987 réponses à ce sujet

[Zanallen]

But mrcrusty, those are just tone icons. Without them, the tone and intent of the dialogue are hit and miss with some being easy to discern and some impossible.

[Corker]

Silent.

My first play through and a half in DA2, I was mostly OK with voiced Hawke. Got a few surprises I didn't like, but nothing that made me reload.

Then I made my third Hawke, a rawboned Ferelden country girl with a big axe. I had ideas about who she was and what she ought to be like. Even aggressive f!Hawke just sounded *wrong* for her. Intonation and delivery sounded too high falutin', not nearly what I imagined. She's still stuck on the docks outside Kirkwall.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Zanallen wrote...

You are looking at the problem backwards. Skipping the dialogue isn't the problem. The repetition is the problem. People were complaining about having the character speaking the exact same line that they just read. The suggestion offered was to have a paraphrased choice that lead to the actual dialogue line. It is the same reason for the change between TW1 (Full line followed by dialogue) and TW2 (Paraphase followed by dialogue).

That's not at all what BioWare has said.  They said they investigated the paraphrase option because the repetition of the line produced player behaviour - skipping the dialogue - they wanted to prevent.

Furthermore, even if the repetition is the problem, as you say (which, again, conflicts with previous statements from the developers themselves), the paraphrase is a terrible solution.  The cure is far worse than the disease.  Letting us choose the line produces an unfortunate side-effect, so to fix it they simply remove the choice entirely.

That's not better.

I'm not saying the repetition is good.  I'm saying the paraphrase is worse.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Zanallen wrote...

But mrcrusty, those are just tone icons. Without them, the tone and intent of the dialogue are hit and miss with some being easy to discern and some impossible.

They are a mixture of attribute, skill and tone icons. I don't mind that.

If you're insane enough to read my blog entry on dialog systems (don't unless you've got some time, it's very long), you'll see where I want dialog to end up.

[txgoldrush]

mrcrusty wrote...

Zanallen wrote...

But mrcrusty, those are just tone icons. Without them, the tone and intent of the dialogue are hit and miss with some being easy to discern and some impossible.

They are a mixture of attribute, skill and tone icons. I don't mind that.

If you're insane enough to read my blog entry on dialog systems (don't unless you've got some time, it's very long), you'll see where I want dialog to end up.

Its still not sufficient enough to convey emotion effectively. It was nice for New Vegas, but it simply would not work as well for Bioware.

Bioware should stick to "paraphrasing" but allow the enitre phrase to be shown by selecting that option with a right click or a Y button.

[furryrage59]

mrcrusty wrote...

Zanallen wrote...

But mrcrusty, those are just tone icons. Without them, the tone and intent of the dialogue are hit and miss with some being easy to discern and some impossible.

They are a mixture of attribute, skill and tone icons. I don't mind that.

If you're insane enough to read my blog entry on dialog systems (don't unless you've got some time, it's very long), you'll see where I want dialog to end up.

Interesting blog and read, makes a lot of sense.

[Tommy6860]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Zanallen wrote...

You are looking at the problem backwards. Skipping the dialogue isn't the problem. The repetition is the problem. People were complaining about having the character speaking the exact same line that they just read. The suggestion offered was to have a paraphrased choice that lead to the actual dialogue line. It is the same reason for the change between TW1 (Full line followed by dialogue) and TW2 (Paraphase followed by dialogue).

That's not at all what BioWare has said.  They said they investigated the paraphrase option because the repetition of the line produced player behaviour - skipping the dialogue - they wanted to prevent.

Furthermore, even if the repetition is the problem, as you say (which, again, conflicts with previous statements from the developers themselves), the paraphrase is a terrible solution.  The cure is far worse than the disease.  Letting us choose the line produces an unfortunate side-effect, so to fix it they simply remove the choice entirely.

That's not better.

I'm not saying the repetition is good.  I'm saying the paraphrase is worse.

This^ so much. I also think by adding paraphrasing, which many times lead to the unexpected response, is downright jarring and breaks immersiion with companions and NPCs. Add that player agency is all but removed from the game, and you have a pre-set Bioware made action/adventure game.

[Zanallen]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

That's not at all what BioWare has said.  They said they investigated the paraphrase option because the repetition of the line produced player behaviour - skipping the dialogue - they wanted to prevent.

