179 réponses à ce sujet

[DarthCaine]

Cerberus >>> Cthulhu from Outer Space

Modifié par DarthCaine, 06 août 2011 - 02:29 .

[Icinix]

A little disappointed by the elevation of an interesting plot in the Cerberus missions, to them being as big as they are in the sequels and other fiction. I thought they were much more interesting as a small rogue element in ME1 than the standard Dr.Evil empire they've become (unless you support them, in which case, the standard secret organisation trying to save the universe - take your pick)

But ultimately - Its not going to matter - as long as the Reapers threat is finished, dead and buried in ME3.

[ShaggyWolf]

Cerberus is important to the whole narrative, regardless of one's view of them. There's a lot more to Mass Effect than Reapers. When the Reapers are gone, that still leaves the major issue of where humanity will stand with the rest of the galaxy.

The Illusive Man claims at the end of ME2 that Cerberus=Humanity. And if you think about it, he's right. People get too hung up on the whole "terrorist organization" line, which is simply a perception of the group. Nevermind that Cerberus's actions have produced the most powerful human biotics, and are the seed of the reason we even had the Normandy SR-1. Also consider that without Cerberus, Shepard would be permanantly gone, and the chances of the entire galaxy's survival would be gone with him/her.

Some might disagree with the fact that Cerberus is okay with dominating the other species. But in that regard, they're no worse than the Turians or the Asari. The council races want humanity to be a part of the galactic community, but only if we're under their thumbs at the same time. That seems like domination to me. And the Alliance is okay with that. I'm not.

So I say props to TIM and Cerberus. Humanity has proven its worth many times over, there's no reason we shouldn't be able to stand alongside the other races as equals. And before you claim that we could possibly be equals anyway, just look at the hand-slapping Shepard gets if you spare the Council in ME1 and then speak to them again in ME2. I'll bet Saren and Vasir didn't have to take garbage like that.

[Gorosaur]

One thing that I find frustrating about a series and not a standalone story is that fans begin to take ownership of what they think the story should be. The fact of the matter is Cerberus is a plot point Bioware chose to expand. They didn't hijack anything.

Why? Bioware chose Cerberus primarily because you cannot base an entire trilogy of games around a faceless machine race villain. Mass Effect was a great game because in addition to the Reapers you had Saren, one of the best villains in modern day video games. However, with Saren dead all you are left with is fighting giant cuttlefish robots. While fun, this doesn't represent the tension many people need out of a conflict. Having a "human" villain with a somewhat recognizeable face is much more important to satisfying storytelling. Cerberus and the Illusive Man represent this, and for the most part they've worked.

[Ianamus]

Cerberus receive far too much attention, so much so that they actually detract from the other, far more interesting, aspects of the game, like the different races. Why does all media have to feature them?

It's reached the point where the series should be called "Cerberus effect", not "Mass Effect"

What annoys me the most is that in missions about the Genophage and Quarian/Geth conflict, I will be fighting Cerberus, even though they have absolutely no relevance to those plots whatsoever.

[Ragnarok521]

I see and have always have seen the Reapers as the primary foe in the ME series, and you don't need to be always seen in the spotlight to be the villain. However, the story of ME is more than just the coming invasion of the Reapers, that's more of the backdrop that creates the setting for the true conflict. What Cerberus does is throw in the question, 'How far will we go to ensure our survival and dominance?' 'Is it always worth the risk?' Although most Cerberus projects end in disaster and are for the most part ethically questionable, the payoff had they succeeded would have been immense. I tolerate Cerberus because it adds to the conflict I mentioned, one between the paragons who will refuse to compromise their values and identity because of fear and desperation and the so-called renegades who will risk their humanity for the sake of survival and a greater good against a seemingly unstoppable threat. 

(Us versus us) vs Reapers

Do they get a little too much attention in the ME media? I think so. Though, this complaint would be less justified if we could get some more attention on other groups such as the STG or even just a small Krogan clan (To get more details into how they operate). I can understand why Cerberus would get the most love from the writers however; they're the most relatable faction there is outside of the Alliance (Why haven't we gotten as much on them?) as they're human. Maybe they ought to try taking a chance.

Modifié par Ragnarok521, 06 août 2011 - 03:15 .

[Kaiser Shepard]

The real question here obviously is: Why did it take so long as it did for Walters and Karpyshyn to introduce Cerberus? I mean, isn't human dominance something every self respecting ****** sapiens aspires to? Wouldn't the universe be a much better place if we were in charge? What is it with the asari and their self-righteousness? Why does Miranda's catsuit look so snug in all the right places? More importantly, why am I asking so many questions?

The thing is - and yes, I'm just making this up as I go - Cerberus is there to provide an alternative to the indecisiveness that is the Council. Humans are a questioning species by nature, and while the Alliance is trying to slowly bring about change in an otherwise static galactic community, it is hampered by its every present urge to be political correct. Cerberus is the answer to the problem that is the Citadel Council.

Modifié par Kaiser Shepard, 06 août 2011 - 03:26 .

[Hurbster]

All TIM needs is a white cat to stroke, a monocle and duelling scar to complete his transformation to Bond villian.

[James2912]

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter! Cerberus and TIM are freedom fighters! To enemies of humanity they are terrorists. 

Modifié par James2912, 06 août 2011 - 03:49 .

[Kaiser Shepard]

James2912 wrote...

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter! Cerberus and TIM are freedom fighters! To enemies of humanity they are terrorists. 

