313 réponses à ce sujet

[lazuli]

Crimzontearz, your suggestions would work with a different cooldown system. As it is, even a reduced floating effect would be lengthy enough for an Adept to keep at least two enemies out of the fight with minimal upgrades/effort.

I'd rather see lengthier staggers tailored* to the power at hand than a complete revision of the cooldown and protection systems.


*Pull's stagger would have the enemy stumble forward. Throw's stagger would have the enemy reel backwards.

[Gromnir]

dreman9999 wrote...

Gromnir wrote...

Yeti1069 wrote...
<truncated>
 

I do think it would be better if protections worked differently from each other.  I know they are different in regards to certain things being able to punch through them easier, but they otherwise behave the same. 

Protections should also act more like resistances instead of immunities.  A low-level enemy's armor shouldn't be able to stand up to your max-level throw.  Or perhaps the effectiveness of a protection decreases as it gets depleted.

That would make it like ME1...and that was broken.

I think you're missing my point.  Why are there 3 types of protections that do the exact same thing?  The only difference is: use overload for shields, incinerate for armor, warp for barriers.  Even the weapon damage charts for them are mostly the same, with armor being lower or higher than shields/barrier (which are always the same as each other) for some weapons.  They should have more of a different feel to them.

Also, the way that protections work make protection-stripping powers disproportionately useful.

[dreman9999]

crimzontearz wrote...

not the point. the point is that a "stagger" is not a reduced "floating" effect..it is just a stagger.....I'd understand Shockwave working that way, but not pull and throw really. a reduced effect would be being pulled up for a couple of seconds...not just a stagger. Regardless......we will see what the devs do.

Also, that "immunity" works only for vertain classes...to a soldier-for instance- it's just a matter of how many more bullets you have to pump into them and with what mod

And what would be a reduce float effect mean? It would still be just as over powered as ME1.  Powers and Weapons have extra damage on defences, so even it the person was floating for 2 seconds...in that 2 second that person would be stripped and killed. And with the powers and ammo we have now...exta health means nothing, especially when you can freeze them after the defence is gone. The thing is ME2 has more powers the control eneies than ME1. If any of the overpowered nature of ME1's adepts came into it, the adept would walk over enemies like nothing. And if you want some target to be pulled with no problem...Go play the game on veteran.

[dreman9999]

Gromnir wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Gromnir wrote...

Yeti1069 wrote...
<truncated>
 

I do think it would be better if protections worked differently from each other.  I know they are different in regards to certain things being able to punch through them easier, but they otherwise behave the same. 

Protections should also act more like resistances instead of immunities.  A low-level enemy's armor shouldn't be able to stand up to your max-level throw.  Or perhaps the effectiveness of a protection decreases as it gets depleted.

That would make it like ME1...and that was broken.

I think you're missing my point.  Why are there 3 types of protections that do the exact same thing?  The only difference is: use overload for shields, incinerate for armor, warp for barriers.  Even the weapon damage charts for them are mostly the same, with armor being lower or higher than shields/barrier (which are always the same as each other) for some weapons.  They should have more of a different feel to them.

Also, the way that protections work make protection-stripping powers disproportionately useful.

Because if it worked like ME1, stripping power would be useless.
And their is a differance...It's in the base damage, multiplier, and class using the gun. The protection is based more for the class in hand. Caster classes do weaker damage than combat class due to the extra power the combat class get to weapon power. It's to make powers and weapons more effective as certin times without making that power or weapon too over powered.

[Shepard the Leper]

Gromnir wrote...

I think you're missing my point.  Why are there 3 types of protections that do the exact same thing?  The only difference is: use overload for shields, incinerate for armor, warp for barriers.  Even the weapon damage charts for them are mostly the same, with armor being lower or higher than shields/barrier (which are always the same as each other) for some weapons.  They should have more of a different feel to them.

Also, the way that protections work make protection-stripping powers disproportionately useful.

There are three types simply to justify having more abilities. When all enemies have one type of defenses, most powers and weapons become redundant. With the current system the player has to think about which powers, weapons and squadmates are going to work well together. It's a simple system, but it works rather well.

Defense stripping is actually the easiest part of playing on Insanity. Those that truly mastered ME2 gameplay excel in using every ability at exactly the right time.

I find it rather amusing to hear people suggesting Insanity is about defenses only, whilst it requires a greater effort to finish off enemies who have lost their protection.

