188 réponses à ce sujet

[Rahmiel]

Walker White wrote...
Network effects.  They are particularly important for multiplayer games.

Are you hinting at a two fold statement with that link?  Could you expand on your line of thinking other than linking something and then crypticly saying something?

Are you saying simultaneously, that EA launching Origin is a bad thing because it's cutting into Steam's "Network Effect" thus reducing the positive effects of the service, which you are mad about?  As well as saying that since Origin is new, it lacks the network effect and so the games you love to play will fail?

How does the distribution service for a game figure into its ability to be played?  Are you just upset that you need something else open while playing games?  Why should EA not have their own service much like steam?

I would like clarification on your point though, as well, does anyone have any really good reason why Valve should be the only company to have such a service?

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

Store/retail copies will require Origin Client to play the game.

GG scrubs, I wonder how many of the Origin devote worshipers will convert...well they won't but I'm sure the intermediates will be on the anti-Origin side of the fence.

[slimgrin]

I don't like Steam or Origin. Someone please tell my why they're better than D2D. Problem is, with some games now we don't have a choice anymore. You want the game, you get the client. End of story.

[Walker White]

Memmahkth wrote...

Walker White wrote...
Network effects.  They are particularly important for multiplayer games.

Are you hinting at a two fold statement with that link?  Could you expand on your line of thinking other than linking something and then crypticly saying something?

I am saying that network effects are why people do not want multiple digital distribution platforms.  These platforms provide a lot of benefits that are a function of the number of people that use them.  More platforms fragment the user base and this reduces these benefits.

This is particularly true with multiplayer games.  There are a lot of community features that Steam provides that are not part of the games themselves, that help in organizing play.  Because these features are tied to Steam, they are lost if someone uses another platform.  And a competitor cannot simply copy Steam's software to provide that functionality; it is the large number of Steam users that make the features so valuable.

[DiebytheSword]

I'm annoyed at needing Origin. It will not stop me from getting ME3, but it was the decider on whether or not to get BF3 or MW3. Going forward, any new title I am not currently invested in will have a heavy mark against it if it requires Origin. That said, I do have origin installed and currently run ME2 through it. While I could use DA2 through it as well, I continue to use DA2 on Steam.

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

DiebytheSword wrote...

I'm annoyed at needing Origin. It will not stop me from getting ME3, but it was the decider on whether or not to get BF3 or MW3. Going forward, any new title I am not currently invested in will have a heavy mark against it if it requires Origin. That said, I do have origin installed and currently run ME2 through it. While I could use DA2 through it as well, I continue to use DA2 on Steam.

I too despite my obvious hatred for their tactical moves, will buy the game. Just a matter of when...I'm pretty confident a launch purchase is out of the question now unless they remove forced use of Origin Client.

Now I must add, they haven't confirmed it yet, but they only confirmed it on BF3 RIGHT BEFORE LAUNCH. So I have no doubt ME3 will pull the same stunt unless Origin gets some major backlash before then.

I was going retail route. 

[Ahglock]

DiebytheSword wrote...

I'm annoyed at needing Origin. It will not stop me from getting ME3, but it was the decider on whether or not to get BF3 or MW3. Going forward, any new title I am not currently invested in will have a heavy mark against it if it requires Origin. That said, I do have origin installed and currently run ME2 through it. While I could use DA2 through it as well, I continue to use DA2 on Steam.

I wont say it is stopping me from getting ME3, but it is stopping me from getting it on the PC.  I'll get it eventually on the 360, like when its a $20 title or when it comes with all the DLC.  I'll lose my saves, but to me it is worth losing them to avoid Origin.  

[craigdolphin]

Likewise for me...if the pc retail comes with an origin requirement I'll be buying a secondhand copy of the xbox version instead.

EA being a privacy-invading jerk means EA doesn't get to see anything from my wallet. I dislike being forced to do that as Bioware work hard to earn their income and I'd like to spend my money to support them. But, they are making it bloody hard to do so.

[Rahmiel]

Walker White wrote...
I am saying that network effects are why people do not want multiple digital distribution platforms.  These platforms provide a lot of benefits that are a function of the number of people that use them.  More platforms fragment the user base and this reduces these benefits.

This is particularly true with multiplayer games.  There are a lot of community features that Steam provides that are not part of the games themselves, that help in organizing play.  Because these features are tied to Steam, they are lost if someone uses another platform.  And a competitor cannot simply copy Steam's software to provide that functionality; it is the large number of Steam users that make the features so valuable.

I still don't see it.  That'd be like saying that all multiplayer games after the very first mp game is killing its client base.  The argument you're making against origin can be applied to battlefield vs. modern warfare.  Or WoW vs. any other mmo.

Choice is better.  I'm 100% positive that WoW is a much better game due to games like warhammer online and the soon to be released swtor.