Furthermore, even if the repetition is the problem, as you say (which, again, conflicts with previous statements from the developers themselves), the paraphrase is a terrible solution.  The cure is far worse than the disease.  Letting us choose the line produces an unfortunate side-effect, so to fix it they simply remove the choice entirely.

That's not better.

I'm not saying the repetition is good.  I'm saying the paraphrase is worse.

It is easy enough to fix by adding a full line toggle or a mouse over option that brings up the full line when a paraphrase choice has been selected for a couple of seconds. If Bioware didn't want people to skip the lines, they would have removed the option to skip the lines. Paraphrasing doesn't prevent it. All paraphrases prevent is the repetition of lines.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

One thing I do wonder about is why do people think there is a fundamental difference between the wheels and trees?

Structurally, they are the same. Games with "wheels" still use dialog trees. The only difference is the UI and presentation.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 19 août 2011 - 12:40 .

[Zanallen]

mrcrusty wrote...

One thing I do wonder about is why do people think there is a fundamental difference between the wheels and trees?

Structurally, they are the same. Games with "wheels" still use dialog trees. The only difference is the UI and presentation.

People think that?

[Verly]

I prefer the voiced protagonist. I hope there is more variety in the next game. I still love Origins and I always will, but playing it after playing DA2 where Hawke is actually part of the game, it's really jarring for me.

[txgoldrush]

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...
Suspend disbelief, why do I have to suspend disbelief? The protagonist staring like an idiot clashes with the language he is trying to express. Its last gen limitations. Its not even the silenet protagonist thats the biggest problem, its how Bioware handled him or her. Fallout games don't show the character standing around with a blank stare in emotional moments or in big more than two character conversations. But DX Human Revolutions dialogue system will even surpass Fallout New Vegas's with a vocal protagonist and a smart dialogue wheel.

a) And how does that any worse than an idiot 3 color personality AI Hawke who talk the tone I don't want him/her to?

txgoldrush wrote...
The problem with games like DAO is that they want you to suspend disbelief and not suspend disbelief at the same time. The cinematic presentation downright hurts the silent protagonist. If the Warden is shown doing things you have no control of doing, why can't he talk and emote as well. They are trying to have it both ways. They try to make him part of the presentation, but not part of it as well.

And the problem with set protagonist is you are not talking. You just watch and analyze just like you are doing now. Watching and day dreaming is not role-playing. Watching movie is not the same as acting in the movie where you're suppose to be the actor.

txgoldrush wrote...
With Hawke, the conversations are more natural as they chose to take one path, the cinematic over the other.

c) More natural? You mean Hawke inability to investigate in consistent sarcastic or aggresive tone is natural? More like psychotic disorder to me.

txgoldrush wrote...
Freedom is nice, but it sacrifices plot porgression. There is a trade off, the more free your RPG, the weaker the plot.

d) I would to say that freedom is what make RPG interesting because it's all about journey, exploration and your own story to share with others. Not the one same journey and story for the rest of 99999 blue,purple and red Hawke clones all over the world.

txgoldrush wrote...
The cutsomizable protagonist will always be a shallower character than a set protagonist, and while Hawke is not as deep as say, someone like the Nameless One, Geralt, or upcoming Adam Jensen (who are evel less customizable than Hawke)...she is certainly deeper than the Warden or the Spirit Monk (and while KOTOR lets Revan and the Jedi Exile be customizable, offical canon has them both as set protagonists) . DAII traded freedom for humanity, which is a fine tradeoff. No (or less) suspension of disbelief neccessary.

e) Problem is your two goody shoes Hawke is the same character and has the same story with the one I've played. That's annoy me even more than the shallow customizable character.

a) because the Warden isn't allowed to show emotion while the other characters are, and not only that he is voice acted outside of dialogue, breaking immersion even more. "Can I get a ladder so you can get off my back" over and over..ugh.

you are never the actor and your freedom is limited anyway. And when does a cvidoe game RPG have to be narrowly defined.

c) She investigates in her normal voice, in fact, playing through a female red Hawke, she speaks her normal tone 70% of the red lines, its more of a subtle direct approach than an intimidating one for the most part, however in some parts she brings the intimidation. Only a few times does she become like Renegade Shepard. Really Red Hawke is a huge improvement over Reenegade Shepard as she is much more subtle and most of her direct lines match the tone of her normal voice.