[The Spamming Troll]

Dreman,
Nobody is talking about ME1 so y do u keep bringing it up?

When ME3 comes out and you see some of the changes made to combat are you going to think its a worse off game? Literally youve tried to shoot down every suugestion offered in improving gameplay in ME3. You love ME2 alot, we get it.

[Yeti1069]

Well, I've been pressing on with my Insanity playthrough and am appreciating Mordin a little more, but he still does feel pretty useless until shields or barriers are down, which means he only comes along for missions that are armor-heavy, which sucks.

Jack feels COMPLETELY useless, since she can't really deal with any defenses. I keep bringing her along, get frustrated and restart the mission with someone else. Yeah, when you've stripped defenses she can control a couple of targets at once, but if defenses are down, other characters have ways of dealing with them also. Staggering someone out of cover doesn't feel all that useful.

Seems like Miranda is going to occupy a permanent party slot since she can take down any defenses, boosts my health and weapon damage and eventually gets a decent CC ability as well. I like using her, but don't enjoy feeling like she's stapled into the 2nd squad slot.

[The Spamming Troll]

Yeti1069 wrote...

Staggering someone out of cover doesn't feel all that useful.

its equally as dissapointing as being a jedi without force powers.

i agree with your thought process that goes into picking squadmates too. i basically make miranda my LI for not other reason then shes by my adepts side all the time anyways. might as well bang her if shes just gonna put that booty in my grill all day, you know!

[crimzontearz]

dreman9999 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

not the point. the point is that a "stagger" is not a reduced "floating" effect..it is just a stagger.....I'd understand Shockwave working that way, but not pull and throw really. a reduced effect would be being pulled up for a couple of seconds...not just a stagger. Regardless......we will see what the devs do.

Also, that "immunity" works only for certain classes...to a soldier-for instance- it's just a matter of how many more bullets you have to pump into them and with what mod

And what would be a reduce float effect mean? It would still be just as over powered as ME1.  Powers and Weapons have extra damage on defences, so even it the person was floating for 2 seconds...in that 2 second that person would be stripped and killed. And with the powers and ammo we have now...exta health means nothing, especially when you can freeze them after the defence is gone. The thing is ME2 has more powers the control eneies than ME1. If any of the overpowered nature of ME1's adepts came into it, the adept would walk over enemies like nothing. And if you want some target to be pulled with no problem...Go play the game on veteran.

wait what? You do realize there is a difference  between say floating for a good five seconds and floating for only 1.5 before falling down?

Or between being thrown literally across a field(possibly to your doom) or just a few meters?

if the power flat out does not do what it is "supposed" to do and merely "staggers" an enemy making a small dent in their defenses then it did NOT work at all. It didn't work at reduced effectiveness. It is supposed to work as crowd control not as "induce stagger". Yes, in 1.5 seconds a goon COULD be killed. but that's it...ONE goon, even using an evolved pull for instance and pulling up 3 goons 2 of them would be pretty much unfazed as they would just go back to cover. I do not see that as overpowered at all.

Again maybe YOU like playing insanity as a  defense strip fest as an adept (does not matter to me I play only Vanguard) but to others that is obviously unsatisfactory regardless of the "challenge factor" that may be thrown into it , it just does NOT feel like the adept.

Let me give you an example. Let's say I play crysis 2 on its highest level of difficulty. The game IS actually harder, enemies are faster, more aggressive, there are more high level opponents and often sport better weapons....same for humans but for god's sake my nanosuit STILL works (I think the drain on the battery is higher but still). I can STILL be invisible without ALL the enemies  see me right away unless I shoot them a little first to "weaken" them. I can still sneak up behind them and 1-shot kill them with a stealth kill without them being immune to it. I can still knock aliens on their feet with a ground stomp without having to remove all their armor first because they are now "immune" to it. I can still use nanovision to find out my enemies before they see me. If  all enemies became pretty much immune to all nanosuit powers for the sake of creating a flase sense of challenge then it would NOT feel like being a nanosuit soldier at all and it would kill the core idea that makes Crysis 2 is actually a VERY fun FPS.


