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Top 10 Prozac Moments in DA 2 *spoilers*


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#101
jamesp81

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Dave of Canada wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

Depressing and unfulfilling storytelling should be avoided.


Unless that's the purpose of the series. ("Unfulfilling" is subjective.)


Which would be a relatively odd purpose.  And, apparently, a lot of people agree with me since DA2 was not received nearly as well as DAO and, at the end of the day, BW has to pay the bills.  They do that by selling games to the largest available market.  I think we both know what that market is.

If you make it too dark, even if some like me play it, we're going to not get immersed in it at all.  All the skill brought to bear writing it will have been for nothing, as we will simply gloss over it.  Which would be a shame, because when it comes to talented writing in RPGs, Bioware is pretty much the last word.

It's ridiculous anyway, it's a game that's supposed to be about choices.  The endings should range from very good to epic fail based on the choices.

But if the writers are determined create a game that's going to make me want to cut myself after playing it, I can always just vote with my wallet.  It's the only method of approval or disapproval any of us have ;)

#102
Addai

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jamesp81 wrote...
Don't take it as non-constructive criticism, but I cannot for the life of me see why anyone would pay money for something that leaves them feeling depressed. DA2 gets a nominal pass since it's not the last title and we don't know the end yet.

I like to be moved, even if it breaks my heart.  There's catharsis in caring so much about a fictional character that you hurt with them.

The feeling that no one is safe and there can be unintended consquences to your actions also heightens drama.  This is one point where DA2 could have done better, by actually showing divergent outcomes, at least in side quests like Hubert's mine for instance.  Too many were railroaded, so it leads to feeling less involved rather than more.

#103
Herr Uhl

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jamesp81 wrote...

Which would be a relatively odd purpose.  And, apparently, a lot of people agree with me since DA2 was not received nearly as well as DAO and, at the end of the day, BW has to pay the bills.  They do that by selling games to the largest available market.  I think we both know what that market is.


I don't think that "darker" is why DA2 was less warmly recieved.

jamesp81 wrote...

It's ridiculous anyway, it's a game that's supposed to be about choices.  The endings should range from very good to epic fail based on the choices.


That would mean that the choices are no brainers and there is a "right" way to do things. That is what is called weak writing, which I find ridiculous.

Modifié par Herr Uhl, 11 août 2011 - 09:40 .


#104
jamesp81

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Herr Uhl wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

Which would be a relatively odd purpose.  And, apparently, a lot of people agree with me since DA2 was not received nearly as well as DAO and, at the end of the day, BW has to pay the bills.  They do that by selling games to the largest available market.  I think we both know what that market is.


I don't think that "darker" is why DA2 was less warmly recieved.


I do think that.

#105
Icinix

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Honestly, by the end of DA2 - I was fatigued and disappointed by all the suffering and tragedy.

I don't read books like that, I don't watch movies like that, if I accidentally find myself in a situation watching / reading one of them - I certainly don't enjoy it.

Cue arguments : Thats life though, it can't be all roses etc - and thats fine. That is life or a set tale of tragedy. But in a game where choice is massive and choice and consequences are billed as important, where you direct your characters story, forcing wave upon wave of tragedy upon the character doesn't do much for me personally.

Don't get me wrong, a little tragedy is ok, but the whole game, AND all out of your control?

If I want to experience despair, pain and tragedy beyond my control. I watch the evening news.

#106
jamesp81

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I guess I just don't get people.

Playing a game where the only outcome is loss and defeat seems so wasteful to me.  Who wants to be a loser?  I've been a loser for real enough that I'm not going to pay money to do it in a video game.

Besides, losers whine about doing their best.  Winners go home and **** the prom queen.  You can guess which I prefer.

#107
jamesp81

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Icinix wrote...

Honestly, by the end of DA2 - I was fatigued and disappointed by all the suffering and tragedy.

I don't read books like that, I don't watch movies like that, if I accidentally find myself in a situation watching / reading one of them - I certainly don't enjoy it.