Purple tone needs more work however, the entire purple dialogue in the game is hit or miss. Its awesome some times and dreadful in others. Also matches Hawkes normal tone the least.

d) Once again, you are trying to define RPGs in narrow terms...they are not always about freedom. Most RPGs don't emphasize freedom in the first place.

e) and many RPGs have every playthrough as the same character, whats the problem with that? The Wardens outside the Origin stories have the same story just as much as Hawke does, there is no real difference, the Warden always defeats the Archdemon. Hell Geralt in TW2 has more story differences across playthroughs then th efully customizable Warden.

[furryrage59]

^

Starting to wonder if trolling or believing the delusions being put down.

[txgoldrush]

furryrage59 wrote...

^

Starting to wonder if trolling or believing the delusions being put down.

Because defending Hawke is trolling....right

But lets try to imagine when Bioware prevents us with immersion breaking elements in DAO such as showing the protagonist in conversation as well as giving him a voice in battle....thats not delusional to criticize this.

[Ulfindl]

I didn't mind the voice as much as I thought I might. However, now that I've played one male and one female, it's odd for the next people. I started a second male and it bugs me that he sounds like my first guy. That wouldn't be a problem if there were more voices, but there aren't.

I wish there was an option to leave Hawke unvoiced. For that matter, why not make it so that you can control both if you want to see Hawke's lines and hear them? Some people might actually want both, some might want one or the other.

The dialog wheel paraphrases left me feeling a little surprised at what Hawke actually said once or twice. In a way, it's fun to be surprised. But it leaves me feeling like Hawke is a stranger in his/her own mind, not knowing what will come out once he/she decides to say something.

How about an option to display a preview of the actual line as you mouse over the paraphrases? And then, if you have opted to not view the dialog when Hawke speaks, you do not get a repetition, because the words are not actually there at the time Hawke speaks them.

All in all, I do think the worst part is that there is only one male and one female voice. I'd actually pay (maybe $5) to get another set of voices as it would help replay value a lot for me.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Zanallen wrote...

mrcrusty wrote...

One thing I do wonder about is why do people think there is a fundamental difference between the wheels and trees?

Structurally, they are the same. Games with "wheels" still use dialog trees. The only difference is the UI and presentation.

People think that?

txgoldrush wrote...

And really, the dialogue wheel system allows for much more subtle, natural, and colorful language than dailogue trees ever do. You have to be literal so you don't confuse the player. With the wheel, you do not have to be literal.

txgoldrush wrote...

You can't put emotion in a dialogue tree, you can't put subtle or natural language in a dialogue tree, you can't put sarcasm or having a character say one thing in a tone implying another in a dialogue tree, and you can't put body language in a dialogue tree. Dialogue trees have limits in that they have to be literal so you don't confuse the player.

Ryllen Laerth Kriel wrote...

And saying that a dialogue tree's handicap of being literal is kind of funny since a fair number of people are annoyed by the vagueness of the paraphrasing in the dialogue wheel system.

xkg wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...
And at least two games outside Bioware have used a similiar dialogue "wheel" system, The Witcher 2 (just like DAII's conversation, without the wheel) or this variation of it from Alpha Protocol lacking dialogue words entirely. Shows that Biowares formula was successful.

Nice logic but worth nothing. Following it I can name dozen of games that use full dialogue and that would mean - full tree formula is more successful.

LordKinoda wrote...

Indeed. I can agree with this. The wheel isn't perfect, but it's leagues better than the tree with a silent character.

furryrage59 wrote...

LordKinoda wrote...

Indeed.
I can agree with this. The wheel isn't perfect, but it's leagues better than the tree with a silent character.

Tree was more diverse and i could immerse myself with the options given, rather than being lumbered with words that i had nothing to do with.

And that's just in the last 2-3 pages.

Presentation of dialog options and UI is the only difference. Structurally, dialog "wheels" and "trees" are both trees. That is to say, exactly the same.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 19 août 2011 - 02:37 .

[LordKinoda]

This is patently false. I guarantee that you did not.

The only reason you think you did is because you weren't trying to resolve any detail. You couldn't tell any more than the rest of us what specific questions would be asked or answered by Shepard's or Hawke's lines. You just didn't care, which is why that uncertainty didn't bother you.

Riiight. You're going to tell me how I think and how my brain works...

Bolded - is purely your opinion and isn't a universal truth, not by a very very long shot.

Correct. Never said it was a universal truth, it's just my opinion.

I HATE the wheel and paraphrasing system in dragon age and more often than not he says something that has nothing to do with your options given.