Also....please do not resort to the BS argument "if you do not like this then play on an easier mode" Honestly, I have my insanity achievement for ME1 and 2, my Legendary achievement for the Halo games and the Nightmare achievement for GoW 1 and 2, I play on those difficulties simply for the achievements and otherwise play the game on their "normal" setting because that's where the baseline experience is supposed to be and if I wanted an extra challenge I could always bump it up but if I REALLY like Adept's playstyle I am pretty sure I would not have found Insanity a rewarding challenge but simply a frustrating one. Just because something needs to be more "challenging" that does not mean it has to be tedious and change what is "fun" about playing a certain class. And so far a lot of people are finding it not fun or rewarding.

[Shepard the Leper]

crimzontearz wrote...

wait what? You do realize there is a difference  between say floating for a good five seconds and floating for only 1.5 before falling down?

Or between being thrown literally across a field(possibly to your doom) or just a few meters?

If you make those changes, you successfully ruined the combat-power system. It cannot be done. Please explain why anyone would ever want to use one of all the other biotic powers (Singularity, Stasis, Reave, Shockwave, Warp, Slam, Dominate) if all you need to do is knock all enemies on their backs using Pull and Throw alone?

Enemies that go down have to get back up. This takes 2-3 seconds (at least) and, considering Pull and Throw's quick cooldowns, would allow you to, single-handedly (only Shepard), engage anybody. Two YMIRS are not going to be able to fire a single shot. A bunch of Krogan? What Krogan - oh, you mean those crawling figures on the floor. Etc etc. That would be gamebreakingly boring imho.

if the power flat out does not do what it is "supposed" to do and merely "staggers" an enemy making a small dent in their defenses then it did NOT work at all. It didn't work at reduced effectiveness. It is supposed to work as crowd control not as "induce stagger". Yes, in 1.5 seconds a goon COULD be killed. but that's it...ONE goon, even using an evolved pull for instance and pulling up 3 goons 2 of them would be pretty much unfazed as they would just go back to cover. I do not see that as overpowered at all.

You can throw fireballs all day long at Dragons (in DA) without any effect. Does that make elemental attacks / powers useless? You cannot stun Dragons either, does that render DA's stunning abilities obsolete? Why should powers always, and against any foe, work alike? What's wrong with the concept of having powers that are excellent in situation A and lousy in B?

Again maybe YOU like playing insanity as a  defense strip fest as an adept (does not matter to me I play only Vanguard) but to others that is obviously unsatisfactory regardless of the "challenge factor" that may be thrown into it , it just does NOT feel like the adept.

Let me give you an example. Let's say I play crysis 2 on its highest level of difficulty. The game IS actually harder, enemies are faster, more aggressive, there are more high level opponents and often sport better weapons....same for humans but for god's sake my nanosuit STILL works (I think the drain on the battery is higher but still). I can STILL be invisible without ALL the enemies  see me right away unless I shoot them a little first to "weaken" them. I can still sneak up behind them and 1-shot kill them with a stealth kill without them being immune to it. I can still knock aliens on their feet with a ground stomp without having to remove all their armor first because they are now "immune" to it. I can still use nanovision to find out my enemies before they see me. If  all enemies became pretty much immune to all nanosuit powers for the sake of creating a flase sense of challenge then it would NOT feel like being a nanosuit soldier at all and it would kill the core idea that makes Crysis 2 is actually a VERY fun FPS.

You cannot use the abilities we are discussing here in Crysis. The nanosuit has no effect whatsoever on enemies - all biotic powers have to fired / used on enemies (not on the player).

I have not played Crysis 2, but in the first and on the toughest (Delta, I recall) difficulty setting, the armor, speed, and strength boosting features become rather redundant. Sure, you could activate armor - but you'll get shot and killed within a second or two (if it isn't less). It has hardly any effect on gameplay (it has when you're playing on the normal difficulty setting). Speed and Strength were situational powers at best (could be usefull to go somewhere quickly or to jump over walls or obstacles).

Making the ME powers gamebreakingly OP, when playing on the hardest difficulty level, defeats the whole purpose of having a small challenge. In many ways, the added protection (on HC and Insanity) makes ME2 a better game by giving all powers (those that have to be used on the enemy and not on Shepard him/herself, like the nanosuit) specific strengths and weaknesses.