Cue arguments : Thats life though, it can't be all roses etc - and thats fine. That is life or a set tale of tragedy. But in a game where choice is massive and choice and consequences are billed as important, where you direct your characters story, forcing wave upon wave of tragedy upon the character doesn't do much for me personally.

Don't get me wrong, a little tragedy is ok, but the whole game, AND all out of your control?

If I want to experience despair, pain and tragedy beyond my control. I watch the evening news.


That's the damned truth.

I don't mind tragedy or despair...as they make the win at the end all that much better.  That's predicated on there being a win at the end, of course.

#108
Herr Uhl

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jamesp81 wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

I don't think that "darker" is why DA2 was less warmly recieved.


I do think that.


So the unfinished feel, rushed ending and change in design weren't the major reasons? Look what most people complain about, the story being too dark is very low on the list.

Modifié par Herr Uhl, 11 août 2011 - 09:42 .


#109
K_Tabris

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That's one of the aspects of the game that make my very, very short list of dislikes. Every side quest (it seems) has a heart-rending story, or a 'prozac moment'. Once in awhile, it's just too much!

#110
Sir Edric

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Herr Uhl wrote...
So the unfinished feel, rushed ending and change in design weren't the major reasons? Look what most people complain about, the story being too dark is very low on the list.


Dark is good, it adds emotion, and DA2 did it really well. Though Hawke has to be one tough son of a b!tch everything what he went through in my playthrough.

#111
jamesp81

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Herr Uhl wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

I don't think that "darker" is why DA2 was less warmly recieved.


I do think that.


So the unfinished feel, rushed ending and change in design weren't the major reasons? Look what most people complain about, the story being too dark is very low on the list.


1) BSN isn't the only place to list off complaints about the game.
2) There are several posters in this very thread that cite the game's glum outlook as one of their issues.  Since neither of us has exactly taken a scientific poll on the matter, there's no way to know which issue is the biggest.

3) I didn't think the game felt unfinished.  The areas and terrain were certainly repetitive in places, but DA2 is by far not the worst offender in that department.

#112
Cutlasskiwi

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Dave of Canada wrote...

thats1evildude wrote...

On the other hand, if the hero's struggles never amount to anything, then what's the point of the journey? Why should you form attachment to characters you know you're going to lose?


I know I'm in the minority when I say this, though I'm actually a bigger fan of the hero's struggles not achieving some better end. Hell, my favorite protagonist is probably Hawke because of it.

Roleplaying Hawke as somebody who's trying his hardest to stop the inevitable and dealing with it all despite not being able to change much was probably one of the best experiences I had with a Bioware protagonist (imo). Siding with the Templar to try and stop Anders and his plans, only to fail and have it happen anyway, left me incredibly satisfied as I imagined Hawke looking upon the world with horror as he failed to achieve what he wanted.

Many might disagree, though I'm a big fan of bad and/or bittersweet endings.


Very much this. During my first playthrough my Hawke tried to stop the blooming conflict before it could tear Kirkwall apart, and me as a player figured that this would be possible. I was incredibly happy when I saw that Hawke failed and it didn't end with a 'game over, please reload' screen.  

#113
jamesp81

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Yellow Words wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

thats1evildude wrote...

On the other hand, if the hero's struggles never amount to anything, then what's the point of the journey? Why should you form attachment to characters you know you're going to lose?


I know I'm in the minority when I say this, though I'm actually a bigger fan of the hero's struggles not achieving some better end. Hell, my favorite protagonist is probably Hawke because of it.

Roleplaying Hawke as somebody who's trying his hardest to stop the inevitable and dealing with it all despite not being able to change much was probably one of the best experiences I had with a Bioware protagonist (imo). Siding with the Templar to try and stop Anders and his plans, only to fail and have it happen anyway, left me incredibly satisfied as I imagined Hawke looking upon the world with horror as he failed to achieve what he wanted.

Many might disagree, though I'm a big fan of bad and/or bittersweet endings.