Just as this is yours

Then I made my third Hawke...

How wonderfully ironic this statement is. If the voiced character annoys you so, why have MULTIPLE playthroughs ?

-Furthermore, even if the repetition is the problem, as you say (which, again, conflicts with previous statements from the developers themselves), the paraphrase is a terrible solution. The cure is far worse than the disease. Letting us choose the line produces an unfortunate side-effect, so to fix it they simply remove the choice entirely.

Heh, I'm not against them adding an option to toggle paraphrasing if people want it. I just can't see why the hell you would want to read an entire line, then have it read back to you. It's incredibly asinine, but to each his own.

c) More natural? You mean Hawke inability to investigate in consistent sarcastic or aggresive tone is natural? More like psychotic disorder to me.

Know a lot of people who only act and respond with only ONE type of emotion do you ? Doubt it. Everybody has experienced each type of emotion at least once in their life. Happy,sad, depressed, rage, anger, fear, pleasure, etc. No one person responds the same way to EVERYTHING. So yes, it is more natural to have and choose different options. Now the character being psychotic acting is up to you. If you chose a different type of response each chance you had, yes that's crazy. Logically you mostly choose one type of path [e.g. diplomatic] and pepper in some other types of responses for flavor and realism.

I'm not saying the repetition is good. I'm saying the paraphrase is worse.

Since you don't like the repitition either, I guess this next statment is for others. Has anybody who is in favor of reading the line and then having it spoken back to you ever played Tomb Raider: Angel of Darkness ? They did this in that game. It was EXTREMELY annoying.

Is paraphrasing the best option ? Apparently not, with so many people here not able to understand it. But what other suggestion do you have ? Besides making the character silent of course ;P

e) and many RPGs have every playthrough as the same character, whats the problem with that? The Wardens outside the Origin stories have the same story just as much as Hawke does, there is no real difference, the Warden always defeats the Archdemon.

Exactly. The only huge difference are the origin stories. The main plot of the rest in universal.

Starting to wonder if trolling or believing the delusions being put down.

"This person doesn't agree with me, they must be doing it just to annoy me." Seriously ? That's what you basically just said. Nobody should have an opposing opinion to yours ?

Presentation of dialog options and UI is the only difference. Structurally, dialog "wheels" and "trees" are both trees. That is to say, exactly the same.

Serioulsy, cut it out. I got it last time you said it, which was only 1 hr 1/2 before you said it this time, hell it's even on the same page. Yes, technically there is no difference other than their presentation. But one uses voiced dialog, and the other doesn't. So it's easier to just use "tree" and "wheel" for references. How can YOU not see that ? That's the point. Drop it, it adds nothing to the conversations.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

U mad bro?

I was replying to Zanallen.

Personally, I'd think that voiced/silent works fine in distinguishing the differences. First of all, because that is the actual difference between them. Secondly, because it's in the thread title. Finally, it's been the distinction that people have been using for most of this thread until txgoldrush insinuated there was some inherent difference and everyone jumped on it. When people say wheel/tree, they might as well be arguing for different font sizes.

Since there is no inherent differences in the way dialog is structured between a voiced and unvoiced protagonist, it comes down to what people prefer. Pretty sure you argue for a voiced protagonist, but as long as you're not claiming that silent is some relic from the past, I don't really care.

On the issue of repetition, some people (such as Sylvius) prefer to know exactly what their character says because it suits his type of roleplaying better than dialog options with a fixed tone with ambiguous content. So, the paraphrases are worse than repetition for such people based on the concept, not execution. Meaning that a non specific paraphrase will never be a good idea.

So, while you may think repetition is asinine, others may think paraphrasing is asinine.

Funny how opinions work.

FTR, I don't like repetition either but I think inaccurate paraphrasing is much worse.

Now, if full text dialog responses cannot come back, I would like to see a description system replace paraphrases in an attempt to actually explain a thought process rather than have one or two words along with an icon. This is still done when trying to prompt players into taking physical actions. I don't see why it can't be adapted to dialog as well.

So something like:

"Oh, I miss the good old days, you remember them right? Games like Planescape: Torment. When dialog responses were more than just a couple of words with an emoticon... convincing the Transcendent One of what can change the nature of a man..."