Also....please do not resort to the BS argument "if you do not like this then play on an easier mode" Honestly, I have my insanity achievement for ME1 and 2, my Legendary achievement for the Halo games and the Nightmare achievement for GoW 1 and 2, I play on those difficulties simply for the achievements and otherwise play the game on their "normal" setting because that's where the baseline experience is supposed to be and if I wanted an extra challenge I could always bump it up but if I REALLY like Adept's playstyle I am pretty sure I would not have found Insanity a rewarding challenge but simply a frustrating one. Just because something needs to be more "challenging" that does not mean it has to be tedious and change what is "fun" about playing a certain class. And so far a lot of people are finding it not fun or rewarding.

You're talking about your own personal preference here. Stuff you consider to be fun, or challenging does not equal the opinion others have and it's the purpose of having a difficulty system in the first place. The hardest difficulty levels are never supposed to be fun, they're meant for players who consider the normal level too easy.

I'm not nearly as good as some of the folks on YouTube (playing Adept). I have to tone down the difficulty to Veteran to play in such a way. But that doesn't mean Insanity sucks. I love tossing enemies around for a while, but there isn't much to call 'fighting' when I'm playing without the added protection bars. I prefer to play on Insanity because it actually feels like combat. I have to think what to do. Which power to use. What weapons to select. Who to take with me. And how to mix those things up to get the most out of all the stuff the game provides the player with.

For me that is fun and rewarding. - the option, to throw all enemies out of the window with both hands tide behind my back, is not.

[crimzontearz]

grr I hate quote segmentation while I am on my smartphone so I'm going to, again, coalesce it all

First off, by actually letting powers work at reduced effects you are not rendering other CC powers (other than pull and throw) useless. Not all characters have all Biotic CC powers and Adepts can still use appropriate powers in the right situations when cover is involved or enemies are singling themselves out or you want to pull off a warp bomb or whatever. Defense stripping would still be a great way to save bullets (especially on insanity where you need to use a lot more). Point is you want the status quo to remain as is....other people do not. And it is not a matter of difficulty as we have discussed beforebut of "feel"


so let's move on to your DA example shall we? sure dragons are immune to fire based spells...sure they cannot be stunned....but are they immune to EVERYTHING but swords? No...petrifying spells still work, so does paralysis and so on and so forth and it would be ok even if the dragons had more immunities because they are the most powerful enemies in the game. How about we make ALL DA enemies immune to all magic effects but say stone fist? all the way down to the weakest hurlok and tiniest deep road dwelling pest....totally immune but a 2 seconds stagger effect and and very small damage dealt. Immunities are all fine and dandy if properly distributed and if not EVERYONE (including feral varren) is immune to EVERYTHING uness you have already pummeled them nearly to death first.


Moving on to my Crysis example. No the powers of the nanosuit in crysis 2 (on supersoldier) are not redundant. Sure armor mode will not last as long as on Soldierdifficulty but not because enemies are bypassing it altogether, but simply because enemies are more accurate and aggressive. As I said enemies will not just be immune to all the nanosuit powers and yes there aremore liutenent lnevel enemies that might, for instance, be able to see past my cloak but they will notbe ALL like that otherwise it would just be pointless to actually use the nanosuit at all. On insanity powers aside overload, incinerate or warp are useless unless defenses are taken down first. That's not a streanght/weaknesses scenario that's a "useless until conditions are met" scenario. If some powers passed through shields, some through armor but non through both THEN it would be a strength/weakness scenario...as it is right now it simply is a defense-strip fest.


I do not care how super-leet some people are? how they waltz through insanity without dying once...people like that are always going to exist. It's a matter of how the majority feels and so far a lot of people dislike the "defense = immunity" system. I understand YOU may like it but others do not (me too on principle) and I hope bioware listens to them

[MELTOR13]

I hope BioWare DOESN'T listen to alot of the ideas in this thread. I don't think many of the changes suggested here would provide a better gameplay experience.

[MELTOR13]

Yeti1069 wrote...

Well, I've been pressing on with my Insanity playthrough and am appreciating Mordin a little more, but he still does feel pretty useless until shields or barriers are down, which means he only comes along for missions that are armor-heavy, which sucks.

Jack feels COMPLETELY useless, since she can't really deal with any defenses. I keep bringing her along, get frustrated and restart the mission with someone else. Yeah, when you've stripped defenses she can control a couple of targets at once, but if defenses are down, other characters have ways of dealing with them also. Staggering someone out of cover doesn't feel all that useful.

Seems like Miranda is going to occupy a permanent party slot since she can take down any defenses, boosts my health and weapon damage and eventually gets a decent CC ability as well. I like using her, but don't enjoy feeling like she's stapled into the 2nd squad slot.