I will agree with you, however, that it is annoying having separate friends lists and needing to consult them all.  Is so and so on?  Well, he's not on steam, let me check origin.  No?  Let me log into battle.net...

But the same thing happens in all these messenger programs too.  bbm, msn, aol, yahoo, icq (lol dating myself)
I still say choice is good though.  You'll find deals on steam and origin.  We'll just have to see how it all plays out.  Blizzard has their own system too.  I'm curious if anyone else is going to follow suit, or if these will be the only 3 such systems used to play/buy games online.

*edit:  I should also add that I'm only concerning myself with PC games.  MS already has their own version of digital download as well, but consoles is a whole different ballpark, imo.

Modifié par Memmahkth, 26 octobre 2011 - 10:10 .

[Fenderbaum]

craigdolphin wrote...

Likewise for me...if the pc retail comes with an origin requirement I'll be buying a secondhand copy of the xbox version instead.

EA being a privacy-invading jerk means EA doesn't get to see anything from my wallet. I dislike being forced to do that as Bioware work hard to earn their income and I'd like to spend my money to support them. But, they are making it bloody hard to do so.

Ummm....you do realise it's the same company now yes?  The 'only' 2 reasons EA kept Bioware going wer for brand name, and a tax dodge.

Bioware is EA and vice versa.  Bioware as a company no longer exists, they are now a 'division' of EA, meaning wholly owned, and they do what they are told to do.

[craigdolphin]

Fender....yes. I do understand that. Really.

To me, however, the staff of Bioware carry the legacy of Bioware of-old. They deserve respect regardless of the legalities of brand ownership. As much as I personally felt disappointed by DA2, and angry about various DRM/spyware issues they've had going in the past few years, I still admire the talent and imagination of the devs at Bioware. Even when I strongly disagree with some of their new directions.

So for me I phrased things the way I did to make clear that my threat to ensure no money from my wallet will support EA's publishing decisions, is a reluctant one, because I really would prefer that the money I spend helps keeps the actual developers who work for 'Bioware' in business and making games instead of benefitting some random retailer like gamestop.

You have no idea how deeply I despise the anti-customer mindset at EA that keeps issues like these recurring when Bioware games are released. It sucks.

But it's not the animators, story writers, programmers, artists, and voice actors that are responsible for it. They are the ones whose creative expression is being tarnished by this kind of nonsense, and they can't do anything about it. I feel bad for them.

But not enough to allow spyware on my PC.

Unfortunately, as you rightly point out, I can't simultaneously punish EA and reward 'Bioware' for bad corporate behavior: they're joined at the hip.

[Kothoses Rothenkisal]

THe problem is only half to do with EA though, the other half is the fact that steam wont let you sell a game that has DLC unless that DLC is also purchaseable via steam.

This conflicts with the "Bioware points" currency system that is used so that the price on XBLA and PC remain similar for DLC. Steams ToS changed towards the end of last year meaning that if your game had DLC you had to sell that on steam too. Games which were released before the TOS were grandfathered out of this but anything released after this on Steam is subject to the new ToS.

I like Steam, I like Valve, I support both with my custom, but I wont boycott a game just because one STORE/SHOP doesnt sell it, that is frankly quite silly. I make my purchases based on if I will enjoy the product and a few ethical considerations. Not selling the game on Steam does not break either.

The whole "Origin invades my privacy thing" I wonder do people realise they gave just about as much data when they played DA:O right?  Or perhaps some one would like to log into facebook and comment on their lack of online privacy?  There are a great many causes to get worked up about but the Origins issue.... I do get the impression a lot of people ride the issues around it a lot harder because A its EA and B its not Steam... brand loyalty is a strange thing to me.

Modifié par Kothoses Rothenkisal, 27 octobre 2011 - 03:57 .

[Pzypro]

Well from what I know, Steam has so far lost Crysis 2, DA2, BF3, the latest NFS and Alice all like within a few months. Basically every recent EA game. At this rate, the chances of ME3 coming are zero.

I think that EA is the more guilty one here but frankly, I'm irritated with both companies since the customer loses out here.

I just tried Origin today and the stupid thing won't even let me register (never mind the fact that it thinks I live in Europe, I'm in central america, and thus has all prices un euros roughly 50% higher than US counterparts). So as far as I'm concerned the service is horrible. Also it's lol-worthy that Valve restricts EAs "ability to deliver direct quality customer service as we deserve and expect". If anything, Valve is protecting us from EAs direct and unwanted attention.

On the other hand, Steam is the only one getting screwed over by EA at this time. D2D, Gamespot and other places didn't get EA games pulled from them so obviously Steam is being more difficult than some of the competitors.

I don't care who thinks better of themselves, just rerelease the games on Steam and let me continue using the clunky Bioware points mechanic as I was doing before. I can live with it.

Modifié par Pzypro, 24 novembre 2011 - 02:21 .