Very much this. During my first playthrough my Hawke tried to stop the blooming conflict before it could tear Kirkwall apart, and me as a player figured that this would be possible. I was incredibly happy when I saw that Hawke failed and it didn't end with a 'game over, please reload' screen.  


The thing is, though, is that I don't really view the mage / templar war as a "grim ending".  Chiefly because it's not an ending at all.  The war just started, we don't know how it's going to end for good or ill.  This is the sole reason DA2 gets a pass from me for being so glum most of the time; it's not supposed to give us an ending, it's supposed to give us a Pivotal Moment In History.

I am annoyed that Hawke's story seems to be have been left hanging without any resolution.  I would prefer for his plotline to get wrapped up in a DLC or in the next game.

If the conclusion of the series is lolgrimdark, then yes, I will be annoyed and won't buy it.  I like DAO fine because it did give as an ending (to the blight) and all manner of results were possible from very good to very bad, at least as far as the major characters were concerned.

Modifié par jamesp81, 11 août 2011 - 10:16 .


#114
Fenris_13

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Dave of Canada wrote...

thats1evildude wrote...

On the other hand, if the hero's struggles never amount to anything, then what's the point of the journey? Why should you form attachment to characters you know you're going to lose?


I know I'm in the minority when I say this, though I'm actually a bigger fan of the hero's struggles not achieving some better end. Hell, my favorite protagonist is probably Hawke because of it.

Roleplaying Hawke as somebody who's trying his hardest to stop the inevitable and dealing with it all despite not being able to change much was probably one of the best experiences I had with a Bioware protagonist (imo). Siding with the Templar to try and stop Anders and his plans, only to fail and have it happen anyway, left me incredibly satisfied as I imagined Hawke looking upon the world with horror as he failed to achieve what he wanted.

Many might disagree, though I'm a big fan of bad and/or bittersweet endings.


I have to agree with this guy.

#115
Apollo Starflare

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Yellow Words wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

thats1evildude wrote...

On the other hand, if the hero's struggles never amount to anything, then what's the point of the journey? Why should you form attachment to characters you know you're going to lose?


I know I'm in the minority when I say this, though I'm actually a bigger fan of the hero's struggles not achieving some better end. Hell, my favorite protagonist is probably Hawke because of it.

Roleplaying Hawke as somebody who's trying his hardest to stop the inevitable and dealing with it all despite not being able to change much was probably one of the best experiences I had with a Bioware protagonist (imo). Siding with the Templar to try and stop Anders and his plans, only to fail and have it happen anyway, left me incredibly satisfied as I imagined Hawke looking upon the world with horror as he failed to achieve what he wanted.

Many might disagree, though I'm a big fan of bad and/or bittersweet endings.


Very much this. During my first playthrough my Hawke tried to stop the blooming conflict before it could tear Kirkwall apart, and me as a player figured that this would be possible. I was incredibly happy when I saw that Hawke failed and it didn't end with a 'game over, please reload' screen.  


Yep. I see plenty of people (here included) complain about how too many games are forumlaic and follow the same 'hero saves the day from great evil' pattern. DA2 gave us something different, right down to not being able to win, ultimately. I applaud it for that. I just wish Meredith and Orsino had been fleshed out a little more considering the way things ended.

As far as the thread itself, I would pretty much only be echoing others in my choices. However I'll add a shout out to the fate of Bethany in the Deep Roads. I went into DA2 as blind as possible (sadly, not completely unspoiled alas) and despite the warnings that were, looking back, beyond obvious, I was still taken completely by surprise by that twist. Heart wrenchingly so. I had liked Beth since she was revealed and planned to keep her around for the majority of the game, instead I didn't even have her cameo later on as I hadn't taken Anders with me; ironically because Bethany had been my party mage.

Something about the way Varric said 'oh Sunshine' just gutted me and I almost reloaded. But instead I stuck with it, the tragedy becoming very much a defining aspect of that playthrough and Hawke. Very few death moments in games have hit me like that in the past, it blew Virmire out of the water for starters.

