450 réponses à ce sujet

[JBONE27]

jamesp81 wrote...

JBONE27 wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

ratzerman wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

So, OP, Bioware is supposed to say "nah, this isn't a good jumping in point. You shouldn't buy this game if you didn't play the others."

Is that seriously what you are suggesting they say?

I'm pretty sure that is not what she is suggesting.

I'm also pretty sure that selling more copies of the game is superior to selling less copies of the game.

There is something very wrong when everyone reacts negatively towards a company doing its best to turn a profit on their work.

 I'm afraid I have to somewhat disagree with you.  I'm not stating this for Bioware at all, but some companies turn a profit through less than ethical means.  I disagree with that, but from what I've seen Bioware does everything it can to make a quality relatively guilt free product, and the profit comes from just selling a ****ton at a price that is slightly more than it costs to make per copy.

I'm not advocating unethical business practices.  But then, I don't see Bioware engaging in any.

 Thank you for clarifying.  I agree with you.

[ratzerman]

fortunesque wrote...
Some people didn't like ME2 because it did away with things that they liked in ME1. But many of them were told to trust BW and that it'd all turn out okay in the end. For those individuals, it didn't turn out okay. The way that choices and lore carried over was a pittance for what they were interested in. Some lost complete interest in the franchise; still, others remained cautiously hopeful.

The prevailing concern is that it'll happen again, that those who stuck it out through a second chapter that they didn't even like will have nothing to show for it. And it's incredibly hard for them to trust any kind of BW PR after being labeled as "acceptable losses".

Exactly this.

[Whatever42]

fortunesque wrote...

Let me try to put this clearly for some of the people that might not understand and assume that everyone should like it because it's Mass Effect. This is how a lot of the people who share the concerns of the OP feel:

Some people didn't like ME2 because it did away with things that they liked in ME1. But many of them were told to trust BW and that it'd all turn out okay in the end. For those individuals, it didn't turn out okay. The way that choices and lore carried over was a pittance for what they were interested in. Some lost complete interest in the franchise; still, others remained cautiously hopeful.

The prevailing concern is that it'll happen again, that those who stuck it out through a second chapter that they didn't even like will have nothing to show for it. And it's incredibly hard for them to trust any kind of BW PR after being labeled as "acceptable losses".

If you really didn't like the second chapter then I'm not sure why you would be optimistic at all? Bioware made it very clear that they were happy where they took the series. 

Now developers and producers have given us a lot of information about what they intend to do. If that doesn't turn your crank then you really should just wait for the reviews and if you have any glimmer of interest after those then buy a used copy a few months later.

Getting agitated because you have some dim hope that they will make it a fundementally different game is not the answer.

[fortunesque]

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

fortunesque wrote...

Let me try to put this clearly for some of the people that might not understand and assume that everyone should like it because it's Mass Effect. This is how a lot of the people who share the concerns of the OP feel:

Some people didn't like ME2 because it did away with things that they liked in ME1. But many of them were told to trust BW and that it'd all turn out okay in the end. For those individuals, it didn't turn out okay. The way that choices and lore carried over was a pittance for what they were interested in. Some lost complete interest in the franchise; still, others remained cautiously hopeful.

The prevailing concern is that it'll happen again, that those who stuck it out through a second chapter that they didn't even like will have nothing to show for it. And it's incredibly hard for them to trust any kind of BW PR after being labeled as "acceptable losses".

If you really didn't like the second chapter then I'm not sure why you would be optimistic at all? Bioware made it very clear that they were happy where they took the series. 

Now developers and producers have given us a lot of information about what they intend to do. If that doesn't turn your crank then you really should just wait for the reviews and if you have any glimmer of interest after those then buy a used copy a few months later.

Getting agitated because you have some dim hope that they will make it a fundementally different game is not the answer.

I'm not excited in the least, nor do I care about Mass Effect. I actually came on this thread because I saw that some of my friends were on here and I attempted to explain their frustrations. I can explain how they feel, but I cannot explain how they're still hopeful; they're much more dedicated than me.

I'm not agitated; I'm an observer. The point of the post that I made was to attempt to further explain how some people feel and why they feel that way, especially now that it seems like more of the same old song and dance.

Edit: Bethesda love me longtime.

Modifié par fortunesque, 09 août 2011 - 09:24 .

[xXRevan0515Xx]

Well, I guess there is only one thing left to say...Sorry to those who don't like the direction of Mass Effect, best of luck in your search for other games to play.

[Therefore_I_Am]

The "jumping point" is just PR talk for newcomers. They are going to show a little comic like they did for the PS3 fans, and have a little intro that newcomers can relate to.
The panicking over this kind of thing is not justified.


What you SHOULD be worrrying about is the possibility of MP being in ME3, since it can actually effect the elements & length of the story, as well as the gameplay mechanics.

Modifié par Therefore_I_Am, 09 août 2011 - 09:28 .

