nice. too many pages to read tho i only read the 1st page.Arcian wrote...
^Just click the linky in my sig that says "Prothean Thread". The theory is detailed there.
Charon Relay - Encased in ice for a reason?
Débuté par
Wolverfrog
, août 07 2011 09:29
#126
Posté 08 août 2011 - 08:26
Dr JewLove
-
- Members
- 114 messages
Retour en haut
#127
Guest_iOnlySignIn_*
Posté 08 août 2011 - 08:27
Guest_iOnlySignIn_*
Guest_iOnlySignIn_*
-
- Guests
I'm pretty sure that's the case. New Relays are still in the process of being discovered - when the humans discovered the Charon Relay, it is the first time ANY of the Citadel Species discovered it. Which means that during the millenia that the Asari and the Salarians spent exploring the Galaxy from the Citadel, they have failed to discover it.Wolverfrog wrote...
It just seems weird to me that the Reapers would build a Mass Relay if they knew it would get encased within ice. Surely if that was the case many Mass Relays would be in a similar situation as many of them are far away from their system's sun, rendering most of them useless.
And that's not surprising at all, seeing that the Citadel Species inhabit 0% of the habitable universe. Just compare any conservative estimation of the number of planets likely to have developed sentient life to the number of planets known by the Citadel Species.
Your theory as a whole is very logical and reasonable, although I think the Charon Relay is just one of many red herrings. Let's hope BioWare can come up with an even better plot!
#128
Posté 08 août 2011 - 08:27
Dr JewLove
-
- Members
- 114 messages
what is wrong with all these damn late double posts of mine!!!!! arrrghhhArcian wrote...
^Just click the linky in my sig that says "Prothean Thread". The theory is detailed there.
Modifié par Dr JewLove, 08 août 2011 - 08:28 .
#129
Posté 08 août 2011 - 08:34
Augoeides
-
- Members
- 454 messages
marshalleck wrote...
Augoeides wrote...
Mass Effect is rife with mysteries that may never be explained; a la Leviathian of Dis, a suspected Jupiter Brain, Beings of Light and Machine Devils etc.
They're all references to other works of science fiction the writers were inspired by. That's your explanation.
Maybe. Still they could be expanded upon to be something more based on cameos. Or something more that happened to be a cameo as it was developed.
#130
Posté 08 août 2011 - 08:49
didymos1120
-
- Members
- 14 580 messages
iOnlySignIn wrote...
New Relays are still in the process of being discovered - when the humans discovered the Charon Relay, it is the first time ANY of the Citadel Species discovered it.
That backed up by the Codex:
There are many dormant primary relays whose corresponding twins have not yet been located. These are left inactive until their partner is charted, as established civilizations are unwilling to blindly open a passage that might connect them to a hostile species.
I believe there's some dialogue in ME1 about it as well.
Modifié par didymos1120, 08 août 2011 - 08:50 .
#131
Posté 08 août 2011 - 08:53
Reptillius
-
- Members
- 1 242 messages
[quote]Dr JewLove wrote...
[quote]didymos1120 wrote...
[quote]Dr JewLove wrote...
[quote]didymos1120 wrote...
[quote]Dr JewLove wrote...
even if the protheans did encase the relay in ice it wouldn't make sense to just die out on mars. i mean they could've just lived on earth. I'm sure they could've easily avoided being discovered.[/quote]
Where they would have died out. No way they had the population to last very long, and especially not without all the tech their entire civilization depended on.
[/quote]maybe they mated with humans. you never know.
[/quote]
Right. I'm sure that quad-strand DNA was totally compatible. To say nothing of potential genitalia issues.
[/quote]they had a buttload of advanced technology in mars im sure they couldve figured something out.
[/quote]
Actually... According to the Codex entries it did not have a boatload so to speak. It had just enough to get us going in real Mass Effect Technology research... Seems to me other races had simular finds as I recall.
it provided us with almost nothing else about the Protheans... it is our mass effect Technology jumping point into the greater ME universe as a race. Being the driven race that we are we advanced quickly. There are lines in a few different places in codex's and the games when talking about racial evolution that bring up the fact that we are a much more goal/forward momentum driven race than many of the others. If you also look we are also one of the shorter living races compared to several of the others as well. And our Diversity as a species being by far the most diverse helps us to adapt, change, and advance in ways that other races can't really match.
[quote]Sisterofshane wrote...
[quote]ThePwener wrote...
[quote]Sisterofshane wrote...
Actually they did build one. It was called the conduit. It was what enabled Saren and Shep to get inside of the Citadel from Ilos. So, since they were able to construct a working prototype, theoretically they could have been able to know of, and know how to disable, simple systems and mechanisms involved with the mass relays that the Reapers had built.
And I always take offense to being called "illogical", for future reference. I don't object to the "highly unlikely" part, that's all a matter of opinion.
I'll let you off the hook this time
.