However it does highlight how much a double edged a sword it was, having the 'thrown into the chaos' opening. Losing the first sibling can never compare to the potential loss of your sibling in the Deep Roads (or the later events in Act 2) - simply because we never get to know them well enough before hand. Somehow it's more than that though, even on future playthroughs as a Mage, losing Bethany at the start just doesn't have the same impact despite my knowing more about her.

#116
Addai

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jamesp81 wrote...
Harrowmont gave the impression of knowing what he was doing, when in fact he was just very skilled as a politician, thus coming off as sounding smart even when he really wasn't anything special.

Image IPB  He wasn't skilled at all.  That was sort of the point, he was a good man and a terrible politician and ruler.

All of this pain could have been avoided, if you had Zevran in the party when encountering Dulin Ferender. Image IPB

#117
LT123

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My top ones are the Chantry explosion, Leandra's death, and the sibling's death in the Deep Roads.

Someone else mentioned Pol's death as one of the tragic moments earlier, and I agree with that. Most of it is the VA absolutely nailing those lines, as did Anders' and Hawke's VAs with "Merrill, he's gone" and (if Hawke's a spirithealer) "I would if I could."

I remember wondering why the Dalish clan you meet in Origins couldn't be Mahariel's clan, but the huge payoff in DA 2 more than makes up for it.

I think where the writers nailed some of the tragic moments is when they involve people from Origins. Meeting the clan again in DA 2 was moving because I remembered them-Fenarel volunteering to help the Dalish Warden look for Tamlen, Junar teaching Pol how to hunt, Pol being happy to be out of the city and explaining how the city elves live. And Marethari's death was sad. Poor Warden Alistair got me choked up with his brief appearance: "It belonged to the love of my life...and she doesn't need it anymore."

And I sat at my computer for a good five minutes going "Oh, crap" and "Hawke, you idiot" when Flemeth popped out of the amulet on Sundermount. Somewhere in Thedas or Mirror World the Warden is screaming in rage and frustration. I hadn't played a game before where a new PC undid something good a previous PC did.

That's also one reason why so many people like Anders as a character in DA2-we got to see him and Justice in Awakening, pre-merge, and than the consequences of that decision in DA2, and even when Anders is friendmanced, he's still a trainwreck. He was screwed up in Awakening too, but at least then he had defense mechanisms, friends, and a Warden-Commander who actually cared about him.

I also agree with the comments above about Hawke feeling like a Fereldan and not a Kirkwaller. There's all sorts of moments where that's reinforced-"Maker bless the rule of our Queen Anora/Queen Alistair," refusing to kill the noble for Meeran because he sent help to Ferelden, spying on the thugs who are planning to sabotage Amaranthine ships, etc.

And you guys made the right choice with the unstoppable Alistair sacrifice in Origins. That was amazing, even though I knew it was coming. And the US is probably my favorite ending. Somebody else mentioned the Warden's despairing look after Riordan dies, and that was really touching, especially if you didn't do the ritual.

#118
Iakus

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jamesp81 wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Honestly, by the end of DA2 - I was fatigued and disappointed by all the suffering and tragedy.

I don't read books like that, I don't watch movies like that, if I accidentally find myself in a situation watching / reading one of them - I certainly don't enjoy it.

Cue arguments : Thats life though, it can't be all roses etc - and thats fine. That is life or a set tale of tragedy. But in a game where choice is massive and choice and consequences are billed as important, where you direct your characters story, forcing wave upon wave of tragedy upon the character doesn't do much for me personally.

Don't get me wrong, a little tragedy is ok, but the whole game, AND all out of your control?

If I want to experience despair, pain and tragedy beyond my control. I watch the evening news.


That's the damned truth.

I don't mind tragedy or despair...as they make the win at the end all that much better.  That's predicated on there being a win at the end, of course.


Indeed.  I'm a fan of the trope Earn your Happy Ending .  Victory is all the sweeter when you come within a hair of utter ruin.  But that presumes there's a happy ending to earn in the first place.  The seemingly constant bombardment of death and tragedy kinda hit me with something more akin to Darkness Induced Moral Apathy.

