on the rest of the game.  They can have an effect on one instance in the game and it may not mean a whole lot or anything throughout the remainder of the game.  In this case you're using the save editor to modify or alter a save so that a certain continuation of a storyline plays out the way it's supposed to.  Had that "fix" not been used to 'alter' or (again) modify the save the renegade outcome would play every single time.  There's no getting around this.

As to whether Conrad was meant to be in ME2 regardless of choices that goes against the Biowares statement of consequences because there is a way to get Conrad killed in ME.  So, no, he's not meant to be in ME2 regardless.  There's supposed to be 3 outcomes regarding Conrad.

[charmingcharlie]

Xeranx wrote...
A fix or a mod doesn't have to have an effect on the rest of the game.  They can have an effect on one instance in the game and it may not mean a whole lot or anything throughout the remainder of the game.  In this case you're using the save editor to modify or alter a save so that a certain continuation of a storyline plays out the way it's supposed to.  Had that "fix" not been used to 'alter' or (again) modify the save the renegade outcome would play every single time.  There's no getting around this.

Yes but you are not modifying the GAME are you.  You do not mod the actual Mass Effect 2 game one little bit.  All you are doing is fixing the "save game" which I happily admit could be construed as modding but it is stretching the definition a hell of a lot.  The actual Mass Effect 2 game with Conrad in it has a Paragon and a Renegade greeting built in does it not ? (you don't actually mod the paragon greeting into the game it is already there) So since Bioware intentionally put in a Paragon and a Renegade greeting into Mass Effect 2 it stands to reason that if you charmed Conrad in ME 1 you would meet him on illium (Sarge034 claims that is not the case).  All that happened is Bioware messed up the flagging which you correct and hey presto you get the paragon greeting.

Xeranx wrote... As to whether Conrad was meant to be in ME2 regardless of choices that goes against the Biowares statement of consequences because there is a way to get Conrad killed in ME.  So, no, he's not meant to be in ME2 regardless.  There's supposed to be 3 outcomes regarding Conrad.

I have never really bothered with Conrad all that much (to be honest he kinda gets on my nerves).  Obviously if he can be killed in ME 1 then you can't meet him in ME 2 just like if you killed Fist you cannot meet him in ME 2.  However what I was trying to say is that regardless of whether you charmed or intimidated him you would meet him in ME 2, therefore the Wiki and Sarge034 is wrong.

[Han Shot First]

efrgfhnm wrote...

I can only think of one issue with my imports, and that was Conrad, which I liked anyway because it addeda neat little assignment. If there are others I'm not thinking of then please correct me haha.
 

The other is that the Asari Consort gets run out of town as if you never did her personal mission.

While bugs like this are midly annoying and it would be nice if they had been patched, it isn't enough for me to rage quit the series. Conrad and the Asari consort are very minor characters.

[didymos1120]

charmingcharlie wrote...

It is possible that the email happens if you never fully met Conrad all three times in ME 1 (that is just speculation on my part). 

There is no Conrad email.  Don't know how this myth got started, but you can see for yourself with the ME2 TLK Tool.  It doesn't exist.  There is a cut Kirrahe email though.

[didymos1120]

charmingcharlie wrote...
So since Bioware intentionally put in a Paragon and a Renegade greeting into Mass Effect 2 it stands to reason that if you charmed Conrad in ME 1 you would meet him on illium (Sarge034 claims that is not the case).

OK, if you don't use the updated Gibbed Save Editor with the new fix, here's what happens:

If only the Paragon flag is set, and you re-import, Conrad shows up....and you still get the Renegade version of the events.

If only the Renegade flag is set, and you re-import that save, Conrad will NOT show up. 

The import utility just ignores the Renegade flag in the ME1 plot table. Why? Because ME1 always flags both if he was Charmed or Intimidated, so it only needs to look at one variable to know you did one or the other, but of course it has no way to know which. The Paragon flag comes first in the table, so they just check that one.  But there is never a case where an imported ME1 save will result in a Charmed/Intimidated Conrad not appearing, unless you've modified it (highly unlikely since there's no ME1 save editor).

And for the curious, here's how the new fix works: there's another, duplicate table in the ME2 save that is what the game actually reads from to determine what should happen (and thus it can be modified without having to re-import in order to see a change).  It's effectively just a copy of the ME1 table, except for Conrad: for him, the Renegade flag is always set. Due to the ME1 bug, they had to pick one of the two scenarios, and for whatever reason, that one was it.

Modifié par didymos1120, 06 août 2011 - 08:07 .

[Ninjapino]

A) Bioware has said already that the Conrad glitch will be addressed in ME3. Conrad is not the most stable person to begin with, so it's easy (for me at least) for him to claim I was much more aggressive with him than I actually was.

That is a very minor news report......really not worth the time I think to patch it to take it out considering you get an email from the consort anyway.

C) Yes, it was stated Sirta might be shutting down originally because of a bug, but that could easily be explained...whether you saved the hostages or not, it could have been a very massive PR mess for them and forced them to shut down anyway. I don't remember the exact phrasing of the news cast, but I don't think it said any details of if all the hostages were saved or killed.

Overall, these are three VERY minor glitches that so far haven't had much effect on the games.  They might very well address all three in ME3, but even if they don't, the mass amount of OTHER decisions and choices they are porting over kind of over-shadow it.  Those are some extremely picky issues to refuse to buy the game over, imo. 

Modifié par Ninjapino, 06 août 2011 - 08:26 .

[TwistedComplex]

marshalleck wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

Who makes patch for almost 4 year old game?

Blizzard comes to mind.

And they have a reputation for quality and polish as a result.

Blizzard. Quality.

Modifié par TwistedComplex, 06 août 2011 - 08:45 .

[Ianamus]

I'm only frustrated with the whole multiplayer thing. Every time Cesey seems to say it's not in ME3, another article comes up with a 'leak' and theres a quote from another person making the game who says "I cant deny that multiplayer is in the game, and we have many other cool features to announce"
It's just so aggrivating   I want a straight answer with no contradictions. 

[CuseGirl]

didymos1120 wrote...

Sarge034 wrote...

 So, what do you all think?
 

That the bugs are few and don't affect anything all that significant, and thus aren't worth drawing a line in the sand over. Seriously, what are they?  There's:

a. Conrad.
b. Incorrect news story about the Consort plays.  Choice might be correctly recorded though, since you get the proper email from her.

Yes, there's the Anderson/Udina choice not being recorded into the endgame saves, but it's handled in ME2 with a question on the shuttle ride w/ Miranda and Jacob. 

Wait, wut question on the shuttle ride?

[didymos1120]

CuseGirl wrote...

Wait, wut question on the shuttle ride?

This one: 

Miranda: Shepard, think back to the Citadel, after the Council died on the Destiny Ascension, and you killed Saren. What happened next?

or alternately:

Miranda: Shepard, think back to the Citadel, after the Alliance saved the Destiny Ascension, and you killed Saren. What happened next?

You then get one of the following sets of choices:

"Anderson led a new Council." / "Udina led a new Council."

or:  

"Anderson joined the Council." / "Udina joined the Council."

It's there because ME1 makes the endgame save before you choose the Councilor (I think it saves immediately after Robospectre is killed). A dev said it supposedly will be recorded if you sit through the end credits, but that doesn't work on the PC. Haven't tested it on the 360.

Modifié par didymos1120, 06 août 2011 - 09:54 .