[/quote]
[/quote]
Wrong.
After coming out of stasis, the Protheans spent years studying the Relays. When they used the Conduit, they weren't 100% sure that it would function properly, or even at all. Point is, they didn't know how to make one prior to the invasion.
I'll let YOU off the hook this time. Go talk to Vigil again.
[/quote]
That's not the way it happened. The Research facility on Ilos was SPECIFICALLY BUILT by the Protheans in order to build a prototype mass relay. That's why it was so top-secret that even the Reapers never found it. Once the Scientists were revived, they realized the plight of their species, spent a few decades trying to find a way to stop the cycle, and then came up with the idea to "reprogram" the Keepers to not respond to any signal outside of the citadel itself. They then used the conduit to take a one way trip to the citadel, reprogrammed the Keepers, and then died a presumably slow death of starvation.
So, by the time the Reapers invaded and Ilos went "dark", they either had finished the relay, or had been so close to finishing the relay that they knew it would work. In fact, they had to know it would work in order for their plan to reprogram the keepers to hold any merit.
Perhaps it is you that should talk to Vigil again.
[/quote]
I'm going to have to agree a little with you both but mostly with the fact that they did have Mass Relay Technology of a sort... Vigil actually states outright if you choose all his options not that they had Mass Relay Technology but that they were on the cusp of unlocking it when the Reapers attacked. This is something they were reasearching before hand.
To argue that they didn't brings up a cast aside logical fallicy that they can't build one end of the conduit on the Citadel if they only come up with the Technology after the Reapers attack and purge the galaxy of advanced sentient life so they can't get onto the Citadel again to reprogram the keepers and Thus they can't save the future races from the fate that they suffered and yet they did... and so on and so forth until it results in a Paradox arguments of did and didn't that means nothing.
The conduit as not only stated but shown in ME1 is built as a one way device. It is an active Device all that time. Powered but not linked on one end to the Citadel as noted by most of the characters that walk by it and talk about it seeming to hum or having an energy to it. The Problem with the condiut and further proof that they didn't have complete Mass Relay Technology is that the two ends of the conduit are connected only to each other and are only able to support travel in one direction. They have not managed to come up with the protocols for linking travel between more than one conduit or in both directions.
Finally for the matter of the Relay freezing over. Most Theories of Probability prefer to work on the principle simpler is better.
With this principle in mind let's consider something. many would argue that there is no way enough could collect on the Relay to freeze it over in a mere 50K years since the Prothean's existed. There is actually evidence contrary to this. Our own planet, which could be considered primarily a warm body in the Universe due to various factors that also make it habital for life (by our definitions of what it takes to produce life we do not currently support many ideas for life existing on hot or cold bodies in the universe without extenuating circumstances). Snow that gathers and stays on our polar ice caps gathers at a rate that would be surprising to many people. Crash a plane in the arctic for example and go back to get it 50 years later. You will find yourself digging through like a dozen yards of ice or more (at least 33 feet for those feeling math challenged at this moment). There are documentaries that support this. Go look at the recovery and restoration of WWII to 1960's era planes from the arctic for an example of this.
With this simple time factor and accumulation factor in mind on our own planet multiplied out to the point of time that it's been between the Protheans last using the gate and our Race finding it finally and the accumulation is simple and easy to say it is plausable. it becomes more plausble and a more reliable solution... Even elegant for the writers when combined with things like Current Theories of how Charon was formed by our own scientists.
The end result if you really need a dues ex machina device to it all is to argue that it's so far out in our system compared to others perhaps to say that the Protheans moved it out to where it could naturally accumulate the ice if you really need to push yourself into the "somebody caused it" category.
[quote]didymos1120 wrote...
[quote]Dr JewLove wrote...
[quote]didymos1120 wrote...
[quote]Dr JewLove wrote...
even if the protheans did encase the relay in ice it wouldn't make sense to just die out on mars. i mean they could've just lived on earth. I'm sure they could've easily avoided being discovered.[/quote]
Where they would have died out. No way they had the population to last very long, and especially not without all the tech their entire civilization depended on.
[/quote]maybe they mated with humans. you never know.
[/quote]
Right. I'm sure that quad-strand DNA was totally compatible. To say nothing of potential genitalia issues.
[/quote]they had a buttload of advanced technology in mars im sure they couldve figured something out.
[/quote]
Actually... According to the Codex entries it did not have a boatload so to speak. It had just enough to get us going in real Mass Effect Technology research... Seems to me other races had simular finds as I recall.
it provided us with almost nothing else about the Protheans... it is our mass effect Technology jumping point into the greater ME universe as a race. Being the driven race that we are we advanced quickly. There are lines in a few different places in codex's and the games when talking about racial evolution that bring up the fact that we are a much more goal/forward momentum driven race than many of the others. If you also look we are also one of the shorter living races compared to several of the others as well. And our Diversity as a species being by far the most diverse helps us to adapt, change, and advance in ways that other races can't really match.