#119
CrimsonZephyr

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Jennifer Brandes Hepler wrote...

Dragon Age has always been a game that has pushed the idea of tragedy. When we first discussed having Alistair sacrifice himself out of love of the Warden, there was debate over whether players would find that moving or just be frustrated that he made a decision they couldn't control. We decided to go with what we all reacted to in our guts as a cool emotional moment, and it became a defining part of DA:O for people who experienced it.

I certainly don't deny that most of our writers tend to prefer tragic moments. For me, personally, I've never really trusted an author who wasn't willing to kill a likeable character. Happy endings often feel cheap and unearned. But I have also experienced tragedy-fatigue (parts of GRRM, or the second Melanie Rawn Dragon trilogy come to mind), and I'm sorry if DAII reached that level for some people. I think it's particularly hard to judge the tragedy-per-square-foot sweet spot in a game, since the pacing is very different if you play it over a few days, a few weeks or a few months. I imagine the faster you play, the more saturated it seems.

That said, it is important to us on the team that Dragon Age continue to push the bounds of what a videogame can make you feel. And for that, sorrowful or touching events are a far better guage than happy ones. If your character gets everything he wants, are you feeling happy because you genuinely empathize with him, or just because you've "won" the game? It's when you stop to help a character that you get no benefit from just because you care about him as a person, or mourn the loss of someone like Leandra, who had no game benefit, that we've really reached past the limits of the game with the story.

So, while we have certainly been disapointed in the number of fans who didn't feel a sense of agency with Hawke because of all the emotional events surrounding her/him -- and will be taking steps to ensure a better feeling of personal impact in future stories -- Dragon Age products will likely continue to push the boundaries of dark fantasy and human tragedy. So, while you may experience greater victories in future products, it wouldn't be Dragon Age if they didn't come at a cost.


Tragedy is good, if used sparingly. The problem with overdosing on tragedy is that you stop caring. Eventually, you have to ask yourself why people aren't committing mass suicide if their lives seem to be so immutably miserable. And more importantly, it was tragedy for the sake of tragedy, not because characters were acting in character or because the player's actions caused something to go totally awry.

For example, the plot with Anders. You could refuse to help him, you could refuse to distract the Grand Cleric, you could tell Cullen straight to his face that something bad was going to happen at the Chantry and nothing changes. Anders still succeeds. You could have kicked him off your party for most of the game and he just randomly pops up, even though he explicitly needs your help for most of his quests! It's actually surprising that you consider the inability to kill off a character to be a weakness because Anders has possibly the most egregious example of plot armor in the entire series. Never once does Hawke consider stabbing him in the back before he blows up the Chantry, even though he's a progressively insane abomination who has lost control several times. No, the plot needs to railroad Hawke to that final moment. Hawke comes off looking like a fool, even the perennially genre-savvy and unflappable snarky Hawke or the constantly antagonistic rival Hawke.

Another example is Merrill. Never once does a rival Hawke consider smashing the mirror. He considers it a monumental danger to Merrill yet he stops after withholding the arulin'holm. No, Merrill has to destroy that mirror herself after either her clan is dead or she is banished. That's tragic, after all, right? Even though a Hawke on her rivalry path constantly, and rightly claims its a danger, there is no option other than to be a spectator and watch hell break loose only to say "I told you so!" after the fact. Hawke, again, looks completely impotent as a character and as a hero.

Then there's Thrask, about as Lawful Good as Lawful Good gets with the Templars. So, he sets out on the noble goal of bringing Templars and mages together to reform the Circle, reasoning they don't have to be enemies. That's all well and good, and it's a much more reasonable and savvy solution than "beat those mages raw!" So, we've established Thrask as a forward-thinking and reasonable man. Who does he ally with? Grace. The lover of a known blood mage and together they take Hawke's friend hostage. This could be Hawke's sibling (which is monumentally stupid). Bethany, for example, is a Circle mage and Neutral Good incarnate. Thrask has her incapacitated with blood magic and trusts Grace. This is to prevent Hawke from interfering. Even if Hawke is explicitly pro-mage and says so in front of a crowd of noblemen! Is he brain-dead? Again, characters commit brazenly idiotic actions, sometimes against their character because that path leads fastest to tragedy.