[Whatever42]

fortunesque wrote...
I'm not excited in the least, nor do I care about Mass Effect. I actually came on this thread because I saw that some of my friends were on here and I attempted to explain their frustrations. I can explain how they feel, but I cannot explain how they're still hopeful; they're much more dedicated than me.

I'm not agitated; I'm an observer. The point of the post that I made was to attempt to further explain how some people feel and why they feel that way, especially now that it seems like more of the same old song and dance.

Well, they shouldn't get agitated then. 

Ultimately, this thread seems to be mostly apprehension about the story. How much the writers deliver on our past choices is only part of that. We all know about Alien 3, Matrix 3, Terminator 3, RotJ, etc. And there will really be no way of knowing if they really nailed it until we play the game. 

Yes, some people were disappointed in some of the writing in ME2 and there are legitimate criticisms there. But dissecting the words of every Bioware employee and getting worked up doesn't solve anything. It certainly doesn't give us any answers.

Bioware devs, writers and producers have told us their intentions. We know the central theme of the story. At this point you either trust Bioware or you don't. I'm fine with don't. But it's not worth getting agitated about.

Of course people will still do this. I was visiting the SWTOR boards a while back and they riot there daily. If a SWTOR dev says good morning in the wrong tone then its the apocolpyse. 

P.S. I love Bethesda too. Well, I was a little disappointed in Oblivion but Skyrim leaves me... hopeful. 

Modifié par Whatever666343431431654324, 09 août 2011 - 09:33 .

[fortunesque]

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

fortunesque wrote...
I'm not excited in the least, nor do I care about Mass Effect. I actually came on this thread because I saw that some of my friends were on here and I attempted to explain their frustrations. I can explain how they feel, but I cannot explain how they're still hopeful; they're much more dedicated than me.

I'm not agitated; I'm an observer. The point of the post that I made was to attempt to further explain how some people feel and why they feel that way, especially now that it seems like more of the same old song and dance.

Well, they shouldn't get agitated then. 

Ultimately, this thread seems to be mostly apprehension about the story. How much the writers deliver on our past choices is only part of that. We all know about Alien 3, Matrix 3, Terminator 3, RotJ, etc. And there will really be no way of knowing if they really nailed it until we play the game. 

Yes, some people were disappointed in some of the writing in ME2 and there are legitimate criticisms there. But dissecting the words of every Bioware employee and getting worked up doesn't solve anything. It certainly doesn't give us any answers.

Bioware devs, writers and producers have told us their intentions. We know the central theme of the story. At this point you either trust Bioware or you don't. I'm fine with don't. But it's not worth getting agitated about.

Of course people will still do this. I was visiting the SWTOR boards a while back and they riot there daily. If a SWTOR dev says good morning in the wrong tone then its the apocolpyse. 

P.S. I love Bethesda too. Well, I was a little disappointed in Oblivion but Skyrim leaves me... hopeful. 

I think the concern is because the PR tone has been the exact same as ME2's, using almost the same phrases. To some, this series is still their favorite and they'd be devastated to see the same thing happen again. And they're afraid to trust.

[Icinix]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

"The game is going in a direction I DON'T LIKE!! BIOWARE NEEDS TO PAY ATTENTION TO ME!"

Pretty much some people on this thread, right?

I used a similar argument against people who wanted the mako and elevators gone.

I got nowhere with it.

[Commander Shep4rd]

Badpie wrote...
Mass Effect came out almost eight years ago

The fact that he makes up things like this makes me wonder why are people listening to him............

Modifié par Commander Shep4rd, 09 août 2011 - 09:48 .

[neftones]

People who freak out over marketing and PR speak are the absolute worst. Get in touch with reality.

[Captain_Obvious]

xXRevan0515Xx wrote...

Well, I guess there is only one thing left to say...Sorry to those who don't like the direction of Mass Effect, best of luck in your search for other games to play.

Agreed.

[Destroy Raiden_]

I can see people wanting to jump in on 2 however if you jump in on anything in the 3rd act you should be lost, confused, and otherwise stupefied by the game/show/movie/ects content as punishment. No one should jump in 3rd act and understand everything games should be played at game 1 and if your system doesn't have that game then game 2 should be simi lenient for this purpose however by game 3 if you won't play 2 you should be lost you shouldn't be handheld into the world and you should just go back and play bare minimum at game 2 so you can grasp the world, its established characters, and its established events. I'm so not for the intro newbies into 3.

[thE SpACE hAMStER]

Destroy Raiden wrote...

I can see people wanting to jump in on 2 however if you jump in on anything in the 3rd act you should be lost, confused, and otherwise stupefied by the game/show/movie/ects content as punishment. No one should jump in 3rd act and understand everything games should be played at game 1 and if your system doesn't have that game then game 2 should be simi lenient for this purpose however by game 3 if you won't play 2 you should be lost you shouldn't be handheld into the world and you should just go back and play bare minimum at game 2 so you can grasp the world, its established characters, and its established events. I'm so not for the intro newbies into 3.

they don't need to be punishmened tho

i agree they should get the basics of what's goin on but i believe the idea behind this is for new players to ask why is everything the way it is in the uinverse.