Becomes:

<Reminisce about dialog in old RPGs like Torment>

Instead of:

[RPG Grognard icon] Old RPG Dialog

Of course:

[Nostalgia] "Oh, I miss the good old days, you remember them right? Games like Planescape: Torment. When dialog responses were more than just a couple of words with an emoticon... convincing the Transcendent One of what can change the nature of a man..."

is the best case scenario for me.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 19 août 2011 - 04:39 .

[Zanallen]

I don't care one way of the other about repetition, but I can see how it would become annoying. I can also see how the paraphrase can be annoying. Best case scenario would be some form of toggle or mouse over option that reveals the full dialogue line. Shouldn't be too difficult to do either, at least not if they place the full line in the dialogue recap box that is already in place.

My personal take on the matter is that a voiced protagonist has the potential to be less ambiguous when it comes to the tone and intent of the dialogue options. Granted, I am a firm believer that the dialogue options, voiced or silent, have an implied tone and intent built in by the writers. There is no such thing as the NPC misinterpreting your response.

[LordKinoda]

U mad bro?

I was replying to Zanallen.

Not at all. Just annoyed that you insisted on pointing out something that is implied and understood to mean the same thing no matter which way you say it. Be it silent/voiced or tree/wheel. Nobody starting talking about UI presentation, they immediately understood what somebody meant when they said tree/wheel. It's irrelevant which way you choose to refer to it, thread title or no.

Pretty sure you argue for a voiced protagonist, but as long as you're not claiming that silent is some relic from the past, I don't really care.

I can't exactly say 'relic from the past' but I can say it's stagnated and complacent.

So, while you may think repetition is asinine, others may think paraphrasing is asinine.

Don't know how many more ways I can spell it out, I'm only speaking about and defending my own opinion, I'm not going to preface everything I say with IMO. Paraphrasing may not be the best way to handle the wheel but it's a decent placeholder until they come up with something better. Like I said, it hasn't bothered me, but I can see how it might confuse some. And your example is a little much, the paraphrasing in the games isn't THAT vague.

Granted, I am a firm believer that the dialogue options, voiced or silent, have an implied tone and intent built in by the writers. There is no such thing as the NPC misinterpreting your response.

Yes, I stated this an earilier post. It's irrelevant what tone you had in mind for a particular response because only the writers know how it was meant to be said, and they have the NPC's react accordingly. So that bullet point for the silent argument is scratched off.

Modifié par LordKinoda, 19 août 2011 - 05:03 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Human Revolution (the new Deus Ex game) is using such a system. I guess we'll see how it's received.

LordKinoda wrote...

And your example is a little much, the paraphrasing in the games isn't THAT vague.

Oh I know. But it was just a demonstration of how it could be that vague and how a description system would be much better equipped. Then again, I'm wholly expecting Sylvius to come in and provide examples of where the paraphrase is actually that vague/bad.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 19 août 2011 - 05:17 .

[MonkeyLungs]

Silent PC please.

[FJVP]

I'm fine with either, although if it is voiced I would like to listen to an example on how the protagonist would sound in-game before they release it. I loathed both of Hawke voices, one was too whiny and the other one emotionless.

I would also like them to get rid of the prevalent tone system and just keep a neutral tone or improve it. I facepalmed everytime I heard Hawke say "RAWWR! IMMA KILL YOU" followed by "Could you please tell me how to get to this place?"

Modifié par FJVP, 19 août 2011 - 05:19 .

[Xewaka]

LordKinoda wrote...
Heh, I'm not against them adding an option to toggle paraphrasing if people want it. I just can't see why the hell you would want to read an entire line, then have it read back to you. It's incredibly asinine, but to each his own.

You know how annoying it is to have to reload the game at least twice every conversation because the guess you made didn't follow whatever train of logic the writer was using that moment, and thus what that git in the screen said had nothing to do with what you expected him to say?

LordKinoda wrote...
Since you don't like the repitition either, I guess this next statment is for others. Has anybody who is in favor of reading the line and then having it spoken back to you ever played Tomb Raider: Angel of Darkness ? They did this in that game. It was EXTREMELY annoying.

I did not play the exact game you mention. I did, however, play Monkey Island 3, Full Throttle, Grim Fandango, and Sam'n'Max Hit the Road. All of which had full dialogue options and have the voiced line repeated when picked. I was never annoyed by it.