Or, in the search for Quentin, this is a real crowner for idiocy: Hawke and his companions miss the secret entrance to his creepy lair because a giant trapdoor was hidden underneath a barrel. Now, leaving out the fact that the trapdoor is in fact larger than the barrel that was over it in Act I, and would thus be really obvious, Aveline really should have had some guys comb that place down. Anyone with half a brain who did a halfway-decent spot check would have found the entrance. I mean, the guy ran into the inner parts of that foundry and mysteriously vanished. He was obviously still there. Aveline, I am disappointed, you are a substandard policewoman.

All in all, Dragon Age II was grim dark with an idiot plot. If anyone, even Hawke, took two seconds to think things through, even if it still resulted in tragedy, it would have been better. Instead, players are left wanting the character to do things infinitely more sensible than the three idiotic options presented. I think a huge problem is that Dragon Age II was never really about roleplaying or the characters. It was about the endgame. The ending of this game was so huge to the setting of Thedas that player choice had to be severely limited, or else it might never have happened. Unfortunately, Hawke comes out of it looking like a dunce.

Modifié par CrimsonZephyr, 12 août 2011 - 06:09 .


#120
Quill74Pen

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Y'know ... on my first playthrough, I didn't particularly sympathize with Kirkwall's viscount. But ... that changed after I witnessed Anders blowing up the Chantry with Grand Cleric Elthina inside it.

I saw a madman — note that word, "madman," not mage — kill a truly innocent, reasonable soul, along with a lot of other innocents in the Chantry.

It was then my view of the viscount changed. After that, I saw him as another one somewhat similar to the grand cleric. He was caught between extreme forces, trying to hold things together while going through family upheaval of his own. And, in the end, just like the grand cleric, he, too, was cut down by the extremists.

Yeah, depressing. Especially for moderates. Few games can accomplish that, but Bioware's DA and ME games hit the nail on the head.

Quill74Pen

#121
Quething

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Ryzaki wrote...

I prefer happy endings as well. I was wishing the DR would've had more of a cost attached to it. It feels too much like a "get out of jail free" card for the moment.


Well, that's cuz you don't like Morrigan. If she's your favorite character, "you'll never see me again" is a pretty brutal blindside. And given the craptastic fail of Witch Hunt, that doesn't necessarily get alleviated by DLC like you'd think it would.

Also, I'd like to strongly second everything CrimsonZephyr just said.

#122
TobiTobsen

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Quething wrote...

Also, I'd like to strongly second everything CrimsonZephyr just said.


Aye. I support that.

#123
Nerevar-as

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Quill74Pen wrote...

Y'know ... on my first playthrough, I didn't particularly sympathize with Kirkwall's viscount. But ... that changed after I witnessed Anders blowing up the Chantry with Grand Cleric Elthina inside it.

I saw a madman — note that word, "madman," not mage — kill a truly innocent, reasonable soul, along with a lot of other innocents in the Chantry.

It was then my view of the viscount changed. After that, I saw him as another one somewhat similar to the grand cleric. He was caught between extreme forces, trying to hold things together while going through family upheaval of his own. And, in the end, just like the grand cleric, he, too, was cut down by the extremists.

Yeah, depressing. Especially for moderates. Few games can accomplish that, but Bioware's DA and ME games hit the nail on the head.

Quill74Pen


Elthina allowed Meredith´s Circle politic, so she´s hardly innocent at all. The Viscount however did as best as he could with the very limited power he was granted. At times I felt he was there to be the visisble face for complaints without power to do anything about it. (About Origins, Harrowmont believed in the Caste system, so he isn´t such a good person).