I'm always confused with statements like these. You can complete the game easily with just about any squadmate/Shep setup. It's not necessary to min/max with squadmates. Miranda isn't necessary on any difficulty, even though she is useful. Jack can be a beast of a squadmate, and Mordin is extremely useful for just about any mission, not just armor-heavy ones. All in all you can bring just about whoever you want with you for any given mission and be fine. 

[dreman9999]

crimzontearz wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

not the point. the point is that a "stagger" is not a reduced "floating" effect..it is just a stagger.....I'd understand Shockwave working that way, but not pull and throw really. a reduced effect would be being pulled up for a couple of seconds...not just a stagger. Regardless......we will see what the devs do.

Also, that "immunity" works only for certain classes...to a soldier-for instance- it's just a matter of how many more bullets you have to pump into them and with what mod

And what would be a reduce float effect mean? It would still be just as over powered as ME1.  Powers and Weapons have extra damage on defences, so even it the person was floating for 2 seconds...in that 2 second that person would be stripped and killed. And with the powers and ammo we have now...exta health means nothing, especially when you can freeze them after the defence is gone. The thing is ME2 has more powers the control eneies than ME1. If any of the overpowered nature of ME1's adepts came into it, the adept would walk over enemies like nothing. And if you want some target to be pulled with no problem...Go play the game on veteran.

wait what? You do realize there is a difference  between say floating for a good five seconds and floating for only 1.5 before falling down?

Or between being thrown literally across a field(possibly to your doom) or just a few meters?

if the power flat out does not do what it is "supposed" to do and merely "staggers" an enemy making a small dent in their defenses then it did NOT work at all. It didn't work at reduced effectiveness. It is supposed to work as crowd control not as "induce stagger". Yes, in 1.5 seconds a goon COULD be killed. but that's it...ONE goon, even using an evolved pull for instance and pulling up 3 goons 2 of them would be pretty much unfazed as they would just go back to cover. I do not see that as overpowered at all.

Again maybe YOU like playing insanity as a  defense strip fest as an adept (does not matter to me I play only Vanguard) but to others that is obviously unsatisfactory regardless of the "challenge factor" that may be thrown into it , it just does NOT feel like the adept.

Let me give you an example. Let's say I play crysis 2 on its highest level of difficulty. The game IS actually harder, enemies are faster, more aggressive, there are more high level opponents and often sport better weapons....same for humans but for god's sake my nanosuit STILL works (I think the drain on the battery is higher but still). I can STILL be invisible without ALL the enemies  see me right away unless I shoot them a little first to "weaken" them. I can still sneak up behind them and 1-shot kill them with a stealth kill without them being immune to it. I can still knock aliens on their feet with a ground stomp without having to remove all their armor first because they are now "immune" to it. I can still use nanovision to find out my enemies before they see me. If  all enemies became pretty much immune to all nanosuit powers for the sake of creating a flase sense of challenge then it would NOT feel like being a nanosuit soldier at all and it would kill the core idea that makes Crysis 2 is actually a VERY fun FPS.


Also....please do not resort to the BS argument "if you do not like this then play on an easier mode" Honestly, I have my insanity achievement for ME1 and 2, my Legendary achievement for the Halo games and the Nightmare achievement for GoW 1 and 2, I play on those difficulties simply for the achievements and otherwise play the game on their "normal" setting because that's where the baseline experience is supposed to be and if I wanted an extra challenge I could always bump it up but if I REALLY like Adept's playstyle I am pretty sure I would not have found Insanity a rewarding challenge but simply a frustrating one. Just because something needs to be more "challenging" that does not mean it has to be tedious and change what is "fun" about playing a certain class. And so far a lot of people are finding it not fun or rewarding.

1. Staggering enemies out of cover is Crowd control. Why? Because you stopped them from moving, allowed them to be out of cover to be shot at  and  stopped them from shooting back. CC is what Adept main streight alway was. Even if it's not the full effect, it still uses them main theme of attack Adepts have...crowd control.
2. Of coure I know the differance  between 1.5 and more...The thing is that amount of time mean no difference to a low level enemy. With the bonuses to defene  weapons now have,enemies are quickly stripped to health....if you buy the upgrades for your guns. And that's my point, if you can bypass shields and lift target they are more avalible to be fired on or shields overloaded. Even if they allowed you to lifting them and not allowing them to ignite till the targets protection is down, in a second the target defence is down and ignited any way. I t would make the class overpower all over agein...It would make Pull over powered. It would make the game play like the lower setting...easy.
3. And that's the thing you not understanding with Adepts...They are built to take on crowds. The character you play as in those games were never make to take out crowds continuously in combat. If they adept is too strong at taking out crowds...the adept is too powerful....no matter the setting. It would be ME1 all over again.