LordKinoda wrote...
Is paraphrasing the best option ? Apparently not, with so many people here not able to understand it. But what other suggestion do you have ? Besides making the character silent of course ;P

The best option for making an informed dialogue choice is full line. Because the only sure way to understand the full extent of the line you're choosing is to know the full extent of the line before choosing it (yay tautology).

mrcrusty wrote...
One thing I do wonder about is why do people think there is a fundamental difference between the wheels and trees?
Structurally, they are the same. Games with "wheels" still use dialog trees. The only difference is the UI and presentation.

I would assume that, since in Bioware games the wheel is used to present paraphrased dialogue while the trees are used for full line choice, people use wheel as shorthand for "paraphrase system" and "tree" for "full line presentation".

mrcrusty wrote...
Human Revolution (the new Deus Ex game) is using such a system. I guess we'll see how it's received.

LordKinoda wrote...
And your example is a little much, the paraphrasing in the games isn't THAT vague.

Oh I know. But it was just a demonstration of how it could be that vague and how a description system would be much better equipped. Then again, I'm wholly expecting Sylvius to come in and provide examples of where the paraphrase is actually that vague/bad.

Can I try instead?

-- Possible Spoilers Ahead --

Act 3 Merrill's personal quest. After dealing with the cave encounter, you come out to find an angry mob wanting to burn the witch (Merrill). The line "I'll take responsibility" appears as a choice. Given the context, the reasonable assumption is to think Hawke will take the blame of the events that transpired to shift the mob hatred to himself. His actual line, however, is "MERRIL TOTALLY DID IT, GUYS!"
Act 1 Apostitute quest. A puppeteed Hawke with a knife to his/her own throat is given the option of "Bethany/Anders/Merrill!" with a companion Icon (mage companion breaks the control over Hawke), a "no!" option, associated with the "combat" icon (thus we can assume Hawke will stab the apostitute) and a "Let go!" option associated with a choice icon (the three arrows). I was curious to see how this non-violent, non-external help option would work, so I chose it. How did it work? Murder Knife Engages and stabs the apostitute. Now I'm left wondering what the violent answer would do, given that the non-violent one involved murder.

Modifié par Xewaka, 19 août 2011 - 07:50 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

LordKinoda wrote...

This is patently false. I guarantee that you did not.

The only reason you think you did is because you weren't trying to resolve any detail. You couldn't tell any more than the rest of us what specific questions would be asked or answered by Shepard's or Hawke's lines. You just didn't care, which is why that uncertainty didn't bother you.

Riiight. You're going to tell me how I think and how my brain works...

It has nothing to do with how your brain works.  It has to do with what facts you had available to you and what the rules of valid reasoning are.

That you draw a conclusion doesn't mean that you were right to draw it, regardless of how well your conclusion describes reality.

How wonderfully ironic this statement is. If the voiced character annoys you so, why have MULTIPLE playthroughs ?

Why do you assume the first two were more than aborted attempts to overcome the voice?

I play every game several times, because it takes several tries to find a coherent character the game will support.  And the more obfuscatory the dialogue system (and the wheel and paraphrase is the most obfuscatory I have yet seen), the more tries it takes.

The wheel and paraphrase renders ay attempt to roleplay a coherent character a mindless chore rather than a fulfilling endeavour.

Heh, I'm not against them adding an option to toggle paraphrasing if people want it. I just can't see why the hell you would want to read an entire line, then have it read back to you. It's incredibly asinine, but to each his own.

I don't want to "read a line and then have it read back to me".  I want to choose a line, full stop.  But that's something DA2 (and ME and ME2) won't let me do.

With regard to the paraphrases, the voice is immaterial.  The paraphrases themselves are a problem.  No matter what they do with the voice, I want to see the full line before I make my selection.

Is paraphrasing the best option ? Apparently not, with so many people here not able to understand it. But what other suggestion do you have ? Besides making the character silent of course ;P

I'd make the voice optional, too.  That should actually be easier than offering the full ines, because it wouldn't require any in-game UI elements.

I don't know how their cutscenes work.

Serioulsy, cut it out. I got it last time you said it, which was only 1 hr 1/2 before you said it this time, hell it's even on the same page. Yes, technically there is no difference other than their presentation. But one uses voiced dialog, and the other doesn't. So it's easier to just use "tree" and "wheel" for references. How can YOU not see that ? That's the point. Drop it, it adds nothing to the conversations.

I'd like to add that the wheel, as it is used in ME and DA2, limits the length of the dialogue options to about 30 characters.  A list down the edge of the screen would allow longer options because they wouldn't all start at the middle of the screen.

So the presentation does actually matter.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 19 août 2011 - 06:27 .