Main reason I don´t like the "dark" tone of DA2 is because it´s plot driven. Characters hardly ever do sensible things that would prevent bad things happening so that the bad things happen any way. I felt like an idiot in Origins with some sidequests for the Blackstones and Mage Collective as it was obvious what they were doing. With Hawke I feel like that every other quest. Merrill? Anders? Petrine? (screaming for a Renegade interrupt here). Isabella in Act 2? And so on. We probably can add Legacy to the list. Hwake and co aren´t savvy. Advancing plot at the expense of characters is bad writing to me, so I was quite dissapointed with the game.

#124
jamesp81

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Dark and depressing is acceptable for a second installment, since a second installment doesn't usually signify any kind of ending, although I do wish we'd wrapped up Hawke's story beyond "he left the city for parts unknown".

What I don't find encouraging about BW's comments on the matter is that they seem to want to do lolyoufail storytelling in every installment. If the end result of the final installment is that I failed to accomplish anything and everyone dies, there's no real point in playing it.

There is a reason that "the hero saves the day" type storytelling keeps getting redone. By and large, people prefer it. If they didn't, that sort of storytelling wouldn't be the dominant plotline you see in all forms of entertainment.

#125
MichaelFinnegan

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Jennifer Brandes Hepler wrote...

Dragon Age has always been a game that has pushed the idea of tragedy. When we first discussed having Alistair sacrifice himself out of love of the Warden, there was debate over whether players would find that moving or just be frustrated that he made a decision they couldn't control. We decided to go with what we all reacted to in our guts as a cool emotional moment, and it became a defining part of DA:O for people who experienced it.

In this particular case, was something like a quick-time-event (QTE) considered? Alistair is about to sacrifice himself, the PC sees it, and is given an option to stop it? I think that would have opened up so many options:
1. For people who did want to let Alistair go ahead and do it, that would have given them the tragedy they wanted
2. For those who stopped him, they'd have a deeper insight into Alistair's love for the PC, into his character, and so on.
3. Lastly, for those who couldn't react to the QTE, the feeling would be one of immesurable guilt

And I would argue that #3 could evoke a feeling that #1 wouldn't even come close to matching. It is that feeling of "what if" that hounds some people all their lives.

I certainly don't deny that most of our writers tend to prefer tragic moments. For me, personally, I've never really trusted an author who wasn't willing to kill a likeable character. Happy endings often feel cheap and unearned. But I have also experienced tragedy-fatigue (parts of GRRM, or the second Melanie Rawn Dragon trilogy come to mind), and I'm sorry if DAII reached that level for some people. I think it's particularly hard to judge the tragedy-per-square-foot sweet spot in a game, since the pacing is very different if you play it over a few days, a few weeks or a few months. I imagine the faster you play, the more saturated it seems.

That said, it is important to us on the team that Dragon Age continue to push the bounds of what a videogame can make you feel. And for that, sorrowful or touching events are a far better guage than happy ones. If your character gets everything he wants, are you feeling happy because you genuinely empathize with him, or just because you've "won" the game? It's when you stop to help a character that you get no benefit from just because you care about him as a person, or mourn the loss of someone like Leandra, who had no game benefit, that we've really reached past the limits of the game with the story.

The issue with Leandra's scene is that I never felt emotionally invested in her. In all of Act 2, she kept on saying, "An elven slave..."

In any case, I'd say that the assessment of "tragic events are a far better guage than happy ones" is highly relative. Relative not just in a sense of going from person to person, but relative even for a person - for instance, the emotional state that he/she is currently in, which could have been shaped by a personal real-life tragedy, or after a hard day's work, and so on and so forth. I think it is sometimes not just about playing the game.

So, while we have certainly been disapointed in the number of fans who didn't feel a sense of agency with Hawke because of all the emotional events surrounding her/him -- and will be taking steps to ensure a better feeling of personal impact in future stories -- Dragon Age products will likely continue to push the boundaries of dark fantasy and human tragedy. So, while you may experience greater victories in future products, it wouldn't be Dragon Age if they didn't come at a cost.

If the writers had an intention of making DA one of dark fantasy and human tragedy, then so be it. I will play them all because what you guys can give me in a game, I have rarely found in other games.