Modifié par dreman9999, 11 août 2011 - 03:40 .

[dreman9999]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

Dreman,
Nobody is talking about ME1 so y do u keep bringing it up?

When ME3 comes out and you see some of the changes made to combat are you going to think its a worse off game? Literally youve tried to shoot down every suugestion offered in improving gameplay in ME3. You love ME2 alot, we get it.

I bring up ME1 because it's a base line for what not to do. If Adepts bypass shield like they did in ME1,.....even with one enemy, they are over powered.

[lazuli]

I don't think removing a single foe from the fight through defenses is all that overpowered. The Engineer can already do this in ME2 with Combat Drone. The Engineer will have to dedicate almost all of his or her cooldowns to it, though, depending on the strength of the enemy. This is why I don't think slightly lengthened stagger animations would break the game, especially for the Heavy evolutions.

[dreman9999]

lazuli wrote...

I don't think removing a single foe from the fight through defenses is all that overpowered. The Engineer can already do this in ME2 with Combat Drone. The Engineer will have to dedicate almost all of his or her cooldowns to it, though, depending on the strength of the enemy. This is why I don't think slightly lengthened stagger animations would break the game, especially for the Heavy evolutions.

The thing is that the engineer does not have the power to blow groups up to point their shields are taken off and the entire group fis thrown though out the area. Also, combat droid don't alway  put a target at a point that the target can be always shot at...like pull does. Combat droid just distracs target long enough fore the engineer to debuff the target. Lifting one enemy is not just taking them out of the fight....Your lifting them in the air...a point that they a can easilly be seen and can quickly be shot a and debuffed. If an adept can't warp bomb them after lifting them when they have protection on then that won't matter because the protection would be off soon any way. Pull would be way too over powered.

[lazuli]

dreman9999 wrote...

lazuli wrote...

I don't think removing a single foe from the fight through defenses is all that overpowered. The Engineer can already do this in ME2 with Combat Drone. The Engineer will have to dedicate almost all of his or her cooldowns to it, though, depending on the strength of the enemy. This is why I don't think slightly lengthened stagger animations would break the game, especially for the Heavy evolutions.

The thing is that the engineer does not have the power to blow groups up to point their shields are taken off and the entire group fis thrown though out the area. Also, combat droid don't alway  put a target at a point that the target can be always shot at...like pull does. Combat droid just distracs target long enough fore the engineer to debuff the target. Lifting one enemy is not just taking them out of the fight....Your lifting them in the air...a point that they a can easilly be seen and can quickly be shot a and debuffed. If an adept can't warp bomb them after lifting them when they have protection on then that won't matter because the protection would be off soon any way. Pull would be way too over powered.

I completely agree, which is why all I'm suggesting is slightly improving staggers.

[adonfraz]

The only biotic powers that can be significantly improved without breaking the Adept are singularity and shockwave.

[dreman9999]

adonfraz wrote...

The only biotic powers that can be significantly improved without breaking the Adept are singularity and shockwave.

The can add things to adepts other powers without breaking them. Pull can just lace Mass effect feilds on targets with protection and make the like igniting the barrier of a dominated enemy. Warp you can allow players to use it like me1 or me2.

[dreman9999]

lazuli wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

lazuli wrote...

I don't think removing a single foe from the fight through defenses is all that overpowered. The Engineer can already do this in ME2 with Combat Drone. The Engineer will have to dedicate almost all of his or her cooldowns to it, though, depending on the strength of the enemy. This is why I don't think slightly lengthened stagger animations would break the game, especially for the Heavy evolutions.

The thing is that the engineer does not have the power to blow groups up to point their shields are taken off and the entire group fis thrown though out the area. Also, combat droid don't alway  put a target at a point that the target can be always shot at...like pull does. Combat droid just distracs target long enough fore the engineer to debuff the target. Lifting one enemy is not just taking them out of the fight....Your lifting them in the air...a point that they a can easilly be seen and can quickly be shot a and debuffed. If an adept can't warp bomb them after lifting them when they have protection on then that won't matter because the protection would be off soon any way. Pull would be way too over powered.