And so starts BSN's daily defining of the word terrorism today...

[Wulfram]

The only interesting feature of Cerberus was their role in the backstory of Sole Survivor Shep, and that was totaly screwed up by ME2. I really don't see why they have taken over the whole setting.

[James2912]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

James2912 wrote...

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter! Cerberus and TIM are freedom fighters! To enemies of humanity they are terrorists. 

And so starts BSN's daily defining of the word terrorism today...

Cerberus is not a terrorist organization however I tire of the same old argument in every thread so I'll just say fine were terrorists from your point of view, just like George Washington was a terrorist from the Britsh point of view in the Rev. war. 

[Pulletlamer]

Cerberus=Unitology from Dead Space.

Seriously. It's the same. A game that was about "Space monsters coming from an artifact" plot was suddenly turned into "Unitology are the bad guys that worship the artifacts and create the monsters" plot.

Basically the same that happened to cerberus in Mass Effect. I really wish in ME3 the Reapers are the real threat and you feel like you're fighting to stop them -not Cerberus.

And from what we know -that Cerberus enemies are going to be 40% of the enemies in the game- I already think Mass Effect has, if not been turned into a Cerberus-centric plot, at least positioned Cerberus in a very important role of the plot. Which shouldn't have happened at all.

Modifié par Pulletlamer, 06 août 2011 - 04:10 .

[Barquiel]

James2912 wrote...

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter! Cerberus and TIM are freedom fighters! To enemies of humanity they are terrorists. 

The alliance is an enemy of humanity?

[Travie]

This ones for Admiral Kuhoku!!!

BAM BAM BAM!

[bleetman]

James2912 wrote...

Cerberus is not a terrorist organization however I tire of the same old argument in every thread so I'll just say fine were terrorists from your point of view, just like George Washington was a terrorist from the Britsh point of view in the Rev. war. 

I don't remember George Washington exploding cargo containers packed with radiation over cities, then kidnapping the few children that didn't develop birth defects as a result for brutual scientific experiments.

I'd personally be more accepting of Cerberus's place in the overall plot (though not of the organisation itself) if they didn't screw up everything they ever did. The only operation I can remember being depicted that didn't turn into a complete and utter disaster was Lazarus, and that still ended with the station and all staff but two being blown up, gunned down or both.

Modifié par bleetman, 06 août 2011 - 04:29 .

[Sisterofshane]

Saphra Deden wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

Cerberus plays a major role in the Galactic war partially because ME is a human-centric story, and Cerberus is the human organization that is least limited in its potential directions.

Not really, no. There is no need for any human organization beyond Shepard and his/her crew to play a prominent role in the story. The Alliance could fill a lot of roles too, it just takes a bit of imagination and creativity.

The Alliance HAS played those roles at times (see ascension project).  The fact that there is a black-ops organization completely seperate, and yet seemingly intertwined with the Alliance adds just another shade of grey to the whole scenario. And Cerberus does have less tie-downs then the Alliance, which made the whole plot of ME2 possible.

Again, it makes it FEEL more like reality when the lines between good/evil are not so cut and dry.

[Kaiser Shepard]

bleetman wrote...

James2912 wrote...

Cerberus is not a terrorist organization however I tire of the same old argument in every thread so I'll just say fine were terrorists from your point of view, just like George Washington was a terrorist from the Britsh point of view in the Rev. war. 

I don't remember George Washington exploding cargo containers packed with radiation over cities, then kidnapping the few children that didn't develop birth defects as a result for brutual scientific experiments.

That still doesn't make Cerberus terrorists, either.

[James2912]

Barquiel wrote...

James2912 wrote...

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter! Cerberus and TIM are freedom fighters! To enemies of humanity they are terrorists. 

The alliance is an enemy of humanity?

Yes.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Cerberus is a good addition to the ME univrse, but the execution is horrible.

[marshalleck]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Cerberus is a good addition to the ME univrse, but the execution is horrible.

Yeah, I don't know why it's always "Cerberus project gone horribly wrong" with those guys. Would it be so wrong to give Shepard competent antagonists? People who actually seem to present more credible opposition to the hero of the story? It's not doing Shepard any favors pitting him against an organization that's constantly on the verge of destroying themselves and always falling well short of their aims. Shepard isn't even all that heroic; he's just not as much a walking pile of failure and incompetence as the rest of the galaxy. Yay?

[James2912]

I would agree Ceberus has gotten the idiot ball way to many times. And the sad thing is I think were stuck with an incompetent Cerberus in ME3 plus were probably going to have little choice but to be enemies just like we had little choice but to be friends in ME2. So much for choice Bioware!

[LGTX]

Bioware aren't allowed to write their own stories now?

[marshalleck]

Saren actually seemed dangerous, like he was Shepard's equal in charisma, capability, and surpassed him easily in ruthlessness and commitment to doing whatever it took to complete a mission. So why are Cerberus a bunch of bumbling morons? Is it because the ME team lost some writers? Are Bioware afraid of what they've created? Let's be honest, Cerberus has some pretty non-PC views and some really shady characters in its employ. Do Bioware think that if Cerberus were ever even once allowed to win that it would be perceived as glorifying those non-PC values?

Modifié par marshalleck, 06 août 2011 - 06:23 .

[James2912]

LGTX wrote...

Bioware aren't allowed to write their own stories now?

Yes thats exactly what we're saying.  Now run a long and go watch some spongebob and let the adults talk for a while sweetie.