[quote]Sisterofshane wrote...
[quote]ThePwener wrote...
[quote]Sisterofshane wrote...
Actually they did build one. It was called the conduit. It was what enabled Saren and Shep to get inside of the Citadel from Ilos. So, since they were able to construct a working prototype, theoretically they could have been able to know of, and know how to disable, simple systems and mechanisms involved with the mass relays that the Reapers had built.
And I always take offense to being called "illogical", for future reference. I don't object to the "highly unlikely" part, that's all a matter of opinion.
I'll let you off the hook this time
.[/quote]
[/quote]
Wrong.
After coming out of stasis, the Protheans spent years studying the Relays. When they used the Conduit, they weren't 100% sure that it would function properly, or even at all. Point is, they didn't know how to make one prior to the invasion.
I'll let YOU off the hook this time. Go talk to Vigil again.
[/quote]
That's not the way it happened. The Research facility on Ilos was SPECIFICALLY BUILT by the Protheans in order to build a prototype mass relay. That's why it was so top-secret that even the Reapers never found it. Once the Scientists were revived, they realized the plight of their species, spent a few decades trying to find a way to stop the cycle, and then came up with the idea to "reprogram" the Keepers to not respond to any signal outside of the citadel itself. They then used the conduit to take a one way trip to the citadel, reprogrammed the Keepers, and then died a presumably slow death of starvation.
So, by the time the Reapers invaded and Ilos went "dark", they either had finished the relay, or had been so close to finishing the relay that they knew it would work. In fact, they had to know it would work in order for their plan to reprogram the keepers to hold any merit.
Perhaps it is you that should talk to Vigil again.
[/quote]
I'm going to have to agree a little with you both but mostly with the fact that they did have Mass Relay Technology of a sort... Vigil actually states outright if you choose all his options not that they had Mass Relay Technology but that they were on the cusp of unlocking it when the Reapers attacked. This is something they were reasearching before hand.
To argue that they didn't brings up a cast aside logical fallicy that they can't build one end of the conduit on the Citadel if they only come up with the Technology after the Reapers attack and purge the galaxy of advanced sentient life so they can't get onto the Citadel again to reprogram the keepers and Thus they can't save the future races from the fate that they suffered and yet they did... and so on and so forth until it results in a Paradox arguments of did and didn't that means nothing.
The conduit as not only stated but shown in ME1 is built as a one way device. It is an active Device all that time. Powered but not linked on one end to the Citadel as noted by most of the characters that walk by it and talk about it seeming to hum or having an energy to it. The Problem with the condiut and further proof that they didn't have complete Mass Relay Technology is that the two ends of the conduit are connected only to each other and are only able to support travel in one direction. They have not managed to come up with the protocols for linking travel between more than one conduit or in both directions.
Finally for the matter of the Relay freezing over. Most Theories of Probability prefer to work on the principle simpler is better.
With this principle in mind let's consider something. many would argue that there is no way enough could collect on the Relay to freeze it over in a mere 50K years since the Prothean's existed. There is actually evidence contrary to this. Our own planet, which could be considered primarily a warm body in the Universe due to various factors that also make it habital for life (by our definitions of what it takes to produce life we do not currently support many ideas for life existing on hot or cold bodies in the universe without extenuating circumstances). Snow that gathers and stays on our polar ice caps gathers at a rate that would be surprising to many people. Crash a plane in the arctic for example and go back to get it 50 years later. You will find yourself digging through like a dozen yards of ice or more (at least 33 feet for those feeling math challenged at this moment). There are documentaries that support this. Go look at the recovery and restoration of WWII to 1960's era planes from the arctic for an example of this.
With this simple time factor and accumulation factor in mind on our own planet multiplied out to the point of time that it's been between the Protheans last using the gate and our Race finding it finally and the accumulation is simple and easy to say it is plausable. it becomes more plausble and a more reliable solution... Even elegant for the writers when combined with things like Current Theories of how Charon was formed by our own scientists.
The end result if you really need a dues ex machina device to it all is to argue that it's so far out in our system compared to others perhaps to say that the Protheans moved it out to where it could naturally accumulate the ice if you really need to push yourself into the "somebody caused it" category.
Modifié par Reptillius, 08 août 2011 - 08:57 .
#132
Posté 08 août 2011 - 09:01
Arijharn
-
- Members
- 2 850 messages
marshalleck wrote...
Arijharn wrote...
I thought midichlorines (note; actual midichlorines, and not Mr. Lucas midichlorines) did actually track the permutations of genetic diversity? I'm not a geneticist either!
Even still, you would need ancestral Eve.
Oh my god.
Mitochondria. The word you're looking for is mitochondria. And please don't invoke mitochondria and George Lucas's total science-rape of midochlorians (or whatever) together in the same sentence.
I did say that I wasn't a geneticist