I completely agree, which is why all I'm suggesting is slightly improving staggers.

I agree with that, too. Even injuring them to make them move slower.

[lazuli]

adonfraz wrote...

The only biotic powers that can be significantly improved without breaking the Adept are singularity and shockwave.

A fair point, but I'm not sure I agree.  Here's what I would change:

Singularity: Increase projectile speed or make it instant hit.  Reduce recharge by 1 second.
Shockwave: Increase damage dealt to defenses.  Add small barrier regeneration when used (for utility)
Pull: Increased stagger time on some evolutions.
Throw: Increased stagger time on some evolutions.

Modifié par lazuli, 11 août 2011 - 04:46 .

[adonfraz]

lazuli wrote...

adonfraz wrote...

The only biotic powers that can be significantly improved without breaking the Adept are singularity and shockwave.

A fair point, but I'm not sure I agree.  Here's what I would change:

Singularity: Increase projectile speed or make it instant hit.  Reduce recharge by 1 second.
Shockwave: Increase damage dealt to defenses.  Add small barrier regeneration when used (for utility)
Pull: Increased stagger time on some evolutions.
Throw: Increased stagger time on some evolutions.

I don't consider increased stagger time significant but I agree with changes you and dreman suggested.

Can you imagine some one saying "Wow pull and throw staggers protected enemies one second longer than it did in ME2, it's way better."

Modifié par adonfraz, 11 août 2011 - 04:56 .

[The Spamming Troll]

dreman9999 wrote...

The Spamming Troll wrote...

Dreman,
Nobody is talking about ME1 so y do u keep bringing it up?

When ME3 comes out and you see some of the changes made to combat are you going to think its a worse off game? Literally youve tried to shoot down every suugestion offered in improving gameplay in ME3. You love ME2 alot, we get it.

I bring up ME1 because it's a base line for what not to do. If Adepts bypass shield like they did in ME1,.....even with one enemy, they are over powered.

i call that playing an adept. period. i dont call the adept on insanity in ME2, an adept. i call him an idiot. a half-second-stagger idiot.

i get that you want to play ME2 when your playing ME3, but if improvments arent made to adepts gameplay with enemy protections, theres gonig to be more upset people then content people. you wouldnt miss out on the game becasue your adept can do more things, while i WILL miss out on the game if my adept cant do more things. improving abilities/defense is really a win-win situation.

lazuli wrote...

adonfraz wrote...

The only biotic powers that can be significantly improved without breaking the Adept are singularity and shockwave.

A fair point, but I'm not sure I agree.  Here's what I would change:

Singularity: Increase projectile speed or make it instant hit.  Reduce recharge by 1 second.
Shockwave: Increase damage dealt to defenses.  Add small barrier regeneration when used (for utility)
Pull: Increased stagger time on some evolutions.
Throw: Increased stagger time on some evolutions.

singularity should already be instacast in ME2, no doubt. if liaras singularity is instacast in ME3, shepards must also be instacast.

i wouldnt like shockave regenerating health. i dont want to use a CC ability, and get a health boost. using shockwave and getting a health boost wouldnt make sense to me. i dont like it at all. i like reave, but thats becasue reave giving health sortof makes sense.

no matter what happens with biotics in ME3, i think the maxxed level of pull or throw should at the very least put an enemy on their butt or lift them into the air for a few seconds. if basic throw accomplishes exactly what super-mega-throw does, im not going to be happy investing points into abilities.

Modifié par The Spamming Troll, 11 août 2011 - 05:22 .

[lazuli]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

i wouldnt like shockave regenerating health. i dont want to use a CC ability, and get a health boost. using shockwave and getting a health boost wouldnt make sense to me. i dont like it at all. i like reave, but thats becasue reave giving health sortof makes sense.

I'm proposing it restoring barrier, not health.  My biggest interest in ME3 is the gameplay.  In ME2, my problems with the Adept were all about keeping the flow going.  I got addicted to the Vanguard's style of constant action and it was hard to shift back to other classes.  Giving the Adept a way to restore barriers without being saddled with a huge cooldown could help their gameplay significantly.