[KillTheLastRomantic]

Honestly, its totally reasonable and acceptable that some people WILL play the third game without playing the prior two and Bioware giving these people some exposition and introduction to the world is fair enough. But the third entry in a trilogy is NOT a 'natural' entry point and its stupid to say so. If one of my mates decided they wanted to get into the LOTR's films I wouldn't be like, "Here's Return of the King! It's a NATURAL ENTRY POINT!"

[SalsaDMA]

didymos1120 wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...
 When the dev specifically states that he doesn't consider himself a rpg dev, that HAS to make you wonder why the game is labeled as a rpg then.

Gee, funnily enough, that's covered in the part of the answer that was left out. 

Not really. Unless you consider a dev stating that games they try to steer in one direction accidently gets classified as something they aren't trying to create by marketing. He clearly states that his intent is not to create rpgs in the left out bit as well.

That's the same as explaining that McDonalds food can be labeled as a 'fine and healthy meal' despite everyone knows that's not the purpose of its design.

[SalsaDMA]

jamesp81 wrote...

ratzerman wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

So, OP, Bioware is supposed to say "nah, this isn't a good jumping in point. You shouldn't buy this game if you didn't play the others."

Is that seriously what you are suggesting they say?

I'm pretty sure that is not what she is suggesting.

I'm also pretty sure that selling more copies of the game is superior to selling less copies of the game.

There is something very wrong when everyone reacts negatively towards a company doing its best to turn a profit on their work.

I find your pretense of omniscense disturbing.

So you think the marketing guy sounding like he is only interested in a certain segment of consumers while ignoring or outright belittling previously loyal customers is going to sell more copies of the game total?

Please do enlighten us with what amazing technology you are using to garner this fact from the plausibilities of the futures where he did this and he didn't.

[Clonedzero]

why do people get so uptight over obvious marketing?
take a chill pill lol

[SalsaDMA]

xXRevan0515Xx wrote...

Well, I guess there is only one thing left to say...Sorry to those who don't like the direction of Mass Effect, best of luck in your search for other games to play.

Yeah.. Let's just accept the turning of yet a company into a faceless drone producing basicly the same game everyone else are making.

There's only so many times playing the same game is fun, you know, and given that every major producer seems hooked on making the same game all the time, we're left with indie devs trying to deal with underbudgeted developments for the games that will actually be remembered in the future for standing out from the crowd.

[Phaedon]

Of course it is.


In Marketing language.

[Badpie]

Captain_Obvious wrote...

xXRevan0515Xx wrote...

Well, I guess there is only one thing left to say...Sorry to those who don't like the direction of Mass Effect, best of luck in your search for other games to play.

Agreed.

Or we can voice our concerns in a civil manner on a public forum made specifically for such a thing and hope that our opinions are heard and implemented.  You know so we'll buy their game....like they want us to.

Modifié par Badpie, 09 août 2011 - 10:50 .

[Niddy']

"you’re not going to remember all the details from when you played that game, right? Even I can’t recall everything that happened to me when that came out in 2007. It’s human nature. We’re not Rain Man…"

AKA; we're lazy and trying too hard to impress new call of kids to buy our game.

[Badpie]

iakus wrote...

littlezack wrote...

 The only way you can bring newcomers in is if the story is so straightforward and abandons the majority of it's lore.

Or you could do what they did in Mass Effect 2 and create a comic that lets newcomers get caught up with the story. And Mass Effect 2 didn't 'abandon the majority of it's lore'..

Ah yes, the comic:

Feros, where's that?
What's a Cipher?
That Kaiden sure is a "good kid"
Choose a romance?  (psst, you wanna pick Liara)

Yeah, comics fix eveything 

The comic was a fail of epic proportions.  And this is the only thing new folks had to jump in with.  Based on the horrible horrible butchering of the handling of past events, story, characters and decisions in Genesis is it any wonder we're a little concerned about just what kind of pedantic shorthand will constitute "backstory" at the beginning of ME3?

Modifié par Badpie, 09 août 2011 - 10:58 .

[didymos1120]

SalsaDMA wrote...

xXRevan0515Xx wrote...

Well, I guess there is only one thing left to say...Sorry to those who don't like the direction of Mass Effect, best of luck in your search for other games to play.

Yeah.. Let's just accept the turning of yet a company into a faceless drone producing basicly the same game everyone else are making.

So what do you suggest?  The only power you have to make them heed your displeasure is to not give them your money. People can complain, and complain, and complain, but if they buy the games anyway, all they can expect is to be ignored.  So no, telling people "good luck finding something else" isn't advocating that people "just accept" anything.  It's advocating that they do the only thing actually matters to a business (and especially one that is publicly traded): put that money in someone else's coffers.